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Re: Parnate: weight gain, & the literature - Zeke

Posted by Elizabeth on December 15, 1999, at 21:10:30

In reply to Re: Parnate: weight gain, & the literature - Adam, posted by Zeke on December 15, 1999, at 10:26:36

> 1. A protocol of giving the entactogen and several hours later giving an SSRI (and perhaps deprenyl) would aloow for the beneficial effects but minimize possible neurotoxicity. Use of the levo isomer of MDMA appears safer as it excludes delayed damage -- loss of uptake sites. SSRIs may offer no protection from this toxicity, but again is is stereospicific.

Even excluding the slight problem of illegality of MDMA (yes I am opposed to this, but it is a difficulty nevertheless!) I think you would have a nigh-impossible time convincing most pdocs to do this, between the speculative uses of SSRI and selegiline, and the mixing of the three. Indeed, I believe more research needs to be done before this is done clinically, and the patient would have to be very well monitored.

That said, though, interesting idea. Can you explain (on a psychological level) the mechanisms whereby MDMA might aid with this kind of "blocking?" Never experienced the stuff myself.

> As for free radical damage, there are MAOis but also other central antioxidants.

I hope you just mean selegiline (you *do* know what happens when you take a nonselective MAOI with MDMA, right? do we actually know this won't happen with selegiline? especially with an SSRI too?).

> I think selective MAO inhibitors will be their resurrection. Side effects and interactions are few(er) and rare, and efficacy in depression is being demonstrated. What do you think?

Not that you asked :), but I thought selegiline was much more difficult to tolerate than the nonselective MAOIs (I took it at high (nonselective) doses, though). It also did not work - doh. As for moclobemide, it has a rep in countries where it's used for not being particularly effective in the people who would be trying the irreversible MAOIs (those who've already tried a lot of other stuff). I also don't think, based on the stories I've heard from patients who've tried it, that it's really all that much more tolerable than the irreversible MAOIs.

Does anyone know what happened to clorgyline, though? Was it ever marketed for clinical use?

But anyway, I think it's more likely that the nonselective MAOIs will be resurrected as the "stigma" surrounding them (re the dietary restrictions, which it turns out have been overblown) vanishes.




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