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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 14 of 14. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Tamara Beezley on March 18, 2009, at 3:37:22
Aaarrgghh!! So, I've been in therapy for about 5 years and have been diagnosed with Major Depression and Complex PTSD. My T and I know that I experience Depersonalization and Derealization. I have been under a lot of stress lately and over the last few months I have been dissociating a lot more than usual, although it's starting to calm down a bit.
I have always heard many voices in my head and have often experienced times where I have felt little, or noticed that my personality had changed, or my ideals had changed. These episodes would last anywhere from a few minutes to a few days. I am missing blocks of time from when I was a child. I dont remember much at all between the ages of 5 and 7 or 7 through 12 for that matter. I have a history of physical, emotional, and sexual abuse during childhood and in to adulthood.
In mid-January of this year I made a discovery....I guess. It came to my attention that I had these different personas that seemed to take over at times, yet I still had awareness however I couldn't control it other than to stop talking or hide at home. These personas began to introduce themselves to me and they have names and ages. I understand that dissociation is on a continuum and that everyone experiences some dissociation in their lives, but this is just too much. These states, alters, personas, parts, or whatever one is inclined to call them have shown me pictures/flashbacks to certain points in my childhood where they claim they were "there".
So what's my point? I told my therapist about this and she listened and gave me a referral to a psychologist to be assessed for DD and DID. I did some diagnostic testing and an interview with the Psychologist and she diagnosed me with DID. I have accepted this, yet still go through periods of denial where I tell myself that this can't possibly be happening to me.
My T is now telling me that she is worried about my reactions/responses to the diagnosis and that she is concerned about this being an iatrogenic diagnosis, meaning caused by suggestion. She is not hearing me when I tell her that these experiences have been happening since I was a young child, that I just didn't realize it or want to explain it because it all just felt so crazy. She said to me last week "your really good at hiding it." Excuse me??? I don't feel I've been "hiding" anything. I just wasn't as aware of these issues until now and I'm not Sybil!!! My switches can be quite subtle and the part I consider my host part is the one who usually shows up for therapy and puts on a front around others....some can tell when I am behaving differently, but I guess only I can tell when I switch and that usually isn't right away.
I feel like I'm living in a fog. I experience a lot of micro-amnesias. Now my T is suggesting a second opinion. I have agreed to that and am fine with it actually. I don't care what you call it. DID, DDNOS, BPD, PTSD...crap, call it fricken pizza for all I care, it still doesn't change the fact that I am having these scary experiences. I would really like to find out where on the continuum of dissociation I set...It makes me feel more in control I guess...yeah, it's a bit of a control thing, not afraid to admit it. I know I am going to fall either in DID or DDNOS, but I wish i didn't have to go through anymore of this or have to pay for another professionals assessment.
Anyway, just a rant from someone who's frustrated. Anyone that was patient enough to read all of this, please respond back with any of your comments, suggestions, or experiences. You can even tell me to quit whining...LOL!!
Thanks for reading,
Posted by SLS on March 18, 2009, at 6:19:33
In reply to Dissociation Frustrations-Long post., posted by Tamara Beezley on March 18, 2009, at 3:37:22
I guess you have already figured out for yourself that stress and anxiety make depersonalization and derealization worse. I experienced this symptom pair earlier during the course of my bipolar depressive illness.
It was a very scary time in my life. I felt like I was an observer, hovering over myself viewing my interactions with my environment as if I were an alien from outer space. Nothing seemed the same anymore. Nothing was real. I still get hit with mild to moderate derealization when my depression gets worse.
You must try to get your anxiety under control to optimize your chances of emerging from the D&D nightmare. If you can do it psychologically, that's great. However, anxiety can get in the way of therapy. You might want to take a medication to reduce your sense of stress and anxiety so that you can reduce the severity of the D&D experience and begin processing issues more effectively in therapy.
Do you suffer from anhedonia?
Anhedonia is a lack of the sensation of "reward". Nothing makes you feel good about anything. It is a sort of numbness to otherwise pleasurable experiences.
