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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by Racer on January 14, 2006, at 12:41:17
In reply to One Wasted Session Later, posted by Poet on January 14, 2006, at 10:56:23
How about you do it because it's ego syntonic? After all, if you are as terrible as you say you are, then you do deserve to feel the way you do. Therefore, you try to convince the rest of the world that you are the worst person in it. (This never worked for me, but don't you feel egocentric for thinking you could be the very worst in the world?)
I think, and am probably wrong, that you're afraid to accept your own successes, because they don't fit what you've been taught about yourself. Maybe if you could 'teach' yourself a single success you've achieved, you could start breaking the cycle? Like it's that easy, but it wouldn't be worth doing if it were, right?
Aren't you a success for your degree? (Something I never managed. One more of my failures.) No fair saying it doesn't matter, because you haven't become famous in that field -- just stick to what you HAVE done.
Right now, my success for this part of my life, which isn't finished, but will be this weekend, I hope, is to have come up with an imaginative decorating scheme for our living room/dining room. It has a very ugly bit of duct work along one wall, and I got some cheap wooden framed mirrors which we're hanging along it. I put gold leaf on the edges of the mirrors, and used a red wax based finish on them. It turns a bug into a feature, by making it a focal point. Even my critical husband said it was a good idea, once he saw some of them up. Today, I'll finish putting the rest up.
Find yourself something to point to as a success. Another of mine is that my cat, at nearly 18 years old, still wants to be near me, is still able to get up into my lap, and onto the sofa. If I were really a total loser, my cat wouldn't have lived this long. What's more, even if he were still alive, he would have gotten over liking me. My husband thinks well of me, even if my mother doesn't. ('Nother story...) I can knit. I taught myself to spin on a spinning wheel, and made enough yarn to make a sweater for my husband and a lace vest for my mother, as well as several pairs of socks for me. I've read enough books to Know Some Things. (That's actually a mixed blessing. Many times I feel pathetic for knowing so many things that other people don't. But that's imposed judgement, not native to me. I've been told too many times that I'm weird because I know things.) I have a talent for friendship, proven by the fact that many of my friends still like me after two decades or more, and I'm even still friends with my ex-bf and his new wife.
Sure, it's not much, and it's not enough for me, but it's better than nothing.
What can you offer up for the Success side of your balance sheet?
Posted by Racer on January 14, 2006, at 12:44:35
In reply to Re: One Wasted Session Later » Poet, posted by Racer on January 14, 2006, at 12:41:17
Don't insult yourself or anyone else by trying to say that you don't have anything at all to put in that column. Even the very worst people have something to put there -- they're kind to dogs, or they can assess a situation accurately, something. You, with so much more to offer, can fill that Success side very well, no matter what your tax returns may say.
And isn't that a very artificial way to judge success?
Posted by antigua on January 14, 2006, at 14:46:42
In reply to One Wasted Session Later, posted by Poet on January 14, 2006, at 10:56:23
I still do it a lot, but try to curb myself. I do find that if I'm doing it in therapy then something is wrong--something special that is. My pdoc recently told me how well I was doing (my husband thinks I'm a mess) and he used some strong words--phenomenal, he says (a bit strong), and I told him to stop it because it made me feel very uncomfortable. My T tries to tell me the same, but I can't go there. They try to push me, but I just won't let them. Sometimes I get angry and tell them that I know it's just their job to tell me that!
I know I've made great strides but inside I'm still very negative. It must be that small girl who still believes (or thinks like an adult) that she should have been able to get out of the abuse.
Take care, Poet,
antigua
Posted by Dinah on January 14, 2006, at 14:49:39
In reply to One Wasted Session Later, posted by Poet on January 14, 2006, at 10:56:23
Well, if you're anything like me, you'd probably rather blame yourself than to blame others. First, there's a sort of power in that. If you're to blame, things can ultimately change. If you aren't to blame, then things are random and out of your control. Which is scarier than thinking I caused Hurricane Katrina, when you think about it.
