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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 20 of 20. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Partlycloudy on July 18, 2014, at 16:22:30
My sleep continues to be inconsistent, as my meds were seriously messed up while at That Place. Now I am sleep deprived. In turn, my depression has kicked up a notch and I find that my ordinary stressors have extraordinary power. It's as if I have taken giant leaps backwards.
My therapist is asking me to just hang in there, and try to do some sort of physical activity that will help tire me for the end of the day. And to try to disregard the agitation I am feeling, since it is coming from such a disordered place.
I'm entertaining really ridiculous crap thoughts. Nothing dangerous, but nothing smart. It's like all the limitations have spotlights and none of the possibilities are visible. Argh.
I might try to dance in my kitchen. That is a crazy thing.
Posted by Partlycloudy on July 21, 2014, at 12:21:19
In reply to Not thinking rights, posted by Partlycloudy on July 18, 2014, at 16:22:30
Dancing helps. But sleep is hit or miss. I am tired of trying to tread water. I could care less if I ate, but if food is in front of me, it doesn't taste of much but I feed the machine.
I know so much of this is my situation. I came back from the extended period away from home to a brief honeymoon period. Phfft. That didn't last long. Tired of being the person working on change, working on making things better. Do I just shut up and accept this? Do I shut up and make my life happier in my own bubble - and is that what marriages are about? You find ways to fill the voids that aren't filled otherwise?
Animosity has fled. Just a hollow aching emptiness of reality staring at me. He won't do counselling again. Sobriety has meant that there's no escape (blackout) hatch, no slow suicide. That is much better in many ways, but the sadness sits and faces me. Sitting in the living room, TV on, both of us tapping on our tablets; that's our life. No conversation, none. Depression is a natural consequence.
Blah. Blech. Thank goodness for a life outside the house. I have one with the groups I go to. He rides his bicycle for hours every week. We are barely a couple. The way it is.
Posted by Phillipa on July 21, 2014, at 17:02:10
In reply to Re: Not thinking right, posted by Partlycloudy on July 21, 2014, at 12:21:19
Seriously this is also how we live. And to us the void is fillled with other things. At night we both are on computers working. Still doing the ebay. And the minute we get home. I am the one out riding the bike and talkng to the people I meet. We drive in the car and don't talk much. And in bed at night I read my Nook and he reads a book from his Nook tablet. Why is this so bad? I honestly thought most marriages were like this. My kids in Florida one flies to different states to run half marathons at least once every month. He stays home and pup sits. Son does spend more time with wife as he can't drive with the blindness, and youngest spends more time with Granddauther of mine her child. Husband of hers works a lot of hours. Anyway such is life to me. Phillipa
Posted by PartlyCloudy on July 21, 2014, at 19:03:16
In reply to Re: Not thinking right » Partlycloudy, posted by Phillipa on July 21, 2014, at 17:02:10
Seriously, I think my life could be better than this. Doing things on my own is opening my eyes.
Posted by Phillipa on July 21, 2014, at 20:40:38
In reply to Re: Not thinking right » Phillipa, posted by PartlyCloudy on July 21, 2014, at 19:03:16
Do you have a list of what you would like changed? Or different? I once went for 7 years to marriage counselling with first husband and never ever again for me. Phillipa
Posted by baseball55 on July 21, 2014, at 21:02:03
In reply to Re: Not thinking right » PartlyCloudy, posted by Phillipa on July 21, 2014, at 20:40:38
PC - this is how things were getting for me. We were drifting apart. Not quite as bad as it sounds with you and your husband though. But not a relationship worth staying in either. What benefits does the relationship have? What keeps you in it if you aren't happy or feeling loved?
Posted by Phillipa on July 21, 2014, at 21:23:04
In reply to Re: Not thinking right, posted by baseball55 on July 21, 2014, at 21:02:03
What is drifting away? I worked the opposite times of husband when first married. And it was fine. We never have clung to one another. Different ages too different interests. but some things we share like the pups and cat and ebay? Phillipa
Posted by Partlycloudy on July 22, 2014, at 6:11:37
In reply to Re: Not thinking right, posted by baseball55 on July 21, 2014, at 21:02:03
He works hard at understanding my mental illness and my limitations. The only source of family support for me. And yes, financial security. He can be genuinely affectionate if I make enough noises and remind him to act more outwardly.
