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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 25. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by karen_kay on November 5, 2003, at 13:14:40
I just recently remembered some things that happened to me as a child growing up. The memory came to me on Saturday. It is now Wednesday afternoon. I have not been able to eat or sleep since then. I am literally climbing the walls here. I have already spoken with my therapist about it. The question is how do I get to sleep? And be able to eat? I just keep watching my bedroom door at night, it is not that I am actively thinking about things. I know it will get better and eerythign and I am talking to people, I just need advice on how to get to sleep. I tried to eat yesterday and my stomach is still in knots today form it, and trust me I am usually a stress eater. I would call my therapist for advice, but he acts put out if I call him between appointments. So, that is not an option. Any advice would be helpful. Thanks a lot. Karen
Posted by Miss Honeychurch on November 5, 2003, at 13:33:17
In reply to Please help!, posted by karen_kay on November 5, 2003, at 13:14:40
Karen,
I am a chronic worrier and would never get to sleep at night were it not for talk radio. If I didn't have talk radio to concentrate on while lying in bed, I would be up for hours worrying about everything under the sun. However, I have discovered that listening to talk radio while I'm in bed lets me concentrate on that and I fall asleep much quicker.
Posted by sadmom on November 5, 2003, at 13:56:12
In reply to Re: Please help!, posted by Miss Honeychurch on November 5, 2003, at 13:33:17
When I get stuck on something from my past I find I can't stop thinking about it until I tell my therapist about it. Can you make an emergency appt?
As for sleep, I turn on Law & Order reruns and lay back in the recliner, and eventually fall asleep there. If I try to sleep in my bed, I worry about everything. Like Sunday night I laid in bed for 3 hrs and finally took a Xanax.
Posted by karen_kay on November 5, 2003, at 15:15:50
In reply to Re: Please help!, posted by sadmom on November 5, 2003, at 13:56:12
I just talked to my therapist on Monday, and he wasn't really supportive. Actually I am really trying to avoid him. I kinda feel like it is his fault that this has come up. I think that he has had some knowledge for a while that I may have been abused by my father growing up and failed to let me know aobut it. And I just got a vivid memory of it on Saturday. so, do you think that just taking a single Xanax may help to "get me back in the swing" of sleeping again? I have only been able to sleep about 2-3 hours a night for the last 4 days and it is taking its toll, you know?
Thanks. Karen
Posted by Poet on November 5, 2003, at 18:48:07
In reply to Re: Please help!, posted by karen_kay on November 5, 2003, at 15:15:50
I can't believe your therapist isn't being supportive over something that traumatic. I'd say call him and say you need to talk right away, but I can understand why you want to avoid him.
It couldn't hurt to try the Xanax. My doctor just prescribed the anti-depressant Trazodone and Ambien (to take if Ttrazodone doesn't work within two hours) to help me sleep. Previously I was on the anti-depressant amitriptyline to sleep until my body became immune to it. So I would give the Xanax a shot.If the Xanax doesn't do it, can you get the doctor who prescribed it to give you something else?
Also have you tried Melatonin? It's an over the counter supplement that my husband takes and sleeps all night.
You need sleep and I'm sorry your therapist isn't there to help you stop the worrying.
Poet
Posted by Medusa on November 7, 2003, at 2:41:56
In reply to Please help!, posted by karen_kay on November 5, 2003, at 13:14:40
you need a therapist who'll help you deal with these issues head-on. Can you find a new therapist? Maybe one who takes family and childhood issues seriously? Many therapists don't, you know ...
Posted by karen_kay on November 7, 2003, at 5:56:32
In reply to Re: Please help!, posted by Medusa on November 7, 2003, at 2:41:56
The thing is, he is the one who helped me realize what happened. I guess I knew that some things happened, but now I'm starting to remember other things that happened too. So, I know he takes these issues very seriously. And he has helped other women in my situation. I just think it may be a reflection of the way I feel, that I am being a burden. I don't know, everything is confusing right now. And he has really helped me in the past to feel better, so I want to stick with him. I'm just wondering if I will ever feel better? Karen
> you need a therapist who'll help you deal with these issues head-on. Can you find a new therapist? Maybe one who takes family and childhood issues seriously? Many therapists don't, you know ...