And if you're afraid of anger, you might prefer to direct it at yourself than to get angry at others, especially others that you care about.
If you're really upset at what you see as repetitive sessions... Well, first of all, I don't think you should be all that upset because most of us have one or two bugaboos that drive all our dysfunctional behavior, and plugging away at it and hearing the same thing over and over again does help. But if you want to shake things up a bit, why don't you try doing something completely different for a session. Act the opposite of how you usually act. Or do something really silly.
I don't know. Sigh. Just throwing ideas out there.
Posted by daisym on January 14, 2006, at 23:18:32
In reply to Re: One Wasted Session Later » Poet, posted by Dinah on January 14, 2006, at 14:49:39
I like Dinah's idea of doing something different. How about you ask the questions for once? Or sit in her seat! (evil grin.)
I like Racer's idea about making a list of successes. I think you should try. It is easy to lose track of what we can and have done sometimes. The bad stuff seems so much bigger and more important.
I hate hearing I'm doing "well" also. Because then I have to live up to it all the time. But it isn't any easier to hear I'm a mess. And for me, I'm terrified that if I am doing well I'm not allowed to have therapy or my therapist anymore.
I will admit to doing well in the baking area. And I write killer poetry. My cats like me too!
Posted by fairywings on January 15, 2006, at 0:02:27
In reply to One Wasted Session Later, posted by Poet on January 14, 2006, at 10:56:23
((Poet)) I think it's so hard to pull out of thinking sometimes, it just feels like we're trapped, no way out. And we can't find meaning no matter where we look. How can we feel good about ourselves at times like these?
I know what you're talking about. I feel that sense of failure, and that my life has amounted to a big fat nothing.
Sometimes now I can see the wisdom in what my ex T told me. I used to get mad at him and feel he was really harsh, and he didn't ever let me off the hook. It wasn't fair at the time because I hadn't ever had a chance to work through anything, I'd only seen him for 2 months. Even though I think it was good to leave, I can appreciate some of what he said now more than I could then.
i don't know if it would be helpful or not, but i'm finding it somewhat helpful. i'm listening to caroline myss CD "Self Esteem: Your Fundamental Power" I think she's the type of speaker you either love or hate. She's a bit harsh, but for me, I think she's more right on the money than not.
fw
Posted by Poet on January 16, 2006, at 12:38:55
In reply to Re: One Wasted Session Later » Poet, posted by Racer on January 14, 2006, at 12:41:17
I can easily spin success into failure, so this is hard.
I graduated from college.
I completed a certificate program post grad.
I kept one diabetic cat alive for six months, the other for a year and a half, giving insulin injections and checking blood glucose levels.
I'm good at laundry- I know how to get stains out and even hang clothes out to dry in summer so they smell fresh.
I make good salads- lots of veggies and types of lettuce.
I'm good at water aerobics. It's the only exercise that I've kept up for more than a few months.I'll think of more. I'm starting to think how this can all be made negative, so I'll stop for now.
Poet
Posted by Poet on January 16, 2006, at 12:47:33
In reply to Re: One Wasted Session Later » Poet, posted by antigua on January 14, 2006, at 14:46:42
Hi Antigua,
> I know I've made great strides but inside I'm still very negative. It must be that small girl who still believes (or thinks like an adult) that she should have been able to get out of the abuse.
I can identify with how you feel. That small girl became an adult who convinced herself that she doesn't need to be dependent on anybody for any kind of support. Don't tell me good things, they can't be true anyway.
I have always been negative, it's so deeply set in me that I think I could be in therapy for the next 30 years and still be told that I'm projecting again.
Try hard to believe the good things about yourself that your pdoc and T think.
