![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 20 of 20. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Fivefires on September 1, 2008, at 7:01:14
Hey. It's 5f.
I'm posting about the pharmacology and pharmacodynamics of venlafaxine (I know. That's just what I was thinking.) I copied and pasted a paragraph from
http://www.realmentalhealth.com/medications/effexor.asp
and it is as follows:
<The mechanism of the antidepressant action of venlafaxine in humans is believed to be associated with its potentiation of neurotransmitter activity in the CNS. Preclinical studies have shown that venlafaxine and its active metabolite, O-desmethylvenlafaxine (ODV), are potent inhibitors of neuronal serotonin and norepinephrine reuptake and weak inhibitors of dopamine reuptake. Venlafaxine and ODV have no significant affinity for muscarinic cholinergic, H1-histaminergic, or α1-adrenergic receptors in vitro. Pharmacologic activity at these receptors is hypothesized to be associated with the various anticholinergic, sedative, and cardiovascular effects seen with other psychotropic drugs. Venlafaxine and ODV do not possess monoamine oxidase (MAO) inhibitory activity.>
Can someone tell me ... don't we need some inhibiting of the reuptake of Dopamine too? Why doesn't venlafaxine care about Dopamine? Did the company make a different med for it?
(I wonder if trazodone inhibits the reuptake of dopamine? I ask because I can choose either trazodone or Soma.)
What meds do inhibit the reuptake of Dopamine?
Am I correct dopamine's job is to 'relax me' and serotonin's job is to 'make me feel happy'?
And hey, just read a post over in Medications about serzone and/or Nefazodone. There was talk of it working like Effexor.(?) I believe the poster referred to it as a med that worked very well, after trying many that didn't.
No one has ever mentioned serzone or Nefazodone to me. (I'm pouting.) So, there's another one I've not tried.
My diagnoses are anyone's guess, except for the anxiety which way fits the bill. Currently we're going w/ Atypical Depression, but this looonnnggg Episode of Major Depression hasn't let up. Now PCP looking at mono, CFS, and Epstein-Barr. Iron, B12, other labs low.
How do you get mono? I've never had it. Did my ex-sigother kiss someone else and then kiss me?:{
Only thing I take besides Effexor-XR, Xanax-XR, Xanax, and levothyroxine, is Provigil. I think we'll be discussing augmenting Effexor-XR or going to the old Effexor and augmenting it, at appt in a little over a week.
Augmentingt suggestions have been Remeron, amitriptyline, nortriptyline, and Lamictal.
What is it with all the hooplaa over Lamictal? What is it w/ hoopla at all? I have none. Nada. I never get happy anymore.
I tried Lamictal once and just got a headache.
Pardon me for touching on a few different issues w/o any particular order here. If I tried to put this in order, I'd have to stand up and yell at my post, pointing and yelling at each paragragh, like I was Al Pacino, 'Your out of order!' 'Your out of order!' 'Your ALL out of order!'(?)
It's the dosages of Effexor-XR make me shake my head. I only weight 112lbs, but if it's excreted in the urine, well ... I, pee, (I know you do to, but get a load of the following.) about every *30minutes* since had a total abdominal hysterectomy and bilateral oophorectomy (latter tubes and ovaries) and my bladder fell down in the big empty space (repaired but fell again) and I've developed a cystocele (it's like a pocket where urine (pee) gets stuck in there and you feel like you always have to go and you do. You kind of have to do weird body positions, like yoga on the toilet, and breathing like you're having a baby, to get it out. Yes I should have surgery again, but now it involves a piece of mesh and will fail if you become constipated and I would because I'm on a narcotic for a back injury, sooo I just keep putting off thinking about the whole thing.
Anyway, what I want to say is 300mg is comfortable, but 375mg is very comfortable! Did I say, I'm little? I weigh 112lbs. and am 5'5". Anyone else take this much? I, and anyone I've ever spoken w/ about it, agree I am a fast or poor metabolizer, so I NEED MORE of a medication, especially those that hang out in body fat.
I should be in bed. I couldn't sleep. I broke a 13yr relationship off tonight and the thrashing in my bed sort of scared me into thoughts like 'maybe this is when pp start hearing voices' and my feet hit the floor pretty quickly.
Someone pls read this (You can do a quick scan; no one will ever know.) Humoring me would even be appreciated. Poor me. Poor, poor me. No! Poor him! Loser! Way poor him!