Posted by Dinah on November 7, 2003, at 9:51:51
In reply to Please help!, posted by karen_kay on November 5, 2003, at 13:14:40
I hate to have to say this, but "recovered memories" are a hot issue for therapists today, and one of the main causes of lawsuits. Could your therapist not be being very encouraging because he doesn't want there to be any way he could be accused of creating iatragenic (sp?) memories and the associated problems for you?
If you think that's possible, you might want to discuss it with him. Perhaps even suggest that he seek supervision, or a consultation for the two of you, if this is causing problems for him being the best therapist he can be for you.
It's a shame that you would have to mention this to him, but honestly from the literature I've seen, you might run into problems with a lot of therapists in this area, purely because of their fear of lawsuits. Apparently there is a fine line to be walked, and not everyone is good on fine lines.
Posted by karen_kay on November 7, 2003, at 10:51:44
In reply to Re: Please help!, posted by Dinah on November 7, 2003, at 9:51:51
I've mentioned it to him several times, about false memories, and he thinks that the answer would be no because he is not, I repeate not leading me in any way. Also, my body seems to remember more than my mind does at this point. And there are a lot of boundry issues that my dad crossed growing up (ie. no locks on bathroom doors, I had no bedroom door). I remember 2 memories in vivid details, but now I am startign to have flashbacks, and I just feel like my therapist is not really there, like he promised he would be. But, I have talked a lot aobut maybe having false memories, I'm just sure this sin't the case. Too many things make sense now, like why I'm afraid to close my eyes in the shower. Man, and I was just startign to think things were getting better, you know? I guess, in a way this is a sign I'm ready to finally handle it. I guess I have always known something was wrong I just haven't always been ready to accept it and actually "remember" what happened. Thanks for the imput, but I still can't eat or sleep.... Am going nuts here... *sigh*
Posted by Dinah on November 7, 2003, at 11:15:44
In reply to Re: Please help!, posted by karen_kay on November 7, 2003, at 10:51:44
Oh, I hope I didn't give you the wrong impression. I'm not saying you *are* having false memories. It's just that you said your otherwise supportive therapist isn't being very encouraging to you in this matter and that was the most logical reason I could think of why that may be true.
But if he says he doesn't feel uncomfortable about it, that must not be it.
Posted by karen_kay on November 7, 2003, at 13:05:09
In reply to Re: Please help! » karen_kay, posted by Dinah on November 7, 2003, at 11:15:44
I just think maybe it is the way I perceive the whole situation anyway. I don't know what I expect from him. I called my dr. and left a message. Hopefully he will get back to me soon, because I need to relax. Thanks guys. Karen
> Oh, I hope I didn't give you the wrong impression. I'm not saying you *are* having false memories. It's just that you said your otherwise supportive therapist isn't being very encouraging to you in this matter and that was the most logical reason I could think of why that may be true.
>
> But if he says he doesn't feel uncomfortable about it, that must not be it.
Posted by DaisyM on November 7, 2003, at 13:16:33
In reply to Re: Please help! » Medusa, posted by karen_kay on November 7, 2003, at 5:56:32
K-
I have been in and out of where you are for the past few months so I really feel for you -- those deep, dark middle of the nights are awful. It is not uncommon for depression to wreck your sleep, especially if you dream about the past or recent therapy sessions. I recommend deep, very focused breathing. Keep bringing yourself back to breathing. Even if you can't get to sleep, you will get the body benefit of relaxation. Just try it...Also, is it possible that you are projecting really old feelings about having to take care of yourself, of not having support, on your Therapist? I know I've done this. I think there is a part of you that so wants to protect the secret that it creates feelings against the person you have told. And, against yourself.
Have you identified any triggers, especially ones that happen at night? Sex is a big one, whether it was sexual abuse of not, just because of the vulnerability. It might be OK during, but later you might have really intense feelings.
From what I've read, when you reveal traumatic memories, you are often emotionally flooded and regression to the age of the trauma can happen. As kids, we dealt with fear and upset by seeking hugs (or at least wishing for them). It is the same now. These emotions want to be buried in someone's arms. Therapists can't do this for us. That doesn't stop us from wishing they would.
Two weeks ago (Monday)I had one of those sessions where I told in as much detail as I ever have what happened to me. I was wreck all week. There was so much anxiety, so much fear. Lucky for me, I could go back in several times. I was actually right back in again Tuesday and we basically just sat and talked about how sad I was and how anxious "telling" was making me: what must my Therapist think of me, was it too awful for him to hear? Would he decide he couldn't help me? Could I take it all back!!?? And, we sat in silence ALOT. I just needed someone to help me work through it and since no one else knows, my Therapist was really the only one I could be such an honest mess with. I ended up in 3x that week with a 20 minute phone call on a day I wasn't in.
