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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 18 of 18. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by sar on September 10, 2001, at 1:39:06
dear all,
i feel i've been going through a glorious horrible metamorphosis. a summer + 2 hospitalizations + 2 meds have given me some verve, some kick, some sarcasm, some outgoingness, more petulance than i've ever had.
my old friends and family are alienated and shocked. they are used to a sluggish, submissive, secretive (name here)...and i'm just not like that anymore. i seem to amuse my new friends quite a bit and make them easily, but these old friends and my parents seem to not like me too much anymore.
i'm happier with my new self, and i suppose that is the important thing.
i'm curious, though, if anyone else has experienced anything similar. they accuse me of being a "bitch" when i feel i've finally gotten a *backbone.* (previously very shy and submissive before--always strong-willed, but now it shows alot more).
reconciliation of 2 selves...it was such a qucik evolution that i suppose it set some heads spinning.
i never want to be my old self again.
but how the hell do i know if i'm really the bitch they accuse me of being?!!
sar
Posted by Kristi on September 10, 2001, at 1:57:36
In reply to bitch, posted by sar on September 10, 2001, at 1:39:06
Sar....
I couldn't let this post drive by without adressing the similarities. Unbelievable. All my adult life I've been told that I let people walk all over me, that I don't stick up for myself, I have no self esteem, am too meak and weak... now that I am not that way.... I am tough, I have self esteem, I'll call people on what needs to be called on...... I'm still not good enough????? To hell with what these people think... it's what we think that counts. Them and their comments caused me to change, now they don't like it. But I do... and that's what counts. I have no answers to any of your questions, but I can relate. Former nice girl turned bitch, Kristi> dear all,
>
> i feel i've been going through a glorious horrible metamorphosis. a summer + 2 hospitalizations + 2 meds have given me some verve, some kick, some sarcasm, some outgoingness, more petulance than i've ever had.
>
> my old friends and family are alienated and shocked. they are used to a sluggish, submissive, secretive (name here)...and i'm just not like that anymore. i seem to amuse my new friends quite a bit and make them easily, but these old friends and my parents seem to not like me too much anymore.
>
> i'm happier with my new self, and i suppose that is the important thing.
>
> i'm curious, though, if anyone else has experienced anything similar. they accuse me of being a "bitch" when i feel i've finally gotten a *backbone.* (previously very shy and submissive before--always strong-willed, but now it shows alot more).
>
> reconciliation of 2 selves...it was such a qucik evolution that i suppose it set some heads spinning.
>
> i never want to be my old self again.
>
> but how the hell do i know if i'm really the bitch they accuse me of being?!!
>
> sar
Posted by Phil on September 10, 2001, at 6:14:11
In reply to Re: bitch » sar, posted by Kristi on September 10, 2001, at 1:57:36
sar, You really find out who your friends are when you change for the better. It's confusing.
Focus on you and being honest. They will get used to it.
You might see a therapist to kinda get an opinion on this. But well intentioned friends and family can be our worst enemies sometimes. A good therapist can help us navigate our changing internal architecture. I'm sorry, it's way too early for me to try and make sense!Phil
Posted by Racer on September 10, 2001, at 6:14:30
In reply to bitch, posted by sar on September 10, 2001, at 1:39:06
I'm sorry, sar, but I recently told my therapist that my goal in therapy was to learn to be a bitch!!! It's true, too.
See, the way I see it, three quarters of the problems in my life come about because I don't say no, I don't tell people that I won't cover for their incompetance, that I don't explain -- in words of one syllable or less -- why the project they're giving me can't be completed by yesterday, and that they're being unfair to me. I do let them hurt me, while trying to save their feelings. I do bust my ass trying to do the impossible in order to please them. And I wait until some of them are asleep to sneak into the guest room with my vibrator...
Anyway, here's what I'm figuring out about my depression: I'm smart, which intimidates a lot of people, who then want to take me down a peg to make themselves feel better. I'm big, which is intimidating to men in particular. I'm not good at keeping my mouth shut, which I do need to work on, but not in shutting myself up: more in using my mouth more appropriately. Being stronger. Not caring quite so much what others think of me, and caring more that I'm right when I know I am.