Ex-boyfriend lied, a lot. Can't believe I stayed w/ him so long. Can you? There I go thinking 'it's all about me' again.
Am I dissatisfied w/o being hurt? Think it could be so. Another issue plopped into the midst of this post. It involves last betrothed and injured.
Moooo said the bull; ON said the cow!? o_o
I meant to say, moooovvviinnngg ooonnnn...but thought that was funny. Maybe it isn't?
Don't understand why Effexor didn't do something to block the reuptake of dopamine? (I don't think it should be capitalized.) What about uptake? There has to be uptake to be reuptake doesn't there? Is the dopamine, in this case, given two shots at getting to its proper destination? Uptake and then reuptake? What is the diff' of uptake and reuptake?
When will there be an AD that blocks reuptake of serotonin, norepinephrine, and dopamine; the whole shabang?!
tks&hopeuget2stayhome, 5f
Posted by mav27 on September 1, 2008, at 7:35:53
In reply to Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No?, posted by Fivefires on September 1, 2008, at 7:01:14
The dopamine is fired out.. but some of it gets sucked back in.. thats the re-uptake part. The need for domapine reuptake inhibitors doesn't seem to be a big thing.. there was one but it was banned due to possible abuse potential i believe although it may still be available is small parts of the world. If you have possible low dopamine problems the doctors will use stimulants so no need to really make AD's that effect dopamine as well. The only one i can think of off the top of my head that has some effect on dopamine is bupropion (wellbutrin or some spelling like that)
Posted by SLS on September 1, 2008, at 8:23:53
In reply to Re: Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No?, posted by mav27 on September 1, 2008, at 7:35:53
> The need for dopamine reuptake inhibitors doesn't seem to be a big thing..
Once upon a time, the FDA approved nomifensine (Merital) for depression. By that time, it was already available across the globe. Nomifensine is a potent dopamine and norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor. For some people, it was the only drug they have ever responded to. It was extensively studied. However, the drug wasn't out for a year when reports of fatal hemolytic anemia began to collect. The drug company decided to voluntarily take nomifensine off the worldwide market.
> there was one but it was banned due to possible abuse potential i believe although it may still be available is small parts of the world.
You probably are referring to amineptine (Survector). Yes, this drug was under scrutiny as being abused by drug addicts and athletes. The drug company decided to withdraw the product voluntarily as pressure mounted in the press. Again, for some people, this is the only drug that had given them relief.
> If you have possible low dopamine problems the doctors will use stimulants so no need to really make AD's that effect dopamine as well.
There is much about antidepressant drugs that we don't understand within the context of theoretical mechanisms. Nomifensine and amineptine act as true antidepressants, while stimulants do not.
> The only one i can think of off the top of my head that has some effect on dopamine is bupropion (wellbutrin or some spelling like that)
Most people used to think that the reuptake inhibition by bupropion of dopamine and norepinephrine was not potent enough to exert an antidepressant effect. It is the subject of ongoing debate. Recently, I have seen less and less resistence to the hypothesis that DA and NE reuptake inhibition is the mechanism by which bupropion acts.
Although the antidepressant effect of nomifensine lasted only briefly for me, I felt really well while taking it. Ritalin and Dexedrine did not have this effect on me.
To me, the bottom line is that it is better to have more drugs available than less drugs. DA reuptake inhibitors would be nice to have sitting on the gun rack. Upon reflection, many experts don't believe that nomifensine or amineptine should have been discontinued. The occurence of hemolytic anemia with nomifensine was rare. Many good drugs have the potential of being abused. Amineptine was not particularly addictive, but gained notoriety as being abused as an athletic enhancement drug.
- Scott
Posted by desolationrower on September 1, 2008, at 11:27:20
In reply to Re: Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No? » mav27, posted by SLS on September 1, 2008, at 8:23:53
Also keep in mind there are other ways to affect dopamine-related neuronal activity besides reuptake. Dopamine agonists are used as augmenting agents. MAOIs increase dopamine levels. Some specific receptors affect dopamine downstream, so for instance mirtazapine has been shown to increase dopaine levels in some brain-parts. Lower doses of supiride increases dopamine release. etc. I would not worry about 'covering all three neurotransmitters' per se.
