Posted by Eltoro on December 18, 2007, at 13:46:47
In reply to Re: Bad therapy ending » eltoro, posted by lovelorn on December 18, 2007, at 11:25:03
> >.. i dealt with it the wrong way...
>
> It is good you see you dealt with something the wrong way. Which way had you wanted to deal with it?------------------------------------------
I told her in my last email i wish I had left earlier and thanked her for everything, because i had nothing left to say, my reasoning was "its my fault to be this negative, there is no reason to contaminate therapy with this, i know i have to deal with it". I also mentioned in therapy how I felt an urge to "NOT give her credit for my acomplishments", similar to what happens with my friends, i started to feel her very much like them, telling me the obvious things but not really caring that much, what i didnt mention was that I thought it was weird and wrong and I knew it, i DID want to give her credit and become a decent guy for all the people that has supported me in my life, including her. But she interpreted that as an agression i think.
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> >she kicked me out of therapy because she was not willing to deal with my negativity, 10 minutes earlier she had threathen me to kick me out according to her, but I read it as a legitimate question as if that was what I was looking for, so I didnt see it coming.
>
> Well, I am surprised to read this. How horrible were you? Doesnt' sound too professional to kick you out just because you were expressing negativity. You two should have talked about why you were being so negative. Read what as a legitimate question? And didn't see what coming?--------------------------------------------
She told me something like "your negativity is offensive, sometimes people cant handle goodyes, do you want to be kicked out?". And a bit later I said "I just dont see why you are so fixated in not giving me what i need, we are people, i want to know that therapy was more than giving prepared advice as if it comes from my operating manual, and to aknowledge you are part of this bad experience too".She: "do you want me to act like a mom?"
Me: no, but.. i dont know.. maybe..
She: "i think therapy is over, i am not willing to come here and be offended like this, you dont care for people, and I cant deal with this, you owe me $xx.xx, goodbye" (i didnt see this coming).Its not nearly exact, its all fuzzy in my mind, just big chunks of what i remember. She probably interpreted my "no, i dont know, maybe.." as a request for intimacy, maybe even sexual. In my mind I just wanted a hug or a pat in the back, i could see how she could make the mistake tho.
She shuts me out entirely for even sugest getting a peek of her feelings and then kicks me out for not caring about other peoples feelings.
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> >to explain my side of things, that I was looking for a symbolic goodbye hug, or a pat in the back, and I got needy, and she refused to divert from structured therapy...
>
> What did she say when you told her you were looking for a symbolic goodbye hug, etc. Why symbolic? Or did you really mean you wanted it for real. Being honest with yourself first is always good. Again though, I see her a bit at fault for not addressing this feeling of yours.---------------------------------
I told her it was symbolic the session she allowed me to come back and explain myself, she told me it my fantasy hug "story" looked clearly manipulative. It was symbolic because a real one was out of the question, she had a way to make me feel like that at that point, I also told her i gave up on that fantasy, but i had constructed another one even less ambitious (or more pathetic) that that one, in which we ran into each other later in life and she greeted me, in a public event, we say hi for a minute or two and thats it. And that i was hanging on to this ridicule fantasy, defending it from being destroyed too (along with the last pieces of my dignity).
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> >But painfully for me that session ended with me being a manipulative and insensitive person again, thats the summary of all.
>
> Why do you say this? What did you really do to be manipulative and insensitive. Were you really or is that just your perception?---------------------------------
Thats what i felt she told me i was after i tried to explain my actions not knowing exactly what I was apologizing for (now i guess she assumed i was ok'ing all her assumptions, well I DID ok'ed them by apologizing unconditionally).I was unconciously manipulative, but the reason was to defend my last piece of dignity by mantaining my fantasy alive, the idea that i could bump into her and be greeted, treated like a decent man. She thought i was being nasty. Or.. she was trying to show me how submissive and pathetic i was being, in a horrible way. I am no white sheep, i did in fact had sexual fantasies about her in addition to the most natural ones i explained, but i search really deep on this and I really feel thats not what i was thinking when the critical events happened, i truly just wanted sympathy from her, and kept pushing for it all the time without realizing i was.
She always had problems understanding how I could separate my concious and subconscious wishes and behaviours, how I could do one thing but feel another, part of it because she is a woman and men are more used to doing this, for example, we have sex with strangers (conciously) and then feel guilty about it (because our subconsious thought it was a bad idea all along), women have a harder time separating that.
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>
> >A couple days later I start to realize the punishment is wildly uncalled for..
>
> Punishment? Therapy is not about punishment. Interesting you think in terms of her punishing you.-------------------------------
She is punishing me for the manifestation of my unconcious wishes, which she misinterpreted. I understand how she mishandled that, and when all this happened a week ago, i even justified her. Not anymore, she made bad interpretations and its her fault, not mine.
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> >Why is she making me feel that way?---- Read above
>
> People do things, how you feel about what they do is your own reaction. Maybe you should ask why are you making yourself feel the way you do about her.
>
> >explain via email to someone that you are not a pervert even if you are not sure thats what she is thinking,...
>
> Good point, you aren't sure that is what she is thinking so don't automatically assume that is what she is thinking. Those are your thoughts, not hers.
>
> >because she is so righteous and i am a piece of scum...
>
> Who says you are a piece of scum?-------------------------------
I do, it seems. She just banked on it and washed her hands. Feeling-wise i think i rather commit to that point of view, thinking thats what she thinks of me I can handle, but if she is doing this because a textbook says thats how pathetic needy patients should be handled, that i would never forgive, i cant accept she wins both ways doing whats right clinically and getting rid of me for life at the same time, i cant handle that, its scarring me inside. Im a nice guy who shuts himself in and has hurt people close to him by being so passive and apathetic, and who has done wrong things (nothing illegal), but i am resisting to admit i need something like this to help me 'function' properly.
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> >well, i need a couple sessions with a different therapist to figure a big chunk of this...
>
> You talk about seeing another therapist to try to figure out why she did what she did or said what she said. Think about that. The only person that knows for certain that knows these things is the therapist. So, it is probably a better idea to see another therapist if you want to sort out your own feelings of what happened, but don't expect you will find out what is in her head unless she tells you.
>
> I am sorry it didn't go well. For whatever reasons, it sounds like you and the therapist were working at cross purposes at the end there. If it were me, I would ask for one more session to ask some specific questions from the therapist and to clear up an misconceptions - that is, if the therapist was also open to doing the same.
>-----------------------------------
She is not open, i think i would have to beg for another session, we were in cross purposes at the end, that triggered it because she called me stubborn and i call her stubborn back, that sparked it. I cant go and humilliate myself one more time, its too risky for me at this point. I sent my email and i will probably send another one in the future if this does not end well, probably a short and educated, but yet a spiteful one.Thanks for your comments, i cant tell you how much it means to me to have a chance to ventilate this a bit more, because I have no trust in my own criteria lately, i need to 'bounce' my ideas with some form of reality.
So thank you again, its really what i would expect to get from visiting another therapist, i know i wont know what she thinks until she tells me (she wont), i wanted to go to therapy to put my ideas together and see if I can make a more solid resolution of all this, for myself.
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poster:Eltoro
thread:801388
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/psycho/20071215/msgs/801419.html