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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 7 of 7. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by christophrejmc on February 9, 2002, at 0:59:43
Lately I've been talking to a cousin of mine who has been diagnosed with bipolar depression. It's strange for me to talk to anyone from that side of my family (I dislike most of them very much) but she had known that I had spent a lot of time hospitalised as a teenager, and she needed some support from someone who understood what it was like to experience mental illness. I'm terrible at talking about my problems with anyone and even worse at talking about anyone else's problems; but the relationship seems to work quite well anyway.
I know she has thought about suicide recently and has acted on such impulses in the past. I don't know quite how to handle this. Her parents tend to ignore her illness. She sees a psychologist, but she doesn't feel comfortable talking to him. Her (new) psychiatrist denies that she has any illness whatsoever and refuses to discuss medication options.I'm unsure of what to do if I suspect she is in danger of harming herself. I do not want to betray her trust (from my personal experience, this is the worst part and as a result I never tell anyone I'm suicidal anymore in fear of their over-reaction). [Many of the strategies used with suicidal adults are very different from those advised for use with adolescents (Pamela Cantor, PhD. has written a few very good articles about this).] Does anyone have any suggestions? I think anything that would harm our current relationship would be very bad, as it seems like I am her only means of support.
Thanks,
Christophre.
Posted by Anna Laura on February 9, 2002, at 1:56:45
In reply to how to help a teen in crisis?, posted by christophrejmc on February 9, 2002, at 0:59:43
> Lately I've been talking to a cousin of mine who has been diagnosed with bipolar depression. It's strange for me to talk to anyone from that side of my family (I dislike most of them very much) but she had known that I had spent a lot of time hospitalised as a teenager, and she needed some support from someone who understood what it was like to experience mental illness. I'm terrible at talking about my problems with anyone and even worse at talking about anyone else's problems; but the relationship seems to work quite well anyway.
> I know she has thought about suicide recently and has acted on such impulses in the past. I don't know quite how to handle this. Her parents tend to ignore her illness. She sees a psychologist, but she doesn't feel comfortable talking to him. Her (new) psychiatrist denies that she has any illness whatsoever and refuses to discuss medication options.
>
> I'm unsure of what to do if I suspect she is in danger of harming herself. I do not want to betray her trust (from my personal experience, this is the worst part and as a result I never tell anyone I'm suicidal anymore in fear of their over-reaction). [Many of the strategies used with suicidal adults are very different from those advised for use with adolescents (Pamela Cantor, PhD. has written a few very good articles about this).] Does anyone have any suggestions? I think anything that would harm our current relationship would be very bad, as it seems like I am her only means of support.
>
> Thanks,
> Christophre.I think she needs someone to trust and to look on to in the first place (good thing she found you).
An empathetic, no-judgemental, reliable person is a very precious thing being the first step on the healing path.
Another important thing is getting all the informations you can get about bipolar illness and find a specialist.
I think she should look for other pdocs in the first place, may be you could help her find the right one, leading and supporting her throughout her search.
I'm not a bipolar (i suffered from psychotic depression in the past) but i believe that a uncaring psychologist/pdoc can be worse then having no support at all, as he/she can bring more confusion and despair, adding trouble over trouble.
I entered the major depression tunnel as a young adult (i was 21): i have been misdiagnosed,
labelled borderline, sent to an obnoxious psychoanalist, and given benzos at high doses. I got worse month after month, not being supported at all.
I spent months and years, laying on a couch all day long in a small house, forgotten by my family, in utter dispair, not knowing anything about my illness.
When i searched for help my pdoc would yell at me, saying i grew dependent from benzos,
and the psychotherapist ,that horrible bitch, would scold me telling me i was immature, that i had the emotional age of a fifteen years old girl and that i didn't put any effort in the therapeutic setting, jeopardizing my recovery in the long run. I was thinking about suicide at that point.
In my personal opinion you shouldn't push her or talk about suicide with her unless she wants to.