But he doesn't believe in therapy. Keeps waiting for the combination of pills that will make me more like I used to be; and that person is long gone.
This is hard.
Posted by Partlycloudy on July 22, 2014, at 12:07:25
In reply to Re: Not thinking right » baseball55, posted by Partlycloudy on July 22, 2014, at 6:11:37
> He works hard at understanding my mental illness and my limitations. The only source of family support for me. And yes, financial security. He can be genuinely affectionate if I make enough noises and remind him to act more outwardly.
> But he doesn't believe in therapy. Keeps waiting for the combination of pills that will make me more like I used to be; and that person is long gone.
> This is hard.More sleep will help me think straight and be my assertive self. I am going to keep quiet until my mind has some more order to it. 4 hours of sleep a night is making me ultra sensitive, unable to concentrate, and quick to pick an argument with. My Ambien CR has just been put back to where it started - 12.5mg. Thank goodness for an understanding family doctor, who sees the bigger picture when I am unable to.
Posted by baseball55 on July 22, 2014, at 20:15:05
In reply to Re: Not thinking right, posted by Partlycloudy on July 22, 2014, at 12:07:25
Sleep well. So you've looked at the costs and benefits and found that you get enough to stay. For me, it wasn't enough. I felt like we were roommates. If we had been roommates, that would have been okay, but we were supposed to be a couple, caring for and giving to one another. And that was lacking. Not okay for me.
> > He works hard at understanding my mental illness and my limitations. The only source of family support for me. And yes, financial security. He can be genuinely affectionate if I make enough noises and remind him to act more outwardly.
> > But he doesn't believe in therapy. Keeps waiting for the combination of pills that will make me more like I used to be; and that person is long gone.
> > This is hard.
>
> More sleep will help me think straight and be my assertive self. I am going to keep quiet until my mind has some more order to it. 4 hours of sleep a night is making me ultra sensitive, unable to concentrate, and quick to pick an argument with. My Ambien CR has just been put back to where it started - 12.5mg. Thank goodness for an understanding family doctor, who sees the bigger picture when I am unable to.
>
Posted by Partlycloudy on July 23, 2014, at 7:18:06
In reply to Re: Not thinking right » Partlycloudy, posted by baseball55 on July 22, 2014, at 20:15:05
I am still not decided what to do. I am only listing the realistic reasons I am holding back. Financial security would only be a temporary concern, and I am scared, not terribly materialistic.
I still didn't sleep too great. So I know I need to be as rational as I can.
Do you see what I am saying?
PC
Posted by Partlycloudy on July 23, 2014, at 9:18:34
In reply to Re: Not thinking right » baseball55, posted by Partlycloudy on July 23, 2014, at 7:18:06
> I am still not decided what to do. I am only listing the realistic reasons I am holding back. Financial security would only be a temporary concern, and I am scared, not terribly materialistic.
>
> I still didn't sleep too great. So I know I need to be as rational as I can.
>
> Do you see what I am saying?
> PCThis is what I get for being honest.
Posted by Phillipa on July 23, 2014, at 19:09:03
In reply to Re: Not thinking right, posted by Partlycloudy on July 23, 2014, at 9:18:34
What do you mean by last comment? Makes sense to me?
Posted by baseball55 on July 23, 2014, at 19:49:43
In reply to Re: Not thinking right » baseball55, posted by Partlycloudy on July 23, 2014, at 7:18:06
> I am still not decided what to do. I am only listing the realistic reasons I am holding back. Financial security would only be a temporary concern, and I am scared, not terribly materialistic.
>
> I still didn't sleep too great. So I know I need to be as rational as I can.
>
> Do you see what I am saying?
> PCI absolutely understand what you are saying. I struggled for months about leaving even after I knew he was involved with someone else. The financial issues were daunting but worst was just the idea of being alone, starting over, leaving the familiar. On the other hand, once I made the decision to leave, I felt better. Mostly, I felt better about myself - that I was not settling for being unhappy and trying to patch together and rationalize what had become a bad relationship.
