Posted by Questionmark on June 17, 2004, at 14:47:05
In reply to Re: GABA » Questionmark, posted by Larry Hoover on June 16, 2004, at 9:09:05
> > i have read a number of reports/anecdotes from people on here who have said that they notice an effect from taking GABA supplements-- usually an anti-anxiety effect. But i was under the impression that GABA does not cross the blood-brain barrier, so how is this possible? Do you think it Is possible for GABA supplementation to work? ..Maybe a certain proportion of the GABA is able to cross the BBB? What do you think?
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> First off, the blood-brain barrier is not a wall. It's more like a filter, but not even a perfect filter. GABA is a pretty small molecule, relatively speaking, so, perhaps if the blood concentration gets high enough, there's enough of a trickle-in effect to be noticeable.
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> Someone recently raised an interesting conjecture....if GABA is converted to GHB by a certain enzyme (succinic aldehyde reductase or something like that), and that happened outside the blood-brain barrier, then most certainly the GHB can enter freely. If I recall correctly, GHB is soluble in the BBB, so it doesn't need to be transported across. It just drifts on over by diffusion.
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> More generally, I think the argument itself is somewhat moot. Arguing mechanisms to explain (or refute) actual experience is not going to tell us much. Empiricism (what people actually observe) is reality. If people feel less anxiety with oral GABA, then that sounds like a good thing to me. Geeks have been wrong before.
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> Lar
i compLETEly agree (w/ your last paragraph). That's the trap that so many psychiatrists fall into and it ticks me off beyond words. i just wasn't sure how many people did feel something with GABA and how noticeable/potent any effects were.
i didn't know that GABA was a relatively small molecule. You're probably right then (about the "trickle-in effect").
i think i also remember reading that GHB crosses the BBB via passive diffusion. But do you think that GABA is really converted into GHB by an endogenous enzyme (okay i think all enzymes are endogenous but i mean without taking anything with the GABA or anything)? That's great if that's true, considering all the positive things i've heard about GHB and anxiety & depression. How likely do you think it is that some [peripheral/ supplemental] GABA is converted to GHB in the body? And if you have any idea, what proportion of GABA (in supplement form, ingested) do you think IS converted to GHB?
Finally, do you or anyone else have any good idea about how much GABA to take to notice significant (i.e., definitely noticeable) anxiolytic (anti-anxiety) effects?
Thanks so much for your help Larry, & anyone else who might reply.
poster:Questionmark
thread:357170
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/alter/20040613/msgs/357581.html