- Scott
Posted by B2chica on March 18, 2009, at 14:28:00
In reply to Dissociation Frustrations-Long post., posted by Tamara Beezley on March 18, 2009, at 3:37:22
i'm right there with Scott, my anxiety would Definately exacerbate my derealization issues. Especially when things were getting 'rough' in therapy.
and also, you are certainly at the right place regarding you dx. there are several on this board with a DID or DDNOS or DDspectrum dx. myself included.
mine, i consider fairly mild in that i dont really remember it being a 'behavior' until i was around 19 (when i was completely on my own).
and i, similar to you, am totally aware of this 'switch' but become only an observer and have no control over what i say , think or how i react. but i also have a "mediator' presence who when things get violent with my "teen" will literally -shut me down.my biggest issue with this is the MIS diagnosis i was getting before. i had seen three other therapists before it was mentioned to me. the one therapist would even joke saying "i never know who you are going to be when you come in here" i was just scared and confused and needed help, he actually made me feel worse about my behaviors. the second one i never was really outed but a couple times when i got to the floor against a wall and cried like my 'littleone'. but he never said anythign about it.
this time around it was this T who one time when i was telling her how weird it was and that i felt like a fool but i wasn't talking like that on purpose. i was in tears and she told me what she thought i was dealing with. She never used the term DID she said "ego states" and then described my switching and such. it was several months later that we were casually discussing somethig else that she (slipped up) and said something about my "DID"...
but it was such a relief to me because 1)i was being believed AND understood!, 2)i could get help dealing with it and have since gotten it to the point where they mostly ONLY come out during sessions. and 3)no more med issues!
i also have a dx of bipolar disorder and part of these behaviors overlap and sometimes my meds would work and other times (no knowing the DID times) it did not work and i nor my doctors could figure out why. so i was on about 6-7 medications. and STILL having issues.And about your docs comments about your hiding it. well i think that was an inappropriate choice of words for her to say. because with me, my biggest fear was that someone was going to think i was making it all up (mostly because it seemed SO weird to me!) and to have someone say that sounds similar...Also and quite frankly my inners would purposefully not 'out' me. Teen would be Just sarcastic or angry enough or would only come out to my DH or someone who would just write it off as being 'moody'. and littleone tends to want to hide from the world anyway (thats why it was SO often confused with my depression, i always wanted to curl up in a ball)....and still do.
the lucky part is i've only had amnesia accounts a couple times, well when i KNEW i switched and that is in session. my T explained it to me that when we do 'parts' work that my 'parts' can dissociate thus causing my non-memory of the entire session. sometimes not even being sure that i showed up.
but the rest of my amnesia was straight dissociation. i would envelop into this fog (that i now recognize as part of my littleone) but i would 'snap out of it' and it would be minutes or hours later. i noticed this right when everything came down the wire (memories started coming back, depression hit bottom...etc)******************
OK, anyway. i guess i'm saying RANT away. and rant often here!!!
best wishes with your dx.
b2c.
Posted by Phillipa on March 19, 2009, at 12:26:40
In reply to Dissociation Frustrations-Long post., posted by Tamara Beezley on March 18, 2009, at 3:37:22
Pizza? Just kidding. Didn't know PTSD and super high anxiety could trigger DID or whichever name you wish to call it. What are the best meds for it? Phillipa.
Posted by Tamara Beezley on March 19, 2009, at 14:15:05
In reply to Re: Dissociation Frustrations-Long post., posted by Phillipa on March 19, 2009, at 12:26:40
Hi Phillipa ;),
Hi Everyone. Just wanted to say thanks to those that have read this post and communicated with me.
I did want to make a few comments to clear a few things up.
Phillipa, to answer your question about the best meds....first let me say that PTSD does not necessary lead to DID or Dissociative Disorders. A lot of people who have PTSD, Borderline Personality Disorder, and Bi-Polar Disorder, along with other mental health issues can experience dissociation as part of their experiences, which does not necessarily give them a diagnosis of Dissociative Disorders, however DD may be co-occuring.
My understanding is that everyone experiences dissociation to some degree and it can be very normal. My T states that dissociation occurs on a continuum with more normal dissociation being on one end and DID/DDNOS being on the opposite end of that continuum. Some mental health experts feel that DID is a bogus or factitious diagnosis that doesn't even exist. My theory is, okay it doesn't exist, but people are still experiencing these extreme experiences of dissociation so no matter what you call it or whether you think it exists, it obviously does for these people and therefor warrants validation and demands understanding and education for those in the field of treating these types of disorders. It does not warrant suspicion on the part of the therapist. I apologize if I am giving you info that you are already aware of. I'm hoping this will help others as well.
As for the best meds? There really are no meds that specifically treat DID. Medications like anti-depressants and anti-anxiolytics can be helpful in treating the depression or anxiety that come along with the dissociative disorders, but this is definitely something that should be discussed with a practitioner that specializes in medications for the mental health illnesses and disorders. I will be posting another thread here in a bit, but I wanted to address yours first instead of just ranting on like I did originally.
Once again, Thanks for reading and communicating with me. I appreciate the support.