-D/R
Posted by SLS on September 1, 2008, at 13:49:01
In reply to Re: Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No?, posted by desolationrower on September 1, 2008, at 11:27:20
> I would not worry about 'covering all three neurotransmitters' per se.
So, is it your belief that we don't need a DARI because drugs that address dopamine already exist, despite their not being of the same pharmacodynamic?
Have you ever tried nomifensine to compare it to d-amphetamine, methylphenidate, and bromocriptine? I have. I think that gives me a unique position from which to comment on the desirability of having DARIs become available.
If you don't need a DARI, then you don't have to try one when they come out. But why argue for excluding a drug from our pharmacopia if it is safe and effective? Why argue for less when more is needed? Actually, we will be seeing triple-reuptake inhibitors before too long as at least two are well along into phase II clinical trials.
- Scott
Posted by desolationrower on September 1, 2008, at 22:20:32
In reply to Re: Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No? » desolationrower, posted by SLS on September 1, 2008, at 13:49:01
uh
I was just saying that DA reuptake blockade won't necessarily make a new drug a magic bullet if such a drug is release. see in the OP "When will there be an AD that blocks reuptake of serotonin, norepinephrine, and dopamine; the whole shabang?!"
I'm very much in favor of new drugs...
Posted by Fivefires on September 2, 2008, at 2:29:17
In reply to Re: Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No?, posted by desolationrower on September 1, 2008, at 22:20:32
Think understand.
Does methamphetamine permanently damage the travel of dopamine to its target? Is this correct?
How about Provigil? What is it doing to dopamine reuptake inhibition?
No one said which, I think we refer to these as hormones right? No one explained what one of these is responsible for feeling happy? I've heard serotonin, but then I heard dopamine.
Did I say I was on Provigil? Told pdoc felt couldn't get out of bed w/o it. Still, he wants me to remain on it.
In the past couple days, it has been a thought put in my mind, spoken 'by someone'?, which really never occurred to me.
All this time I've been thinking/saying I'm in a major depressive episode. But, labs are suspicious. Could it have been mono all along, or CFS, or EB?
Will call PCP as the tests Phillipa kindly said were the most important to run for a true thyroid reading don't match what my PCP checked. He didn't mark a mono test either. Hope he'll let me do this via his okay on the phone.
I was sort of 'kidding around' (I must be feeling better!?) When I said, 'why isn't there a drug which targets all, SN&D?'
I'd supposed there'd be followups saying 'there already.'
Now, I'm interested in this new one, not yet approved. Look forward to hearing about it.
Tks, 5f
Posted by Phillipa on September 2, 2008, at 12:38:29
In reply to Re: Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No?, posted by Fivefires on September 2, 2008, at 2:29:17
It depends what is wrong which med will work for you but don't think a med can make you happy that is up to your thinking patterns and mine are altered due to anxiety/ depression irreguardless of the cause. Phillipa
Posted by desolationrower on September 3, 2008, at 0:38:36
In reply to Re: Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No?, posted by Fivefires on September 2, 2008, at 2:29:17
> Think understand.
>
> Does methamphetamine permanently damage the travel of dopamine to its target? Is this correct?depends a lot on the dosage. Therepeutic, there is some dispute; abuse, probably. Damage is probably relate to the way and extent dopamine neurons connect to others.
> How about Provigil? What is it doing to dopamine reuptake inhibition?
noone knows. It isn't just blocking dopamine reuptake across the board.
> No one said which, I think we refer to these as hormones right? No one explained what one of these is responsible for feeling happy? I've heard serotonin, but then I heard dopamine.
Well if you want to simplify it (and I mean simplify it A LOT), serotonin is more about serenity/content. Dopamine is more about interest/reward. Keep in mind there are a lot of receptors that have different effects from the same neurotransmitter, and the 'where' in the brain matters a lot. And, what 'happy' means.
> Did I say I was on Provigil? Told pdoc felt couldn't get out of bed w/o it. Still, he wants me to remain on it.
>
> In the past couple days, it has been a thought put in my mind, spoken 'by someone'?, which really never occurred to me.
>
> All this time I've been thinking/saying I'm in a major depressive episode. But, labs are suspicious. Could it have been mono all along, or CFS, or EB?
>
> Will call PCP as the tests Phillipa kindly said were the most important to run for a true thyroid reading don't match what my PCP checked. He didn't mark a mono test either. Hope he'll let me do this via his okay on the phone.