What about the people around me? Most of them, even those who say I should stand up for myself more, LIKE ME THE WAY I AM **BECAUSE** they can manipulate me. BECAUSE they get lots of kewl things out of my pain: someone to 'take care of', someone who will drop everything to take care of them. It's a lot easier for them to say that they want me to stand up for myself, but they want me to stand up to everyone EXCEPT themselves.
No wonder they think I'm a bitch when I do!
So, what's the answer? Do you truly like the new you? If so, it's easy: either train your old friends to like the new you, too; or encourage them to get the help they obviously need so that they don't need you to be weak in order to make themselves feel strong.
And here's the unsolicited advice: forget about whether they like the new you. Does the new **and IMPROVED** you like them?
xoxo
Posted by Phil on September 10, 2001, at 6:48:57
In reply to Re: bitch ROTFLMAO!!! » sar, posted by Racer on September 10, 2001, at 6:14:30
Are you up feeding the horses already?? :^)
Well said Racer. You always seem to have a zinger or two in your posts. Keep em coming.Your bud,
Phil
Posted by Racer on September 10, 2001, at 7:26:46
In reply to Re: bitch ROTFLMAO!!!Racer, posted by Phil on September 10, 2001, at 6:48:57
nah, just can't sleep!
The OL thing, you know... Now I'm thinking of another OL, whom I had a dream about: holding hands with the OL above, saying to the sweet young thing next to OL2 (sweetly, of course), "you must be his wife, ********, is it? How nice to meet you!" before runnign off to let him explain to her that it must be some sort of mistake, he's not married at all {{chortle}}, shaking and quivering with a combination of rage and glee as I run to hide with the OL I've already described. Then explaining why brought that on, to OL1.
That dream, though, did tell me I didn't want anything more than friendship with OL1... That's good, right?
Also, and this might be frightening to some of you, I just spent a ton of time looking MYSELF up on a bunch of search engines, to find out what anyone could find out about me on the web... So far, I know that I've got a sick sense of humor, am brilliantly witty, understand cats remarkably well, and am one hell of a great writer! (Ask your cat about its voting record, why doncha? Might surprise you...)
Anyway, now I'm going back to ripping apart furniture. Redoing the living room while the SO is out of town. He'll be so surprised!
(And, if it's actually done before he gets back, I'll be surprised too!)
Posted by kid_A on September 10, 2001, at 8:41:43
In reply to bitch, posted by sar on September 10, 2001, at 1:39:06
sar,
before meds i was a bit meek, i wouldnt stick up for myself in many situations, i would suffer sometimes needlessly... i would wait patiently to be served when it seemed like i was being ignored... now post med, im pushy, when i want something i ask for it... when questioned i answer strongly... when threatened i respond in kind..celebrate your inner bitch, when there is no one else around, who else better to stick up for yourself...
Posted by Krazy Kat on September 10, 2001, at 9:12:23
In reply to the bitch is back... » sar, posted by kid_A on September 10, 2001, at 8:41:43
Sar:
I think it's going to take a long time to determine the true self - it really takes all our lives, I guess. I used to put on a false bravado, and have actually done sort of the opposite - I'm quieter now. But then I was, and am, two people - one very rebellious and mischievous, one quite sedate and penatant.
I think there can be a sense of a loss of self when taking meds, also a sense of gaining self. It certainly changes our reactions to things.
What would a Taoist say?
- K.
Posted by tina on September 10, 2001, at 17:20:37
In reply to bitch, posted by sar on September 10, 2001, at 1:39:06
Sar
B.I.T.C.H = Babe In Total Control of Herself
You go girl!!
> dear all,
>
> i feel i've been going through a glorious horrible metamorphosis. a summer + 2 hospitalizations + 2 meds have given me some verve, some kick, some sarcasm, some outgoingness, more petulance than i've ever had.
>
> my old friends and family are alienated and shocked. they are used to a sluggish, submissive, secretive (name here)...and i'm just not like that anymore. i seem to amuse my new friends quite a bit and make them easily, but these old friends and my parents seem to not like me too much anymore.
>
> i'm happier with my new self, and i suppose that is the important thing.
>
> i'm curious, though, if anyone else has experienced anything similar. they accuse me of being a "bitch" when i feel i've finally gotten a *backbone.* (previously very shy and submissive before--always strong-willed, but now it shows alot more).
>
> reconciliation of 2 selves...it was such a qucik evolution that i suppose it set some heads spinning.
>
> i never want to be my old self again.