~Elysium3006
Posted by Phillipa on March 19, 2009, at 19:55:57
In reply to Re: Dissociation Frustrations-Long post. » Phillipa, posted by Tamara Beezley on March 19, 2009, at 14:15:05
Thanks so much for explaining. No meds? Another question then can't high anxiety cause it sometimes? Love Phillipa
Posted by Phillipa on March 19, 2009, at 20:00:35
In reply to Re: Dissociation Frustrations-Long post. » Phillipa, posted by Tamara Beezley on March 19, 2009, at 14:15:05
Tamara could your turn on babblemail? Question wanted to ask you or babblemail me? Love Phillipa
Posted by Tamara Beezley on March 19, 2009, at 20:37:40
In reply to Re: Dissociation Frustrations-Long post. » Tamara Beezley, posted by Phillipa on March 19, 2009, at 20:00:35
Phillipa,
I will turn on babblemail...it might take me a bit to figure out how to do that.
From my understanding, high anxiety can definitely exacerbate, or make worse, episodes of dissociation, but I do not believe that high anxiety itself would be considered a cause of DID or DDNOS. More than likely one would want to look at what type of issues are leading to the high anxiety and address those issues. If a person does have DID or DDNOS with high anxiety, typically addressing the cause of that anxiety (i.e. abuse history, major life issues) should, I would think, help ease the dissociative experiences a bit.
I know when my life is running a little more smoothly and there is not so much outside turmoil, my internal turmoil seems to decrease a bit and my dissociative experiences don't seem to be as severe, but I can't speak for everyone.
Talk with ya later,
~Elysium3006
Posted by Phillipa on March 19, 2009, at 21:07:54
In reply to Re: Dissociation Frustrations-Long post., posted by Tamara Beezley on March 19, 2009, at 20:37:40
Tamara you can click on my name in blue and a screen appears and write a message to me like an e-mail. Just something wanted to ask you. Love Phillipa
Posted by softheprairie on March 19, 2009, at 21:43:54
In reply to Dissociation Frustrations-Long post., posted by Tamara Beezley on March 18, 2009, at 3:37:22
Not to discourage use of PsychoBabble :), but *in addition to it*, I've recently been lurking at PsychCentral, (http://forums.psychcentral.com/), (I haven't yet joined), and wanted to mention it in case you don't already know of it; it's another message board, and I see it has an active community of members with DID/related conditions in its psychotherapy board as well as specific boards for DID, PTSD, and others.
Posted by Tamara Beezley on March 20, 2009, at 3:00:04
In reply to Re: Dissociation Frustrations-Long post. » Tamara Beezley, posted by softheprairie on March 19, 2009, at 21:43:54
Softtheprairie~Thanks for the info. I have been to a lot of blogs and sites...I am not sure if I have seen that one yet but I will check it out.
Take care and thanks again! :)
~Elysium3006
Posted by rskontos on March 31, 2009, at 17:32:42
In reply to Re: Dissociation Frustrations-Long post., posted by Tamara Beezley on March 19, 2009, at 20:37:40
>>>>From my understanding, high anxiety can definitely exacerbate, or make worse, episodes of dissociation, but I do not believe that high anxiety itself would be considered a cause of DID or DDNOS. More than likely one would want to look at what type of issues are leading to the high anxiety and address those issues. If a person does have DID or DDNOS with high anxiety, typically addressing the cause of that anxiety (i.e. abuse history, major life issues) should, I would think, help ease the dissociative experiences a bit.>>>>
I wish it were that easy. I have alleviated some of my anxiety but I am now dissociating at a all time high. In fact, I am about to give up on stopping ever.
I have been in therapy with my therapist now for over 18 months and I am still dissociating too much. But as it is something I guess I have always done to a high extreme it is maybe my normal. sigh
I don't know anymore. I too don't care what it is called but I know how things are with me. And I don't have any control over it. At least, I can't stop it but I have figured out some how to induce it.
rsk
Posted by Tamara Beezley on March 31, 2009, at 21:33:06
In reply to Re: Dissociation Frustrations-Long post. » Tamara Beezley, posted by rskontos on March 31, 2009, at 17:32:42
RSKONTOS-
Sorry that you are having such difficult experiences. Dissociating non-stop can be extremely exhausting.
I have been in therapy for the last 5 years, and some throughout my childhood and am just now getting a more accurate picture/diagnosis of what I am experiencing.
18 mos of therapy is a good start for severe dissociation, but it can take a while to get to the root of what is leading to your experiences
I am glad that you have been able to alleviate some of your anxiety...that is progress. Unfortunately it sounds like that has come with a trade off. Do you have any understanding as to what is leading you into your dissociation?