>
> I was sort of 'kidding around' (I must be feeling better!?) When I said, 'why isn't there a drug which targets all, SN&D?'
>
> I'd supposed there'd be followups saying 'there already.'
>
> Now, I'm interested in this new one, not yet approved. Look forward to hearing about it.
>
> Tks, 5f
>Hope you find something that works.
-D/R
Posted by cumulative on September 3, 2008, at 1:36:10
In reply to Re: Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No?, posted by Fivefires on September 2, 2008, at 2:29:17
Targeting the reuptake transporters of DA, NE, and serotonin.
But it may take a while for anything to hit the market. Given patent considerations, which seem to me to rule psychiatric medicine.
Posted by mav27 on September 3, 2008, at 9:50:03
In reply to 'Triple' reuptake inhibitors are being studied., posted by cumulative on September 3, 2008, at 1:36:10
id have thought it better to have drugs that just act on 1. i mean they tell us its a chemical imballence causing our problems.. they only way toi fix an imballence is to work on 1 at a time untill u find the correct balance. if you start effecting all 3 at once there is millions of ratio combos that could be needed to fix an imballance.
> Targeting the reuptake transporters of DA, NE, and serotonin.
>
> But it may take a while for anything to hit the market. Given patent considerations, which seem to me to rule psychiatric medicine.
Posted by bulldog2 on September 5, 2008, at 16:51:36
In reply to Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No?, posted by Fivefires on September 1, 2008, at 7:01:14
> Hey. It's 5f.
>
> I'm posting about the pharmacology and pharmacodynamics of venlafaxine (I know. That's just what I was thinking.) I copied and pasted a paragraph from
>
> http://www.realmentalhealth.com/medications/effexor.asp
>
> and it is as follows:
>
> <The mechanism of the antidepressant action of venlafaxine in humans is believed to be associated with its potentiation of neurotransmitter activity in the CNS. Preclinical studies have shown that venlafaxine and its active metabolite, O-desmethylvenlafaxine (ODV), are potent inhibitors of neuronal serotonin and norepinephrine reuptake and weak inhibitors of dopamine reuptake. Venlafaxine and ODV have no significant affinity for muscarinic cholinergic, H1-histaminergic, or α1-adrenergic receptors in vitro. Pharmacologic activity at these receptors is hypothesized to be associated with the various anticholinergic, sedative, and cardiovascular effects seen with other psychotropic drugs. Venlafaxine and ODV do not possess monoamine oxidase (MAO) inhibitory activity.>
>
> Can someone tell me ... don't we need some inhibiting of the reuptake of Dopamine too? Why doesn't venlafaxine care about Dopamine? Did the company make a different med for it?
>
> (I wonder if trazodone inhibits the reuptake of dopamine? I ask because I can choose either trazodone or Soma.)
>
> What meds do inhibit the reuptake of Dopamine?
>
> Am I correct dopamine's job is to 'relax me' and serotonin's job is to 'make me feel happy'?
>
> And hey, just read a post over in Medications about serzone and/or Nefazodone. There was talk of it working like Effexor.(?) I believe the poster referred to it as a med that worked very well, after trying many that didn't.
>
> No one has ever mentioned serzone or Nefazodone to me. (I'm pouting.) So, there's another one I've not tried.
>
> My diagnoses are anyone's guess, except for the anxiety which way fits the bill. Currently we're going w/ Atypical Depression, but this looonnnggg Episode of Major Depression hasn't let up. Now PCP looking at mono, CFS, and Epstein-Barr. Iron, B12, other labs low.
>
> How do you get mono? I've never had it. Did my ex-sigother kiss someone else and then kiss me?:{
>
> Only thing I take besides Effexor-XR, Xanax-XR, Xanax, and levothyroxine, is Provigil. I think we'll be discussing augmenting Effexor-XR or going to the old Effexor and augmenting it, at appt in a little over a week.
>
> Augmentingt suggestions have been Remeron, amitriptyline, nortriptyline, and Lamictal.
>
> What is it with all the hooplaa over Lamictal? What is it w/ hoopla at all? I have none. Nada. I never get happy anymore.
>
> I tried Lamictal once and just got a headache.