I think you should show her a way out from confusion and despair, because it's when you feel trapped and see no solution in sight that you think about suicide.
She could benefit from group therapy also, learning how to cope with her illness with the support of others, meeting people who grew better and are leading satisfactory and meaningful lives. I think she needs to hear "healing stories" also.
I firmly believe that if i'd have found the right pdoc, learned everything possible about my illness, i'd not be where i am now, being a college drop out and a chronic depressed adult who thinks about suicide every now and then, wondering if this life it's worth living.
She is still young and the chances of growing better and live a decent life are pretty high right now.
Don't waste time!
Once she gets a little bit better (possibly through therapy and medication) you could try to talk to her family.
She needs all the support and care that she can get.Wishing good luck to you and to your cousin
Posted by Dr. Bob on February 9, 2002, at 15:59:18
In reply to how to help a teen in crisis?, posted by christophrejmc on February 9, 2002, at 0:59:43
[Posted by jane d on February 9, 2002, at 15:48:46]
> Christophre,
>
> I must be getting old because my answer is not what it would have been a few years ago. I'm sure many people will disagree with me and they may be right.
>
> I think how to deal with your cousin depends on her age. And, for that matter, yours. Assuming that you are an adult, your responsibilities to a thirteen year old are different than those to a nineteen year old. I think, if she is a child, an adult doesn't have the right to decide to be just a friend any more than they have the right to participate in a sexual relationship. The imbalance in power and knowlege requires certain things from you. One of those things would be breaking any confidences she made about plans for suicide. I think betrayal is telling a child you won't repeat anything they say when this is not a promise you can or should keep.
>
> It's different with someone older (and I don't know exactly how much older I mean). I don't think you are automatically responsible anymore. You can choose to take responsibility if you think they are to ill to take care of themselves but I think that you can also choose to decide that they are responsible for themselves. I've had to make that judgment one way or the other a couple of times over the years (luckily without fatal consequences) and I'm still not sure what the right thing to do is when dealing with another adult.
>
> That's theory. On a practical basis I would try to protect the relationship you have formed while trying to get her some more support. No one should be relying on support from one other person. If she cannot talk to the Psychologist perhaps you can help her find someone else. Teenage girls are sometimes more comfortable talking to a woman. If she can't change maybe you can help her figure out how to feel comfortable enough to get what she can out of the doctors she has now. That's an area where your experience should help.
>
> Good luck.
>
> Jane
Posted by ST on February 9, 2002, at 23:50:17
In reply to how to help a teen in crisis?, posted by christophrejmc on February 9, 2002, at 0:59:43
It's great you're talking to her and listening. I was 15 when I tried to commit suicide. (I'm bi polar II) I didn't know what was wrong with me; I didn't want to tell my parents what was going on in my mind. I would have loved to have had a cousin like you around. I thought I was all alone - a freak.
Jane's suggestion of a group for her is right on the nose. I remember feeling that no one else out there was going through or understood what I felt. If I could have sat and talked with other teens in a group therapy situation who felt as I did, it would have made a world of difference. Offer to go with her to a meeting. Research what groups are available in the area. Seeing this particular pdoc can only harm her, I feel, at this point.
Good luck!
Sarah
> Lately I've been talking to a cousin of mine who has been diagnosed with bipolar depression. It's strange for me to talk to anyone from that side of my family (I dislike most of them very much) but she had known that I had spent a lot of time hospitalised as a teenager, and she needed some support from someone who understood what it was like to experience mental illness. I'm terrible at talking about my problems with anyone and even worse at talking about anyone else's problems; but the relationship seems to work quite well anyway.
> I know she has thought about suicide recently and has acted on such impulses in the past. I don't know quite how to handle this. Her parents tend to ignore her illness. She sees a psychologist, but she doesn't feel comfortable talking to him. Her (new) psychiatrist denies that she has any illness whatsoever and refuses to discuss medication options.
