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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Dinah on April 7, 2008, at 9:49:08
When I was choosing my rock for my therapist, I asked for my husband's help. He chose the ones with major cracks in them. :) Thanks, dear.
But he seemed sort of crabby, and I asked if he were jealous of my therapist. To my surprise, he said yes. But he wouldn't say much else on the topic. My husband doesn't like talking about feelings all that much.
I know my husband has been jealous of two of my dogs over the years, and rightly so I might add. I doted on those dogs, loved to cuddle them and shower them with kisses, missed them when I was apart for an hour, etc. I often said I'd have married one of them if it were legal. (A girl dog. No sexual overtones.) In short, I did give them some of what was due a husband.
But I don't give my therapist anything due a husband. A parent maybe, but not a husband. And it has always been my understanding that my husband sees my therapist as a protection from me. From my craziness and overemotionalness, from my desire to speak on topics concerning emotion. My husband would rather be strapped down and forced to listen to endless political advertisements than engage in a conversation about emotions. Well, maybe not that. But still.
I talked to my therapist about it, and asked him if I should pursue it further. My therapist apparently thought I should, since he referred to my not doing so as sweeping it under the rug. I told him both my husband and my mother had thought he was a good looking man. And my mother used to say that this was the reason I stayed in therapy. But that while of course he was a good looking man, I had never really seen him that way. And that my response to both of them was that if he had looked like Dr. Drew I'd have never entered therapy with him. Because Dr. Drew was my type. My therapist said he really liked Dr. Drew too, and I asked if he was his type too. :) He said that he thought Dr. Drew was a good looking man, and liked his approach. lol. (I didn't tell my therapist this, but when my husband saw my therapist a couple of years ago, he thought he really wasn't as good looking as he remembered.) And mentioned that my husband was not that much unlike Dr. Drew in type. I said I thought I might be defensive, and my therapist agreed I might be. What I meant was that I thought I might feel like I should stop therapy. And I had no desire or intention to do that.
So I brought it up with my husband again, and asked if he meant he was jealous of my therapist as a man, or like he was of my dogs. And he said something like that he was just sorry that I was so in need of help, and that he wasn't able to give it to me. It's hard to describe but it sounded vaguely insulting to me. But my husband tends to say vaguely insulting things to me, so that was no big deal.
I find this bothers me. My husband admits that he doesn't in any way want me to stop seeing my therapist, and that he doesn't want to have to talk to me about the things my therapist talks to me about. And I know that I'm not sexually or romantically attracted to my therapist. He is very tall and very large, and he makes me feel like I used to when I was able to fit both my feet in one of Daddy's shoes. But that's not what I'm attracted to in a man, just in a therapist/mommy/daddy.
And as I've often said, I'm well aware that outside therapy I would never have chosen my therapist as a friend. We have very different interests and values.
My husband knows that I'm not sexually interested in my therapist. He knows me well enough to know I'm not a particularly sexual person, and wouldn't even understand that sort of attraction to another man, much less act on it.
Still, I kind of wish I didn't know how my husband felt. And I feel sort of uncomfortable with the whole thing. I wouldn't hurt my husband for the world. I love him dearly. He has integrity, which I find the sexiest quality in a man. He is funny, which is also darn attractive. But he's also part of the reason I need therapy. In so many ways he's a wonderful husband to me, and has the complementary qualities that make our marriage successful. But he's hypercritical of everyone, including himself. He'd be the first to admit that and is in fact rather proud of it. And he's a pillar of crackling electricity that occasionally sends off sparks.
I'm not sure why I'm writing this. But I'm thinking maybe it did have something to do with my anniversary session falling a bit flat.
Posted by fleeting flutterby on April 7, 2008, at 10:12:01
In reply to Something hard to talk about, posted by Dinah on April 7, 2008, at 9:49:08
>> So I brought it up with my husband again, and asked if he meant he was jealous of my therapist as a man, or like he was of my dogs. And he said something like that he was just sorry that I was so in need of help, and that he wasn't able to give it to me. It's hard to describe but it sounded vaguely insulting to me. But my husband tends to say vaguely insulting things to me, so that was no big deal.<<
Please excuse me if I'm way off-- I'm quite new here and may not be familiar with all your situation. What caught my eye was the paragraph above-- I've heard men, in general, when in relationships, like to know they can fix things. Maybe your husband feels bad about that-- the fact that HE is not what can "fix" you. so in that he feels flawed somehow............
