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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 25. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Dinah on March 15, 2006, at 11:10:27
But my husband thinks that we can arrange things so that I can quit work. This is what I've always wanted. I think my work is bad for my body, my soul, and my emotional health. My husband is particularly concerned about the toll on my body.
There are some financial concerns, and some latent feminist in me is having a bit of trouble with it too, but my main concern is therapy. I've often said that without work (and maybe without Babble because that's where most of my interpersonal angst comes up) I wouldn't need therapy. And my husband has factored that into the financial calculations.
So getting my life dream, removing a major source of stress in my life, and having more time to be a great mother and keeper of a home on one side. Losing my therapist, and I suppose to some extent at least Babble on the other.
It's hard to explain to my husband why losing my therapist would be such a big deal.
If we have to move, I guess the decision would be a lot easier. If I can't see my therapist anyway, that part of the equation is solved.
I'm excited about the prospect on one hand. And feeling terribly upset at losing my therapist on the other.
Mind you, the therapist thing matters a lot more to emotional me. Rational me says to go for it. Be healthier, have less stress, and why would I need therapy anyway. But emotional me still wants to cling to something that has become so important to me. And wonders if losing therapist is akin to death for that part of me.
I wonder if it's ok to just do what I think is best for my family and myself and assume that my emotional self would be ok in the long run.
Posted by agent858 on March 15, 2006, at 19:16:24
In reply to Not sure I'm quite ready to talk about this, posted by Dinah on March 15, 2006, at 11:10:27
I don't think you would need to lose Babble...
I feel like that sometimes. Babble is my greatest source of interpersonal stress, triggering, etc etc. Sometimes I think I shouldn't be here ('cause it is dangerous) when I don't have anyone to process stuff with IRL. But what I've found... Is that without Babble I'm a whole heap lonlier. And that is a source of stress and triggering too. So... And it is amazing what you can do on the boards. People on the boards etc.
It might not be as bad as you think...
It would be nice to not have to worry about work.
I don't suppose you could do a course or something to keep you occupied?
Otherwise... You will have more Babbletime I suppose ;-)
Posted by TherapyGirl on March 15, 2006, at 21:00:39
In reply to Not sure I'm quite ready to talk about this, posted by Dinah on March 15, 2006, at 11:10:27
>
> I wonder if it's ok to just do what I think is best for my family and myself and assume that my emotional self would be ok in the long run.
>I replied to this post earlier (I swear, I really did) and I have no idea what happened to it. So here goes with my opinion:
I don't think you can assume your emotional self will be okay in the long run. I don't mean you shouldn't work towards that goal and I don't mean that it wouldn't be easier without the stress of work, but I am guessing that there will still be some core issues to work through. Is there any way to decrease the therapy visits without cutting them out altogether?
Posted by Dinah on March 15, 2006, at 21:32:18
In reply to Re: Not sure I'm quite ready to talk about this » Dinah, posted by agent858 on March 15, 2006, at 19:16:24
Babble is definitely one of the two richest sources of therapy material (the other being my work), and the biggest source of emotional triggers in my life. At least since I haven't been seeing much of my mother. grin.
It's been very helpful while I'm in therapy, and opened up areas where I might never have been able to go. But I'm not sure I could process Babble as well if I didn't have my therapist.
You know how high strung I am.
I'm reasonably sure I wouldn't be bored for years. Just cleaning the dratted house would take at least a year at my current hourly workload. :) And then there's all the special projects I'd love to do.
Posted by Dinah on March 15, 2006, at 21:33:59
In reply to Re: Not sure I'm quite ready to talk about this » Dinah, posted by TherapyGirl on March 15, 2006, at 21:00:39
I daresay that as stressors came up I'd still melt down.
And I don't think my concern that without therapy my emotional core would get pretty deeply buried is unfounded. I'm not always sure if that would be a bad thing. :)
Posted by agent858 on March 16, 2006, at 2:27:09
In reply to Re: Not sure I'm quite ready to talk about this » agent858, posted by Dinah on March 15, 2006, at 21:32:18
> Babble is definitely one of the two richest sources of therapy material (the other being my work), and the biggest source of emotional triggers in my life. At least since I haven't been seeing much of my mother. grin.
Yeah. Me too. But then if it wasn't babble... It would be something else... And without babble... I think IRL would be a whole heap more triggering...