>
> Pardon me for touching on a few different issues w/o any particular order here. If I tried to put this in order, I'd have to stand up and yell at my post, pointing and yelling at each paragragh, like I was Al Pacino, 'Your out of order!' 'Your out of order!' 'Your ALL out of order!'(?)
>
> It's the dosages of Effexor-XR make me shake my head. I only weight 112lbs, but if it's excreted in the urine, well ... I, pee, (I know you do to, but get a load of the following.) about every *30minutes* since had a total abdominal hysterectomy and bilateral oophorectomy (latter tubes and ovaries) and my bladder fell down in the big empty space (repaired but fell again) and I've developed a cystocele (it's like a pocket where urine (pee) gets stuck in there and you feel like you always have to go and you do. You kind of have to do weird body positions, like yoga on the toilet, and breathing like you're having a baby, to get it out. Yes I should have surgery again, but now it involves a piece of mesh and will fail if you become constipated and I would because I'm on a narcotic for a back injury, sooo I just keep putting off thinking about the whole thing.
>
> Anyway, what I want to say is 300mg is comfortable, but 375mg is very comfortable! Did I say, I'm little? I weigh 112lbs. and am 5'5". Anyone else take this much? I, and anyone I've ever spoken w/ about it, agree I am a fast or poor metabolizer, so I NEED MORE of a medication, especially those that hang out in body fat.
>
> I should be in bed. I couldn't sleep. I broke a 13yr relationship off tonight and the thrashing in my bed sort of scared me into thoughts like 'maybe this is when pp start hearing voices' and my feet hit the floor pretty quickly.
>
> Someone pls read this (You can do a quick scan; no one will ever know.) Humoring me would even be appreciated. Poor me. Poor, poor me. No! Poor him! Loser! Way poor him!
>
> Ex-boyfriend lied, a lot. Can't believe I stayed w/ him so long. Can you? There I go thinking 'it's all about me' again.
>
> Am I dissatisfied w/o being hurt? Think it could be so. Another issue plopped into the midst of this post. It involves last betrothed and injured.
>
> Moooo said the bull; ON said the cow!? o_o
>
> I meant to say, moooovvviinnngg ooonnnn...but thought that was funny. Maybe it isn't?
>
> Don't understand why Effexor didn't do something to block the reuptake of dopamine? (I don't think it should be capitalized.) What about uptake? There has to be uptake to be reuptake doesn't there? Is the dopamine, in this case, given two shots at getting to its proper destination? Uptake and then reuptake? What is the diff' of uptake and reuptake?
>
> When will there be an AD that blocks reuptake of serotonin, norepinephrine, and dopamine; the whole shabang?!
>
> tks&hopeuget2stayhome, 5fDidn't read the other posts but Parnate has a strong dopamine component.
Posted by Racer on September 8, 2008, at 11:48:47
In reply to Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No?, posted by Fivefires on September 1, 2008, at 7:01:14
> Can someone tell me ... don't we need some inhibiting of the reuptake of Dopamine too? Why doesn't venlafaxine care about Dopamine?
Effexor does affect dopamine at higher doses. Also, dopamine is different from the other catecholamines -- it's a precursor to norepinephrine, as well as being a neurotransmitter in its own right.
>
> Am I correct dopamine's job is to 'relax me' and serotonin's job is to 'make me feel happy'?It's not that simple. All of these neurotransmitters have various effects in various regions of the brain. Dopamine, for example, is integral to voluntary movement, which is governed by one particular region of the brain. And behavior also affects happiness and content a great deal. We're not simply reacting to chemicals in our central nervous system -- we also have free will, and many of our choices will affect our moods.
>
> And hey, just read a post over in Medications about serzone and/or Nefazodone.
> No one has ever mentioned serzone or Nefazodone to me. (I'm pouting.) So, there's another one I've not tried.Serzone is a special case. About a decade ago, it was put into a kind of limbo -- last I heard, it was still available, but with very, very strong recommendations to use it only in those patients who were already doing well on it and hadn't responded to alternative medications. Serzone came with a high risk of very serious liver damage, and probably won't be offered to you by any doctor out there. You can ask your doctor about it, but be prepared to be told that it's not on the table.
>
> How do you get mono? I've never had it.Actually, you only know that you haven't been diagnosed with it. Mono is one of those diseases that can take a varied course -- some people experience a few days of flu-like symptoms with no sequelae; others end up laid out for six months. Mostly, people have it as children, when it will just look like a bad cold or flu. Unless testing is done, it's not going to be called mono.