>
> In so many ways he's a wonderful husband to me, and has the complementary qualities that make our marriage successful. But he's hypercritical of everyone, including himself. He'd be the first to admit that and is in fact rather proud of it. And he's a pillar of crackling electricity that occasionally sends off sparks.<<hmmmmmm..... hypercritical even of himself..... maybe he feels he's not good enough since he isn't able to make you feel better on his own....
could it be that he is feeling a bit insecure- feeling he's not ALL that you need? (I've heard some men like to be the "end all"- the "everything" for their partners) *shrugs*-- maybe I'm way off-- just thought I'd share what I thought from your post.
wishing you inner peace
fl.flutterby
Posted by Dinah on April 7, 2008, at 10:22:14
In reply to Re: Something hard to talk about » Dinah, posted by fleeting flutterby on April 7, 2008, at 10:12:01
I think that's definitely true of my husband. He is very hard on himself, and he is a "fixer".
But he's also very precise with words, and I am not sure jealous is the word he'd use in that context. I could be wrong though. Since he says that's what he meant, maybe I should take him at his word.
Posted by Happyflower on April 7, 2008, at 10:48:50
In reply to Something hard to talk about, posted by Dinah on April 7, 2008, at 9:49:08
Hi Dinah,
I just would like to say who wouldn't be jealous of a marriage partner in therapy?
Maybe your DH wishes he could provide for you what your T does, but he can't for some reason. You have been with your T a long time and that could make him feel a little jealous of him. I think spouse of T's are feeling a little jealous too, because I am sure they don't get that at home from them much.
Maybe the gift thing is what is doing it. I know with friends we don't celebrate a anniversary like that usually. Usually anniversaries are for couples to buy gift for. I see nothing wrong with you buying your T a gift, but maybe your husband is feeling insecure or something. Who knows?
If I somehow figure out your DH, can you do the same for me? lol
((((Dinah)))) Sorry stuff is so hard right now.
Posted by Phillipa on April 7, 2008, at 12:12:58
In reply to Re: Something hard to talk about » Dinah, posted by Happyflower on April 7, 2008, at 10:48:50
I feel Dinah and I have similar husband's as mine tries to fix things and he can't fix me as I've told him. But he wants the old me back. Plus I see a female maybe not after today. So no jelousy there except where the pups are concerned. Phillipa
Posted by DAisym on April 7, 2008, at 12:18:04
In reply to Re: Something hard to talk about » Dinah, posted by Happyflower on April 7, 2008, at 10:48:50
Over the course your therapy, and your changing, I'm sure your husband has changed some too. And I find it interesting that you wrote about moving to a more relaxed, real and sort of intimate place with your therapist and then this comes up. I doubt strongly that your husband is jealous in a "sexual" way - you are just so clear that you aren't attracted to your therapist.
But I'm wondering if he is feeling left out a bit. There is a such a strong emotional connection between you and your therapist, and like you said, he meets needs your husband doesn't. But more than that, there is that vague kind of feeling that sometimes descends that is about sharing - I can imagine your husband sometimes feeling this way. Very much, as you said, like when your attention is diverted to the dogs. Like kids when their mom is nice to their friends, sometimes they forget that love and attention stretches. What someone else gets, doesn't take away from what you have to give to them.
I'm wondering if there is anything going on with your husband that makes him need you more right now? And I'm also wondering how much you talk about therapy with him? I absolutely couldn't talk about therapy with my x-husband. He felt embarrassed and invaded by "some guy" that I was telling stuff too. And he didn't understand the need, because I didn't need him.
Seems like you are doing the right things by talking about it. And maybe you need to quietly increase the attention to your husband for a bit.
Posted by raisinb on April 7, 2008, at 13:37:57
In reply to Re: Something hard to talk about, posted by DAisym on April 7, 2008, at 12:18:04
I agree with others that the jealousy is probably natural, especially for someone who doesn't understand what goes on in a therapy relationship.
I don't know you well, so this might be off-base, but what I noticed was how uncomfortable *you* felt about the jealousy--as if you are guilty--or perhaps feel invaded by him having feelings about the subject? It seems as though knowing about his jealousy affects you in some way you haven't quite figured out. After all, though it is understandable, it's still technically his (your husband's) problem, and something for him to deal with.
Anyway, just something maybe to bring up next session.
