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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 9 of 9. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by paxvox on August 24, 2001, at 11:23:20
Why is it that sometimes family members don't support us when we are having bad times, or is it just me? Why do I feel like my illness is a pox upon them? When I need some love and understanding, is it too much to expect that from my spouse? Is there some sort of defense mechanism that makes them mad at us because we are not well? I mean, it's not like I'm not functional. I earn the only salary, I do all the cooking, I help take care of my 6 year old, I more than do my share at home as well as earn the money for the home. A counselor trying to help me get my problems fixed says I am letting myself fall into this trap. My wife acts like she hates me, but interacts fine with others (for a while I thought she was bipolar because of her mood swings, but he says she would act that way to everyone, not just me). Now, she does have a thyroid problem that the endo doc cannot figure out, and clearly has buried a lot of life issues rather than face them, but it seems as if I have become the target for her anger. I thought I deserved some of it, but have changed as much as I can the past year to eliminate the things I KNEW I was doing wrong.
What gives?
PAX
Posted by mila on August 24, 2001, at 15:00:18
In reply to family support, posted by paxvox on August 24, 2001, at 11:23:20
dear pax,
you have raised two interesting questions here, 1) why is it that they area mad at us, and 2) where is the support when we most need it. this is very clever of you, for even if it might look like it is logical to not support the person who makes us angry, many people still do (support), but others don't.
hurt and fear always underlie anger. maybe your condition scares her more than you realize, and maybe it hurts her more than you realize. Could you just ask her about it? about her fears and pain that your condition have caused her? when my husband becomes ill, i seriously panic and become very angry myself, so i understand the dynamic very well. my reactions were a mystery to me for years, but we have talked about it a year or so ago, and now things are much better. despite of the vows (be in sickness and health) the spouse's sickness still gets us by surprise, and some people lack the emotional ability to deal with it more than others. For me it is easier to care about the broken bone or bloody wounds than about the family member who feels extremely weak and low in spirit.
the lack of support always stems from lack of common goals. I am afraid you would have to give it a serious thought too. People tend to support each other when they build something together: a happiness, a family, a house, a shared purpose in life, etc. you have to find a way to see each other as members of the same team, then you will support each other better. each of you could write down a list of individual goals and desires, and then share them and see which are common. after that put your heads together and brainstorm how to get there sooner and better. this will bring back the spirit of camaraderie into your relationship. you might discover that things are not what they used to be when you first met and fell in love. people change. and, strangely enough, always to the better :)
best wishes
mila
Posted by mgrueni on August 24, 2001, at 15:21:09
In reply to family support, posted by paxvox on August 24, 2001, at 11:23:20
Hi Pax,
may I introduce myself to you before
I reply to your post? :o)
I am Michaela. Sounds like a foreign name? It is. I am german, which should explain my sometimes funny english grammar. So - here we go:< Why is it that sometimes family members don't support us when we are having bad times, or is it just me? Why do I feel like my illness is a pox upon them? When I need some love and understanding, is it too much to expect that from my spouse? >
Of course it isn`t too much to expect!
I was wondering about the same thing on many occasions whilst the 6 years of my relationship.< Is there some sort of defense mechanism that makes them mad at us because we are not well? >
What do you mean with *mad*? Is she shouting at you, telling you nasty and unfair things all the time? From my experience it isn`t a *defense mechanism*, but he sometimes simply doesn´t understand what`s wrong with me when I get depressed. The lack of an obvious reason confuse the *normal* people. Of course he tries to help me, but in a very rational way which doesn`t help me at all but makes things even worse. I usually can`t think properly when I am depressed and am already angry with myself for that. Now his constantly *pushing* me to try and understand that there *is* no reason to feel sad makes me feel like an inadequate crap and I get even more depressed. As a reaction on that he gets frustrated (maybe feels *not good enough* to help me himself) and sometimes a bad argue is the result of this misunderstanding.
< I mean, it's not like I'm not functional. I earn the only salary, I do all the cooking, I help take care of my 6 year old, I more than do my share at home as well as earn the money for the home..... >
Sounds dangerous to me, but I am sure this is not news to you. I am also that type of person who think she`s responsible for everything and has to do it all on her own. I am aware that I am making a great mistake by thinking (and acting) that way, but sometimes I just can´t stop it. Lucky me, at least my partner does know me well enough by now to stop me, sit me down on the couch and then he makes a coffee for me. Yes, really! Coffee has a *calming* effect on me. :o)
It`s important that your spouse understands that you *can`t* do it all on your own and that you need her help sometimes.