> It's been very helpful while I'm in therapy, and opened up areas where I might never have been able to go. But I'm not sure I could process Babble as well if I didn't have my therapist.You might surprise yourself. In fact... Babblers might surprise you. I have found... Babblers willing to come to the party... To help me process stuff (because you are right. SOmetimes we need a relatively objective take to help us along). I have found... Babblers to be even better that having a t in the sense that you get a range of opinions and can take what resonates and leave the rest. And... A therapist is just one person after all. And not perfect. And they have the pressures of a real time interaction (ugh).
> You know how high strung I am.
MMM. Not more high strung than me I would have thought...
> I'm reasonably sure I wouldn't be bored for years. Just cleaning the dratted house would take at least a year at my current hourly workload. :)Yeah. I hear you there...
> And then there's all the special projects I'd love to do.
yeah. I just remembered you were thinking about studying psychology. I wondered whether that might be an option. A little at a time... SOmetimes the mental stimulation can be good... It might help you with your own stuff... Who knows... You might want to be a t one day... Or religion... I thought you wanted to study that or something... But it doesn't matter.. It is much more fun just reading waht you want as the mood takes you in a way.
Posted by All Done on March 16, 2006, at 3:21:36
In reply to Not sure I'm quite ready to talk about this, posted by Dinah on March 15, 2006, at 11:10:27
Dinah,
I've given this some thought myself. For me, it's been all about priorities and goals. Now, of course, my son and family are my number one priority as I know yours are for you. I decided whether I'm working or not, in therapy or not, I need to be the best mother and wife I can be. I've found that a large part of that means being true to myself and finding ways to be comfortable in my own skin. That's one of my goals, if not my main goal, in therapy. I know it sounds corny, but I need to accept myself. I have always had a hard time with this and until I started my own family, I just played by everyone else's rules. Then, I realized I needed to make and follow my own rules in order to have a successful marriage and family. I need to feel confident in my abilities and I need to be able to enjoy what's happening in my life. What do they say? When mom's happy, everyone is happy. ;)
Anyway, the more work I do in therapy and the more I understand my emotional self, the better I feel about me. It's slow, but I'm getting there. I feel my emotional self is too big a part of me to ignore. I think I tried to do that for years and it got to the point where I couldn't take it anymore. I want and need to understand all of me. But this is just me. Therapy definitely got more serious for me within the last year, so I think there's still a lot left to explore.
I understand wanting to stay home, especially when work doesn't make you happy. Maybe you need to ask yourself if letting go of emotional you will help you to be the kind of mom and wife you want to be? If you feel confident you will be comfortable with the outcome of doing that, it may be the best choice for you and your family.
(((Dinah)))
You'll make the right decision for all of you.
Laurie
Posted by Pfinstegg on March 16, 2006, at 8:27:27
In reply to Re: Not sure I'm quite ready to talk about this » Dinah, posted by All Done on March 16, 2006, at 3:21:36
Dinah- a brief rely to a complex question. Whatever you do decide, make sure you include ALL of you in your new activities! Your emotional side is vital, providing, as it does, the wellsprings for loving, finding meaning in life, and living it to the fullest. It sounds like a wonderful oportunity, to me. You can escape some of the pressures, and will probably find it easier to take really good care of your health. You also have the opportunity to develop some new skills, and use that terrific brain of yours- I do think having mental challenges, and mental as well as emotional growth, is part of a full life, don't you?
Posted by gardenergirl on March 16, 2006, at 12:42:01
In reply to Re: Not sure I'm quite ready to talk about this, posted by Pfinstegg on March 16, 2006, at 8:27:27
As pfinstegg said, it's a complex question. It's definitely worth thought. And I can see how it can be attractive to think about. I remember how freeing it appeared to be when Clearskies stopped working.
Can you and your husband look at the financials again to see if there might be room for therapy once a week or maybe once every other week? Or are you maybe somewhere inside thinking you might want to terminate with your T, and this might be a "safe" way to do it? Just a thought. You know how much weight I give the unconscious....:)
Whatever you decide, I know you will decide it with thought and wisdom. And remember, this decision would not be set in stone. You never know what opportunities might be coming down the pike.
gg
Posted by JenStar on March 16, 2006, at 12:44:31
In reply to Not sure I'm quite ready to talk about this, posted by Dinah on March 15, 2006, at 11:10:27
hi Dinah,
I'm not at all sure that leaving work would mean that suddenly you would no longer need therapy. Some forms of stress would go away, yes, but others would suddenly appear.And if you're been reliant on therapy for so long to help organize your mental life, then I just don't think you could so suddenly give it up.
