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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 30. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by fairywings on January 8, 2006, at 20:45:12
I've been really depressed lately, and I think it's partly bec. I can't handle the emotions that go along with therapy - sitting w/the feelings that come up, the anxiety of talking about things and the depression that comes after, the dependence, the needy feeling, the feelings of humiliation and low self esteem, etc. I honestly wonder if I'd be better off w/o therapy. My T is unavailable right now, and I think I want to wean myself from therapy bec. it's too overwhelming. Since he's unavailable, I think I'd be fine, maybe better off, if I weaned away from therapy.
Sometimes when I think about things I get so anxious I feel like I'm going to have a heart attack, and when I sit with my mind unoccupied, trying to just be with my feelings, it feels like my heart is very heavy, or I have a rotted feeling inside - which comes on me all of a sudden and scares me. But mostly now I just feel bad - I don't even know how to describe it.
I talked to my husband about quitting - he's a great guy, very kind, but he has NO negative feelings ever (never sad, down, or depressed) and no interest to get in touch with any feelings, so he's just no help figuring it out. He doesn't understand my feelings of sadness, why I start to cry for no reason out of the blue, why therapy would be so overwhelming, and when I was suicidal he just pretty much patted me on the head, asked if he could get me anything, and went on his way. It's not that he doesn't care, he just honestly doesn't have a clue.
When I went to my pdoc and told him how depressed I'd been feeling; my level of anxiety was through the roof about an hour before my appt. and all during my appt. Just thinking about having to tell him makes me incredibly anxious. I just don't know how many times I can go through that, maybe one of these times I will have a heart attack, and if therapy is partly bringing up those bad/depressed feelings, is it worth it? I don't get anxious like that with my T, just when I have to talk to my pdoc about changes for the worse in my mood, and he's always so nice. I don't know why I get so anxious. I guess it's the humiliation and low self esteem. And I know he's not judging me in any way, so that's not the issue. I know he just wants to help.
Should I quit therapy now that I have a chance to wean away?
fw
Posted by muffled on January 8, 2006, at 22:00:42
In reply to I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger**, posted by fairywings on January 8, 2006, at 20:45:12
> I've been really depressed lately, and I think it's partly bec. I can't handle the emotions that go along with therapy - sitting w/the feelings that come up, the anxiety of talking about things and the depression that comes after, the dependence, the needy feeling, the feelings of humiliation and low self esteem, etc. I honestly wonder if I'd be better off w/o therapy. My T is unavailable right now, and I think I want to wean myself from therapy bec. it's too overwhelming. Since he's unavailable, I think I'd be fine, maybe better off, if I weaned away from therapy.
****I know EXACTLY what you are saying.
>
> Sometimes when I think about things I get so anxious I feel like I'm going to have a heart attack, and when I sit with my mind unoccupied, trying to just be with my feelings, it feels like my heart is very heavy, or I have a rotted feeling inside - which comes on me all of a sudden and scares me. But mostly now I just feel bad - I don't even know how to describe it.***yeah I got badness inside too that I can't make go away.
>
> I talked to my husband about quitting - he's a great guy, very kind, but he has NO negative feelings ever (never sad, down, or depressed) and no interest to get in touch with any feelings, so he's just no help figuring it out. He doesn't understand my feelings of sadness, why I start to cry for no reason out of the blue, why therapy would be so overwhelming, and when I was suicidal he just pretty much patted me on the head, asked if he could get me anything, and went on his way. It's not that he doesn't care, he just honestly doesn't have a clue.***My husband had a crazy upbringing but he's way better adapted than me. He keeps teeling me its all in my mind, I just have to decide I gonna be betterand not shy and just go for it like he did and everything will be fine. He don't get it either. Makes me wonder about myself even more. What the hells my problem anyways.
>
> When I went to my pdoc and told him how depressed I'd been feeling; my level of anxiety was through the roof about an hour before my appt. and all during my appt. Just thinking about having to tell him makes me incredibly anxious. I just don't know how many times I can go through that, maybe one of these times I will have a heart attack, and if therapy is partly bringing up those bad/depressed feelings, is it worth it? I don't get anxious like that with my T, just when I have to talk to my pdoc about changes for the worse in my mood, and he's always so nice. I don't know why I get so anxious. I guess it's the humiliation and low self esteem. And I know he's not judging me in any way, so that's not the issue. I know he just wants to help.***I'm just starting to be ok with my T. But the thing is, sometimes I wonder why I 'stir up the pot' as it were. Everytime things get a little intense, I freak and do SI and then my T backs off. Now she wants me to do dbt cuz I think she dunno what to do with wacko me. :(
>
> Should I quit therapy now that I have a chance to wean away?***I had a therapy break and I never felt better. Went back to my old familiar comfortable (dysfunctional) patterns. But it started to go wrong again, so I went back.
