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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by All Done on January 19, 2004, at 12:59:36
I hope you don’t mind if I rant for a bit, but yesterday I got a phone call from my mom. A few months ago she said some things that hurt me beyond my wildest dreams. It devastated me and could have destroyed my family (me, my husband, and our son). I have been having a very difficult time dealing with it all. I’ve had to distance myself from her like I’ve never done before and it has me so torn I don’t know what to do. Some days, I just despise her and think I never want to see her again. Other days, I miss her terribly.
Yesterday she called and reverted back to her old ways of crying on my shoulder and complaining about every little thing under the sun. (Unfortunately, we lost my dad just over a year ago, too.) Everything has always been only about her, but I can’t stand to have it that way, anymore. I’ve never had boundaries with her before, but I think I need them now more than ever. How do I go about putting them in place after 31 years of having none? And why does she think we can just forget about what happened and go back to the way things were?
Sorry to be so down, but it’s just been a rough day for me. Thanks for listening.
All Done
Posted by gardenergirl on January 19, 2004, at 13:09:19
In reply to Bad day : (, posted by All Done on January 19, 2004, at 12:59:36
Posted by Angielala on January 19, 2004, at 13:26:06
In reply to Bad day : (, posted by All Done on January 19, 2004, at 12:59:36
You can definitely have a good relationship with yur mom again. Back to how things used to be- well, it will be different, but for the better.
Your mom, however, has to realize what the reality of your relationship is before you two can work on it. Unfortunately, that means she has to admit her faults and also her selfishness.
Does your mom know that what she said that one time that absolutely knocked you off your feet? Is she aware of her effect on you at all?
There is *definitely* hope in this. Please try and realize that the reason this relationship isn't working is because of her lack of understanding. Perhaps your mom needs some therapy before she can realize this- but how can you tell your mom that wihtout her going bonkers? That's the hard question. I went through therapy to deal with her effects on me, and once I felt strong enough and secure enough, I was able to have that hard conversation and tell my mom how she effects me, even though she may have not wanted to hurt me, she did and she had to deal with it, not me. After a while, I got a long apology and the best efforts to be a friend to me. It took a while, but while that mother/daughter love is the toughest relationship, it's also the strongest, no matter how bad it can be at times. It's perfectly normal to despise and miss her at the same time, I know what you mean. Sometimes you need your mom to be your mom, sometimes she needs to be your friend. Mom's seem to learn this after the daughters have figured it out.
I hope that helped some- we are here for you and you can rant ANYTIME! that's what this is for!
> I hope you don’t mind if I rant for a bit, but yesterday I got a phone call from my mom. A few months ago she said some things that hurt me beyond my wildest dreams. It devastated me and could have destroyed my family (me, my husband, and our son). I have been having a very difficult time dealing with it all. I’ve had to distance myself from her like I’ve never done before and it has me so torn I don’t know what to do. Some days, I just despise her and think I never want to see her again. Other days, I miss her terribly.
>
> Yesterday she called and reverted back to her old ways of crying on my shoulder and complaining about every little thing under the sun. (Unfortunately, we lost my dad just over a year ago, too.) Everything has always been only about her, but I can’t stand to have it that way, anymore. I’ve never had boundaries with her before, but I think I need them now more than ever. How do I go about putting them in place after 31 years of having none? And why does she think we can just forget about what happened and go back to the way things were?
>
> Sorry to be so down, but it’s just been a rough day for me. Thanks for listening.
>
> All Done
>
Posted by Poet on January 19, 2004, at 13:34:15
In reply to Bad day : (, posted by All Done on January 19, 2004, at 12:59:36
This is a safe place for your rant. I haven't had the courage to tell my parents I'm in therapy, more or less that they are a major factor in why I'm in it. They're in their late 70s, so I think it's better this way, harder on me, but better.
Listen to Angilala, she has it way more together family wise than I do.
Poet
Posted by Ilene on January 19, 2004, at 13:52:49
In reply to Bad day : (, posted by All Done on January 19, 2004, at 12:59:36
> I hope you don’t mind if I rant for a bit, but yesterday I got a phone call from my mom. A few months ago she said some things that hurt me beyond my wildest dreams. It devastated me and could have destroyed my family (me, my husband, and our son). I have been having a very difficult time dealing with it all. I’ve had to distance myself from her like I’ve never done before and it has me so torn I don’t know what to do. Some days, I just despise her and think I never want to see her again. Other days, I miss her terribly.