Poet
Posted by Poet on January 16, 2006, at 12:48:30
In reply to Re: One Wasted Session Later, posted by Poet on January 16, 2006, at 12:47:33
Posted by Poet on January 16, 2006, at 13:06:53
In reply to Re: One Wasted Session Later » Poet, posted by Dinah on January 14, 2006, at 14:49:39
Hi Dinah,
I feel so out of control right now. The logical part of me knows that I can't control everything and that I couldn't control the bad stuff that happened to me as a kid. It's the, but I should have done something to save myself part of me that can't stop blaming herself.
< I don't think you should be all that upset because most of us have one or two bugaboos that drive all our dysfunctional behavior, and plugging away at it and hearing the same thing over and over again does help.
Thanks for reminding me that everybody has those bugaboos.
Acting the opposite in therapy would mean not crossing my arms and legs and opening up. I don't see that as happening.
Maybe I'll sit on the floor. Pile all the love seat cushions around me and make a fort. I'd do a pillow fight, but my T has really good aim and she'll win.
Poet
Posted by Poet on January 16, 2006, at 13:16:09
In reply to Re: One Wasted Session Later, posted by daisym on January 14, 2006, at 23:18:32
Hi Daisy,
I did post a few successes above. The bad stuff does seem so much more important. I can easily list what I should have done. What I should have done better. What I did right or am good at is hard. I don't like myself, why would I like anything I've done? Sigh. Bad me. Bad, bad me. See, there I go.
How can I be doing well when I can't even reach my own standards? My T tells me to lower the bar, but I don't. I just run head first into it because I should be able to leap over it with ease.
I told Dinah that I might pile up the loveseat cushions and build a fort. I think my inner children would love to hide in it.
I like the idea of asking her questions. Sit right down in her chair and ask away. I think she'd cross her arms and legs and glare at me just like I do to her. Though it would be fun.
Poet
Posted by Poet on January 16, 2006, at 13:25:36
In reply to Re: One Wasted Session Later » Poet, posted by fairywings on January 15, 2006, at 0:02:27
Hi Fairywings,
I read Caroline Myss's "Sacred Contracts Awakening Your Divine Potential"
It's like finding your different personality types within you and learn about yourself and why you act certain ways. It was accurate for me. I should reread my charts I made. I am definitely being too much of a judge/critic right now.
I do feel so trapped. Trapped in a situation that I created with my own thoughts. I know my T wants to be in there with me, but I fight to keep her out. Leave me alone with my negative thoughts. Go away. But I'll be at the next session and the one after that... Maybe therapy is really just another way for me to punish myself.
Negative thoughts 100 Self Esteem 0. I'll look into the CD, I need all the help I can get.
Thanks.
Poet
Posted by fairywings on January 16, 2006, at 14:45:23
In reply to Success, I Guess » Racer, posted by Poet on January 16, 2006, at 12:38:55
(((Poet)))
Sometimes it seems it's just a matter of who you feel you really are, and not what you've accomplished, or what you're able to do. What you say reminds me of the John Bradshaw books - "Homecoming..." and others? He was incredibly accomplished, but didn't feel good about himself. I think he said he felt like a fraud.
I wish I'd accomplished just a fraction of what you have scholastically, and as far as your heart - it's huge. To care so deeply about your companions that you go to great lengths to keep them alive and healthy. That says a lot about who you are. Any you eat well, exercise, and can make the laundry smell good! ; )
I know it's easier to say that to someone else than to feel it about yourself, but I like you, and I think you're awesome.
fw
Posted by littleone on January 16, 2006, at 14:52:44
In reply to Success, I Guess » Racer, posted by Poet on January 16, 2006, at 12:38:55
> I graduated from college.
> I completed a certificate program post grad.
> I kept one diabetic cat alive for six months, the other for a year and a half, giving insulin injections and checking blood glucose levels.
> I'm good at laundry- I know how to get stains out and even hang clothes out to dry in summer so they smell fresh.
> I make good salads- lots of veggies and types of lettuce.
> I'm good at water aerobics. It's the only exercise that I've kept up for more than a few months.Can I add another one?