Posted by Partlycloudy on July 24, 2014, at 6:39:04
In reply to Re: Not thinking right » Partlycloudy, posted by baseball55 on July 23, 2014, at 19:49:43
I have already been through the thought process, even, Baseball; began the separation piece. I didn't discuss it with my spouse, though. We'd been through counselling, he tried therapy, and he easily slipped back into his old patterns.
That's when I decided to clear my head by becoming sober - again - and had a poor experience at rehab. So I am coming to the same conclusions again, but with a sober mind.
What I haven't done yet is attempt to assert myself. So that is next on the list. I want this to work, rather than for me to repeat my pattern of running away from my problems.
Thanks for hanging in with me on this.
Posted by Poet on July 24, 2014, at 13:32:02
In reply to Re: Not thinking right, posted by Partlycloudy on July 22, 2014, at 12:07:25
Hi PC,
When you can't sleep it's hard to think right- my thoughts turn more negative than usual and I can't stop that inner voice of self loathing. My worst was when Ambien stopped working and I called Dr. Clueless and left a voicemail after being awake for 36 hours. Hence, I now take seroquel to sleep. I hope the upped dose of Ambien CR allows your thoughts to stop creeping in and you get some much needed rest.
I wish that rehab place had treated you better- really hard cyber slaps to everyone there.
Poet
Posted by Partlycloudy on July 24, 2014, at 15:07:47
In reply to Re: Not thinking right, posted by Poet on July 24, 2014, at 13:32:02
> Hi PC,
>
> When you can't sleep it's hard to think right- my thoughts turn more negative than usual and I can't stop that inner voice of self loathing. My worst was when Ambien stopped working and I called Dr. Clueless and left a voicemail after being awake for 36 hours. Hence, I now take seroquel to sleep. I hope the upped dose of Ambien CR allows your thoughts to stop creeping in and you get some much needed rest.
>
> I wish that rehab place had treated you better- really hard cyber slaps to everyone there.
>
> PoetI tried Seroquel, and it made me sleep - for 12 hours a night! Last night was my first full night of sleep, despit not feeling sleepy when I went to bed. I managed to avoid a prolonged nap in the mid afternoon, because I knew that didn't help. Nice little headache there.
Actually, a lot of headaches, but not all migraines. Note to self.
And for all the damage that rehab seems to have done to me, I discovered some truths about myself. That being around very ill, disturbed people in a close setting is extremely unkind to PC's psyche. That one size does not fit all, not only in psychiatry, but in addiction rehab as well. That there is not yet a medically sound treatment for addiction that doesn't involve ingesting illegal substances. I learned many things.
And at home, of course, nothing has changed, because I am the one who will have to change. Sobriety (again) was big. The assertiveness I once had, I have to reclaim. I took a little step today, tried to play it lightly, and it was OK apart from my nervousness.
I don't ever want to act from a position of weakness. I have so much to rebuild, to build up in the first place. I know that at one point when I was ready to move out, it was a sense of running away from, not running to. I don't want to run. I want to face this and act like an adult.
Those cyber slaps would get you banned from the weekend trip to the beach!
PC
Posted by alexandra_k on July 26, 2014, at 1:21:51
In reply to Re: Not thinking right » Poet, posted by Partlycloudy on July 24, 2014, at 15:07:47
rehab is a difficult environment. i found myself in two such settings... and while neither sounds as bad as the experience you had... it was still pretty far from therapeutic for me.
with respect to the change thing... if he doesn't want to change... i don't suppose you can make him. sometimes... there can be miscommunications, though. he thinks you want x but really you want y. i wouldn't know how to go about sorting those out...
it might be that you can learn to live with... perhaps even be happy in your current situation (perhaps especially if he actually is happy with the way things are?) if you get to exercise more freedom to seek the companionship you seek outside the relationship... or maybe not... it is hard...
anyway... hang in there...
