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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 18 of 18. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by CaffeinePoet on July 22, 2012, at 21:11:46
Thirtysomething woman here. I lost a fairly good job in late 2009, went back to school, got a Bachelor's degree, learned programming skills, and finally got a good professional job one year ago in July 2012.
In late February, I was let go from the job -- I was doing a good job but I was disliked socially, the only woman on the team and ten years older than my coworkers. Honestly I worked my *ss off there, coming in at 6 a.m. some days. Not appreciated.
Now, six months later, still no good job. Working at a call center for a rate that qualifies me to be on food stamps. Have hustled to volunteer, build my portfolio, network, all those good things.
The lesson? I am just not good enough. It is a lie that you can turn your life around in this society. Get it right the first time -- graduate at age 21, and build those corporate connections while you are young and pretty or it is GAME OVER.
God, the universe, or whoever has decided that I can't have a nice middle class life like so many others have. I am having to put off marriage, having children, all the goods of middle class life. I am not materialistic but I do want to pay my rent, my student loans, and have some stability before having kids.
So -- here it is. I am tired of working for nothing, I am tired of endless poverty. I feel like God is just letting me struggle for nothing, for no reward, endlessly.
Decision: If it is all the way to next February with no professional job for me, I must find a way to kill myself, as painlessly as possible. I have already told God that if s/he is going to let me just struggle nonstop for nothing.
Those around me will suffer, but they are succeeding in life. They have cars, homes, children. They get to use their skills. I am just a financial burden to society and I am suffering for doing work that is far below my capacity.
Posted by sleepygirl2 on July 22, 2012, at 21:27:02
In reply to Fleeting suicidal thoughts, posted by CaffeinePoet on July 22, 2012, at 21:11:46
((((poet))))
I'm so sorry you're going through this.
I feel like I've paid my dues and more, and that I'm still struggling. It's demoralizing, to be sure, to work hard, and feel like you've just been spinning your wheels.
You are good enough.
It is extraordinarily difficult to get ahead sometimes, and it's not for lack of trying. I know it can be a huge blow to one's ego, that you may get tired of trying.
However, I do believe that things can change, maybe unexpectedly. When you're trying to get through everyday, maybe in pain, it can be of little comfort.
You sound like you've been pretty determined, and that you might be pretty damn tired.
I believe things can get better, and I wish that for you.
Posted by Phillipa on July 22, 2012, at 23:29:57
In reply to Re: Fleeting suicidal thoughts » CaffeinePoet, posted by sleepygirl2 on July 22, 2012, at 21:27:02
Agree with Sleepygirl. Also if any consolation you are very young. I know the job market is pretty bad now but don't put your worth on money or possessions. Do you have a Boyfriend at the time? Husband? As who knows you could meet the perfect man who can support you and maybe the need for the high paying job won't be needed. Nothing wrong with being a stay at home Mom. Lots of the men around me are MR Mom as their wives are the breadwinners. It's just a strange work world today. Got a feeling you are going to achieve your goals. Phillipa
Posted by CaffeinePoet on July 23, 2012, at 0:32:04
In reply to Re: Fleeting suicidal thoughts » CaffeinePoet, posted by sleepygirl2 on July 22, 2012, at 21:27:02
thx you guys, it is nice to hear that someone else out there understands and cares.
most days I am optimistic. other days the system seems hopelessly broken.
Posted by papillon2 on July 23, 2012, at 1:54:31
In reply to Fleeting suicidal thoughts, posted by CaffeinePoet on July 22, 2012, at 21:11:46
Are you seeing a therapist or psychiatrist? Have you told them about your suicidal thoughts?
Posted by Caffeinepoet on July 23, 2012, at 7:18:15
In reply to Re: Fleeting suicidal thoughts » CaffeinePoet, posted by papillon2 on July 23, 2012, at 1:54:31
> Are you seeing a therapist or psychiatrist? Have you told them about your suicidal thoughts?
Thank you , I am seeing one on Tuesday (tomorrow).
Posted by Christ_empowered on July 23, 2012, at 8:46:47
In reply to Re: Fleeting suicidal thoughts » papillon2, posted by Caffeinepoet on July 23, 2012, at 7:18:15
I know, it sounds cheesy, but...seriously: keep going. I struggle, too. I apparently have a higher than average IQ *now*. For years, I was burned out, stupid, basically the village idiot. Unmedicated psychosis. Even shrinks made fun of me.
