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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 35. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Janice on September 18, 1999, at 20:24:20
Just feeling a bit paranoid and curious. Is there anyway someone could be traced? Thanks.
Neurotically yours,
Janice
Posted by Noa on September 19, 1999, at 10:28:42
In reply to Is this board completely anonymous?, posted by Janice on September 18, 1999, at 20:24:20
Good question, Janice. Not so neurotic, if you ask me. Dr. Bob, can you respond?
Posted by Dr. Bob on September 20, 1999, at 3:40:16
In reply to Is this board completely anonymous?, posted by Janice on September 18, 1999, at 20:24:20
> Just feeling a bit paranoid and curious. Is there anyway someone could be traced?
This is a good question. So good :-) that I added it to the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#anonymous
Bob
Posted by Janice on September 21, 1999, at 22:37:59
In reply to Re: Is this board completely anonymous?, posted by Dr. Bob on September 20, 1999, at 3:40:16
didn't you mention that you studied computers. Glad you had a nice few days away. You sound better.
Posted by dj on September 21, 1999, at 23:47:05
In reply to dj, do you know the answer to this..., posted by Janice on September 21, 1999, at 22:37:59
Thanks Janice! I feel better generally until I start attempting to read techie manuals and keep going into deep space 6 or someplace other than the material I am attempting to absorb, unsusccessfully.
I am including Dr. Bob's FAQ below. I believe that he is correct and I dont' see any reason why a hacker would want to hack this site or your internet provider so I would say that your anonyminity is pretty good here overall. Racer would know better than I as I believe she teaches this stuff but I'm pretty sure Dr. Bob is bang on and that the odds of being hacked are minimal.
" Only the name (and email address, if any) that you give (and the time) are included with posts. My web server does keep a record of what it does, so some more information is in fact gathered, but that isn't public. But it's possible, I suppose, that a hacker might be able to access it, or to intercept your post in transit and trace it back to your computer.
Also, your Internet service provider probably has the ability to monitor what you do, and your browser probably keeps track (on your own computer) of where you go.
To be completely safe, unfortunately, I think you have abstain."
> didn't you mention that you studied computers. Glad you had a nice few days away. You sound better.
Posted by Bob on September 22, 1999, at 11:25:09
In reply to Re: dj, do you know the answer to this... Racer?, posted by dj on September 21, 1999, at 23:47:05
I sent Dr. Bob an email to add a few things to the FAQ. These deal with local security ... particularly if other people have access to the computer you use to visit this board.
To make surfing faster, browsers "cache" each page you download. Usually, there is a several megabyte limit to the size of the cache. Nosy people can look at the documents in a browser's cache just like any other web document ... they get stored on your hard drive with very odd (for us) code names that tell the browser what they are, but you can always open them through the file menu, if you know where to look.
To keep snoops from peeking at where you have been, do the following when you are through surfing. Find the Preferences command (for Netscape, its in the Edit menu). In the preferences dialog box, you should see some area called Advanced (in Netscape again) or Cache (within Advanced). Choose this set of preferences. There are two caches for Netscape -- the memory cache and the disk cache. Click on the "Clear Cache" buttons and those files will be removed from sight of anyone but the nosiest, geekiest snooper, armed with special software.
Another thing browsers do to "help" us is they remember where we've been and what links we have followed. This is called the browser's history list. Again, go into the Preferences and look for the Navigation section. Win/Netscape has two types of history you can clear -- the history list itself and the history list available in the location bar (where the page addresses pop up). Clear both of them. Some older browsers (<4.0) may say something like "Expire all links now?" instead ... that's the choice you want.
These methods are kind of like dragging a branch behind you to wipe out your footprints. A determined, hard-nosed, knowledgeable, slimeball snoop can get around these, but this will hide your trail from even fairly savvy users.
Cheers,
Bob
Posted by Racer on September 23, 1999, at 18:25:29
In reply to Re: dj, do you know the answer to this... Racer?, posted by dj on September 21, 1999, at 23:47:05
I checked around, and it's not readily apparent in the ways that I usually can check. In general, though, the security on this script is pretty fair. When I can get information off it easily, it's really only router paths, which makes it difficult to link to an individual.
This is not to say that it's impossible. Remember what Monica Lewinsky learned last year. There's always a way to get this information, but you'd have to have superuser access to a number of different servers, which is really unlikely. The NSA could do it, and the FBI, but the average hacker is unlikely to be able to track variable IP addresses and even so would be more unlikely to do so.