>
> Yesterday she called and reverted back to her old ways of crying on my shoulder and complaining about every little thing under the sun. (Unfortunately, we lost my dad just over a year ago, too.) Everything has always been only about her, but I can’t stand to have it that way, anymore. I’ve never had boundaries with her before, but I think I need them now more than ever. How do I go about putting them in place after 31 years of having none? And why does she think we can just forget about what happened and go back to the way things were?
>
> Sorry to be so down, but it’s just been a rough day for me. Thanks for listening.
>
> All Done
>I think my psychiatric problems are genetic, coming from my mother's side of the family. She may or may not have been clinically depressed, but she certainly had an anxiety disorder. She was emotionally abused by her mother, too. I don't think she had much insight into herself.
My mother was extremely critical, and I was (am) extremely sensitive to criticism. A bad combination.
I try to do the best I can with my kids, but I don't act like "normal" people. I think I'm doing a better job than my mom did with me, but my depression, anxiety, chronic fatique, and other problems make it impossible for me to be like other moms.
Coming back to your post--your mother may not be aware of the effect her behavior has on other people, or she may not be in enough control of her own behavior to stop herself from saying hurtful things. It might be easier to distance yourself from her if you consider those things.
Ilene
Posted by Karen_kay on January 19, 2004, at 14:01:37
In reply to Bad day : (, posted by All Done on January 19, 2004, at 12:59:36
(((All Done)))
Your mom could be like mine and forget the things she says...
If you want to start persuing boundaries, the best way to begin is by limiting phone calls. I personally don't have a problem, as my mother never calls me. But, do you have caller ID? If so, when she calls and you don't feel like taking her call, then don't. If you don't have caller Id and she calls when you can't handle it then listen as long as you can and ring your own door bell and say you have to go. Make up excuses if you must.
If you start enforcing boundaries, then talking with her won't be nearly as dreadful. And talk with Beefcake about your situation so you can help get over (pardon my phrasing, I don't want to sound harsh as in "Just get over it " or anything like that because I know it isn't anything like that, understand what I'm throwing out here? :)) the feelings you have towards your mom, and a solution to this problem. I know it's hard to do, trust me I've been there.
Personally, I limit all contact with my mother because she is very cold and emotionless. But, she doesn't live in the same state either. Though, she's moving back to this state soon. I suspect that I still won't see too much of her.Also, if you can limit visits with your mom to a certain time limit and to a public place, that may help keep emotions from flairing. I know that attempting to talk to my mother wasn't an option. She said several times, "I know I wasn't a good mother," and "I bet you talk aobut me all the time with your therapist." But, I know that telling her she was a terrible motherwouldn't do any of us any good, so I reassure her she did the best she could, which I think is true.
Just try to remember that people deal with problems in their own way. Maybe your mother, similar to mine, was taking her own problems out on you. I'm sorry that happened. I wish that I could make that go away and never happen to anyone else again. But, we're here for you. I promise that. We need to get this sleep over going and really make it happen girl :)
Posted by Angielala on January 19, 2004, at 14:02:48
In reply to Re: Bad day : (, posted by Poet on January 19, 2004, at 13:34:15
I never thought EVER that I would EVER have a relationship that didn't irritate the heck out of me with my mom. Once I made it a top issue with my therapist, I really started working everything out for me. I got to the point where if I didn't have a normal relationship with her, it would be okay with me. I was ready for the worst and felt okay about that- and then my mom said one day, "I am so sorry for never being there for you. I don't know how you stayed so strong." Strong- NEVER considered myself strong, because through it all, it was hard and I often felt helpless. But for my mom to say those words, everything began to fall in place. I could actually forgive her, once she realized and admitted this.
