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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 11 of 11. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by LOOPS on November 14, 2005, at 9:19:06
Hi all -
just in case this is of any use to you all -
yesterday I had a very, very bad day. The worst for a long time since starting higher dose Mg. I think the problem was I took too much Mg the night before and had bad diarrhea YET AGAIN the next morning. Worried I was losing more Mg than I was taking in, I took another dose of Mg chloride. I gradually fell into the worst tailspin of my entire life during the day and was a crying mess for most of it, unable to relax etc etc.
It was a relief to get to bedtime. This week admittedly has been hard for me and the weather has been really crap; I have been alone and very unmotivated - but I had actually managed to get over the worst of my depression this past year through fish oil/vits, and now Mg WAS helping.
So last night I only took 200mg Mg citrate and another 100mg at 6am (my usual wakey-wakey hour when I actually need more sleep). Held my breath this morning and woopee no diarrhea.
As an emergency last night, I also took some lithium orotate, a small amount of st johns wort and extra dose of fish oil. The lithium orotate I take on ad-hoc basis as it seems to help when taken every now and then for me, not all the time. It certainly puts a stop to crying fits and dysphoria at very low doses for me.
Today I am feeling much better (I react quite quickly to things luckily), and I am not giving up the Mg.
But I do think taking it in the day is a very bad move for me. It really seems to help with sleep, and when taken at night ONLY it actually does seem to make me less depressed the next day. However taken in the day it seems to have the opposite effect. Odd huh?
And I do think the diarrhea issue is very important i.e. not to get it.
As regards the Mg chloride - I actually have no idea how much Mg is in a packet (30g). I was assuming 12% Mg and taking the solution accordingly, but with hindsight I think it might have been much stronger than that.
I'm going to be taking a trace mineral supplement as well soon as I think this would be very beneficial in balancing out mineral status (?)
I must say I think yerba mate tea is also very useful as it contains very high levels of minerals - the manganese content is through the roof which is good, as high Mg can lower manganese in the body (so I read).
So here is my new list of things I am taking (pared down to the best of the best):
Occasional use: 5htp (50mg), lithium orotate, sjw
Daily:
low-dose multi (centrum)
berocca (B vits, ca/mg, C, zinc)
cod liver oil (lowish dose - is Summer here)
high EPA fish oil (2g EPA)
extra E and C (E 200IU, C 1-2g)sleep: Mg citrate (300mg)
Calcium 250mg
Melatonin 1mg
K salts - sprinkle in water (am on low-carb diet)Most of this stuff I have been taking for awhile - it is really the Mg I have been messing with.
Oh one more thing - NO PMT THIS MONTH - NONE! ABSOLUTELY NONE! In fact, my period took me by surprise which is unheard of. I usually suffer terrible depression before along with bingeing and feeling very tense. This has only happened after Mg supplementation, so it IS working for me.
Hope everyone is well
Loops
Posted by Larry Hoover on November 14, 2005, at 12:43:06
In reply to new Mg update on progress..., posted by LOOPS on November 14, 2005, at 9:19:06
> As regards the Mg chloride - I actually have no idea how much Mg is in a packet (30g). I was assuming 12% Mg and taking the solution accordingly, but with hindsight I think it might have been much stronger than that.
The molecular weight of MgCl2 is 95.21.
Mg is 24.31 and chloride is 2 X 35.45
Ratio Mg to MgCl2 is 24.31/95.21 = 25.53 % by weight
You've underestimated the Mg content by a factor of just over 2
The 30g sample of MgCl2 contains about 7.7g MgLar
Posted by LOOPS on November 15, 2005, at 8:48:10
In reply to Re: new Mg update on progress... » LOOPS, posted by Larry Hoover on November 14, 2005, at 12:43:06
> > As regards the Mg chloride - I actually have no idea how much Mg is in a packet (30g). I was assuming 12% Mg and taking the solution accordingly, but with hindsight I think it might have been much stronger than that.
>
> The molecular weight of MgCl2 is 95.21.
> Mg is 24.31 and chloride is 2 X 35.45
> Ratio Mg to MgCl2 is 24.31/95.21 = 25.53 % by weight
> You've underestimated the Mg content by a factor of just over 2
> The 30g sample of MgCl2 contains about 7.7g Mg
>
> LarOH wow -
thanks Larry! I guess that kinda clears that one up then. No wonder I was taking too much. I also realized the bottle I have holds 60ml not 30ml (doh) - must have been making the solution on a day I'd already had too much Mg ho ho.
So if mixed with 60ml water, each ml gives me around 140mg Mg? If so, it would seem I can't go over 200mg Mg at one time without diarrhea. Obviously I feel better if I don't get that high.
Loops
Posted by LOOPS on November 15, 2005, at 9:34:04
In reply to Re: new Mg update on progress..., posted by LOOPS on November 15, 2005, at 8:48:10
sorry - I meant 130mg Mg for 1ml of solution.
Posted by teejay on November 15, 2005, at 20:56:45
In reply to Re: new Mg update on progress..., posted by LOOPS on November 15, 2005, at 8:48:10
LOOPS, i've been in these tailspins mysle fin the past due ot messing with supps to apoint where i'm not sure what i'm doing, and have found the best solution is stop EVERYTHING for a couple of weeks and see where I am once my body has naturally levelled itself out.
Of course I wouldnt recommend people stop Pmeds if they are on them, but sometimes we tend to mess with soooo many supps and vits etc that we can throw ourselves out of kilter and it takes a period of abstinence to allow us to re-assess the situation.