Posted by raisinb on April 7, 2008, at 13:39:23
In reply to Something hard to talk about, posted by Dinah on April 7, 2008, at 9:49:08
Posted by Dinah on April 8, 2008, at 7:35:38
In reply to Re: Something hard to talk about » Dinah, posted by Happyflower on April 7, 2008, at 10:48:50
Maybe it was the gift. It seems like he'd feel worse about the immense sums I've paid him over thirteen years than the silly rock that costs less than a dollar.
I know what you mean about the spouse's of therapists. I've always thought I got the best part of him. But I kind of feel that about my husband too. I see his wonderful reviews on his teamwork and patience and wonder where this man goes at the end of the day. :) It's inevitable I guess.
It is true that I'm less sentimental about anniversaries (and any traditional holidays) than my husband is. But that's partly because we express our caring for each other all the time. I'm free telling him how much I love and admire and appreciate him. I am entertained by his impersonations and humor. We cuddle in bed at night to watch his favorite TV shows. And mine if he doesn't get to the remote first.
Therapy is different. Those expressions are not as free. And milestones are more important somehow. For example, we discussed how far therapy has come and where it is going.
It's just different.
Posted by Dinah on April 8, 2008, at 7:37:28
In reply to Re: Something hard to talk about, posted by Phillipa on April 7, 2008, at 12:12:58
I really do think the desire to fix me is an issue. But you know, having a husband trying to fix me is different than having a therapist try to fix me. I don't want my husband to fix me. I want him to love me.
Posted by Dinah on April 8, 2008, at 7:44:56
In reply to Re: Something hard to talk about, posted by DAisym on April 7, 2008, at 12:18:04
Well, I suppose I was a bit surprised that this didn't come up when I was wailing and crying and getting hysterical when we were going to move. That can't be easy for a husband. I guess it helps that a close friend of his moved to another city when her therapist (a woman) did. So while he may think it's weird, he doesn't think it's unique to me.
I speak of my therapist a fair amount. X says this, X says that. But I often don't speak of him in glowing terms. I make angry comments about my therapist scratching my name off an appointment space and neglecting to call me. Or cynical statements about my therapist's appreciation of money and stuff. I make clear that he's helpful to my condition, but also clear that I don't admire him nearly as much, for example, as I admire my husband.
I don't think I do this for deception purposes. My feelings about my therapist are very split. And the rational part of me that usually is the one to interact with my husband really doesn't admire my therapist overmuch, and really does admire my husband a great deal.
But as I've become more tolerant of my therapist's flaws, I imagine that might be showing too.
Posted by Dinah on April 8, 2008, at 7:57:21
In reply to Re: Something hard to talk about » DAisym, posted by raisinb on April 7, 2008, at 13:37:57
I don't have responsibility OCD for nothing. :)
My therapist says it's partly because my parents led me to believe I had way more power in the family than I genuinely did. Allowed me to be peacemaker and go between and distractor and calmer. But it's very hard for me to take responsibility for any part I play in any sort of argument, and try to fix it. Especially to modify my part.
I wouldn't want my husband to feel any discomfort from my actions for the world. I love him so much, and appreciate his wonderful qualities and all the things he does for me and for the family. I don't want to hurt him.
Yet, I suppose that while my husband has the total devotion of rational me, emotional me really only speaks to my therapist. This is partly because my husband doesn't particularly care for emotional me in either bad or even good moods. I'm torn about that. On the one hand, I recognize that this is a part of me where my therapist is of immense importance to me. I'm enormously attached and maybe that isn't right for a wife. Although that part of me isn't really a wife. Not in any real sense of the word. That part of me isn't grown up enough to be a wife.
But I also am completely aware that my husband doesn't want this part of me. Is angered and annoyed by it, and consistently rejects it. So I suppose it makes me angry that he would in any way mind my giving away something he does not wish. My allowing that part of me to be and exist and live, when he doesn't want it. It seems like sour grapes.
Of course, my husband doesn't think in those terms. In an emotional sense his thinking is very concrete. Almost amusingly so when we find ourselves in the company of a therapist together. He'd never put this kind of thought into what was going on and would hate any attempts I made at doing so.
Posted by Phillipa on April 8, 2008, at 19:01:31
In reply to Re: Something hard to talk about » Phillipa, posted by Dinah on April 8, 2008, at 7:37:28
Dinah totally agree. Fine thinks he can fix me and he can't. Love Phillipa
This is the end of the thread.
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