Poet- thanks for making me FEEL so together :) Age difference can be a big factor. My mom is young, only 46. I made her aware of my therapy once I felt confident enough for any backlash they could have thrown my way. I thought of it this way- I knew I needed help. I admitted it. I got help, I'm working on myself to make sure I will be okay. If my parents came back and started bashing therapy or me actually needing therapy- then I knew it was that stigma... that "MY daughter doesn't need help!" because parents are too afraid to think that there may have been a problem with their upbringing. When my mom said that I was fine and blowing things out of proportion by going to therapy, I simply said, "I know my potential and am working to reach my fullest. I feel bad that you cannot understand why, but would appreciate respect for trying to better myself than to keep family taboos." Of course this intiated a 2 year silence, but that's what brought my mom around- she actually thought about what I said and realized that I didn't need her in my life if she was only going to try and deny what really happened. Like I said, it's a long road, but it's worth it- there is so much hope and love- and you have them. Don't waste that on anyone who's trying to keep you from finding yourself. The fact of the matter, my mom reflected on her current realtionship with her mom, and began to realize that if SHE didn't do anything about it, I'd become just as estranged as she and her mom did. She was close enough to that mid-life scare that life isn't the way you planned and she acted on it. I think a generation or two older than my mom has an even tougher time understanding these things because taboos were much more common then. It's a generation gap AND a stigma that needs to be conquered. Geez- it's like we should win medals for dealing with all their crap sometimes :)
All Done- focus on you, put her out of your mind. I know how hard that is, and how hard harboring that anger can be. Focus on you, and how much more together you are than you might realize. You are SO much stronger than so many people who have to deal with this strange mother/daughter quandry. Follow your heart on this one, that's what needs protection and your nuturing :)
> This is a safe place for your rant. I haven't had the courage to tell my parents I'm in therapy, more or less that they are a major factor in why I'm in it. They're in their late 70s, so I think it's better this way, harder on me, but better.
>
> Listen to Angilala, she has it way more together family wise than I do.
>
> Poet
Posted by Poet on January 19, 2004, at 15:07:53
In reply to Re: Bad day : (, posted by Angielala on January 19, 2004, at 14:02:48
I'm glad you think you're mother's still young, because I reluctantly admit I'm her age. Still want to be my friend, if I promise no mid-life crisis? My whole life is a crisis.
BTW, my first reference just got called, one to go (he's an MD so he'll be hard to reach, but I hope he kept a patient waiting, hee, hee.)
Poet who's damn old and now everybody knows it
Posted by All Done on January 19, 2004, at 20:54:25
In reply to Hang in there! We're here for you. (nm), posted by gardenergirl on January 19, 2004, at 13:09:19
Thank you, gardnergirl. I really needed a little extra support today.
Posted by All Done on January 19, 2004, at 21:29:52
In reply to Re: Bad day : (, posted by Angielala on January 19, 2004, at 13:26:06
> You can definitely have a good relationship with yur mom again. Back to how things used to be- well, it will be different, but for the better.
>>I know, I think I'm just having a hard time admitting that it's never going to be the same. Funny, though, how I never thought our relationship was that great and now part of me just wants that back.
> Your mom, however, has to realize what the reality of your relationship is before you two can work on it. Unfortunately, that means she has to admit her faults and also her selfishness.
>
> Does your mom know that what she said that one time that absolutely knocked you off your feet? Is she aware of her effect on you at all?>>Well, without getting into too much detail, her words caused a lot of third parties to get involved and everyone told her how much harm she caused. But, to answer your question, she has no idea of the damage she did. She has many issues from her own past and I believe they came creeping through and this was a cry for help.
> There is *definitely* hope in this. Please try and realize that the reason this relationship isn't working is because of her lack of understanding. Perhaps your mom needs some therapy before she can realize this- but how can you tell your mom that wihtout her going bonkers? That's the hard question. I went through therapy to deal with her effects on me, and once I felt strong enough and secure enough, I was able to have that hard conversation and tell my mom how she effects me, even though she may have not wanted to hurt me, she did and she had to deal with it, not me. After a while, I got a long apology and the best efforts to be a friend to me. It took a while, but while that mother/daughter love is the toughest relationship, it's also the strongest, no matter how bad it can be at times. It's perfectly normal to despise and miss her at the same time, I know what you mean. Sometimes you need your mom to be your mom, sometimes she needs to be your friend. Mom's seem to learn this after the daughters have figured it out.