You're safe, and you won't have any of us show up on your doorstep!
The cache notes, though, will show where you've been, so if that's really an issue for you, clear 'em regularly.
Posted by Janice on September 23, 1999, at 22:21:26
In reply to Re: dj, do you know the answer to this... Racer?, posted by Racer on September 23, 1999, at 18:25:29
What got my curiosity going was that I've heard of pedophile rings being busted through the internet (At least this is how I thought they caught them). Janice.
Hope the man is good racer. be careful. You're probably more vunerable than most people. Janice.
Posted by dj on September 26, 1999, at 23:53:26
In reply to My paranoia is eased & curiosity satisfied, posted by Janice on September 23, 1999, at 22:21:26
Chances are that they were using a mailing list or something of that sort or perhaps the police confiscated the computer where the posts were being made and the traces were on that...if there are any pedophiles on this board they are probably too depressed to act out their fantasies ; >
> What got my curiosity going was that I've heard of pedophile rings being busted through the internet (At least this is how I thought they caught them). Janice.
>
Posted by Racer on September 27, 1999, at 4:12:19
In reply to Re: My paranoia is eased & curiosity satisfied, posted by dj on September 26, 1999, at 23:53:26
If someone had superuser status on a system that acted as a passthrough on the way to the board, it would have footprints on it. Especially since both the PIII chips and Win98 both have IDs that can't be turned off.
Remember though, that this sort of search for who is doing what where online is expensive, time consuming, and really not something that is going to be done for fun. The police, FBI, NSA, etc can do it, for the same reason they can find out who you call. They have access to telephone records, etc, if it's in the interest of public safety.
Here, though, nothing is being written which would bring down the interest of the authorities. On the other hand, if someone posted here that he/she wanted to go out in a blaze of glory by first drowning Al Gore in a teacup, Dr Bob might be able to get the proper authorities involved and save our poor Veep by tracing the person offering such a thing.
We are safe, though, since Dr Bob seems an honorable man, and we're simply exchanging information and support, with no laws broken. (Remember, thanks t othe first amendment to the constitution in America, it would take an explicit threat to involve the authorities. It's something about Freedom of Speech, and what a nice notion...)
Posted by Dee on September 29, 1999, at 12:38:25
In reply to Easier than that, dj, posted by Racer on September 27, 1999, at 4:12:19
I *wish* I was interesting enough for someone to go through al the trouble of finding out who I am and what I do. I don't think anyone ever will. By the way - anyone wants my e-mail address or my URL, it's just to ask - I can post it, no secrets here.
I do, however, like to be able to opt for privacy when I choose to. And I find the weakest link to be my PC. The P in PC stands for Personal and I like to keep it that way - NO ONE can access my computer but me. A roommate who has to type a resume will have to go to Kinko's to do it, because he won't get past the passwords. I don't want anyone to go through letters, bad writing, diaries etc. that have been accumulating since I bought my first 8088 back fifteen years ago.
The Internet for one leaves all kinds of traces everywhere, cookies, cashes, history lists, the netscape address bar that I haven't figured out how to clean... The pictures that I loaded from the net (oh yes, I admit I do go there at times.) How about the files in your root directory that scandisk recovered and put there- that could be anything.
To keep things secure, I require a password at the boot. I know this is not 100% like nothing ever is. It would be really easy to remove my hard disk, for example, and access it through another computer. But considering what possible interest anyone could have in getting to see my files related to the amount of work they'd have to put down to get there I think I am safe.
Same thing with this board. I am sure if, say, the CIA wanted to find out who I am, they could. Why would they want to? (I am sure there is some CIA clerk in some dark basement compiling a list of people with ADD for the sake of the national security laughing out loud when he reads this ;o). Good for you - I'm glad I made you laugh – A little demonstration about subtle good-natured paranoia here in the midst of my rambling)
Did I have a point when I started? I guess that would be that if you are concerned about people accessing what you do and where you go with your computer, then you should secure the weakest link which is the security in your own PC.
Dee
Posted by Janice on September 29, 1999, at 21:07:09
In reply to Re: Easier than that, dj, posted by Dee on September 29, 1999, at 12:38:25
you cracked me up dj ...
if there are any pedophiles on this board, they'd be too depressed to act on it.
Is there such a thing as a non-practising pedophile? Do pedophiles always have to act on their impulses. I have never read one posting by a pedophile...do they want to get better? A specialist on Oprah said there is one pedophile per square urban mile. Janice
Dee, don't forget about the McCarthy era and the witch hunts (half joking of course).