Now, I'm 28. No degree. Unemployed for years. Living off disability and very little $$$ from my ever lovin' parents. So frustrating, you know? I remember the intense "poverty of thought," the years wasted, the years being targeted, and now..what?
Ordinarily, from what I've read, the higher your IQ in a psychotic disorder, the higher your risk of suicide. Ouch. No wonder the drugs make you stupid. But, in my case, this is as good as its been in *years*.
Sounds wimpy, but I take comfort in my faith. Not everyone gets a middle class, respectable life. The way the economy is going, even people who worked their way into that are sliding down into the working and lower classes through absolutely no fault of their own. I don't know what to do about your student loans, or how you can find a job where you'll be allowed to flourish and use your skills. I mean, one thing that's always sucked for me when I worked was being treated like crap even when I did the work better than others. Its like seriously? This is how you run a business that's supposed to make money? But that's life, I suppose.
The answers to this situation used to be "go back to school for (hot career here)" or "you can do it!," but let's face it: good ole fashioned American individualism and optimism have to give way to reality at some point. All I can say is to find a reason to live outside how you "benefit society." There are lots of people who are a drain on the system--people on disability like me, old people, prisoners, rich people who refuse to cough up some tax money--who keep on going. Why? Well, I think because human life has intrinsic value. Its not always "what can you do for society?," its "who are you?"
You may never realize your potential. You may never have a job that matches up with your skills, talents, abilities, and education. You may just have to "settle." I think its better to "settle" and find some sort of joy in your life than simply exist either in bitterness or constant, un-ending pursuit of something better.
Posted by Caffeinepoet on July 23, 2012, at 9:26:16
In reply to don't give up!, posted by Christ_empowered on July 23, 2012, at 8:46:47
> I know, it sounds cheesy, but...seriously: keep going. I struggle, too. I apparently have a higher than average IQ *now*. For years, I was burned out, stupid, basically the village idiot. Unmedicated psychosis. Even shrinks made fun of me.
>
> Now, I'm 28. No degree. Unemployed for years. Living off disability and very little $$$ from my ever lovin' parents. So frustrating, you know? I remember the intense "poverty of thought," the years wasted, the years being targeted, and now..what?
>
> Ordinarily, from what I've read, the higher your IQ in a psychotic disorder, the higher your risk of suicide. Ouch. No wonder the drugs make you stupid. But, in my case, this is as good as its been in *years*.
>
> Sounds wimpy, but I take comfort in my faith. Not everyone gets a middle class, respectable life. The way the economy is going, even people who worked their way into that are sliding down into the working and lower classes through absolutely no fault of their own. I don't know what to do about your student loans, or how you can find a job where you'll be allowed to flourish and use your skills. I mean, one thing that's always sucked for me when I worked was being treated like crap even when I did the work better than others. Its like seriously? This is how you run a business that's supposed to make money? But that's life, I suppose.
>
> The answers to this situation used to be "go back to school for (hot career here)" or "you can do it!," but let's face it: good ole fashioned American individualism and optimism have to give way to reality at some point. All I can say is to find a reason to live outside how you "benefit society." There are lots of people who are a drain on the system--people on disability like me, old people, prisoners, rich people who refuse to cough up some tax money--who keep on going. Why? Well, I think because human life has intrinsic value. Its not always "what can you do for society?," its "who are you?"
>
> You may never realize your potential. You may never have a job that matches up with your skills, talents, abilities, and education. You may just have to "settle." I think its better to "settle" and find some sort of joy in your life than simply exist either in bitterness or constant, un-ending pursuit of something better.Wow, your story is amazing! Honestly I am so glad that you are better now and your intelligence is obvious.
You are right, it did used to be about studying a hot career but I did that and it hasn't been working.
One thing that is meaningful for me is to use these skills to help others. I'm working on a website for a nonprofit program right now and I'm happy about that.
I think a good solution is "accept the present while (non-bitterly) striving.
Posted by Deneb on July 23, 2012, at 12:15:52
In reply to Re: don't give up!, posted by Caffeinepoet on July 23, 2012, at 9:26:16
Hi Caffeinepoet,
Don't give up. I used to be very unhappy all the time, very unstable with borderline personality and suicidal a lot.