>
>I think we'll be discussing augmenting Effexor-XR or going to the old Effexor and augmenting it, at appt in a little over a week.I don't understand why you'd go from the XR to the immediate release?
>
> Don't understand why Effexor didn't do something to block the reuptake of dopamine? What about uptake? There has to be uptake to be reuptake doesn't there?No -- release and reuptake. The molecule is released by one cell and then transported back to that cell for reuse or recycling of its elements.
>
> When will there be an AD that blocks reuptake of serotonin, norepinephrine, and dopamine; the whole shabang?!While they're not called reuptake inhibitors, MAOIs act as inhibitors of all three catecholamines. They inhibit the production of monoamine oxydase, which is an enzyme that breaks down the three catecholamines. That means all three of them hang around in the synapse longer.
None of these effects are straightforward. Many of these medications seem to rely on downstream effects -- it's theorized by some that SSRIs work by their indirect effects on dopamine As the serotonin hangs around longer knocking on receptor doors, those serotonin receptors start to ignore it. That increases the rational effects of dopamine, as those receptors remain unaffected. Neurochemistry of mood is not well understood.
And I wonder if you've tried Seroquel or Risperdal? They can be very helpful for many people with anxiety disorders, among other disorders. If you haven't tried them, they'd be a good option, I think.
Posted by Phillipa on September 8, 2008, at 19:39:22
In reply to Re: Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No? » Fivefires, posted by Racer on September 8, 2008, at 11:48:47
Great explaination. Phillipa
Posted by desolationrower on September 9, 2008, at 21:56:08
In reply to Re: Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No? » Fivefires, posted by Racer on September 8, 2008, at 11:48:47
Nefazadone is hard to get prescribed, but the risk wasn't actually that high, a couple per million...
-D/R
Posted by Racer on September 10, 2008, at 10:58:05
In reply to Re: Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No? » Racer, posted by Phillipa on September 8, 2008, at 19:39:22
Posted by Fivefires on September 10, 2008, at 13:56:50
In reply to Re: Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No?, posted by bulldog2 on September 5, 2008, at 16:51:36
Bulldog
The MAOIs, I think one of which is Parnate, right. So these, like Nardil, are good for their inhibition of dopamine reuptake.
Someone who has someone around them and isn't a little wimp like me, would go for it.
I tried Nardil and felt something 'right/good', but handlihg the side effects properly on my own, was too much :( and pdoc wouldnt' admit for med management.
tks, 5f
Posted by Fivefires on September 10, 2008, at 14:23:15
In reply to Re: Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No? » Fivefires, posted by Racer on September 8, 2008, at 11:48:47
Thanks Racer ... that's another print; anonymous of course!
(I always cut off the top and bottom of my pgs after printing and black out or not highlight and move the name of the poster into the print!)
tks so much, 5f
Posted by Fivefires on September 10, 2008, at 14:30:43
In reply to Re: Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No? » Racer, posted by Phillipa on September 8, 2008, at 19:39:22
> Great explaination. Phillipa>
I'm right behind you Phillipa.
It is well-written so as to be understandable Racer.
tks, 5f
and: I will reply further Racer; my limit for today I believe.
Posted by azalea on September 18, 2008, at 20:49:02
In reply to Re: Inhibit Reuptake of Ser-Yes, Nor-Yes, but Dop-No? » Fivefires, posted by Racer on September 8, 2008, at 11:48:47
> > And hey, just read a post over in Medications about serzone and/or Nefazodone.
> > No one has ever mentioned serzone or Nefazodone to me. (I'm pouting.) So, there's another one I've not tried.
>
> Serzone is a special case. About a decade ago, it was put into a kind of limbo -- last I heard, it was still available, but with very, very strong recommendations to use it only in those patients who were already doing well on it and hadn't responded to alternative medications. Serzone came with a high risk of very serious liver damage, and probably won't be offered to you by any doctor out there. You can ask your doctor about it, but be prepared to be told that it's not on the table.
>
Generic nefazodone is available, but brand name Serzone is not.
Quoting wikipedia, "On May 20, 2004, Bristol-Myers Squibb discontinued the sale of Serzone in the United States and Canada. Several generic formulations of nefazodone are still available."
This is the end of the thread.
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