Posted by Dee on September 29, 1999, at 21:52:00
In reply to Pedophiles and curiosity..., posted by Janice on September 29, 1999, at 21:07:16
I don't know about that, Dj. Luckily pedofiling is not my thing, but I find that when I am approaching a deep depression, one of the sure signs is that I want to act out - all kinds of ways, including sexually. Emphasis on Want to - before I get a chance to do that, I get deeper in the pit and start having the feelings of being unlovable, even repulsive, that I don't get to act on it.
I once wrote something like:
...
this was when storms moved in
unexpectedly
and they were new every time
we watched them as
the sky grew black, and trees
were suddenly less tall
as they held the earth hard
their roots deep
so they wouldn't be blown awaylike I would hold you
years later
not knowing where I had learned to do so. (I love to quote myself)Using the storm as metaphor for the depression, and acknowledging that I would at times use other people to keep the feelings of loneliness, sadness and unlovability away, to have them confirm to me - over and over - that I am loved, and that way refusing to let the depression touch me. A strategy of denial and external dependence that helps for a night, but is not a solution. I would make a dear payment when the other person would refuse to carry my load - and I would be left with the feelings of rejection and ... and so on.
Considering this, I would imagine that a pedofile or whateverfile with ADD (NOT implying that there is a correlation) would be filing while he/she is in or getting to a low, to get away from the pain. Like I do, and I am sure there are others that can relate- only our domain of sexuality is only probably more socially and morally acceptable.
For this reason, I am not jumping into anything any more - if I get into a relationship or connect intimately with anybody, I take some time to make sure that I am doing it for the right reasons: that the person is right for me, and not just a quick fix for acute depression. That way neither one of us will get hurt.
Dee
Posted by Bob on September 29, 1999, at 23:20:02
In reply to Re: Pedophiles and curiosity..., posted by Dee on September 29, 1999, at 21:52:00
> For this reason, I am not jumping into anything any more - if I get into a relationship or connect intimately with anybody, I take some time to make sure that I am doing it for the right reasons: that the person is right for me, and not just a quick fix for acute depression. That way neither one of us will get hurt.
Dee, you're not a teacher, are you? [Boyle's Law of Education: A teacher loves best the sound of his or her own voice. -- I like to quote myself, too ;^]
One of my greatest fears right now is that I did sort of the opposite. I got into my current relationship at the height of a manic reaction to zoloft. It was the first time in my life I had ever felt *good* ... I thought I had been cured, and I wanted to start as normal a life as I could right away. I went off zoloft a month or so later, crashed thru the floor a month after that, and now I'm back in this miasma of non-feeling. We go from moment to moment, and I think that I *should* be in love with her, but I look inside and hardly see a spark.
So, is it that I really never loved her, or am I just incapable of loving that way right now?
I dunno,
Bob
Posted by Dee on September 30, 1999, at 0:19:50
In reply to Re: Not jumping, posted by Bob on September 29, 1999, at 23:20:02
I was teacher once, for a fifth grade foreign-language class in a ghetto in europe. I was at the time studying mathematics at the university, and naively thought I could make some ez currency. I lasted for a day.
I take ADD any day over twenty five twelve year olds.
On a more serious side, I think love is overrated. We are expecting these overwhelming emotions that we see in daytime television and commercials, then feel there's something wrong with us when we cannot live up to these unrealistic standards.
I settle for mutual respect, honesty and friendship in a relationship -- If a can ever find it. Been looking for a long time.I am working on a book that Imentioned up in the recommended reading post. 'My lover, myself' by David Kantor, Ph. D. I got that when the failure of my previous relationship hit me, and I just couldnt comprehend what went wrong. The love was there, mutual as far as I could tell; we both agreed that the sex was about the best we've had, and I was putting down lots of work to make things work, and not to allow any of my irrationality to start messing things up for us. We constructed this castle in spain so well that we surely thought it would last - but down it cam sooner than we could say that we'd always be together.
So I got the book. Here are some of the chapters: The birth, death and rebirth of desire; the Myth of perfect love, the imperfect love; the dark side of love...
I actually found answers tosome of the questions that I've been puzzled by for all my life, like why is it that if I love somone, at times I can only powerlessly watch myself push that person away.The damn thang is hardcover, and I had to cough up twenty five dollars to get it, but I am glad I did. should be easy to found, I got mine in Shakespeare & Co on Broadway @ Astor Place. Lost in a relationship, I'd recommend it.