I'm guessing I'm above average in intelligence. I always did well in elementary and high school. I got really good grades. In my last year of high school however I started having serious mental problems.
I got into an honours science program in university but my problems got into the way of me succeeding. My grades were all over the place, A+ in genetics, then suddenly F for environmental science for skipping the final exam. F for second year organic chemistry for skipping the final exam then a retake and an A- in second year organic chemistry.
I got kicked out of my program and had to settle for a 3 year general science degree. It took me nearly 10 years just to get it because I kept dropping class, taking breaks etc.
I used to be big aspirations. When I first saw my pdoc she suggested I aim to go to med school, but I'm just glad I have a degree now.
What am I doing now? I work in a call centre. Am I miserable? No. Strangely I actually like my minimum wage boring job full of pressure to do the impossible all the time.
I've never been more happy in my life. I know I will never marry or have a place of my own or get a really good job, but I'm OK with it.
I feel lucky really, that I'm was not born in a 3rd world country. I think having a regular job is the best thing to have happened to me. I'm making friends at the call centre too.
I just feel lucky to even have a job. Some people don't even have jobs.
So, instead of thinking about what you are missing out on, think of what you do have. I'm very fortunate to live here with a loving family, enough food, a roof over my head and luxuries like my own room.
I think I started feeling happy when I let go of my needing the middle class life, professional career etc and just accepted things.
I find pleasure in the small things now.
Your life is definitely not over. You can be happy again, even without the middle class life.
Posted by bleauberry on July 23, 2012, at 17:43:18
In reply to Fleeting suicidal thoughts, posted by CaffeinePoet on July 22, 2012, at 21:11:46
Just a few things to keep in perspective. First, this is the absolute worst economy we've ever experienced since the Great Depression. Not just you, but millions upon millions share the exact same story as you. Everyone is afraid to call it for what it is, but by all mathematical definitions it is a depression not a recession, and it was made a lot worse beginning 3 years ago.
You have a leader of the country who is not friendly to business, judging from his behaviors, words, and actions, unless it is a business where there is an interest in, such as GM, but you didn't work at GM. Washington is not your friend at this time and has made it very difficult for any business to be born or to grow so as to hire you.
I see very little, actually nothing, that was your fault here. Everything that happened was beyond your control. It wasn't you.
As for God, keep in mind, we live in the shadow of the valley of death. For sure there are lots of pleasures on the planet, but every single living thing will deteriorate, die, and rot. No escape. This is not our home. It is a temporary stop during the "human experience". What reallly matters is the spiritual kingdom that Jesus followers will see. If one believes the bible which I do.
Until that time, this earth is temporarily under the authority of the evil ones. Deception, illness, pain....anything to keep your eyes off of Jesus. The problem for them is, for those who do talk to Jesus every day, such hardships backfire....they only make the person stronger and even closer to God. I felt that.
The Reagan years through the Clinton years, you would have had so many job offers. Good times. The current situation is the opposite of that. It started to go sour under Bush due to war expenses and he did not stick to conservative economics. Obama took a floundering situation and made it much worse. People are suffering everywhere. You are not alone.
While you see people with nice cars and houses, what you don't see is the millions upon millions of americans who lost theirs!
Success is not an earthly thing, imo. Those people with the money and cars, they don't realize it but all of their possessions are merely on loan. They can't keep them and they can't take them with them. And if those things happen to be their gods, those folks are doomed. Can you imagine sacrificing eternity for some sort of earthly pleasure that only lasts a few decades?
God does want you to feel better and He does want you to succeed. That will only happen voluntarily, on your part, because He does not view us as puppets on a string. In other words, place the entire issue on His shoulders and admit it has become too much for you. Actually, everything is too much for us. We can't even make our heart beat one time, but He does it for us all day long. Place it all in His hands and ask Jesus for some help. Ask for wisdom in the matter.
Anyway, you are wrong. You are good enough. More than good enough. You are living in a lousy time of history. There is a guide though who knows the best way to navigate the dangerous waters, can make miracles happen, small ones and big ones, and is our way through the mess. His name is Jesus. I did not know how to pray, someone told me just talk to Him. Seems to work. But don't insult Him with small requests, make them big! He can do all things.