>
> I'm unsure of what to do if I suspect she is in danger of harming herself. I do not want to betray her trust (from my personal experience, this is the worst part and as a result I never tell anyone I'm suicidal anymore in fear of their over-reaction). [Many of the strategies used with suicidal adults are very different from those advised for use with adolescents (Pamela Cantor, PhD. has written a few very good articles about this).] Does anyone have any suggestions? I think anything that would harm our current relationship would be very bad, as it seems like I am her only means of support.
>
> Thanks,
> Christophre.
Posted by christophrejmc on February 10, 2002, at 1:59:59
In reply to Re: how to help a teen in crisis?, posted by Anna Laura on February 9, 2002, at 1:56:45
Thank you very much Anna Laura, jane d, and ST for your helpful advice.
I have just turned 20 and she is soon turning 18, so there's about a two-year age difference. I will try to get her to see a new psychiatrist/psychologist and possibly help her join a group. I am not very close to her geographically, so it will be difficult to be more involved, but I will try.
She is not the first suicidal friend I've had, but I fear that my previous relationships might not apply (especially because I have relatively no experience with anyone who has bipolar I). I have lost one friend to depression, and I hope to never lose another -- if I fear she is going to harm herself, I will try my best to get her help. I'm very bad at talking with adults (especially ones with no experience with mental illness) about this kind of stuff, and I don't trust her parents to respond appropriately.
I want to try my best at not being intrusive, to a teen that can be very unhelpful.
-Christophre
Posted by Katey on February 11, 2002, at 9:21:04
In reply to Re: how to help a teen in crisis?, posted by christophrejmc on February 10, 2002, at 1:59:59
teens in crisis...sounds like a report on 60 minutes. but that sounds horribly apathetic and stingy coming from someone who is at almost the exact same place and time. listen to her. dont judge her. chances are that if she's telling you suicide plans, she's not going to do them, but it is imperative that you get her help ASAP. Being a teenager is hard enough, being a 'freak' is almost unbearable. she's strong for having made it this far. i definately feel that she needs to find a new pdoc, and a new psychologist wouldnt be a bad idea as well, i, unfortunately, had the same over reacting type of psychologist, which i fired and havent seen one since.
if it's not too intrusive, may i ask where the two of you are geographically located? i may be able to find some help. i also suggest doing as much research on bipolar II, pardon the cliche, but knowledge is power.
> Thank you very much Anna Laura, jane d, and ST for your helpful advice.
>
> I have just turned 20 and she is soon turning 18, so there's about a two-year age difference. I will try to get her to see a new psychiatrist/psychologist and possibly help her join a group. I am not very close to her geographically, so it will be difficult to be more involved, but I will try.
>
> She is not the first suicidal friend I've had, but I fear that my previous relationships might not apply (especially because I have relatively no experience with anyone who has bipolar I). I have lost one friend to depression, and I hope to never lose another -- if I fear she is going to harm herself, I will try my best to get her help. I'm very bad at talking with adults (especially ones with no experience with mental illness) about this kind of stuff, and I don't trust her parents to respond appropriately.
>
> I want to try my best at not being intrusive, to a teen that can be very unhelpful.
>
> -Christophre
Posted by christophrejmc on February 11, 2002, at 15:51:01
In reply to Re: how to help a teen in crisis?, posted by Katey on February 11, 2002, at 9:21:04
> teens in crisis...sounds like a report on 60 minutes.
Heh. I know it sounds cliché and cheesy-self-help-bookish, but I thought it got the general point across.
> if it's not too intrusive, may i ask where the two of you are geographically located? i may be able to find some help.
Michigan, USA.
> i also suggest doing as much research on bipolar II, pardon the cliche, but knowledge is power.
I very much agree. I have dusted off my old child/adolescent psych books and have been studying all those sections I used to skip. It's weird, yet rewarding, to concentrate on someone else's problems rather than my own.
Thanks for your help,
Christophre.
This is the end of the thread.
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