Then of course, I did the whole - I'm a burden/worse client thing this week. *sigh* It isn't easy. Journaling really helped me. And reading.
Hang in there. Clean something. Make soup. Listen to the new Rod Stewart CD - Songbook II. Watch Finding Nemo while hugging a pillow. Keeping busy helps me.
I'm thinking about you and sending support. Feel free to write LONG posts. I promise to read them.
-D
Posted by karen_kay on November 7, 2003, at 15:52:02
In reply to Re: Please help! (long reply), posted by DaisyM on November 7, 2003, at 13:16:33
Daisy, you are a sweetheart... what you said basically captured how I feel.. Everyone I talk to just says "I don't know what to say", and I answer :"neither do I"... I don't know what to say..
I hate my dad.. Two months ago, he was my best friend. I'm glad he is dead. I hate admitting it. I just feel like no one wants to know, I don't want to know. I feel like my therapist doesn't want to know, and if he does then it is sick and twisted.
Sex is the worst trigger for me, and showering. I've always been frightened of closing me eyes when I shower and now I ambeginning to understand why. During sex, unless I initiate, I'm always detatched, waiting for it to be done. I feel like I am obligated to do it. Like it is my job. I have to be a good girl and do what they wnat. I'm sorry if I'm boring people or disclosing too much but it feel sbetter to get this out to strangers who aren't looking at me and asking questions, or who seem too interested.
Daisy, thank you soo much! I guess I'm really afraid of being too needy towards my therapist. I called him thre times last week and he didn't even return my last phone call. He mentioned it when I spoke with him and said "I noticed you called me again." That was it. It's like he doesn't care or understand that I'm havign a rough time. II just had the expectation that we would be there when this went down, as he promised and he is not fullfilling that promise. And it hurts. It seems that everyone is letting me down right now. Agh! Sorry to be a downer, but I am running on no sleep right now!! Thanks agian Daisy, I really can't tell you how much it helps to know that people understand!!!! KAren
Posted by DaisyM on November 7, 2003, at 17:22:14
In reply to Daisy!!! (long one here), posted by karen_kay on November 7, 2003, at 15:52:02
Oh Karen,
Can you hate what happened, and not the man you knew as an adult? We all change, hopefully for the better. I have seperated, in my own head, my dad into two people. Pre-20 years old and post-20 years old. I just can't reconcile them as the same person.How did you respond to, "I noticed you called me again?" If you didn't say, "yeah, I needed to talk to someone" you should have. I think you need to straight out ask him about extra support because he may be assuming you have outside support when you don't. It will also help you if you KNOW his schedule, as in, he doesn't take or return phone calls on weekends or after hours, etc. Try to have a plan before you leave the session about what you are going to do, even if the plan is that you HAVE to live with the anxiety. That is the really hard part, I think, to feel like you are going to be in big trouble because you told! It creates little kid fear which is so overwhelming. If he thinks you are too needy or whatever, he should say so. He should also help you with tools to deal with life between sessions.
I have a huge fear of becoming too attached or being viewed as a complete pain, or worse, someone who wallows in their sorrow. But, we've talked about this a lot and believe me, I have never felt quite so out of control as I did last week, so I HAD to call. He totally understood though, he actually said to me, "well, geez, you did something really, really hard...of course you need more support." He also knows that no one else knows. Learning to lean on him and call, he says, is part of my therapy.
Try to go slow. You can't force the memories any more than you can make them stop hurting. I know all of this is easier said than done. I flip back and forth everyday from thinking it is helping to it is really killing me. :( Again...writing is my release -- I get it all down on paper and it feels better.
-D
Posted by karen_kay on November 7, 2003, at 17:59:03
In reply to Re: Daisy!!! (long one here) » karen_kay, posted by DaisyM on November 7, 2003, at 17:22:14
I don't hate my dad. I idolize my father. I am just very angry right now. This is the first time that I have admitted to myself and others what happened. This is the first time I have begun to remember other things that happened and I am just really angry and hurt an dconfused. I feel a little betrayed by my therapist beause he promised to be there for me when this started to happen and he isn't. I think I am transfering the feelings of betrayal from my father towards my therapist, but I still think he isn't doing all that he promised.