> Thirtysomething woman here. I lost a fairly good job in late 2009, went back to school, got a Bachelor's degree, learned programming skills, and finally got a good professional job one year ago in July 2012.
>
> In late February, I was let go from the job -- I was doing a good job but I was disliked socially, the only woman on the team and ten years older than my coworkers. Honestly I worked my *ss off there, coming in at 6 a.m. some days. Not appreciated.
>
> Now, six months later, still no good job. Working at a call center for a rate that qualifies me to be on food stamps. Have hustled to volunteer, build my portfolio, network, all those good things.
>
> The lesson? I am just not good enough. It is a lie that you can turn your life around in this society. Get it right the first time -- graduate at age 21, and build those corporate connections while you are young and pretty or it is GAME OVER.
>
> God, the universe, or whoever has decided that I can't have a nice middle class life like so many others have. I am having to put off marriage, having children, all the goods of middle class life. I am not materialistic but I do want to pay my rent, my student loans, and have some stability before having kids.
>
> So -- here it is. I am tired of working for nothing, I am tired of endless poverty. I feel like God is just letting me struggle for nothing, for no reward, endlessly.
>
> Decision: If it is all the way to next February with no professional job for me, I must find a way to kill myself, as painlessly as possible. I have already told God that if s/he is going to let me just struggle nonstop for nothing.
>
> Those around me will suffer, but they are succeeding in life. They have cars, homes, children. They get to use their skills. I am just a financial burden to society and I am suffering for doing work that is far below my capacity.
Posted by phidippus on July 26, 2012, at 22:27:46
In reply to Fleeting suicidal thoughts, posted by CaffeinePoet on July 22, 2012, at 21:11:46
Don't do it. You have no idea what awaits you in the afterlife.
You are personalizing your struggle to find a job. Its not you, its the economy. Be patient.
Eric
Posted by Caffeinepoet on July 27, 2012, at 8:30:34
In reply to Re: Fleeting suicidal thoughts » CaffeinePoet, posted by phidippus on July 26, 2012, at 22:27:46
Posted by Caffeinepoet on July 27, 2012, at 8:31:20
In reply to Thoughts stopped as soon as I stopped clonazepam (nm), posted by Caffeinepoet on July 27, 2012, at 8:30:34
Posted by Phillipa on July 27, 2012, at 19:21:51
In reply to Thoughts stopped as soon as I stopped clonazepam (nm), posted by Caffeinepoet on July 27, 2012, at 8:30:34
Same exact thing happened to me with klonopin. I called the pdoc who said don't take anymore klonopin return to xanax. Soon as did I was fine. Phillipa
Posted by ChicagoKat on July 27, 2012, at 19:54:08
In reply to don't give up!, posted by Christ_empowered on July 23, 2012, at 8:46:47
> I know, it sounds cheesy, but...seriously: keep going. I struggle, too. I apparently have a higher than average IQ *now*. For years, I was burned out, stupid, basically the village idiot. Unmedicated psychosis. Even shrinks made fun of me.
>
> Now, I'm 28. No degree. Unemployed for years. Living off disability and very little $$$ from my ever lovin' parents. So frustrating, you know? I remember the intense "poverty of thought," the years wasted, the years being targeted, and now..what?
>
> Ordinarily, from what I've read, the higher your IQ in a psychotic disorder, the higher your risk of suicide. Ouch. No wonder the drugs make you stupid. But, in my case, this is as good as its been in *years*.
>
> Sounds wimpy, but I take comfort in my faith. Not everyone gets a middle class, respectable life. The way the economy is going, even people who worked their way into that are sliding down into the working and lower classes through absolutely no fault of their own. I don't know what to do about your student loans, or how you can find a job where you'll be allowed to flourish and use your skills. I mean, one thing that's always sucked for me when I worked was being treated like crap even when I did the work better than others. Its like seriously? This is how you run a business that's supposed to make money? But that's life, I suppose.
>
> The answers to this situation used to be "go back to school for (hot career here)" or "you can do it!," but let's face it: good ole fashioned American individualism and optimism have to give way to reality at some point. All I can say is to find a reason to live outside how you "benefit society." There are lots of people who are a drain on the system--people on disability like me, old people, prisoners, rich people who refuse to cough up some tax money--who keep on going. Why? Well, I think because human life has intrinsic value. Its not always "what can you do for society?," its "who are you?"