I think you have a very clever sense of humour. I always read your posts.
Posted by fairywings on January 16, 2006, at 14:53:51
In reply to Re: One Wasted Session Later » fairywings, posted by Poet on January 16, 2006, at 13:25:36
Maybe it would help to get those charts out. I think her CDs are pretty good.
Maybe it's just not the time yet, maybe there's a reason why you're so stuck. Maybe it's out there, but just not ready to happen yet. It's good that you won't give up though, I think that's 1/2 the battle. The other 1/2 is probably those wonderful T's who keep pushing us even when we want to curl up and hide....but close to them.
Sorry you're feeling so bad (((Poet))), wish I could help.
fw
Posted by 10derHeart on January 16, 2006, at 16:38:16
In reply to Re: Success » Poet, posted by littleone on January 16, 2006, at 14:52:44
>> Can I add another one? I think you have a very clever sense of humour. I always read your posts. <<
Yup. Me, too. I'll read a Poet sentence and love it. And think, "why can't *I* put words together like that?" Clever, funny, and succinct.
Poet, you write beautifully, whether you're being serious or funny, and in a way especially well suited to this medium. I try to learn from your style.
And I, too, always read your posts.
Thanks for pointing that out, littleone. Funny, (Poet, are you listening?) I think I didn't think of stating it because, well....it seems so obvious. I mean, for me as a Babbler, it's - Poet=lovely writing, great posts.
I say that talent goes on the list.
Posted by Dinah on January 16, 2006, at 18:35:23
In reply to Success, I Guess » Racer, posted by Poet on January 16, 2006, at 12:38:55
> I kept one diabetic cat alive for six months, the other for a year and a half, giving insulin injections and checking blood glucose levels.
You know, that says several good things about you. Someone who cares that much about their pets is automatically worthwhile in my book.
> I'm good at water aerobics. It's the only exercise that I've kept up for more than a few months.
Wow. That's fabulous!
Don't forget that you're smart and funny.
I'm just not sure you can convince yourself into a positive self image. Maybe it just sets yourself up for an internal battle with negative self talk.
Let me think of how I can describe this. I always laugh that my therapist provides me nothing to push against. So that when I push, I just fall down. That's his brilliance. With nothing to push against, I drop my stubborn insistence.
So maybe negative thoughts are something like that. Or like my OCD. I could argue my OCD. I could tell it that of course I didn't leave the door wide open. I couldn't have run over anybody. But doing that gives the OCD something to resist.
But when I named my OCD Ruthie and pictured her as a nagging, worried little girl who was constantly tugging at my sleeve and telling me things she's worried about, I was able to pat her on her imaginary little head and tell her not to fuss so. Yes, yes, I know you think that bump on the road was a person. But right now let's do a little work.
So maybe by fighting the negative self image and trying to convince it that it's wrong, you're just feeding it the energy it needs to live.
And maybe what you need to do with little Grizelda is to pat her on her little head and tell her that yes yes, you know she thinks you're a miserable failure. But right now let's go make a nice salad, and get ready for water aerobics.
If that makes any sense.
(And maybe letting yourself get clobbered in a pillow fight is just what your therapy needs right now. It would certainly shake things up. grin.)
Posted by Dinah on January 16, 2006, at 18:35:53
In reply to Re: Success, I Guess, posted by Dinah on January 16, 2006, at 18:35:23
Posted by Racer on January 16, 2006, at 19:29:40
In reply to Re: Success, I Guess, posted by Dinah on January 16, 2006, at 18:35:23
Posted by Racer on January 16, 2006, at 19:43:29
In reply to Success, I Guess » Racer, posted by Poet on January 16, 2006, at 12:38:55
> I can easily spin success into failure, so this is hard.