Sigh.
Muffled.
Posted by annierose on January 8, 2006, at 22:20:40
In reply to I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger**, posted by fairywings on January 8, 2006, at 20:45:12
We can't answer that question for you fw, but I will give you my experience w/quitting when therapy got too overwhelming. Those overwhelming feelings are inside of you. Just because I quit, they didn't go away. Yes, I buried them, but they would come up again and again. Those feelings that are hard to get a handle on, the overwhelming ones, attachment, longing, lonliness, they don't just disappear. In fact, the more we try to ignore them, the more they like to show up at the worst times.
I went back to therapy, years later. I wish I never quit the first time. Probably would have made different life choices. On the other hand, I made some great choices in the rage of anger after quitting --- putting that energy towards owning my own business. BUT ... in general, I look back with regret and wonder, what if I stuck it out ...
Fairywings, I'm sorry it's so hard right now. I know. I'm there too. But I keep talking about it over and over and over again. I think I'm making progress and so will you.
I hope my situation will help answer some of your questions. Why don't you ask your T these same questions. He will be able to help you too.
Posted by Maynerd on January 8, 2006, at 22:30:00
In reply to I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger**, posted by fairywings on January 8, 2006, at 20:45:12
Absolutely does NOT sound stupid, it sounds very real for you as well as others (me included). I always hated it that my T would cause such a whirlwind of emotions inside of me, then tell me goodbye until next time. By the time I would bring myself back under control it was time to see my T again for another dose.
Personally, I feel that you know what is best for you and so if you really feel you want to break free then perhaps you should try. DO you have a plan in mind? Are you going to quit forever, until a certain time, or perhaps until you feel the need to work through something? Could more time between meetings work rather than total abstinence? Only you know the best answer for that of course, but I truly believe that you will do what is best for your well being and happiness.
Posted by vwoolf on January 9, 2006, at 1:04:32
In reply to I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger**, posted by fairywings on January 8, 2006, at 20:45:12
>>or I have a rotted feeling inside
I also get this so often, and when I feel really bad I imagine worms and maggots inside me too. Anyone have any idea why?
Posted by happyflower on January 9, 2006, at 2:33:33
In reply to I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger**, posted by fairywings on January 8, 2006, at 20:45:12
I emailed you this morning. Please take care of yourself and no, you don't sound stupid. I think a lot of babblers understand what you feel. I have many times wanted to quit therapy because it was just too darn hard sometimes, but for some reason I continued, and I am doing better. It is hard to sit with feelings, I hate that too, it is like torture to me. Please keep in touch. ((((((((((fw)))))))))))))
Posted by fairywings on January 9, 2006, at 7:32:07
In reply to Rotted feeling, posted by vwoolf on January 9, 2006, at 1:04:32
(((V)))
In Caroline Myss' CDs on "Self Esteem: Your Fundamental Power" she says that sometimes what we do to ourselves is like when the inuit ppl eat rotted carcass - you know not good for the body. And what we feed our minds, through our own self abuse, is the same thing. I have tried to watch my thought patterns, but it seems sep. from the waves of feelings that come over me. I don't imagine the maggots, but I know that must be a horrible visual and a horrible feeling.
fw
Posted by fairywings on January 9, 2006, at 7:32:34
In reply to ((((((((((Fairywings))))))))))))))), posted by happyflower on January 9, 2006, at 2:33:33
thanks hf, i emailed you.
fw
Posted by Poet on January 9, 2006, at 8:49:38
In reply to I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger**, posted by fairywings on January 8, 2006, at 20:45:12
Hi Fairywings,
I quit therapy because I didn't think it was helping me and I lasted two weeks of crying and feeling more miserable before I called her and went back.