When my T made the comment aobut my phone call I just said," yeah, I've been climbing the walls." It was ass we were walking back to his office. I was actually hoping he wouldn't even mention it. I called him to see if I could get an earlier apointment. I never call him after hours or on weekends, I only have his business number. I don't want to ask him about extra support, because I don't want to be needy. I don't want to be a little girl, I want to be a woman. A lot of times in the past when I have needed him, i refused to call. For instance, I tried to kill myself. Then next day, I tried to schedule an emergency appointment. Without going into details, he answered," Is an extra appointment necesary?" I was like "I think so." When I got there, he put me in the hospital. See, maybe he really is just a jerk. Then I think, we all make mistakes and maybe he knows what he is doing. I've really opened up to him and I do trust him more thna anyone else, but not as much as I feel I should. But, it is so hard to trust anyone. I don't think I could ever learn to lean on anyone, as they always seem to let me down. But, I think I'll stick with him and try. Karen
Posted by karen_kay on November 8, 2003, at 16:12:53
In reply to Re: Daisy!!! (long one here), posted by karen_kay on November 7, 2003, at 17:59:03
Finally I am feeling a little better! I'm feeling calmer and I slept last night. I'm not pacing anymore. Still not too thrilled with my therapist but we'll get to that on Tuesday and he'll hear it. But that's why I pay him, right? Thanks everyone for such kind words and encouragement! I will be sure to give them back where they are needed and I hope they are still here when I need them in the future! And Daisy, you sure are a sweetheart! I really can't tell you how much it helped to hear from you! I really can't! Thank you thank you! Karen
Posted by DaisyM on November 9, 2003, at 23:08:20
In reply to Yahoo!! Slept last night and feelin fine!, posted by karen_kay on November 8, 2003, at 16:12:53
Glad to hear you are feeling better. Thought about you this weekend. Sleep is a wonderful thing! Also glad to help. Have been helped many times here, and expect to continue to need support! :)
Try to remember not to push yourself especially since you are feeling better. I keep hearing from my Therapist over and over and over again, these things take time. Emotional flooding doesn't help things, it is too draining.
Smile. Maybe it will stop raining tomorrow.
-D
Posted by karen_kay on November 10, 2003, at 10:22:21
In reply to Re: Yahoo!! Slept last night and feelin fine! » karen_kay, posted by DaisyM on November 9, 2003, at 23:08:20
I just need to remember not to push myself too hard as well. But, I figure at this point I have too much going for me to let this stand in my way. And I have a wonderful therapist to help me get through it! And friends as well. I just fear that I may be in too big a hurry to just "get over it", you know. Maybe I'm not going to allow myself enough time to get it out. Right now I feel like it's not really that big of a deal, but I don't really remember too many details. I'm just glad I'm sleeping. And at this point so many things make sense to me now, I realize I'm just a scared little girl, not a girl with psychotic symptoms, as I previously thought. Maybe NOW my pdoc will take my off my antipsychotic? Guess we'll jsut have to wait and see... Thanks hun! You are WONDERFUL!! Karen
Posted by karen_kay on November 10, 2003, at 10:23:25
In reply to Re: Yahoo!! Slept last night and feelin fine! » karen_kay, posted by DaisyM on November 9, 2003, at 23:08:20
Posted by DaisyM on November 11, 2003, at 19:06:31
In reply to And thanks for thinking about me! :) (nm) » DaisyM, posted by karen_kay on November 10, 2003, at 10:23:25
Just a check in. When is your next session? Are you going to discuss how you've been feeling? I was also curious if you are dreaming and if so are you keeping track of the dreams?
I know that after I've been really emotional I tend to dream about therapy sessions, but weird, all mixed-up dreams. People I've talked about in session always end up actually there with me somehow. My Therapist says it is my underlying fear that he won't be there for me and that I'm going to be in trouble for talking about so many secrets. Then I don't sleep because I'm afraid to dream.
Anyway, just wanted to reach out and tech-touch...Hope you are well.