I know that a big part of that is that you aren't able to think well of yourself right now, but how much of that do you think is related to being, you know, female? How much is because you've had that "be modest, never blow your own horn" message beaten into you? Just a thought. Maybe you, like some other women I know -- probably including myself -- just feel so [expletive/adjective deleted] when we start to say something good about ourselves, that we have to turn it around, as punishment for our lack of appropriate modesty?
>
> I graduated from college.
> I completed a certificate program post grad.
> I kept one diabetic cat alive for six months, the other for a year and a half, giving insulin injections and checking blood glucose levels.
> I'm good at laundry- I know how to get stains out and even hang clothes out to dry in summer so they smell fresh.
> I make good salads- lots of veggies and types of lettuce.
> I'm good at water aerobics. It's the only exercise that I've kept up for more than a few months.
>
That's a good start. I can think of a few others:You're one good lookin' woman. (I've never seen pictures of you, but this is something I know without seeing you.)
You have a wickedly funny sense of humor.
Your email correspondence is very special -- the combination of clear vision, humor, caring, and just general warmth that comes through make you one of my very favorite correspondents. That's saying something, too.
You're ['nother expletive deleted] resiliant. That may not seem like a good thing to you right now, but it is.There's a Sylvia comic that has two women, Sylvia and I think BethAnn, sitting in a booth at a restaurant. The other woman is saying that she has stopped being as nice as she used to be, 'the other day, and old man fell down and I didn't stop to help him up.' Sylvia responds, "Did you kick his cane into the gutter?"
Poet, you're not kicking canes into the gutter. In fact, I"d bet you're the ONLY one you're so cruel to. You and I have talked about this failure issue in emails, so I ask you: "What would you tell me if I said I was an unmitigated failure?"
(By the way, you can't tell me you'd tell me I really was... Right?)
Same as people tell me -- offer yourself some of what you offer others. There's a reason people here like you, you know. And it's not that we're idiots ;-D
Posted by Dinah on January 16, 2006, at 20:21:21
In reply to REALLY good stuff here (nm) » Dinah, posted by Racer on January 16, 2006, at 19:29:40
It worked rather astonishingly well for me.
I need to pull it out and dust it off again.
Posted by Poet on January 17, 2006, at 8:34:13
In reply to Re: One Wasted Session Later » Poet, posted by fairywings on January 16, 2006, at 14:53:51
Hi Fairywings,
Thanks so much for having faith in me. I started therapy to get unstuck, three years later I am still trapped up to my neck in mental muck.
If I completely give up I'm a failure. If I try I'm a failure. I know that I am a failure only in my own eyes. My T doesn't think so. People here don't thinks so.
I will get out those Carolyn Myss charts. Lot of wounded child coming out these days.
Thanks for seeing something good within me.
Poet
Posted by Poet on January 17, 2006, at 8:43:24
In reply to Re: Success » Poet, posted by littleone on January 16, 2006, at 14:52:44
Thanks Littleone,
Though I've lost my sense of humor that enabled me to laugh at myself, I still do have as ex pdoc said sardonic wit. Hope I don't lose it.
Thanks for adding a success. Keep 'em coming.
Poet
Posted by Poet on January 17, 2006, at 18:17:16
In reply to Re: One Wasted Session Later » Poet, posted by fairywings on January 16, 2006, at 14:53:51
Thanks Fairywings,
If I give up I'm a failure, If I keep trying I'm a failure. I put myself in an impossible situation that no matter what I chose to do I will be disappointed in myself for choosing it.
I hope there is something out there and that I will get unstuck. I hate going around and around in the same negative groove. I'm getting dizzy.
Poet
Posted by Poet on January 17, 2006, at 18:26:22
In reply to Re: Success, posted by 10derHeart on January 16, 2006, at 16:38:16
Hi 10enderHeart,
I am listening. Thanks for sharing.
I don't think I'd put talent on my list, but I do have a good sense of humor. As expoc said sardonic wit. I'm glad it's appreciated and understood.
Your post is so sweet, thank you.
Poet
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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