>
> but how the hell do i know if i'm really the bitch they accuse me of being?!!
>
> sar
Posted by Shar on September 11, 2001, at 12:00:07
In reply to bitch, posted by sar on September 10, 2001, at 1:39:06
somewhere, someone will Always call any woman with a backbone a bitch! Don't worry about.
There is a quote, and I've forgotten the sayer, but it is: I don't know what a feminist is, I just know that they call me that when I differentiate myself from a doormat or a prostitute.
Being strong/assertive and female has always been uncomfortable for some people to experience. Enjoy being HERE, in the now!
Shar
> dear all,
>
> i feel i've been going through a glorious horrible metamorphosis. a summer + 2 hospitalizations + 2 meds have given me some verve, some kick, some sarcasm, some outgoingness, more petulance than i've ever had.
>
> my old friends and family are alienated and shocked. they are used to a sluggish, submissive, secretive (name here)...and i'm just not like that anymore. i seem to amuse my new friends quite a bit and make them easily, but these old friends and my parents seem to not like me too much anymore.
>
> i'm happier with my new self, and i suppose that is the important thing.
>
> i'm curious, though, if anyone else has experienced anything similar. they accuse me of being a "bitch" when i feel i've finally gotten a *backbone.* (previously very shy and submissive before--always strong-willed, but now it shows alot more).
>
> reconciliation of 2 selves...it was such a qucik evolution that i suppose it set some heads spinning.
>
> i never want to be my old self again.
>
> but how the hell do i know if i'm really the bitch they accuse me of being?!!
>
> sar
Posted by sar on September 11, 2001, at 23:23:25
In reply to False bravado replaced by true sense of self, posted by Krazy Kat on September 10, 2001, at 9:12:23
dear yall,
thanks for all the pro-bitch responoses!
i've given alot of thought to it, to one friendship in particular, with a very outspoken guy who called me "kiddo"...we were very close for 9 years until my perdition/healing....i recently mulled over the past 9 years and realized that the dynamic of our relationship disgusted me, i'd been more like his submissive fan, and when i got better and started standing up to him he accused me of being a crazy bitch, irrational, etc...and months later, i'm still proud of having politely mailed links to narcissistic personality-disorder websites to him (vengeful and bitchy, yes, but i've never enough said what's on my mind--and after 9 years i figured, what the hell--)...
celebrate the inner bitch...ha ha, that's what the books in the self-help section should say, i'm already an innerchild, i need an inner bitch, probably!
Krazy Kat--
I related to your post the most because I've got those 2 distinctive personalities that you describe...and what would a Taoist say? i think a taoist would say: "do nothing, don't try, integration will happen in its own time, at the right time, naturally."
my loss of self on meds has been wonderful--i've lost my nervousness and recurrent suicidiality and gained laughter and a sense of wellness...but i'm somewhat apathetic and unyielding...the past doesn't grasp my heart so dearly anymore, which is a relief (for now)--the meds have toned down my emotionality but they've also made me--pointless? maybe someone else can describe this better? i no longer feel like gasping dying drunk--instead, i feel like an eat-3-meals-a-day-worker-dater but not fully whole--i lack so much fabric of being somehow...
sar
Posted by Krazy Kat on September 12, 2001, at 20:10:07
In reply to bitch...everyone, posted by sar on September 11, 2001, at 23:23:25
> Krazy Kat--
>
> I related to your post the most because I've got those 2 distinctive personalities that you describe...=== My pdoc's first "diagnosis" was Mood Disorder, Not Otherwise Described, Mulitple Personality Disorder... ???
and what would a Taoist say? i think a taoist would say: "do nothing, don't try, integration will happen in its own time, at the right time, naturally."
=== Yes, I think you're right. But it's so difficult going back and forth. I'm starting to realize that even though I feel more stable, I'm still doing that, and I think I always will. But if the line between the two just isn't SO squiggly.
>
> my loss of self on meds has been wonderful--i've lost my nervousness and recurrent suicidiality and gained laughter and a sense of wellness...=== Good! But that's more a loss of bad mojo...
but i'm somewhat apathetic and unyielding...
=== I've noticed apathy as well.
the past doesn't grasp my heart so dearly anymore, which is a relief (for now)--
=== Loss of passion? Loss of raw passion, perhaps?the meds have toned down my emotionality but they've also made me--pointless? maybe someone else can describe this better?