>
> You may never realize your potential. You may never have a job that matches up with your skills, talents, abilities, and education. You may just have to "settle." I think its better to "settle" and find some sort of joy in your life than simply exist either in bitterness or constant, un-ending pursuit of something better.Thanks for your inspiring words. I, too, have been living on disability, a shadow of my former productive self, and I often feel bad and guilty about it. But your post has gone a long way to making me feel better. Thanks again.
Kat
Posted by Mrose on July 28, 2012, at 21:19:37
In reply to Re: don't give up!, posted by ChicagoKat on July 27, 2012, at 19:54:08
What I do when I am feeling hopeless is to ask God to show Me His love. I start looking for Him and I always find his love. It could be from a person or something you read or a thought that makes you say 'Wow!!". Something that can give you encouragement and hope for the future.
Posted by froyo on August 1, 2012, at 7:34:11
In reply to Re: don't give up!, posted by Caffeinepoet on July 23, 2012, at 9:26:16
> > I know, it sounds cheesy, but...seriously: keep going. I struggle, too. I apparently have a higher than average IQ *now*. For years, I was burned out, stupid, basically the village idiot. Unmedicated psychosis. Even shrinks made fun of me.
> >
> > Now, I'm 28. No degree. Unemployed for years. Living off disability and very little $$$ from my ever lovin' parents. So frustrating, you know? I remember the intense "poverty of thought," the years wasted, the years being targeted, and now..what?
> >
> > Ordinarily, from what I've read, the higher your IQ in a psychotic disorder, the higher your risk of suicide. Ouch. No wonder the drugs make you stupid. But, in my case, this is as good as its been in *years*.
> >
> > Sounds wimpy, but I take comfort in my faith. Not everyone gets a middle class, respectable life. The way the economy is going, even people who worked their way into that are sliding down into the working and lower classes through absolutely no fault of their own. I don't know what to do about your student loans, or how you can find a job where you'll be allowed to flourish and use your skills. I mean, one thing that's always sucked for me when I worked was being treated like crap even when I did the work better than others. Its like seriously? This is how you run a business that's supposed to make money? But that's life, I suppose.
> >
> > The answers to this situation used to be "go back to school for (hot career here)" or "you can do it!," but let's face it: good ole fashioned American individualism and optimism have to give way to reality at some point. All I can say is to find a reason to live outside how you "benefit society." There are lots of people who are a drain on the system--people on disability like me, old people, prisoners, rich people who refuse to cough up some tax money--who keep on going. Why? Well, I think because human life has intrinsic value. Its not always "what can you do for society?," its "who are you?"
> >
> > You may never realize your potential. You may never have a job that matches up with your skills, talents, abilities, and education. You may just have to "settle." I think its better to "settle" and find some sort of joy in your life than simply exist either in bitterness or constant, un-ending pursuit of something better.
>
> Wow, your story is amazing! Honestly I am so glad that you are better now and your intelligence is obvious.
>
> You are right, it did used to be about studying a hot career but I did that and it hasn't been working.
>
> One thing that is meaningful for me is to use these skills to help others. I'm working on a website for a nonprofit program right now and I'm happy about that.
>
> I think a good solution is "accept the present while (non-bitterly) striving.That's a very buddhist thought.
I'm still in college, but I have been having trouble choosing a path (I've been on a highly respectable one for a while that I hate, but that's a whole other story) and its making my anxiety go crazy.I'm currently in an asian philosophies class and it is so relevant to the way that I'm feeling (therapy is good too, I'm also in that). if anyone is feeling like they don't know where you're heading, read up on Daoism and Buddhism.
They're so beautiful and simple how you should follow your inward natures (daoism) and to remove suffering by accepting where you are as where you want to be (Buddhism). That second point is not saying that you don't strive, but you accept every point on your journey as where you want to be and you take it from there.
Posted by CaffeinePoet on August 1, 2012, at 8:41:16
In reply to Re: Thoughts stopped as soon as I stopped clonazepam » Caffeinepoet, posted by Phillipa on July 27, 2012, at 19:21:51
This is the end of the thread.
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