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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 17 of 17. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by LlurpsieNoodle on June 17, 2007, at 12:21:37
I think it's related to switching T's, since my medication hasn't changed.
Things like depersonalization (which is the most bewildering and distressing condition of feeling like one's body parts (i.e. when viewed in a mirror, or looking down at the hands) don't belong to me.
Strange sensations when I close my eyes. Like my body is huge and tiny at the same time.
Like my body is being pulled in different directions with sharp cords.
Hearing voices in the ambient noise. Even with earplugs. The voices can't be distinguished, or understood- just sounds like a background murmur. This happens when I'm trying to fall asleep. Whenever I open my eyes, the voices are silenced.
I can't fall asleep unless I feel safe, which means NOT closing my eyes.
2 nights ago, I fell asleep while focusing my eyes on a star in the night sky (remembering that I used to stare at the moon out of my window when household circumstances prohibited falling asleep)
Last night I just took a klonopin and stared at the ceiling.
Seems like my body is trying to tell me something, but I'm not really in a position to listen, because I feel too much change in my life right now. I DONT WANT THIS STUFF right now. I just want to chill out and relax.
I'm terrified that these psycho episodes are what awaits me if I don't distract myself every minute of the day. Spinning out of control is just not an option that is acceptable to me, at least not until I'm actually in a safe therapy environment, and I have a pdoc who will be there to clean up the mess. :(
-Ll
Posted by Dinah on June 17, 2007, at 13:24:53
In reply to Been having more psycho episodes, posted by LlurpsieNoodle on June 17, 2007, at 12:21:37
> Things like depersonalization (which is the most bewildering and distressing condition of feeling like one's body parts (i.e. when viewed in a mirror, or looking down at the hands) don't belong to me.
I think that's related to anxiety. I'm guessing you have plenty of reasons for anxiety.
> Strange sensations when I close my eyes. Like my body is huge and tiny at the same time.That also happens to me, when I'm tired and stressed. Maybe it's related to the first thing.
> Hearing voices in the ambient noise. Even with earplugs. The voices can't be distinguished, or understood- just sounds like a background murmur. This happens when I'm trying to fall asleep. Whenever I open my eyes, the voices are silenced.This happens to me too. My sleep doctor gave it a name, and called it part of my supposed narcolepsy (which the latest sleep doctor doesn't think I have). But neither was overly concerned about it, so it must be common enough. It happens to me when I've had an overstimulating day. Too much stress or too long hours, or too much noise and lights. I always figured it was just my neurons getting rid of the extra input from the day.
> I can't fall asleep unless I feel safe, which means NOT closing my eyes.
>
> 2 nights ago, I fell asleep while focusing my eyes on a star in the night sky (remembering that I used to stare at the moon out of my window when household circumstances prohibited falling asleep)
>
> Last night I just took a klonopin and stared at the ceiling.
>
> Seems like my body is trying to tell me something, but I'm not really in a position to listen, because I feel too much change in my life right now. I DONT WANT THIS STUFF right now. I just want to chill out and relax.
>
> I'm terrified that these psycho episodes are what awaits me if I don't distract myself every minute of the day. Spinning out of control is just not an option that is acceptable to me, at least not until I'm actually in a safe therapy environment, and I have a pdoc who will be there to clean up the mess. :(
>
> -LlI'm guessing your body is trying to tell you that it's stressed, and needs sleep. And maybe that all the changes lately have been just too much for you and you're having an upsurge of anxiety.
The problem is that the anxiety you're experiencing as a result of the symptoms of anxiety is causing even more anxiety and stress and thus more symptoms.
I'm guessing it would help to stop the cycle somehow. Short term sleeping medication to stop the sleep shortage problem? Some CBT from your therapist to control the physical symptoms of anxiety and reframe how you view them?
I'm no doctor of course, and I'm only speaking from my own experience. But these things aren't really psycho episodes, although they're dreadfully uncomfortable. They're your body's response to stress, anxiety, and lack of sleep.
Do you meditate? Or practice your breathing?