=== Yeah, but, if we can't accomplish anything because of the suicidal urges, the limitations caused by the depression and/or mania, then it's pointless not to take something. I would give it time. And you might find that a stabilizer helps. Or, go the other way, and lower your AD... I'm not sure.i no longer feel like gasping dying drunk--instead, i feel like an eat-3-meals-a-day-worker-dater but not fully whole--i lack so much fabric of being somehow...
=== Ah, they've made you one of "them" - one of those nice worker, social people. :) Again, I would give the fabric of being thing time. And you may not be cut out for the 9:00 - 5:00 world. I know I'm not. I'm avoiding it like a plague while I try to decide what to do.
-K. (I feel so guilty for giving up "Kingfish". See, it's that multiple personality thing again.)
Posted by susan C on September 12, 2001, at 21:03:57
In reply to Re: bitch...everyone, posted by Krazy Kat on September 12, 2001, at 20:10:07
You HAVE been PEEKING in my windows...
considering what has been going on, I have been doing pretty good. I actually got to my limit a couple of times today, once talking to someone about something complicated...and my brain stopped, and the other, walking home from an appt, there on a power pole was a sign...literally, a hate crime sign, in MY TOWN... I got so angry, I tore it down and stuffed it in my pocket...then I thought I will throw it away, then I thought I will take it home and show it to son. After we talked about it I said, I can't let this go uncounted. It can go 'unnoticed' but not uncounted...It took me a while to figure out who to call, first I called the newspaper, to find the human rights task force, who said for me to call the police and they would decide if it was important. So, finally the police, they said, bring it down now...bring it down now...I hopped on the bus in ten minutes and turned it in...it was impounded...kind of felt like it was a stray dog...but I did it all. I made a contribution to law, order and the American Way.
Jane, I think, commented yesterday on how she defended women who wear the dark muslim dress from racial yelling in her neighborhood. I would like to think, if someone had yelled this at someone, I would have had the courage to stand up for a muslim and protect their rights...no vigilantism, no taking the law into our own hands. Just letting them know hate is not appropriate.
So, My hands are shaking, but I am clear and feel even and now need to go eat.
Mouse out on a limb
Susan C>
> > Krazy Kat--
> >
> > I related to your post the most because I've got those 2 distinctive personalities that you describe...
>
> === My pdoc's first "diagnosis" was Mood Disorder, Not Otherwise Described, Mulitple Personality Disorder... ???
>
> and what would a Taoist say? i think a taoist would say: "do nothing, don't try, integration will happen in its own time, at the right time, naturally."
>
> === Yes, I think you're right. But it's so difficult going back and forth. I'm starting to realize that even though I feel more stable, I'm still doing that, and I think I always will. But if the line between the two just isn't SO squiggly.
> >
> > my loss of self on meds has been wonderful--i've lost my nervousness and recurrent suicidiality and gained laughter and a sense of wellness...
>
> === Good! But that's more a loss of bad mojo...
>
> but i'm somewhat apathetic and unyielding...
>
> === I've noticed apathy as well.
>
> the past doesn't grasp my heart so dearly anymore, which is a relief (for now)--
>
>
> === Loss of passion? Loss of raw passion, perhaps?
>
> the meds have toned down my emotionality but they've also made me--pointless? maybe someone else can describe this better?
>
>
> === Yeah, but, if we can't accomplish anything because of the suicidal urges, the limitations caused by the depression and/or mania, then it's pointless not to take something. I would give it time. And you might find that a stabilizer helps. Or, go the other way, and lower your AD... I'm not sure.
>
> i no longer feel like gasping dying drunk--instead, i feel like an eat-3-meals-a-day-worker-dater but not fully whole--i lack so much fabric of being somehow...
>
> === Ah, they've made you one of "them" - one of those nice worker, social people. :) Again, I would give the fabric of being thing time. And you may not be cut out for the 9:00 - 5:00 world. I know I'm not. I'm avoiding it like a plague while I try to decide what to do.
>
> -K. (I feel so guilty for giving up "Kingfish". See, it's that multiple personality thing again.)
Posted by Krazy Kat on September 14, 2001, at 9:58:08
In reply to Proactive Response To Stressful Times, posted by susan C on September 12, 2001, at 21:03:57
MM:
This must have been very frightening and frustrating. Good for you. I haven't seen anything close to home, so I'm very fortunate. I would be so angry.