>>After I was able to stop yelling at her, I told her that the only way she *might* be able to repair our relationship was if she went to therapy. After a couple of months of thinking she wasn't going to do it, she finally did. She has been going for just over a month now and she told me she is working on some difficult stuff from her past. My husband and I have had a couple of meetings with a therapist to do some family work and we are all going to meet with my mom next week. My therapist knows everything and referred me to the family therapist. I probably spend at least half of each of my sessions on my mom stuff. So, I'm thinking we have enough therapy going on to start working on things.
> I hope that helped some- we are here for you and you can rant ANYTIME! that's what this is for!
>>Thank you so much. It's nice to have all this support.
Posted by All Done on January 19, 2004, at 21:34:56
In reply to Re: Bad day : (, posted by Poet on January 19, 2004, at 13:34:15
> This is a safe place for your rant. I haven't had the courage to tell my parents I'm in therapy, more or less that they are a major factor in why I'm in it. They're in their late 70s, so I think it's better this way, harder on me, but better.
>>I'm practically dragging my mom (kicking and screaming) to a therapist for herself and to a different one for some family therapy. She's almost 70, so her history is so ingrained in her. Hopefully, she can get something from it, though.
> Listen to Angilala, she has it way more together family wise than I do.
>
> Poet>>Thanks for making this a safe place for me to rant.
Posted by All Done on January 19, 2004, at 21:50:19
In reply to About moms, posted by Ilene on January 19, 2004, at 13:52:49
> I think my psychiatric problems are genetic, coming from my mother's side of the family. She may or may not have been clinically depressed, but she certainly had an anxiety disorder. She was emotionally abused by her mother, too. I don't think she had much insight into herself.
>
> My mother was extremely critical, and I was (am) extremely sensitive to criticism. A bad combination.
>
> I try to do the best I can with my kids, but I don't act like "normal" people. I think I'm doing a better job than my mom did with me, but my depression, anxiety, chronic fatique, and other problems make it impossible for me to be like other moms.
>
> Coming back to your post--your mother may not be aware of the effect her behavior has on other people, or she may not be in enough control of her own behavior to stop herself from saying hurtful things. It might be easier to distance yourself from her if you consider those things.
>
> Ilene
>I can totally relate. Sorry if I'm repeating myself a bit, but I'm not sure who reads what. I told my mom that in order to get any relationship back with me and my family, she needs to see a therapist. I really believe she is suffering from depression and possibly more. I too believe that my mental health has been "handed down" to me from her and I worry (actually, obsess is a better word) about being just like her. I worry about my son, but at least I know I will always be open and honest with him. It feels strange putting myself first, but all I know is that I have to take care of myself in order to be able to take care of my son.
Thanks for sharing your story with me.
Posted by All Done on January 19, 2004, at 23:19:31
In reply to Re: Bad day : (, posted by Karen_kay on January 19, 2004, at 14:01:37
(((All Done)))
Your mom could be like mine and forget the things she says...
If you want to start persuing boundaries, the best way to begin is by limiting phone calls. I personally don't have a problem, as my mother never calls me. But, do you have caller ID? If so, when she calls and you don't feel like taking her call, then don't. If you don't have caller Id and she calls when you can't handle it then listen as long as you can and ring your own door bell and say you have to go. Make up excuses if you must.
If you start enforcing boundaries, then talking with her won't be nearly as dreadful. And talk with Beefcake about your situation so you can help get over (pardon my phrasing, I don't want to sound harsh as in "Just get over it " or anything like that because I know it isn't anything like that, understand what I'm throwing out here? :)) the feelings you have towards your mom, and a solution to this problem. I know it's hard to do, trust me I've been there.
Personally, I limit all contact with my mother because she is very cold and emotionless. But, she doesn't live in the same state either. Though, she's moving back to this state soon. I suspect that I still won't see too much of her.
Also, if you can limit visits with your mom to a certain time limit and to a public place, that may help keep emotions from flairing. I know that attempting to talk to my mother wasn't an option. She said several times, "I know I wasn't a good mother," and "I bet you talk aobut me all the time with your therapist." But, I know that telling her she was a terrible motherwouldn't do any of us any good, so I reassure her she did the best she could, which I think is true.