I don't think you should give up just because the flame burns lower than it used to. I think this is the time you two give a little more of yourselves, have a talk and redefine your relationship. And dig in what's down there in the rectory of your lust, maybe you find something that can flare those flames up again ;o)
Good Luck
Dee
Posted by Dee on September 30, 1999, at 0:24:29
In reply to Re: Not jumping, posted by Dee on September 30, 1999, at 0:19:50
WAit a sec... What was this thread about again???
Posted by dj on September 30, 1999, at 0:52:10
In reply to Re: Not jumping, posted by Dee on September 30, 1999, at 0:19:50
So Dee, explain the rationale behind this -- self hatred?? I certainly recognize the pattern but what's the solution?
> I actually found answers tosome of the questions that I've been puzzled by for all my life, like why is it that if I love somone, at times I can only powerlessly watch myself push that person away.
>
Posted by Bob on September 30, 1999, at 10:08:47
In reply to Re: Not jumping, posted by Dee on September 30, 1999, at 0:24:29
> WAit a sec... What was this thread about again???
We ain't got no anonymity. We don't need no anonymity. I don't have to show you any stinking anonymity!
Wishing I were in the Sierra Madres,
Bob
Posted by Dee on September 30, 1999, at 11:22:08
In reply to Re: jumping with Dee, posted by dj on September 30, 1999, at 0:52:10
Tough one, huh...
The premise in the book is that *everybody* hosts a child inside. That child has experienced an ultimate rejection as in the womb and very early childhood it learned to expect that all its needs will be fulfilled without doubt, and growing up learned that this is not true.
So, in a way we are all split to a child and an adult. The adult is rational, reasonable, has mature ways to solve conflicts. But when there is a sign we interpret as a rejection, then the adult is pushed aside, and the child takes over, expressing the resentments of the original rejection and trying by any means prevent that rejection from taking place.
The adult that has no power in this situation is almost dissociably (is that a word?) watching the child act destructively, knowing that this is only making things worse, and eventually leading to the feared rejection even if in reality there was no such threat.
Well, something along these lines. What it really explained to me is something that really bothered me: if we both love each other, how come we do and say these things to one another, and kill a relationship we both wanted. Makes me ask if I could have saved something in the past if I had learned about this all before.
Dee
Posted by Dee on September 30, 1999, at 11:25:12
In reply to Anonymity?!, posted by Bob on September 30, 1999, at 10:08:47
Whuzzup, Bob... what was that??
Posted by Bob on September 30, 1999, at 12:22:49
In reply to Re: Anonymity?!, posted by Dee on September 30, 1999, at 11:25:12
> Whuzzup, Bob... what was that??
Just an appropriated line from Treasure of the Sierra Madre. One great thing about films with Humphrey Bogart is that he doesn't always get the best lines. If you don't know the quote (and like Bogey), then rent the film ... its not worth explaining otherwise ;^).
Bob
Posted by Noa on September 30, 1999, at 18:01:01
In reply to Re: Anonymity?!, posted by Bob on September 30, 1999, at 12:22:49
Been eavesdropping on this diverse thread. Gotta say, Bob, you are a well rounded kind a guy.
As for me and jumping, I tend to be the kind that doesn't even get up on the diving board--too scary.
Posted by Bob on September 30, 1999, at 19:29:59
In reply to Eavesdropping, posted by Noa on September 30, 1999, at 18:01:01
> Been eavesdropping on this diverse thread. Gotta say, Bob, you are a well rounded kind a guy.
Damn! So that extra 40lbs. Zoloft gave me is showing, is it? =^P
Bob
Posted by janice on September 30, 1999, at 23:18:43
In reply to Re: Eavesdropping, posted by Bob on September 30, 1999, at 19:29:59
and from here we can begin to love other people. Self love remains my focus, or should i say learning self-love. A little companionship and sex is great on the side!
Posted by Racer on September 30, 1999, at 23:42:00
In reply to Re: jumping with Dee, posted by Dee on September 30, 1999, at 11:22:08
I don't know if I subscribe totally to the "inner child" part. There's something to it, but I don't think it's the final answer.
I know that I push people away because I'm so terrified that if I make the committment to someone, that someone will find out what a total loser I am and leave me and then I'll be crushed. I've found the best thing I can do is to keep up my own life, or even expand it at the beginning of a new relationship, so that I'm not so dependant on one person for everything.
Ask me in a month or so how it's working ;-)
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