- K.
Posted by sar on September 15, 2001, at 1:29:37
In reply to Re: bitch...everyone, posted by Krazy Kat on September 12, 2001, at 20:10:07
K,
being "one of them" is fun, it's like going on a jolly little vacation; i feel like my intellect is really wrecked (but it was when i was severely depressed, too) but i'm learning how to...function somehat like a real person. at work they call me "my own private idaho" because i'm a spacey loner, they do say it affectionately though...it feels good to be *calm.* my anxiety had gone through the roof before meds.
passion. raw passion. well, no--i'm still passionate, i'm the type to sob in public, spontaneously hug people i hardly know, feel strongly about my friends and family...and i feel passion for my new boy...i think it's the extremity that's gone. like, i no longer drive around drinking 32-oz-ers thinking about how terrible life is and the perfect suicide plan.
i think you're right--i'm not cut out for the 9-5 world. sometimes i think i want to be a psychologist and sometimes i think i want to just marry rich (bad, i know!!). what kind of work do you do?
do you think you have multiple personality disorder? i saw trudi chase (*when rabbit howls*) on oprah 10 years ago and have never forgotten that or the TV movie. so is Krazy Kat different from Kingfish?
take care babe,
sar
Posted by lostsailor on September 16, 2001, at 14:54:11
In reply to Re: bitch...everyone » Krazy Kat , posted by sar on September 15, 2001, at 1:29:37
Could you explain the "one of them" thing for me for I am a bit "lost".Sar, I am actually affraid that I am really not cut out for the nine to five world. I have regressed into a sort of primal animal.
Aside for grocery shopping, occasional outings with friends, and mountin biking and running, I am at home most of the time. I started to use tranquilizers at concerrts in order to survive. I did not always need them and took
took them as needed. I procured them from friends in parking lot and my mom. Finally I talked to my doc and was given a presciption for xanax and an ssri, then refered to a psychiatrist after his effort were unfruitful. I told my shink
all about my past use of them as well as the use of other substnces that were used for "recreation." he probed a lot and decided that although they were not pprescribed to me, I was only useing them in a close to medicinal fashion.
he upped my dose and has they have become a central part of my life now. I felt for a while like a junkie until he described the difference between addiction and dependence. That made me feel a bit better.On becoming a psychologist... I was a social worker at the bachelor's level and relatives wonder if that's what drove me "over the edge" I do too in a way, but feel that someday I will go back to the field and help many.
What do you do now for work. Is it satisfying? Doc told me to take a break from grad school and work for a bit and put me on temp disability because things were gettings so tough.What is a 32ouncer. Do you mean 22 like Bass Ale or 40 ouncers like uuuuuummmmmm colt 45, i think Also is Kingfish a band that you recognize?????
In Peace, Tony
> K,
>
> being "one of them" is fun, it's like going on a jolly little vacation; i feel like my intellect is really wrecked (but it was when i was severely depressed, too) but i'm learning how to...function somehat like a real person. at work they call me "my own private idaho" because i'm a spacey loner, they do say it affectionately though...it feels good to be *calm.* my anxiety had gone through the roof before meds.
>
> passion. raw passion. well, no--i'm still passionate, i'm the type to sob in public, spontaneously hug people i hardly know, feel strongly about my friends and family...and i feel passion for my new boy...i think it's the extremity that's gone. like, i no longer drive around drinking 32-oz-ers thinking about how terrible life is and the perfect suicide plan.
>
> i think you're right--i'm not cut out for the 9-5 world. sometimes i think i want to be a psychologist and sometimes i think i want to just marry rich (bad, i know!!). what kind of work do you do?
>
> do you think you have multiple personality disorder? i saw trudi chase (*when rabbit howls*) on oprah 10 years ago and have never forgotten that or the TV movie. so is Krazy Kat different from Kingfish?
>
> take care babe,
> sar
Posted by Krazy Kat on September 17, 2001, at 12:35:55
In reply to Re: bitch...everyone, posted by lostsailor on September 16, 2001, at 14:54:11
> Tony:
I'm Kingfish - I pulled a personality switch and changed my alter ego here to Krazy Kat. Now it's just confusing...