Posted by OzLand on June 17, 2007, at 23:30:04
In reply to Been having more psycho episodes, posted by LlurpsieNoodle on June 17, 2007, at 12:21:37
Sorry, but we don't get to choose when this stuff pops up. God knows, I sure did not want it to pop up two years ago, but it did. Yes it sounds like you are having depersonalization and dissociative episodes. So, think about what you are trying to stuff back away, and this will clue you to what you need to talk about in therapy. It won't go away, and you already know that keeping busy doesn't make it go away either. Wish it did, I would be the queen of denial and avoidance if it did.
Posted by sleepygirl on June 17, 2007, at 23:44:00
In reply to Been having more psycho episodes, posted by LlurpsieNoodle on June 17, 2007, at 12:21:37
hey lurpsie,
sorry things are rough. must be tough with a new t
I hope you're doing nice stuff for yourself, you're a brave girl
-sg
Posted by LlurpsieNoodle on June 18, 2007, at 10:16:03
In reply to Re: Been having more psycho episodes, posted by Dinah on June 17, 2007, at 13:24:53
Hi Dinah
>
> I think that's related to anxiety. I'm guessing you have plenty of reasons for anxiety.
>yes, that's true
> > Strange sensations when I close my eyes. Like my body is huge and tiny at the same time.
>
> That also happens to me, when I'm tired and stressed. Maybe it's related to the first thing.probably...
> > Hearing voices in the ambient noise. Even with earplugs. The voices can't be distinguished, or understood- just sounds like a background murmur. This happens when I'm trying to fall asleep. Whenever I open my eyes, the voices are silenced.
>
> This happens to me too. My sleep doctor gave it a name, and called it part of my supposed narcolepsy (which the latest sleep doctor doesn't think I have). But neither was overly concerned about it, so it must be common enough. It happens to me when I've had an overstimulating day. Too much stress or too long hours, or too much noise and lights. I always figured it was just my neurons getting rid of the extra input from the day.
>
That's a relief. Family history of schizophrenia. I always worry about having some tinge of that myself. I like your way of thinking about things
> I'm guessing your body is trying to tell you that it's stressed, and needs sleep. And maybe that all the changes lately have been just too much for you and you're having an upsurge of anxiety.
>
> The problem is that the anxiety you're experiencing as a result of the symptoms of anxiety is causing even more anxiety and stress and thus more symptoms.
>
> I'm guessing it would help to stop the cycle somehow. Short term sleeping medication to stop the sleep shortage problem? Some CBT from your therapist to control the physical symptoms of anxiety and reframe how you view them?
>I already have short term sleep medication, but my anxiety beats it everytime. Sonata, rozerum, klonopin. Only the klonopin seems to be working. I suppose this is diagnostic of some kind of anxiety-related sleeping thing
> I'm no doctor of course, and I'm only speaking from my own experience. But these things aren't really psycho episodes, although they're dreadfully uncomfortable. They're your body's response to stress, anxiety, and lack of sleep.
>
> Do you meditate? Or practice your breathing?
>meditation- sometimes helpful, sometimes extremely frightening. Seems that sometimes I get into trance state during meditation (I practice Vipassana, which is pretty basic meditation based on the 1) the breath, and only later is the attention focused on internal stimuli and then external stimuli, and then finally on mental "noise". I'm guessing that I need to meditate ON a particular image in my head whenever the breathing is no longer the focus of my mind's eye. Perhaps on a buddha or other devotional figure.
I guess the bad stuff that happens with meditation is that my "filtering" mechanisms (the processes by which we pay attention to our world) cease. I think this may be similar to hypnosis, which I think might be traumatic at this point. In fact, my therapist actually discouraged me from doing basic meditative activities. Perhaps on some days when I wake up refreshed it might help.
Guided relaxation helps, however, and when the meditation doesn't dredge up bad feelings and thoughts, it helps me with my focus and general outlook on life.
Thanks for your input. I don't know which is worse, the symptoms themselves, or knowing that I have the symptoms. What a pain.