I wonder if she`s that kind of person who´s easy to talk to, but I am afraid, she`s not? Do you think it would be worth a try to explain her how you feel? Maybe she just isn`t aware of it, because you are not really honest with her? I learnt that I sometimes tend to expect my partner to be a mindreader. I thought it was obvious how bad I felt, so how can he ignore that?
After a long talk it turned out that it was partly my own mistake, as I (unconsciously) tried to hide my feelings because of an old *mental damage* I mentioned in one of my previous posts. I think of myself as someone who has to be strong *always*, doesn`t matter how sad I feel, I can´t allow myself to show it. So, I was doing a good job at it, my partner had no clue that I was down at all until I told him, using unmistakable words like "Look, I feel very, very down and I need you to comfort me. Just hold me and let me cry on your shoulder".< Now, she does have a thyroid problem that the endo doc cannot figure out, and clearly has buried a lot of life issues rather than face them, but it seems as if I have become the target for her anger. I thought I deserved some of it, but have changed as much as I can the past year to eliminate the things I KNEW I was doing wrong. >
:o(
That sounds as if you are very frustrated (understandable!). You are trying to keep in mind her Thyroid or whatever is effecting her way to act, changing the things she dislikes and she`s still using you as her *punching ball*. I don`t know much about your situation, but it seems to me that she really doesn´t know how much her behaviour does harm you.
Are you that type of person who always appears as a "nothing is too much for me, I am *so* strong" ?
If so, I know it`s very hard to change that, but you can`t expect her to know how you feel out of instinct. Maybe she´s just too busy with her own problems to be aware of your being down ?
Maybe you *provoke* her behaviour a bit because you don´t say "stop, I can`t take that any more!" ? It`s very nice of you earning the money, doing all the cooking and so on (every women`s dream, such a man!) But a relationship can´t be a *one way* road.
I hope you can sort that out with her and everything turns to a reconciliation :o)Micha
Posted by susan C on August 24, 2001, at 15:21:23
In reply to family support, posted by paxvox on August 24, 2001, at 11:23:20
> Why is it that sometimes family members don't support us when we are having bad times, or is it just me?
No, not just you, I feel others get wrapped up in their own battles. Last week spouse was frenetic with new responsibilities at work. It wasnt til almost the end of the week that I realized, through my fog, that HE needed HELP from ME.
>Why do I feel like my illness is a pox upon them? When I need some love and understanding, is it too much to expect that from my spouse?
Do you ask? Straight out?
>Is there some sort of defense mechanism that makes them mad at us because we are not well?
Yes, I think sometimes oour spouses think us being ill is a sign of them being a failure. Illogical, but true.
>I mean, it's not like I'm not functional. I earn the only salary, I do all the cooking, I help take care of my 6 year old, I more than do my share at home as well as earn the money for the home. A counselor trying to help me get my problems fixed says I am letting myself fall into this trap. My wife acts like she hates me, but interacts fine with others (for a while I thought she was bipolar because of her mood swings, but he says she would act that way to everyone, not just me). Now, she does have a thyroid problem that the endo doc cannot figure out, and clearly has buried a lot of life issues rather than face them, but it seems as if I have become the target for her anger. I thought I deserved some of it, but have changed as much as I can the past year to eliminate the things I KNEW I was doing wrong.
Have you both gone to the drs together? Do you have a forum to talk together with someone else present...not jerry springer (lol) sorry
I have friends who faced separation, going to a cousellor, one activity they did, was the non control spouse, who was angry, but never showed it, was given responsibility for all deceisions for a period of time, the other spouse had to support them. It was the first time in her life she had been given the opportunity to do that and the spouse, it was the first time he did not have the responsiblity and had to respect her decisions. I am not saying this directly applies, but, if you both have ruled out the obvious medical challenges, and are ruling them out, and interpersonal challenges still remain, is it time to get some help together?
> What gives?
I think both sides, but will she play? even if she feels like shit? Pardon my French.
>
>
> PAXSincerely,
A foreign sounding mouse
Posted by paxvox on August 24, 2001, at 19:58:28
In reply to Re: family support, posted by mila on August 24, 2001, at 15:00:18
Mila, thanks for the very sweet answer. It would take too long to explain the whole story, but clearly you have hit some of the key issues knowing very little about my particulars. So maybe it's not just what I am seeing. Unfortunately, my wife has refused to go to counseling, and refuses even to talk about issues. It is very demoralizing. I will expound in another post. But thanks!