It sounds like you've had success with your pdoc. I'm going through a professional swtich right now, so I kind of understand the whole "trying to find yourself" situation." And there's a lot we can't control right now.
Good luck.
- K.
Could you explain the "one of them" thing for me for I am a bit "lost".Sar, I am actually affraid that I am really not cut out for the nine to five world. I have regressed into a sort of primal animal.
> Aside for grocery shopping, occasional outings with friends, and mountin biking and running, I am at home most of the time. I started to use tranquilizers at concerrts in order to survive. I did not always need them and took
> took them as needed. I procured them from friends in parking lot and my mom. Finally I talked to my doc and was given a presciption for xanax and an ssri, then refered to a psychiatrist after his effort were unfruitful. I told my shink
> all about my past use of them as well as the use of other substnces that were used for "recreation." he probed a lot and decided that although they were not pprescribed to me, I was only useing them in a close to medicinal fashion.
> he upped my dose and has they have become a central part of my life now. I felt for a while like a junkie until he described the difference between addiction and dependence. That made me feel a bit better.
>
> On becoming a psychologist... I was a social worker at the bachelor's level and relatives wonder if that's what drove me "over the edge" I do too in a way, but feel that someday I will go back to the field and help many.
> What do you do now for work. Is it satisfying? Doc told me to take a break from grad school and work for a bit and put me on temp disability because things were gettings so tough.
>
> What is a 32ouncer. Do you mean 22 like Bass Ale or 40 ouncers like uuuuuummmmmm colt 45, i think Also is Kingfish a band that you recognize?????
>
> In Peace, Tony
>
>
> > K,
> >
> > being "one of them" is fun, it's like going on a jolly little vacation; i feel like my intellect is really wrecked (but it was when i was severely depressed, too) but i'm learning how to...function somehat like a real person. at work they call me "my own private idaho" because i'm a spacey loner, they do say it affectionately though...it feels good to be *calm.* my anxiety had gone through the roof before meds.
> >
> > passion. raw passion. well, no--i'm still passionate, i'm the type to sob in public, spontaneously hug people i hardly know, feel strongly about my friends and family...and i feel passion for my new boy...i think it's the extremity that's gone. like, i no longer drive around drinking 32-oz-ers thinking about how terrible life is and the perfect suicide plan.
> >
> > i think you're right--i'm not cut out for the 9-5 world. sometimes i think i want to be a psychologist and sometimes i think i want to just marry rich (bad, i know!!). what kind of work do you do?
> >
> > do you think you have multiple personality disorder? i saw trudi chase (*when rabbit howls*) on oprah 10 years ago and have never forgotten that or the TV movie. so is Krazy Kat different from Kingfish?
> >
> > take care babe,
> > sar
Posted by sar on September 17, 2001, at 12:53:15
In reply to Re: bitch...everyone » lostsailor, posted by Krazy Kat on September 17, 2001, at 12:35:55
dear Tony,
"one of them"--well that's kind of derogatory for what i think Krazy Kat originally intended--i don't know, a real live functioning human being instead of the sweating trembling dying alien i was before?
being "one of them" means being able to hold on a conversation. for more than 3 seconds. in more than a whisper. getting out of bed to go to work. caring enough to bathe daily. having hope. being able to join a group of people talking instead of wanting to drop straight down through the floor.
that's what it means to me, anyway.
"I have regressed into a sort of primal animal." hee hee! that's so funny...i always tell people i'm a cavegirl when they look at me funny because i've no inkling of the latest mvies, television shows, radio music, movies, politics...
how are you doing on the xanax and SSRI? which SSRI is it, if i may ask? i did the same as you, i used to score vicodin, valium, and percodan from friends to chill out...it's better to have a nicely flowing legal supply, though!
what was being a social worker like? i don't know what that job entails. were you in grad school for psych? all the grad students i see look so stressed, i can only imagine how that would exacerbate depression/anxiety! (even regular college drives me crazy.)
32 oz-rs may just be a texas thing, i don't know. we have this microbrew called shiner bock, and it comes in 32-oz bottles. but i think you can also get heineken in the same size. i'm not down with 40's, too big and by the end they taste all gooey and warm to me. but i do like the novelty, 40 in one hand blunt in the otha! :)
time to go take a mother's little helper. even though i'm not a mother.
YAWN!
peace,
sar
This is the end of the thread.
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