-Ll
Posted by LlurpsieNoodle on June 18, 2007, at 10:23:57
In reply to Re: Been having more psycho episodes » LlurpsieNoodle, posted by OzLand on June 17, 2007, at 23:30:04
> Sorry, but we don't get to choose when this stuff pops up. God knows, I sure did not want it to pop up two years ago, but it did. Yes it sounds like you are having depersonalization and dissociative episodes. So, think about what you are trying to stuff back away, and this will clue you to what you need to talk about in therapy. It won't go away, and you already know that keeping busy doesn't make it go away either. Wish it did, I would be the queen of denial and avoidance if it did.
Yeah, why is that? Is it an environmental trigger? I think it was, in my case (combination of dissertation stress/advisor transferrence/body work with a man. And the more I fight it, the worse it gets, until it occupies SO much of my mental space that I cannot do anything else but ruminate on my symptoms and resist resist and pretend that all is normal. Such a struggle.
I think I already hold the title of Queen of Avoidance. However, if you'd like an honorary title, I may bestow one on you after talking to my privy council.
I also hold the title PoPPP, Princess of PolyPsychoPharmacy, however, my favor with the pdoc has declined in recent weeks, and I'm not sure if I will be able to maintain that title with the new pdocs.
On a more serious note, I'm not sure if I'm ready to talk about ANYTHING in therapy. See, this month marks the transition between newT (who I'm saying farewell to) and quieT (who I'm just starting to know) so far so good, but we'll see how things progress...
I feel like there's no one to talk to, and I'm bad at asking for help. Many of the resources that I had as a student are no longer available :( I feel a keen loss of pdoc and dear friends. :(
Thanks for your words, I figure you're a few steps ahead of me. Le me know what happens down the road, k?
-Ll
Posted by Phillipa on June 18, 2007, at 12:11:50
In reply to Re: Been having more psycho episodes » OzLand, posted by LlurpsieNoodle on June 18, 2007, at 10:23:57
Lurpsie maybe up the klonopin for a while didn't the old pdoc say to do that hope you slept last night. Love Phillipa
Posted by LlurpsieNoodle on June 18, 2007, at 12:51:33
In reply to Re: Been having more psycho episodes » LlurpsieNoodle, posted by Phillipa on June 18, 2007, at 12:11:50
> Lurpsie maybe up the klonopin for a while didn't the old pdoc say to do that hope you slept last night. Love Phillipa
I slept okay last night. felt utterly alone in the world, but okay.
my pdoc approved temporary "transient" increase in klonopin when I was in bad dissertation mode. I was actually taking about 1.5 mg a day, which is pretty high for me, considering the amount that geodon sedates me!
Problem is that I don't have a lot of klonopin left, and no refills and no idea how new pdoc feels about this particular medication. There seem to be some strong feelings concerning benzodiazepines, not that I've ever had a problem with dependence on prn medications (sleep meds, benzos, etc)
The only thing that I tend to become addicted to (physical dependence and increasing dosage) is caffeine, specifically coffee. About 3-5x a year the amount I consume becomes troublesome and then I have to detox.
Posted by sunnydays on June 18, 2007, at 14:21:35
In reply to Meditation and psycho episodes » Dinah, posted by LlurpsieNoodle on June 18, 2007, at 10:16:03
Llurpsie - have you tried yoga? A lot of times I can't do meditation because it makes things worse, but yoga helps me a lot because it makes me more focused on my movements, but in a way that is very purposeful and calming to me. And I can feel strong even though I'm physically one of the weakest people I know.
Just a thought. It's not right for everyone, but I've recently gone back to it and found it really helps me. I feel relaxed and whole again when I do it. Just don't overdo it. I did that yesterday and my organs feel bruised today, that's how sore I am.
sunnydays
Posted by LlurpsieNoodle on June 18, 2007, at 16:17:38
In reply to Re: Meditation and psycho episodes » LlurpsieNoodle, posted by sunnydays on June 18, 2007, at 14:21:35
> Llurpsie - have you tried yoga? A lot of times I can't do meditation because it makes things worse, but yoga helps me a lot because it makes me more focused on my movements, but in a way that is very purposeful and calming to me. And I can feel strong even though I'm physically one of the weakest people I know.
>
> Just a thought. It's not right for everyone, but I've recently gone back to it and found it really helps me. I feel relaxed and whole again when I do it. Just don't overdo it. I did that yesterday and my organs feel bruised today, that's how sore I am.