Just try to remember that people deal with problems in their own way. Maybe your mother, similar to mine, was taking her own problems out on you. I'm sorry that happened. I wish that I could make that go away and never happen to anyone else again. But, we're here for you. I promise that. We need to get this sleep over going and really make it happen girl :)>>I’ve always felt the need to “avoid” her – even before everything happened. She simply drains me and now it’s so much worse because I resent her terribly for it. I had actually checked the caller ID when she called, but I weighed out the possible feelings that would come up for me in talking to her vs. the guilt I would feel until I called her back (which, I would inevitably do and which would inevitably cause all the feelings I’m having anyway).
Beefcake knows all about my mom and referred us to a family therapist who we will all visit (me, my husband, and my mom) next week. I always tell him I don’t want to talk about her and then I end up talking about her for half of the session (equipped with tears and everything…ugh).
And I don’t know if you’ve read my other responses, but I know my mom has more than the lion’s share of problems herself. I’ve told her if she doesn’t go to therapy for herself, there’s no chance of repairing our relationship. So, after a bit of a fight, she’s going (all the while making sure I know it’s a *huge* burden on her – whatever).
I keep telling myself – baby steps. I think that’s all I can hope for right now.
Thanks for the support and the hugs. I so needed them today.
Posted by gardenergirl on January 20, 2004, at 0:05:48
In reply to Re: Bad day : ( » Karen_kay, posted by All Done on January 19, 2004, at 23:19:31
All done,
I wanted to write more, but I was running late. Just wanted to give a little more support your way. It sounds like things are really difficult with your mom. I know I am just starting to deal with inadequate parenting in my therapy. It's really hard to still want a relationship knowing that there are problems. I think it's one of life's growing up lessons that many of us avoid. The fact that we can't change our family, but we so desparately want things to be better.Good for you for setting some boundaries. Remember, boundaries are for you to feel safe, not to keep others out. Now, if only I could get my brother into therapy.
Take care of yourself!
gg
Posted by All Done on January 20, 2004, at 9:31:51
In reply to Re: Bad day : (, posted by gardenergirl on January 20, 2004, at 0:05:48
> All done,
> I wanted to write more, but I was running late. Just wanted to give a little more support your way. It sounds like things are really difficult with your mom. I know I am just starting to deal with inadequate parenting in my therapy. It's really hard to still want a relationship knowing that there are problems. I think it's one of life's growing up lessons that many of us avoid. The fact that we can't change our family, but we so desparately want things to be better.
>
> Good for you for setting some boundaries. Remember, boundaries are for you to feel safe, not to keep others out.Thanks for reminding me of that. I just need to keep telling myself that this is about taking care of myself, not my mom. That's a hard thing to change after so many years, though.
>Now, if only I could get my brother into therapy.
Family stuff is so difficult. I hope you can work through yours, too.
>
> Take care of yourself!
>
> ggThanks for taking the extra time to follow up. I was hoping today would be a better day, but I'm still feeling a little down. It helped to have your support this morning, though.
Posted by Ilene on January 22, 2004, at 9:18:39
In reply to Re: About moms » Ilene, posted by All Done on January 19, 2004, at 21:50:19
> I can totally relate. Sorry if I'm repeating myself a bit, but I'm not sure who reads what. I told my mom that in order to get any relationship back with me and my family, she needs to see a therapist. I really believe she is suffering from depression and possibly more. I too believe that my mental health has been "handed down" to me from her and I worry (actually, obsess is a better word) about being just like her. I worry about my son, but at least I know I will always be open and honest with him. It feels strange putting myself first, but all I know is that I have to take care of myself in order to be able to take care of my son.
>
> Thanks for sharing your story with me.
If I shared my entire story it would take days.My older sister just laughed off my mother's insulting behavior. She and her family were killed 16 years ago. After that my mother took down all the her pictures and refused to even hear her name mentioned. My mother died 6 years ago.
I know my mother's younger sister was depressed. One of her sons is "normal" as far as I can tell, but the other son must have a serious personality disorder. I don't see him very often, which is a good thing, because he's a little spooky. He started getting strange when he was in his late teens.
Now I'm starting to worry about *my* son. He's 13, and having problems in school. His social life has fallen off, too. He's going to be evaluated for ADD in a couple of months. I'm worried that whatever genetic mishap afflicts me and half my relatives could be expressed in him.
Ilene
This is the end of the thread.
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