-D
Posted by karen_kay on November 12, 2003, at 13:12:21
In reply to Checking In - Things Still OK? » karen_kay, posted by DaisyM on November 11, 2003, at 19:06:31
I just had a session yesterday and it went great. I haven't had anymore dreams about my father. I just feel that a huge weight has been lifted off of my shoulders. And we kind of talked about what will happen when I start feeling anxious again, when I start to remember things again. I have no doubt that he will be there. I do have a question for you though. Here's is the situation. I have a huge crush on my therapist. It is a little bit of transference, and a little bit about the fact that he is only a few years older than I and very attractive. Well, I am in kind of a power struggle with him, so much that I even dress nicer than him. Which is a struggle, as I am a student. So, I come home from class and change into a business suit to go to therapy (and I know it is silly).. I have told him aobut this and asked permission to wear jeans agian... I just want reassurance that it is ok, that I will still be in control. He said it was fine, but kept remarking how nice I looked and even refered to me as a beautiful woman during the session. He wasn't saying it as a way to build my self-esteem. I think the reason why he said it was to reassure me that men could find me attractive without looking at me in a "lustful way"?????? I don't know? What do you think?? And now I can't wear jeans again because of all the remarks he makes aobut how nice I look. Also, I have previous issues of changing my clothes several times a day that he knows aobut anyway, so why is he playing mind games? But, I love his mind games anyway... Ahhh, to have a crush on your shrink.. soeminput would be helpful. Karen
Posted by DaisyM on November 12, 2003, at 19:00:25
In reply to Hey... Some input????, posted by karen_kay on November 12, 2003, at 13:12:21
Ok, so this is a popular topic of discussion here. I know that a general recommendation is to read "In Session" which talks about this issue in detail.
I think you have to remind yourself that when you are really vulnerable that someone who listens, is caring and supports you will cause this kind of reaction. The parts you don't know are all the stuff about true relationships that we don't see. And, your therapist can not be your friend, date or otherwise engage in "normal" relationship behavior. You don't really want to lose a good Therapist...
This can be a painful process and I know a lot of people struggle through it. It sounds like you are talking about it, just keep doing that. The more "real" you make the feelings, the less powerful they are.
Glad you are doing so well.
-D
Posted by karen_kay on November 13, 2003, at 8:32:51
In reply to Re: Hey... Some input????, posted by DaisyM on November 12, 2003, at 19:00:25
I know that I can't have a relationship with my therapist, but it sure is fun to pretend. I won't get hurt, as I get these crushes all the time, on doctors, bosses, ect. And I just figured out why , which has a lot to dowith the relationship with my father. It breaks my heart to read about people who do get hurt when they develope feelings for their therapist (or think they do through transference). I am just having a good time with the crush! Pure fantasy, nothing more really! I am thankful to have such a wonderful and talented therapist who really brought some issues to light for me. By the way, I am still feeling great! Take care hun! Karen
Posted by Deafmom on November 13, 2003, at 17:10:29
In reply to Please help!, posted by karen_kay on November 5, 2003, at 13:14:40
Karen
I'm so sorry to hear of what you're going through. I recently had a similar experience when I remembered one thing for Halloween and another for my father's birthday. It was a terrible three weeks. No sleep, binging, lots of self harm. My therapist is the type who encourages me to page him whenever and he gets back to me as soon as he can. Every time I paged him he would say that he knows it's rough, but to remember that it's normal to react this way to memories. And that eventually it will subside. The key is to hang on until the storm ends.
Do you have any coping skills that help? Is there a candle scent or a stuffed animal or an activity (coloring,etc.) that might help you feel better and take care of yourself? Hang in there! You're very strong to even be here. That's something to be proud of. :o)
Posted by karen_kay on November 13, 2003, at 18:16:07
In reply to Re: Please help!, posted by Deafmom on November 13, 2003, at 17:10:29
>Ahhh, thanks sweetie!! Fortunetly I am through the rough part at this point, I guess until I begin to remember again. I guess what really helped me through is the realization that so many things now make sense to me. The fact that I am just a scared little girl comforts me a bit. Also, I now know that I have a talented (and yummy!!!) therapist to help me through all of this. I now am at the point that I almost want to hurry up and remember everything so I can move on with my life, as I am tired of being at a stand-still, you know? But, I realize that this is a process and that I would not be able to cope if I were to just remember it all today. So, I'm kinda stuck just waiting around. But, at least I am enjoying life in the process! Hurray for me!!!! Thanks so much for your kind words!! And I'm sure I'll need them again during the next storm! Karen
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