Posted by Partlycloudy on July 26, 2014, at 7:24:00
In reply to Re: Not thinking right, posted by alexandra_k on July 26, 2014, at 1:21:51
> rehab is a difficult environment. i found myself in two such settings... and while neither sounds as bad as the experience you had... it was still pretty far from therapeutic for me.
>
> with respect to the change thing... if he doesn't want to change... i don't suppose you can make him. sometimes... there can be miscommunications, though. he thinks you want x but really you want y. i wouldn't know how to go about sorting those out...
>
> it might be that you can learn to live with... perhaps even be happy in your current situation (perhaps especially if he actually is happy with the way things are?) if you get to exercise more freedom to seek the companionship you seek outside the relationship... or maybe not... it is hard...
>
> anyway... hang in there...Yeah, I am continuing to try to regain my ground at home. I am getting a lot of defensive sarcasm thrown back at me. Very familiar, we have been through this several times. At the moment, I think my job is to get my act together and if the relationship can keep up, then it's a win.
It's a balancing act. I have been beating myself down quite nicely to meet the expectations he has of me. Now that I am starting to feel better, actually making friends (!) outside the house and going to outings and meetings, he's really left with his own world he's made, which is quite isolated.
The more I get out and spend time with like minded people; and that encompasses a pretty broad range, the better I feel about myself. The easier it is to be non combative but assertive. It finally sank in that only by working on myself could I expect a healthier marriage. And I will do my part.
I am also going to speak with a neuroscientist from the local uni about treatment possibilities regarding addiction and early childhood trauma. It's become quite the hot subject lately, and I would rather put all of that behind me instead of dragging it with me.
Thanks for your thoughts. I read a lot about the Church of Scientology this morning (they have a big Flagship center not far from us) and the techniques used at the rehab place I went to are quite similar. Yikes.
PC
Posted by alexandra_k on July 26, 2014, at 16:39:36
In reply to Re: Not thinking right, posted by Partlycloudy on July 26, 2014, at 7:24:00
Part of my thinking... Is that sometimes people need / want different degrees of intimacy. What might feel like being far away to one person can feel like being excruciatingly close to another...
I think quite a lot of women seek intimacy from outside their marital relationship. Things like women's groups where there is conversation about books or films or various hobbies or processing traumas...
Quite a lot of guys like to do things like... Lifting weights in the gym. No talking... Just a group of people all doing something sort of together. Cycling. Team sports... Everyone moving together. Mouths being closed.
Can lead to the same feeling... Of connection. Of being part of something greater than yourself. Of feeling accepted. Valued. At home. Can't do anything about what naturally makes us feel that way... But can make comprimises sometimes for a person we love... But they ain't ever going to change it.
Of course it would be very very very very very different indeed if he was having an affair or something like that - being intimate with another person in the way you want to be intimate with him...
I've long thought I was more like a guy in my way of thinking... I really do think that that is true. It is why I like the gym. And on the one hand I'm glad when other women are inspired to lift weights... And on the other hand I'm always disapointed when they go about ruining the space for me by turning it into a social club.
Anyway... If things are sort of like this... THen what is left for you to do is to look outside the marriage to get needs met. This isn't uncommon... I often think the best marriages are marriages between two relatively independent people. No single person can be everything to us that we require...
> I am also going to speak with a neuroscientist from the local uni about treatment possibilities regarding addiction and early childhood trauma. It's become quite the hot subject lately, and I would rather put all of that behind me instead of dragging it with me.
Sure. SOmetimes I"m not sure that the 'direct' approach is the approach that is most likely to have us moving forwards... When I was focused on staying clean as my biggest focus... I lost sight of why the hell I should be clean. Instead of focusing on staying clean... I focused on things I wanted to do / be (that required me to stay clean). Going to university.. Doing classes... Meeting people who surely wouldn't put up with me when I was high etc. Busy-ing up my life with those things... So I had less time to want to use.
It didn't make all the sh*t go away, that's for sure. But I think it helped it more than attempting to focus on it directly did... And... When I was being productive at university... Uh... THose were actually the times when I got the best help I've ever been offered...
This is the end of the thread.
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