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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 5 of 5. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Patches on July 1, 2001, at 13:45:21
So many mixed feelings. Just need someone to put some perspective into it. I feel somewhat betrayed by my t. and yet ashamed of myself too. I've emailed my t. about once a week with his consent. Occasionally I've over-extended myself when things have come up. It felt assuring to know he was there for me. Well, last week I couldn't get through to him. His server was denying my access. He later told me his wife said that the server was more than likely linking my server to some spam that had gone through and had stopped any mail for the time under that server. I feel betrayed in that he shared my situation with his wife. I'm sure they had a good laugh together about my insecurities. I'm also so ashamed that I've shared too much of myself and my feelings with him. Somehow telling him made me feel not so alone dealing with past and present events. Now I just want to go back to hating myself and dealing with my anger myself - cutting (something I hadn't done for 2 months). I'm so ashamed of myself for bothering him with my problems. So ashamed of depending on him for so much. So ashamed of making a fool of myself. I didn't want to bother him with my emails. I was always asking for his approval for mailing. He said my asking for his approval was "unnecessary". Now I think he was just tolerating me... like everyone else in my life. I don't believe "his wife's" story of spam. I was the spam he wanted to be rid of! I feel so overwhelmed with sadness and loss. I just need to punish myself for my foolishness. It hurts to be such a fool!
Posted by sar on July 2, 2001, at 2:23:27
In reply to The fool to my T., posted by Patches on July 1, 2001, at 13:45:21
hey Patches,
it sounds like you're caught up in an unhealthy cycle of self-balme. if your therapist told you you could e-mail him, then he should have meant it, he should have stuck with it.
some therapists will not be suited to you. please don't blame yourself for this. he may feel overwhelmed by his job (he's got patients other than you) and may not have the energy to respond to every e-mail. on the other hand, if his server denied access to you, i think you ought to consider seeing a new therapist. it's a difficult crux. one of my pdocs gave me her home # but i didn't have the courage to call, i felt i'd be invading.
my opinion is this: is the therapist gives you his/her e-mail address, (s)he has no damn business blocking you. that's flat-out shitty. they need to be honest and set limits. My current psych has told me "You can call me whenever you want," tough I've not had the courage to do so. BUT IF I DID, I wouldn't want to get the impression that I was bothering her.
Psychs and therps are human beings. I see no problem in them setting limits, but I think that lying is extremely detrimental to the patient's health (and we don't even really know if he was lying, but you have reason to suspect that he was). I think that perhaps you should discuss this with him, and if you still feel uncomfortable, switch therps.
One time my pdoc told me she'd be on vacation and miss a few appointments, and to be polite I asked her where she was going. "Why are you curious about that?" she asked me. Made me feel like a creep. Anyway, she knew how to set boundaries without lying, the subject was dropped, and I understood that she wanted to keep her personal life completely private, whch I respect.
Why should you be ashamed with your psych?! This is an issue I've been struggling with myself. *You pay them for this service, and they are well-trained for it.* Please don't hide, tell you therp how you feel. You're not there to impress him, you're there to get help.
Respecting boundaries is a sticky situation, eh? You tell all to a doc but at the same time you're a Patient. And a Human Being, but consider him: has he the emotinal energy to deal with your extra e-mail? Respecting boundaries is so important and confusing, as everyone's differ.
It sounds to me like you should talk to your thero about this. I doubt that he and his wife are having laughs over your probs--what are tou, the Star if the Show, yo? Maybe he;s too busy or depressed himself. Alot of psychs have their own pychological problems,
Anyway, I'd suggest you talk it over with him, and if you still feel uncomforatble, seek out a doctor who wo'll be more suppotive--tho it is a trail & error process.
Please don't cut yourself over this. If your therp is lyin to you, chnces are he a fuckin jerk. he is the one not doing his job coirrectly, but at the sane time, if i were you, i'd consider that i pAY this guy X$ per hour, and maybe in his free time he wants to play golf and drink maritinis rather than responinf to depressong e-mail. he has a life roo.
and so do you. you need an approptiate doctor. talk it out, man, and ,et us know how it goes.
best wishes,
sar
Posted by kazoo on July 2, 2001, at 3:15:59
In reply to The fool to my T., posted by Patches on July 1, 2001, at 13:45:21
> So many mixed feelings. Just need someone to put some perspective into it. I feel somewhat betrayed by my t. and yet ashamed of myself too. I've emailed my t. about once a week with his consent. Occasionally I've over-extended myself when things have come up. It felt assuring to know he was there for me. Well, last week I couldn't get through to him. His server was denying my access. He later told me his wife said that the server was more than likely linking my server to some spam that had gone through and had stopped any mail for the time under that server. I feel betrayed in that he shared my situation with his wife. I'm sure they had a good laugh together about my insecurities. I'm also so ashamed that I've shared too much of myself and my feelings with him. Somehow telling him made me feel not so alone dealing with past and present events. Now I just want to go back to hating myself and dealing with my anger myself - cutting (something I hadn't done for 2 months). I'm so ashamed of myself for bothering him with my problems. So ashamed of depending on him for so much. So ashamed of making a fool of myself. I didn't want to bother him with my emails. I was always asking for his approval for mailing. He said my asking for his approval was "unnecessary". Now I think he was just tolerating me... like everyone else in my life. I don't believe "his wife's" story of spam. I was the spam he wanted to be rid of! I feel so overwhelmed with sadness and loss. I just need to punish myself for my foolishness. It hurts to be such a fool!