I get the why am I doing this and I am going to quit feeling regularly. My T just sort of sighs and says *this again.* I keep telling her that if I quit again she shouldn't take me back. She always says that she can't do that, she'll always take me back.
T says that if I quit because I've gone as far as I can in therapy that's one thing. If I quit because I think I'm not making progress, that's another thing. I am making progress, etc. Well, I'm glad somebody thinks so because I sure don't.
Anyway, this is my experience in quitting and/or thinking about quitting from my perspective and my T's.
Poet
Posted by fairywings on January 9, 2006, at 10:21:04
In reply to Re: I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger** » fairywings, posted by muffled on January 8, 2006, at 22:00:42
> ***yeah I got badness inside too that I can't make go away.
> >(((muffy)))
>>My husband had a crazy upbringing but he's way better adapted than me. He keeps teeling me its all in my mind, I just have to decide I gonna be betterand not shy and just go for it like he did and everything will be fine.
**That's the prob. w/ppl who just went for it and it turned out okay, their perspective is different. Okay, it's all in our mind, but that doesn't make the fear any less real or scary.
>>He don't get it either. Makes me wonder about myself even more. What the hells my problem anyways.
** Don't make it undermine your confidence any more. It's hard to understand what holds us back, it's hard to even start to think about it. When I do, my thoughts just get all jumbled up because I have no direction. Like a big traffic jam.
>>I'm just starting to be ok with my T. But the thing is, sometimes I wonder why I 'stir up the pot' as it were. Everytime things get a little intense, I freak and do SI and then my T backs off. Now she wants me to do dbt cuz I think she dunno what to do with wacko me. :(
**I don't know anything about DBT, but I've heard gg recommend it, so it must be good. I think it's about being accountable? It's pretty intense isn't it?
>>I had a therapy break and I never felt better. Went back to my old familiar comfortable (dysfunctional) patterns. But it started to go wrong again, so I went back.
***I think I'd be okay, but not change much. On the other hand, if I go I'll feel dependant, and I'm not comfy with that.
fw
Posted by fairywings on January 9, 2006, at 10:31:09
In reply to Re: I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger** » fairywings, posted by annierose on January 8, 2006, at 22:20:40
> We can't answer that question for you fw, but I will give you my experience w/quitting when therapy got too overwhelming. Those overwhelming feelings are inside of you. Just because I quit, they didn't go away. Yes, I buried them, but they would come up again and again. Those feelings that are hard to get a handle on, the overwhelming ones, attachment, longing, lonliness, they don't just disappear. In fact, the more we try to ignore them, the more they like to show up at the worst times.
**Thanks Annie, I guess I know no one has that answer for me. I know I'm really dysfunctional, but I wonder if in therapy I'm dysfunctional and anxious! ; ) I wonder if I'm fighting just as hard to keep being dysfunctional because it feels safe to be in my own world, even though it's lonely. I guess there are things I have to admit to myself and face up to b4 I'll get anywhere.
>> I went back to therapy, years later. I wish I never quit the first time. BUT ... in general, I look back with regret and wonder, what if I stuck it out ...**Yeah, I feel that way about school, I beat myself for not finishing. Hindsight.
> Fairywings, I'm sorry it's so hard right now. I know. I'm there too. But I keep talking about it over and over and over again. I think I'm making progress and so will you.***How often do you go Annie? I'm sorry I don't remember. I'm sorry it's hard for you too. I guess what doesn't kill us will make us stronger.
> I hope my situation will help answer some of your questions. Why don't you ask your T these same questions. He will be able to help you too.***Yes, I can see that if I quit now, I might just have to start all over again later. I will talk to my T about it if I go back. Maybe he can help me sort it out.
Thanks Annie,
fw
Posted by fairywings on January 9, 2006, at 11:19:52
In reply to Re: I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger**, posted by Maynerd on January 8, 2006, at 22:30:00
> Absolutely does NOT sound stupid, it sounds very real for you as well as others (me included).
***Thanks Maynerd.
>>>I always hated it that my T would cause such a whirlwind of emotions inside of me, then tell me goodbye until next time. By the time I would bring myself back under control it was time to see my T again for another dose.
***How do ppl keep going back for that, and back for that? I think it's just so overwhelming.
> Personally, I feel that you know what is best for you and so if you really feel you want to break free then perhaps you should try.
