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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 7 of 7. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by DK79 on July 17, 2012, at 16:14:13
What in your experience has helped improve (lengthen the proportion)of your deep sleep and overall improve the circadian rhythm. I have a Sleep Tracker Watch that registers your rem, non-rem sleep and sleep interruptions, and I can see that I need to improve my deep sleep and reduce the number of interrupted moments. I can tell that rarely when I do get longer deep sleep and less interruptions, I feel better next day, more rested and energetic. What promotes deep sleep in your experience (that's not melatonin)?
Posted by Tomatheus on July 17, 2012, at 16:57:52
In reply to What suppl.-s/meds/approaches improve deep sleep +, posted by DK79 on July 17, 2012, at 16:14:13
DK79,
Uridine has been found to increase the frequency of episodes of both slow-wave sleep (deep sleep) and paradoxical sleep (REM sleep) in a rat study:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6549543
Uridine is available as a both uridine monophosphate and triacetyluridine. I haven't tried either version of the supplement as of yet.
Tomatheus
Posted by Johnnybaklava on July 28, 2012, at 12:30:37
In reply to Re: What suppl.-s/meds/approaches improve deep sleep +, posted by Tomatheus on July 17, 2012, at 16:57:52
That's interesting as I picked up some triacetyluridine, tried it for a few days, and have had terrible sleep. The first night I took it right before bed, and found myself waking periodically through the night. Second day I took it in the morning and had a similar problem, then a third night, again with troubled sleep. I reduced the dosage to half a capsule and, again, didn't have a great night. I'm taking a break to see if it's truly the uridine as my sleep is often weird. My results during the day were mixed. A couple days I felt very "on" in a good way, the next couple I felt a little off.
Posted by Tomatheus on July 28, 2012, at 14:01:22
In reply to Re: What suppl.-s/meds/approaches improve deep sleep +, posted by Johnnybaklava on July 28, 2012, at 12:30:37
Johnnybaklava,
I'm sorry to hear that your sleep hasn't been good since you started taking triacetyluridine. I think it's always good to hear about the way supplements actually affect people instead of simply reading about the ways in which they affect lab rats, and so I think it's interesting that you had trouble with sleep while taking triacetyluridine. Of course, I hope that your sleep improves during your break from the supplement, but I think that it was helpful to hear about the way that triacetyluridine affected you.
Tomatheus
Posted by Johnnybaklava on July 28, 2012, at 17:20:10
In reply to Re: What suppl.-s/meds/approaches improve deep sleep + » Johnnybaklava, posted by Tomatheus on July 28, 2012, at 14:01:22
Absolutely. I agree that it's great to have the anecdotal, in-the-trenches reports in addition to the scientific studies. I have often found that if I take a break with something and come back to it later, I occasionally get a different reaction. I am also finding with DMAE that, initially, it seems to work really well, then after a couple of weeks, it either peters out or actually causes mild depression. I'm still not sure if it's the culprit, but it's another substance I often come back to. It, incidentally, is supposed to improve deep sleep.
Posted by Tomatheus on July 29, 2012, at 18:00:31
In reply to Re: What suppl.-s/meds/approaches improve deep sleep +, posted by Johnnybaklava on July 28, 2012, at 17:20:10
Hi Johnnybaklava,
I think it's interesting that you sometimes get a different response to supplements after you stop taking them and then try starting them up once again. I have taken several supplements now (kanna and licorice root come to mind) that seemed to have noticeable therapeutic benefits the first time that I took them but actually did not seem to do much of anything when I tried taking them months after I had discontinued them. But sometimes after a supplement seems to become less effective, stopping it and then resuming it again seems to give the supplement new life. So, I definitely think that it can be the case that supplements can sometimes affect us differently the second or third time we take them (relative to the way they affected us the first time we took them), although I think that the extent to which that happens can vary from one supplement to the next.
I think it's too bad that the DMAE that you're taking may be becoming less effective than it was right after you started taking it most recently and that it might even be contributing to mild feelings of depression. I personally have not had good results with DMAE, especially as far as my depressive symptoms are concerned. The last time I took the supplement, I noticed some improvement in my cognition on the first day that I took it, but then on the second day, my energy and psychomotor retardation became much worse than usual, and that prompted me to discontinue the supplement. However, your response to DMAE seems to be quite a bit different from my response to the supplement, and I think it's good that you have a supplement that you can keep coming back to, even though you may develop some tolerance to it when you take it on an ongoing basis.
Take care, and be well,
Tomatheus
Posted by Lao Tzu on August 14, 2012, at 11:47:11
In reply to What suppl.-s/meds/approaches improve deep sleep +, posted by DK79 on July 17, 2012, at 16:14:13
A combination of Vitamin E, 100mg of vitamin B1, a little melatonin, 500mg of GABA, and perhaps 50mg of riboflavin and B6, seem to help me with sleep. Vitamin E is a good one. It calms you. Usually, all you need is 400IU, but I think that all these vitamins in combination are a great way to get a good night's rest. When I say a little melatonin, I mean about 1mg at bedtime. You don't need real high doses of melatonin to be effective. If that doesn't work, 1-2 grams of tryptophan at bedtime is another good solution. Tryptophan will be helpful in most cases in helping you relax so you can get a good night's sleep. I've tried a lot of herbs for sleep, and in my opinion they never worked well. A doctor can also prescribe you a sleep medication, or there are also OTC antihistamines to take once in a while for sleep. I prefer the vitamins over drugs, but some people may need medication. Talk to your doctor about it if the vitamins don't help. Also, you can exercise early on in the day and that may help you sleep better at night. Staying active usually leads to sleep. Good luck!
Lao
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