PAX
Posted by paxvox on August 24, 2001, at 20:58:49
In reply to Re: family support » paxvox, posted by mgrueni on August 24, 2001, at 15:21:09
> Micha
Thanks, Micha, another sage observation from the pages. As in my answer to a previous response to my post, there is SO much to try to explain to put things into perspective. I am intigued, however, by you ladies and your fairly on target responses! :) My main personality fault is that I always have to be right (or at least I go to great measures to try to be). I am aware of this personality trait, and am trying to deal with it. It is not necessarily manifested in a "I'm an iron man" facade, more so a "no, that's not right because......". A counsellor I am seeing has suggested some ways to overcome this trait. Unfortunately, I am afraid that this has become so ingrained in our 12 year relationship that my wife has perfected rote responses to me that are no longer relevent. Perhaps it is HER self-defense mechanism, I don't know. She does have a lot of unresolved issues, but does not want to get them fixed. She has refused many attempts to go to see someone for help. Maybe her "known devil" is better than the unknown (SC's analogy...kinda mousey). Anywho......I was just venting. I did say for better or worse, so I know that I will find a way to get through, but I know I have to be healthy myself, and not let her exacerbate my condition by sucking me into her darkness (I know that sounds kinda harsh).
More later.
PAX
Posted by Kingfish on August 25, 2001, at 19:16:03
In reply to family support, posted by paxvox on August 24, 2001, at 11:23:20
> Paxvox:
I am going through something so similar right now. I don't have the answers at all, but wanted to offer some support. And since it's from a female perspective, maybe it's interesting.
I'm just coming out of a major depressive episode - last weekend I told my husband I wanted to go into the hospital, was worried about the number of suicidal thoughts, etc. He just couldn't handle it. This one was probably the worse one he's seen. He's been short with me throughout it, not supportive at all. This time he asked for literature on the illness (BP) but I just haven't had the energy to pull it together yet (I've been sleeping since starting Depakote a few days ago).
O.K., to try to keep it short, I think that everyone here's hitting it on the head. I think our spouses feel like they should be able to "fix it." Even if they have come to terms with it as a physical decision, there must still be some feeling of "why can't they snap out of it." And the meds alone are so trying on our bodies. If someone hasn't been through it...
I think I'm going to ask my husband to read parts of Andrew Solomon's new book, Noonday Demon. He just can't see how it's impossible for me to get out of bed some days. Perhaps that will help. I kept telling him two weeks ago I couldn't think straight enough to discuss anything. After nine years, together, he still doesn't understand.
My pdoc has suggested exactly was Susan has - that we need to get a third, non-involved opinion. I wish I were religious, because it would be simpler to have a parish to go to for that.
Just remember, that you're bound to break down at some point if you take on to much. I am slowly learning to set up my life for the long run, to listen to my energy (which, granted, is ziltch, right now), and I'm even thinking of how to plan as stress-free an existence as possible once I'm not sleeping everyday. (In other words, I may not have the most perfectly folded laundry on the block - all right, it's hardly ever folded.)
Back to the marriage: it was a great freedom for me, to realize this past spring, that I didn't have to stay in my marriage, if it wasn't for the best. It just wasn't something I had ever allowed to cross my mind. That has allowed me not to feel guilty about things such as needing to take care of myself when in a depressive state, or sleeping because of medication. Before that, I would have tried to continue my life as usual, probably using alcohol to help me get through it.
Again, sorry, not much help. But much empathy.
- K.
Posted by paxvox on August 25, 2001, at 20:26:39
In reply to Re: family support » paxvox, posted by Kingfish on August 25, 2001, at 19:16:03
> - K.
Two things you said. 1. I cannot nor will I , allow my marriage to fall apart. If I have to suffer for awhile, so be it. It is rather frustrating at times when the one I love so much won't even give me a loving hug of support, but that's what I have for now.
2. You say you wish you were religious, what is it that is keeping you from being so? Bad past or not enough evidence to convince you? Now, I cannot claim to be an expert, but I believe I can provide you a salient arguement on the existance of God. However, I will not be so bold as to post that w/o you asking me to. I will note however, that were it NOT for my religious beliefs, I really would be lost in a bottomless pit. On the days when I have thought that maybe my life was not worth living,I have found peace from knowing that it really is not MY life to control. As I said, not to proselytize, but I will be happy to at least explain why I believe what I believe. It's your call.PAX
Posted by Kingfish on August 26, 2001, at 18:34:28
In reply to Re: family support » Kingfish, posted by paxvox on August 25, 2001, at 20:26:39
Pax:
I certainly and absolutely respect your decisions and am glad you feel very strongly about them.
Was just sharing what has helped me.
I'm very content in my belief-system, or lack of, right now, but thank you for the offer. If I change my mind, I'll get back to you. :)
- K.
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