I encourage you to keep going to therapy and working toward your goals. I know it is not easy to do. I have my moments when I am sure I can't keep it up and when I don't want to keep it up too.
I am intrigued a bit by your comment that you can't control it. Most people I have talked to and most research I have done, plus my own experiences, tell me that it is a very difficult thing to *control*. Yet, you state that you have figured out some how to induce it. Are you inducing it on purpose? If so, why would you want to induce it?
It is not difficult for anybody to induce dissociation. One can use mind altering substances, alcohol, meditation, etc.
Anyway, I hope you are doing a little better by the time you read this. :)
Posted by rskontos on March 31, 2009, at 22:20:49
In reply to Re: Dissociation Frustrations-Long post., posted by Tamara Beezley on March 31, 2009, at 21:33:06
> RSKONTOS-
>
> Sorry that you are having such difficult experiences. Dissociating non-stop can be extremely exhausting.****Thanks. It is.
>
> I have been in therapy for the last 5 years, and some throughout my childhood and am just now getting a more accurate picture/diagnosis of what I am experiencing.
***I have been dissociating since a very young age. Bad childhood. I have been reading alot trying to get a handle on my dx too. I have been dx DID. But I am always fighting it or trying to find a way to validate for myself.
>
> 18 mos of therapy is a good start for severe dissociation, but it can take a while to get to the root of what is leading to your experiences
***Ain't that the truth.
>
> I am glad that you have been able to alleviate some of your anxiety...that is progress. Unfortunately it sounds like that has come with a trade off. Do you have any understanding as to what is leading you into your dissociation?***I only know some of the abuses. My sisters filled me in on some and some they suspected. But as for my remembering that is just not happening in a way that makes sense. I have loads of distrubing flashbacks. But I have used xanax to control those because it got to be way too much. I started dissocaiting during sessions and my t slowed things down. He says I need to trust him move before we tackle too much more of the deep stuff. But he tries to figure out why I am now ramping up on my dissociative moments. At least they feel like moments. But aren't really.
>
> I encourage you to keep going to therapy and working toward your goals. I know it is not easy to do. I have my moments when I am sure I can't keep it up and when I don't want to keep it up too.***yeah, my T won't let me quit although I certainly have tried and tried every excuse I could come up with and he managed to shoot them all down. Good T.
>
> I am intrigued a bit by your comment that you can't control it. Most people I have talked to and most research I have done, plus my own experiences, tell me that it is a very difficult thing to *control*. Yet, you state that you have figured out some how to induce it. Are you inducing it on purpose? If so, why would you want to induce it?>> Well I accidently realized if I think about certain events I have a vague memory of then I will bam left the planet as far as I know for a certain time. Once when I was exploring my mind for memories I came to a strange place in my head and the whole room spun. There are certain memories or vague ones that set me and the whole conscious world spinning. My t and I have and haven't explored it too much. He still thinks I need more trust in our relationship I guess. At least that is what he says is the reason he isn't trying to get more into the DID part. I think he has met more than I know of and he is waiting for me to be more trusting. I find the whole thing unnerving. So no, I am not trying I just stumble on it then I did test it a few times but to tell you the truth it scared me. And when I was telling him about it in a session, I got all floaty and almost left the room. (in my head I mean not physically. )
And as for the control thing, I thought if I could control it I would be more "normal" something I crave but again isn't happening now or ever I think sometimes. If only I could keep those destructive ones in the background.>> Some I am now co-conscious with but only about three. The rest are out of my reach. But we are trying. Lately too much has brought me into feeling so much more unstable. Floaty as I call it but I guess the real terms are derealization and depersonalization which are a huge part right now.
Like today, I was so numb no feelings and my t says that is dissociation too. We talk about it alot but the talk makes me even more uncomfortable. I called him last week in a crisis mode. He tries so hard to help.
>
> It is not difficult for anybody to induce dissociation. One can use mind altering substances, alcohol, meditation, etc.No I don't use substances or alcohol or meds just wellbutrin for more energy (not really working) and xanax for the anxiety.
>
> Anyway, I hope you are doing a little better by the time you read this. :)Well not really but I am trying. But thanks. I dissociate daily at work. I am beginning not freak out about it since i can't stop it and I can't fathom what is causing it. We(t and me, my t is also my p-doc) talk about it often but I just say I don't know alot.
I hope you get the peace you search for too. My t says that I would have so much more energy for the good stuff in life if I can get a handle on this. I hope so, but sometimes I lose hope, and those darn voices that contribute to the loss of hope are many in side my head.
again, thanks for listening to my ramblings. take care
rsk
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