Just a bit of drunken rambling which may (or may not) help you.
Regards
TJ
Posted by teejay on November 15, 2005, at 20:58:31
In reply to Re: new Mg update on progress... » LOOPS, posted by Larry Hoover on November 14, 2005, at 12:43:06
LAr, you dont seem to be your usual bubbly self old boy.......anything we can help you with? Given how much you've given this board over the years, its no shame to ask us for help you know ;-)
Best wishes
TJ
Posted by LOOPS on November 16, 2005, at 6:35:35
In reply to Re: new Mg update on progress..., posted by teejay on November 15, 2005, at 20:58:31
thanks teejay -
I don't really want to quit the minerals as I will most certainly be back to taking pills every night to sleep and I really can't afford to do that now as they make me depressed the next day.
I'm ok now, but the last two nights I have been waking up too much during the night and had to resort to half zopiclone (yuk)at 4am. I suppose it still is an improvement on not being able to sleep at all (been there). I should really start trying to NOT resort to pill backup as I do think I will fall asleep eventually without them.
At least when I am waking up, I do not feel anxious - just oh I'm awake again - what time is it? It is a triumph to wake up and see I've overslept these days. I think the Mg dose and balance with calcium has everything to do with this. If I could just get enough Mg into me without getting the runs I think I would sleep for Britain.
I'm going to try to cut out the melatonin and also the calcium for a few nights - I think the melatonin helps me nod off, but it might be interfering with me staying asleep somehow. Gonna try 300-400mg Mg alone and see what happens.
I hate the zopiclone though - it makes me quite down the next day and I'm sure it will contribute to rebound insomnia in some way the more I use it. I used to take zolpidem on ad-hoc basis and liked that more as it didn't 'hang around' in my system so much. However my repeat prescription got changed (without my consent!) to zopiclone, and to change it back I have to see the doc, which here costs me about 50 dollars. I'm not insured. BAh.
I really envy people who don't have sleep problems. They don't seem to realize what it's like to struggle through the night hoping you'll wake up and find you've had a full 8 hours sleep (ironically I am the type of person that needs 8-9 and sometimes more).
Loops
Posted by teejay on November 16, 2005, at 8:33:13
In reply to Re: new Mg update on progress..., posted by LOOPS on November 16, 2005, at 6:35:35
Hi loops,
I went through a period of perhaps 12 months when my sleep was terrible. I spent all night tossing and turning, and would eventually scrape a couple of hours of broken sleep.
Now I don't have any problems sleeping at all and bar the odd toilet break, sleep straight through 8 or 9 hours with no problems.
What i'm getting at here, is sometimes it MIGHT be all the supps we've taken that are helping to cause the problem. In my case, my sleep improvement actually coincided with a big break I took from all supps.
Sometimes its surprising how much good a break can actually do. You know your body of course, but I certainly wouldnt rule out a break in supps as a potential trial, after all the worst that can happen is it doesnt work.
Didnt realise you were UK by the way.
TJ
Posted by LOOPS on November 17, 2005, at 9:00:27
In reply to Re: new Mg update on progress..., posted by teejay on November 16, 2005, at 8:33:13
Glad to hear your sleep is good! That's a nice place to be.
Well I slept well last night. Usual Mg dosage but less calcium. However I have the beginnings of a candida flare up today, which is not good.
You know though, I've suffered from insomnia most of my life, even when I wasn't taking anything for it. Seems my sleep is so fragile anyway.
I might take a break from supps, but keep a bit of Mg in there. I bet my body is used to higher levels of vits though now and I'll probably crash. Still it will be interesting to find out.
Thanks
Loops
Posted by teejay on November 17, 2005, at 18:34:53
In reply to Re: new Mg update on progress..., posted by LOOPS on November 17, 2005, at 9:00:27
Well it would be a nice place to be if only it did me some good! I feel as washed out when I wake as when I go to sleep, only I wake more irritable and angry with each passing day :-( Still, if nothing else, its an 8 hour break from feelin sh*tty!
You say you'll probably crash.....well yes you might, but its amazing how often our bodies surprise us.
Have you tried some niacinimide with your mag instead of the calcium?
Posted by JLx on November 22, 2005, at 9:10:47
In reply to Re: new Mg update on progress..., posted by LOOPS on November 17, 2005, at 9:00:27
When I first started taking supplements by the truckload, well, ok, handful, I had a paperback book I was using as a reference that said to only take supplements 6 days a week. That's what I do, or even less sometimes. I think it is good to give the body a break from them. And as devoted as I am to magnesium, I do let a day or days go by without ill effect.
You might find George Eby's site on magnesium of interest re the Candida. He seems to have done a lot of experimenting and research and may have some ideas you can use: http://www.coldcure.com/html/dep.html#anticandida
I appreciate you updating us on your ongoing experience, btw. :)
JL
> Glad to hear your sleep is good! That's a nice place to be.
>
> Well I slept well last night. Usual Mg dosage but less calcium. However I have the beginnings of a candida flare up today, which is not good.
>
> You know though, I've suffered from insomnia most of my life, even when I wasn't taking anything for it. Seems my sleep is so fragile anyway.
>
> I might take a break from supps, but keep a bit of Mg in there. I bet my body is used to higher levels of vits though now and I'll probably crash. Still it will be interesting to find out.
>
> Thanks
>
> Loops
This is the end of the thread.
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