>
> sunnydaysSunny! you're in the supportive ZONE today. :) thanks for responding so thoughtfully. I've done some yoga on and off through the years. It helps for sure. Now to get my icky heart to recognize that help and good feelings are what I deserve and need. That's the real struggle.
I just did a guided meditation that I found on the internet. I feel like part of my body now, rather than out of my body. I feel this kind of deep heavy velvet inside that sure beats the strobe lights of constant anxiety. Maybe one can pull the velvet drapes over the strobe light with regular practice? I just have to try to not be critical with myself if I miss a day or get the bad feelings coming back.
perhaps I need the "guide" part of guided meditation to keep me out of the place where my thorax seizes up and I panic. I have no doubt that yoga is another way. Aside from the headstands and such, I think I would enjoy doing yoga more regularly.
Let me know how it's working for you? I know that there are other regular yoga folks out there, like scratchpad, for instance.
For me, anything that slows down the mind is a good thing.
-Ll
and drinking tea
and knitting...-Ll
Posted by sunnydays on June 18, 2007, at 17:13:07
In reply to Re: Meditation and yoga » sunnydays, posted by LlurpsieNoodle on June 18, 2007, at 16:17:38
I just have more time today, so I can post more. And it's hot, so I don't want to move. It is hard to get up the motivation to do physical activity, but it can help if you can force yourself to. I find that listening to a CD helps me when doing yoga because then someone else is directing me and I can follow their voice. Otherwise I tend to go too easy, or I get anxious or give up when it gets hard or something.
I also have been doing some guided meditation lately. I like it a lot, although I think I prefer progressive muscle relaxation - have you tried that? I just have problems sticking to one imagined thing and my mind bounces around.
I don't do headstands. I got to the point where I can do them, but they're really hard for me, and since yoga is about being good to yourself, I don't do them. Plus it's so easy to hurt yourself if you do them wrong.
sunnydays
Posted by scratchpad on June 19, 2007, at 7:30:19
In reply to Re: Meditation and yoga » sunnydays, posted by LlurpsieNoodle on June 18, 2007, at 16:17:38
I LOVE guided meditations. Someone else take the lead, puh-leeze!! Deepak Chopra has some good CDs. And there are podcasts you can download for free from iTunes. I have done ones on centering, on healing, and forgiveness. At various times they are exactly what I need to unlock my own thorax. Also, there are times when I play those podcasts and I'm wound so tight that the words can't make it through - but that's also OK. That I'm making the effort is enough. The wonderful thing about yoga is that there really isn't any measurement of whether you are successful or not. Just the experience itself is a success. Your body and mind takes what it's able to at the time; there is NO wrong way to do it.
I might have some guided meditation CDs I can send on to you, if you are interested.
Scratchpad
Posted by Happyflower on June 19, 2007, at 13:25:52
In reply to Re: Meditation and yoga » LlurpsieNoodle, posted by scratchpad on June 19, 2007, at 7:30:19
Hi Llurpsie,
Today in restorive yoga we did a guided imagery for the first time, and I really liked it. When done with the correct breathing, yoga totally relaxes you. But it takes time to put the right breath with all of the moves.
Posted by Annierose on June 19, 2007, at 15:49:24
In reply to Re: Meditation and yoga, posted by Happyflower on June 19, 2007, at 13:25:52
Yoga? Did someone mention yoga?
I often tell my therapist that yoga has been the single most helpful thing in my life besides her of course. I think therapy + yoga is perfect (for me).
I like going to the yoga studio. I like gathering the strength and energy of the other students, AND, I follow through more often in a group ... i.e. I often turn off the videos at home after 20 minutes or so vs. a 60 - 90 minute class.
My yoga studio encourages everyone to practice as much as they can with their eyes closed. Yoga has helped me with my body image or rather, it has helped me accept the body I have right at this moment.
I just love yoga! And it's only been 18 months since we met.
Posted by OzLand on June 19, 2007, at 21:16:36
In reply to Re: Been having more psycho episodes » OzLand, posted by LlurpsieNoodle on June 18, 2007, at 10:23:57
> > Sorry, but we don't get to choose when this stuff pops up. God knows, I sure did not want it to pop up two years ago, but it did.