***I'm searching my heart, don't know what's best yet. Maybe I will try, just to see how I do. Not like it's irrevocable.
>>DO you have a plan in mind?
***No plan whatsoever.
>>>Could more time between meetings work rather than total abstinence?
***It's the time in between that wreaks havoc on me. Sitting with the feelings is overwhelming. Waves of sadness and despair, but no idea where they come from.
>>Only you know the best answer for that of course, but I truly believe that you will do what is best for your well being and happiness.
Thanks Maynerd, I have lots to think about.
fw
Posted by fairywings on January 9, 2006, at 12:07:36
In reply to Re: I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger** » fairywings, posted by Poet on January 9, 2006, at 8:49:38
Thanks Poet.
> I lasted two weeks of crying and feeling more miserable before I called her and went back.
***Were you depressed?
> She always says that she can't do that, she'll always take me back.***She's very kind, I'm sure many T's get ppl quitting alot, it's very difficult to put yourself through something like this voluntarily.
> I am making progress, etc. Well, I'm glad somebody thinks so because I sure don't.Yeah, I guess the scary feelings mean there's something going on, and that's supposed to be good, but you know what? I hate it.
Thanks (((Poet)))
fw
Posted by madeline on January 9, 2006, at 14:46:51
In reply to I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger**, posted by fairywings on January 8, 2006, at 20:45:12
When you say that your therapist is unavailable - what do you mean? Out of town? Quit his practice? Because it sounds like you need him/her very badly right now.
I also went through several times like this in therapy myself, and always came out better for it. I think you sort of HAVE to re-live some of the pain, anxiety and depression that you should have felt a long time ago. Some of the things that are brought to the surface in therapy ARE very bad, so why wouldn't you feel bad?
But the key is about containment, containment, containment and working with someone that can help you control and overcome those feelings while you work through them. I don't think you need to quit therapy, but both you and your therapist (or another one) should work together to find approaches that don't leave you feeling so overwhelmed.
Posted by fallsfall on January 9, 2006, at 18:28:00
In reply to I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger**, posted by fairywings on January 8, 2006, at 20:45:12
My anxiety decreased a lot when I INCREASED my sessions. It means that there is less time between sessions, so you need to hold yourself together for less time. It also means that you are getting MORE help.
I know that increasing sessions isn't the solution for everyone, but it has made a world of difference to me.
Posted by Dinah on January 9, 2006, at 18:29:41
In reply to Re: I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger** » fairywings, posted by fallsfall on January 9, 2006, at 18:28:00
I had the same experience as Falls.
Posted by Poet on January 9, 2006, at 18:35:44
In reply to Re: I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger** » Poet, posted by fairywings on January 9, 2006, at 12:07:36
Hi Fairywings,
> ***Were you depressed?
I felt way more depressed. I felt even more like a complete therapy failure. Calling her to say I wanted to come back was hard, because I was judging myself for having failed at something. She wasn't judging me, I was judge, jury and the executioner.
> ***She's very kind, I'm sure many T's get ppl quitting alot, it's very difficult to put yourself through something like this voluntarily.
She looked happy to see me. I can't believe anybody would look happy to see me, especially somebody who only hears me whine and complain
> Yeah, I guess the scary feelings mean there's something going on, and that's supposed to be good, but you know what? I hate it.
I hate it, too. I hate feeling vulnerable. I hate feeling dependent on my therapist.
Safe cyber hugs to you ((((FW))))
Poet
Posted by fairywings on January 9, 2006, at 18:47:54
In reply to Re: I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger**, posted by madeline on January 9, 2006, at 14:46:51
> what do you mean? Out of town? Quit his practice? Because it sounds like you need him/her very badly right now.
***Out of town. I will have my appt. this week.
> I also went through several times like this in therapy myself, and always came out better for it.
***That's good to know. Reassuring.
> But the key is about containment, containment, containment and working with someone that can help you control and overcome those feelings while you work through them.
***I have no idea how to do that, and I don't think he had any idea I was going to sink. How do you contain feelings? Or is that something that can't be explained?
>>I don't think you need to quit therapy, but both you and your therapist (or another one) should work together to find approaches that don't leave you feeling so overwhelmed.
***I wouldn't see anyone else, he's really wonderful, but you're right, I need to not feel this way all the time. It's going to ruin my marriage if I do.
