Posted by craig getty on June 30, 2003, at 4:58:49
In reply to Lots of hype and scare. Make your own decisions., posted by Carlos on June 26, 2003, at 16:01:47
Hi all,
Carlos, I am interested in seeing your recent posts, and will comment after I have had time to examine them.
Thank you all for your partication on this discussion thread. Seeing that my initial question about Nardil and ecstacy has raised such fervent debate, I felt obligated to respond.
First, I think it's great that there can be a forum for frank and (hopefully) confidential exchange of information regarding antidepressants and anything having to do with the people who take them. I disagree with anyone who feels that such discussion should bar any mention of *illegal drugs*. That would be the philosophical equivalent of sticking one's head in the sand. Like it or not, the use of *illegal drugs* is a huge part of our society - and I believe that there is a very blurry and overlapping distinction as to why people take them: recreational/self-medication/self-improvement. They are all means to the same end - to feel better, which is the same reason *legal* pharmaceuticals are prescribed. And just like *legal* anti-depressants, the misuse of *illegal* drugs can often make one's problems worse and be dangerous. THAT IS WHY INFORMATION IS IMPORTANT. Especially given all the prejudiced propanda that is out there. So, just as some uninformed people are lead to believe that antidepressants can turn someone into a lobotomized, babbling, grinning idiot, or worse a homicidal maniac - others are led to believe that doing ecstacy 3 times will drain all your spinal fluid and leave you paralyzed; or doing LSD 5 times will render you permanently insane.
It is a fact that many people, when in social situations, use *illegal* drugs and/or alcohol (not to mention cigarettes) - even if they are currently on antidepressants. Although Dr. Bob might recommend that the social implications of this should be discussed on another part of this web site, let me just say that all this *legal* and *illegal* drug taking probably speaks volumes to the state of our society, when so many people are taking so many things just to feel o.k. enough to interact with others (antidepressant drugs make billions for pharmeceutical companies, alternative holistic pills rake in big bucks, illegal drug demand has not reduced despite the *brilliant* war on drugs, cigarettes won't go away, and hello, let's talk about what a major part of the u.s. economy is served by the mighty ALCOHOL INDUSTRY). People have always felt the need to alter/shape their consciousnesses, so perhaps the best thing to do is figure out why.
In follow up to my specific nardial & ecstacy question, my question was not based on ignorance or a desire to hurt myself. I simply knew that I was going to be at a party where there would be the option to do ecstacy (which I have done a few times before, but not in several years), and I wanted to arm myself with as much information as possible. At the party, like most parties, there were many people who were using lots of alcohol, ecstacy, coke and pot. These were not high school or college kids who didn't know any better - this was a party of successful professionals whose ages ranged from mid-20's to mid-40's. There were several I knew who were taking *illegal* drugs while also being on antidepressants (although with the noted exception to follow, they were not taking MAOIs).
Based on the responses I received from this web-site, I made the decision NOT to risk doing ecstacy or any other *illegal* drug. I intended to drink domestic bottled beer (which I know is not good to do, but is not as major an offender as other MAOI alchohol restrictions - and I was not driving). This was the first time I planned to drink after being on Nardil for a little over a month. Interestingly, Nardil seems to have caused me to lose my taste for alcohol. And while I used to have 6-7 beers at a party when I was on SSRIs, I stopped after 1 beer this time. I simply did not enjoy the taste and immediately felt a "mental heaviness" that was not enjoyable.
Now, in reference to the friend of mine who was at the party and who is also taking a MAOI: She has been taking Nardil for considerably longer than I (over a year) and has used ecstacy before while on it, and planned to do it again. I tried to convince her not to, but she was set on it. I told her about the responses to my inquiry on this web site, and we did reach a compromise - she only did half a tab of ecstacy (as well a tiny bit of coke). She was fine, although she did experience blurry vision for 15 minutes or so.
I also checked her pulse on several occassions to make sure it was not too high.NOTE: I do not provide this information to in any way encourage someone taking an MAOI to follow suit, but I provide it for 2 reasons: 1) An anecdotal (and completely unscientific) relay of information - which *could* ultimately lead to better inform us; 2) to demonstrate how frank discussion on this web site can contribute to protecting people, i.e. at least my conversation with her got her to lower her intake of ecstacy.
I, of course, understand the risk of a case where a warped person might flood a web-site with fabricated information with the intent to do harm, but I do not think that censoring what we talk about is the answer.
I value all the discussion that has taken place and all the differing opinions that have been stated, and appreciate that this forum has enabled us to do so.
-Craig
P.S. I have specific question about Nardil, which I will pose in another post as I already seem to have been guilty for an extremely long pscyho-babble here.
> Please read my more recent posts. I discuss a lot about the different "illicit" drugs I have used while on a MAOI. I need no lectures, please. I am very aware of the cons, and pros. Also, on what may occur.
>
> A quick list of drugs used (more than once with no negatice effects) while on 60mg of Nardil.
>
> -MDMA
> -Methamphetamine
> -Cocaine
> -Ketamine
> -GHB
>
> I have noticed that Nardil potentiates (especially MDAM) the effects of most substances so compensation is usually done by lowering dosages of the "illicit" drugs.
>
> -Carlos
>
>
poster:craig getty
thread:228754
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20030624/msgs/238062.html