>
> Yeah, why is that? Is it an environmental trigger? I think it was, in my case (combination of dissertation stress/advisor transferrence/body work with a man. And the more I fight it, the worse it gets, until it occupies SO much of my mental space that I cannot do anything else but ruminate on my symptoms and resist resist and pretend that all is normal. Such a struggle.
>Sorry about that; yes it is usually some sort of environmental trigger. Was for me too; got sick with all sorts of things all at once and had to have four surgeries in one year. EGADS!! And now I am haunted with what I thought I had stuffed away.
> I think I already hold the title of Queen of Avoidance. However, if you'd like an honorary title, I may bestow one on you after talking to my privy council.
>Nope; you can keep the title.
> I also hold the title PoPPP, Princess of PolyPsychoPharmacy, however, my favor with the pdoc has declined in recent weeks, and I'm not sure if I will be able to maintain that title with the new pdocs.
>You can keep that one too; so far I am only taking Parnate and Neurontin, but I am looking at possibly needing another surgery, and today after therapy I was back at work and writing a report. I started to dissociate about stuff I need to talk about and want to AVOID. T: Why do you think you are so resistant; ME: IDK; I guess I don't want to start to feel worse (unspoken part I didn't say: "You scare the sh*t out of me; I hardly know you; how do I know I can trust you; my last T really hurt me badly not just with words but with his incessant insistance on my doing ECT." Even the ECT doc aknowledged I have probably lost IQ points. Those two doctors can go shock each other's brains now.
> On a more serious note, I'm not sure if I'm ready to talk about ANYTHING in therapy. See, this month marks the transition between newT (who I'm saying farewell to) and quieT (who I'm just starting to know) so far so good, but we'll see how things progress...
>Yes this is a difficult time for you now; Try to relax. Oh what a hipocrite am I; I can't even relax myself.
> I feel like there's no one to talk to, and I'm bad at asking for help. Many of the resources that I had as a student are no longer available :( I feel a keen loss of pdoc and dear friends. :(
>Would they be okay with an email or phone call?
> Thanks for your words, I figure you're a few steps ahead of me. Le me know what happens down the road, k?
>
Maybe a few steps ahead. I just realized I have been seeing my T for almost two months, and I am still resisting. I don't think that is a long time, though, and neither does he. I am impatient though to get my sh*t together and move on, and so Friday I will dive in. I may start to dissociate as I did at work and might actually see someone who I don't recognize (what happened at work and scared the sh*t out of me), but I have to try. It's now or never I figure. No time is a good time.> -Ll
Posted by LlurpsieNoodle on June 20, 2007, at 9:19:37
In reply to Re: Been having more psycho episodes » LlurpsieNoodle, posted by OzLand on June 19, 2007, at 21:16:36
I made a half-hearted attempt to my newT the quieT about how it's fine for him to help me adjust to my new community as long as he doesn't tell other people that I'm psycho.
His response (after hearing me talk about the triggers and stuff, and pretty much verifying what I understand about environmental triggers) was that I wasn't psycho.
:)
-L
Posted by Honore on June 20, 2007, at 11:01:22
In reply to update- am I psycho?, posted by LlurpsieNoodle on June 20, 2007, at 9:19:37
In times of transition, many fears and other disturbing thoughts can surface-- as, maybe, a type of hypervigilance about whether you're okay, and still in one piece. As they come to mind, they raise questions and lead you to take account of things that are disturbing. Or disturbing thoughts and feelings start to assume more density than in normal times.
I'm glad that QuieT sees that, and can tell you. I hope it helps, in a small way, that he can confirm your belief that you're not psycho-- and that frightening thoughts don't mean that something is terribly wrong. The fear might, as I think Dinah was suggesting, lead to your focussing on sensations that are one normally ignores--which then take on the worst meanings-- even if, in many cases, it's the focus that gives rise to the strangeness and otherness that you feel about yourself.
You're okay, Llurpsie-- more then okay-- and you'll get used to your new home and find new routines.
(((Llurpsie)))
Honore
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