Thanks,
fw
Posted by fairywings on January 9, 2006, at 18:50:33
In reply to Re: I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger** » fairywings, posted by fallsfall on January 9, 2006, at 18:28:00
> My anxiety decreased a lot when I INCREASED my sessions. It means that there is less time between sessions, so you need to hold yourself together for less time. It also means that you are getting MORE help.
>
> I know that increasing sessions isn't the solution for everyone, but it has made a world of difference to me.Hi falls, i wish I could do this bec. then I wouldn't have to sit with it, but I can't bec. of ins. actually I will have to reduce this year, and that's part of what made me fear getting into this any further, and fear having to sit with this time after time after time.
fw
Posted by fairywings on January 9, 2006, at 18:54:48
In reply to Re: I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger** » fairywings, posted by Poet on January 9, 2006, at 18:35:44
> I felt way more depressed. I felt even more like a complete therapy failure. Calling her to say I wanted to come back was hard, because I was judging myself for having failed at something. She wasn't judging me, I was judge, jury and the executioner.***You and I are so the same. I feel like a failure admitting I need help, admitting there's anything wrong. I know I'd have the same experience.
> She looked happy to see me. I can't believe anybody would look happy to see me, especially somebody who only hears me whine and complain
***You're always so sweet, I would love an IRL friend like you Poet.
> I hate it, too. I hate feeling vulnerable. I hate feeling dependent on my therapist.
***Yeah, it all feels so sad, and overwhelming, and lonely.
> Safe cyber hugs to you ((((FW))))
You too (((Poet))) Thanks.
fw
Posted by fairywings on January 9, 2006, at 18:55:25
In reply to Re: I know this is going to sound stupid **trigge, posted by Dinah on January 9, 2006, at 18:29:41
Posted by LegWarmers on January 10, 2006, at 15:06:23
In reply to I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger**, posted by fairywings on January 8, 2006, at 20:45:12
Its not stupid at all, I go through this in my mind all the time. I havent read the thread so I hope Im not repeating but...maybe you could take a break? You don't have to stop altogether, therapy doesnt have to be intense all the time either, you could try and talk about less stressful things? Id definatly tell him how you feel though.
(((fairywings)))
Posted by madeline on January 10, 2006, at 19:31:38
In reply to I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger**, posted by fairywings on January 8, 2006, at 20:45:12
I took the day and thought about your question - how does one contain feelings like this?
I do think increasing your therapy sessions is a good idea. When I start to feel bad, or anxious beyond all reason, I am right at my T's door.
He helps me to understand that it's okay to feel like crap and that I have every right to feel like crap, and that I can go therapy and just let go of it a little at a time.
It's almost as though the feelings are contained in therapy, I can express them there, where it is safe and no on is going to run out of the screaming.
Talk about pity parties, murderous rages, deeply felt suicidal impulses, i've run the gamut. I just let them all out in therapy.
I know that I only have to wait one week (or less) until I can get some of that awful burden off my back.
If you like and trust your therapist, please don't quit.
Posted by fairywings on January 11, 2006, at 13:31:31
In reply to Re: I know this is going to sound stupid **trigger** » fairywings, posted by LegWarmers on January 10, 2006, at 15:06:23
thanks LW I will think about what you said, I appreciate you a lot.
fw
Posted by fairywings on January 11, 2006, at 13:35:45
In reply to I agree with Dinah and Falls, posted by madeline on January 10, 2006, at 19:31:38
> I took the day and thought about your question - how does one contain feelings like this?
>
> I do think increasing your therapy sessions is a good idea. When I start to feel bad, or anxious beyond all reason, I am right at my T's door.***Thanks madeline i appreciate that you gave it a lot of thought. your post makes so much sense, wish i could increase, but can't afford it.
> It's almost as though the feelings are contained in therapy, I can express them there, where it is safe and no on is going to run out of the screaming.
***I hope i get to feeling like i can contain them. i just want to sleep it off.
>
> Talk about pity parties, murderous rages, deeply felt suicidal impulses, i've run the gamut. I just let them all out in therapy.
>***You are really brave to be able to express all of that. How long have you done therapy?
> If you like and trust your therapist, please don't quit.***I do like him very much. He's very kind, and i think in the long run, it will be helpful. i just don't like the feelings right now.
thanks again, you're awesome.
fw
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