^^^^^^^^^^^
Patches, my dear, the collective story they offered you is more than likely true, only they didn't explain it quite correctly (and I don't think they understood what was happening either). What probably happened was that his server went down due to a DOS (Denial of Service) attack. If you follow the news at all, you will know that these attacks happen at random, to anybody, and everybody, originating from either a disgruntled "client" he has, or from someone who's just plain nuts. A DOS means that the server is flooded with junk packets of information, which the server tries to process, but becomes overloaded and crashes, and this in turn denies anybody else from getting through, or email to be received. Thirteen year old boys seem to have a penchant, and talent, for doing these childish pranks (must be hormonal or something). This is what I think happened so don't blame your "T." or his old lady for something they couldn't control (but I bet they know now!). This stuff happens a lot lately, to the biggest and
the smallest of ISPs and private severs.
Remember: with this "new age" comes "new age harassment."So now that you know what the story is you can stop hating yourself, dispense with the shame, ignore the embarassment, quit putting yourself down, end the cutting, and once again trust your "T." as you had done so successfully in the past, to retain the rapport you have with him. And as far as his wife goes, she should have no bearing in your therapy at all, so the next time you think of her, think "DELETE KEY" and out she goes.
All that needless, enervating frustration from such a silly, little thing.
This new age ... BAH!
Have I been able to explain this clearly to you?
(a concerned) kazoo
Posted by Jane D on July 2, 2001, at 16:47:25
In reply to The fool to my T., posted by Patches on July 1, 2001, at 13:45:21
Patches:
I sympathize. I have experienced the "everybody hates me" feelings. But I think you are misinterpreting what happened. Some information about email that may give you that perspective you asked for. E mail is unreliable. Sometimes you will get a message saying your message is undeliverable. Sometimes the message just disappears. You don't know that it arrived unless the person who got it tells you so. Heres a partial list of possibilities. You may never trust email again.
1. There can be a problem with either your ISP's mail server or theirs Kazoo gave one reason for this. There can be any number of others. Usually, in this case you won't be able to send or receive mail from anyone.
2. The other ISP has blocked any mail coming from your ISP. For a description of why this might happen take a look at st. james' posts in this thread on the admin board: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20010315/msgs/1276.html . When that happens neither one of you may realize there is a problem. Your mail goes through to everyone else (with a different ISP from his), he continues to get mail from everyone else (with a different ISP from yours).
3. Problem with the email program on your machine or his. This could be anything. Double check that the mail was actually sent. I've had some rude surprises over the years.
4. Human error. Bad address. You typed it wrong, or you accidentally edited your address book entry.
5. Human error. Your therapist can't use computers and is hitting delete instead of view whenever he looks at mail. Isn't likely but you never know.
6. Human error. Mail administrators at ISP's make mistakes too. Maybe one of them hit a wrong key or twenty.
7. You name it. Only the mail administrator at the ISP knows for sure and he isn't telling. Sometimes even they don't know.
So. Probably he told you the truth - he didn't get the e mail. The reason he gave will only be his guess because there is no way he can find out for sure.
You also have no evidence that he was talking about you to his wife. Far more likely he just said to her something like "Hey. Someone called me today and said they sent a bunch of emails. I never got them. What do you think happened? Has this ever happened to you?".
If you still have doubts ask him outright if it is OK for you to keep emailing. And if he says yes then don't worry about it. But you may have email problems again. If you are going to get too upset about it you may not want to use email any more.
I've seen this mentioned as a possible problem of on line counseling. I don't remember where and I don't have time to look it up but if you click on "Home" or "Links" at the top of the page here you should be able to find plenty.
Jane
Posted by Patches on July 2, 2001, at 22:26:33
In reply to Re: The fool to my T. » Patches, posted by Jane D on July 2, 2001, at 16:47:25
Thanks to all!
Some of these things may be so. In any case the message came back to me (several times) that the mailing was denied by the server. I've had many of the error messages you described, Jane, but never like this one. My t. got other messages; my messages to others went through fine. Oh well; I'll probably never know. I do know that I'm too attached to my t. I just couldn't stand feeling that it might be rejection. He has always been so patient with me. It's not that I feel like everyone hates me, it's more like I feel people just tolerate me. I'm always needing affirmation that I'm not too much trouble to people... Always wanting people to like me... wanting to feel loved like I've never felt before. Life goes on I guess!
Thanks again to you all! I appreciate your empathy and kindness. patches
This is the end of the thread.
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