Is there a way you could do part-time instead? Or move to a job that is less stressful for you, so that you could keep affording therapy, but reduce work stress? Or do NOT work, but still have therapy as long as you need it?
I'm sure your husband has the financial best intentions possible. But even so..are you sure about leaving therapy?
JenStar
Posted by ClearSkies on March 16, 2006, at 14:12:19
In reply to Re: Not sure I'm quite ready to talk about this, posted by gardenergirl on March 16, 2006, at 12:42:01
> As pfinstegg said, it's a complex question. It's definitely worth thought. And I can see how it can be attractive to think about. I remember how freeing it appeared to be when Clearskies stopped working.
>I feel that when I stopped working, it allowed me the energy to address the core issues that had made working so problematic: depression, anxiety, panic attacks; and my personal favourite, addiction.
While I was working, I really didn't know what direction I was running in. All I knew was that I'd dash from work to appointments to meetings to home and feel that I was ineffective at all those places. Which added to the depression and anxiety. My problems did not evaporate when I crawled away from my job; it did give me the chance to make concrete goals for myself, and the time and energy to make them happen.
CS
Posted by Dinah on March 16, 2006, at 16:32:36
In reply to Re: Not sure I'm quite ready to talk about this, posted by ClearSkies on March 16, 2006, at 14:12:19
I know it's a complex decision.
It's as if I've been handed something I have always wanted, but I can only have it along with something I've never wanted, to give up therapy.
Plus, I know there will still be triggers for me. More if I interact with people. Fewer if I follow my natural hermitlike tendencies. :)
There is a possibility of a middle ground, I suppose. But I'm not sure a middle ground would be acceptable to my husband.
I think at this point, I've definitely decided to take my husband up on it if we have to move, because my telecommuting idea was never a great one. Depending on where we have to move, I guess.
I'll give the other part of it more thought.
Right now there's more of emotional me present, and I just want to cry at the loss. Fine way to react to having my lifelong dream fulfilled.
Posted by JenStar on March 16, 2006, at 18:37:10
In reply to Re: Not sure I'm quite ready to talk about this, posted by Dinah on March 16, 2006, at 16:32:36
hi Dinah,
if you want to cry at the lifelong dream coming true, is it possible that somewhere along the way your dreams changed on you, a bit?If you DO decide to give up therapy, can you build in an "emergency button" kind of money supply just in case you absolutely need it again for a while?
Also, I don't know what kind of work you do, but perhaps it would be possible to take what's considered a "lesser" job just to bring in a few $$$ and keep you social, if you move?
I think it would be difficult, as a strong and independent woman, to stop earning any money and have to be completely dependent on your husband for spending $ and pocket change and any items you want/need. I mean, of course in a good marriage it's not a big deal. And I believe your marriage is good, from the things you say. But still, it's nice to have at least a SMALL supply of your own...or a promise from the DH that there will always be an emergency fund for those necessary things (like therapy!)
But I'm just tossing out ideas based on how *I'd* feel, or how I think I'd feel, in your situation. They might not apply at all!
I hope you're doing well.
JenStar
Posted by Dinah on March 17, 2006, at 22:01:22
In reply to Re: Not sure I'm quite ready to talk about this » Dinah, posted by JenStar on March 16, 2006, at 18:37:10
He's being fair about things. The agreement would be that the spending money after budgeted expenditures would be split evenly between the two of us.
But I do need to do some financial calculations to see if I can manage.
It does bother me though. My husband and I have completely different approaches to finances. He's the most controlled man alive, with these teensy tinsy columns for every expense, and transferring money between banks depending upon use, and every little expenditure planned in advance. Like he'll transfer $5 a month to a column for an annual $60 expense. It's a godsend, I guess, for me to have someone who's the very opposite of me financially. But maybe it works so well because it only peripherally touches me.
No. I'm not sure I could live that way.
And I don't know that I could totally give up therapy.
And maybe I'm jumping at this in part because of the anxiety of moving. I'm not at all convinced telecommuting will work, and I just couldn't find a brand new job for the first time ever. I've never gotten a job, you know. My college job I got through my mother. And my real job was working for my daddy. I've never so much as interviewed. And I flunked my only lie detector test, even though I was telling the truth. And I'm terrible at people politics.
And I don't want to leave therapy.
And I don't want things to change. Not even good change.
Posted by Dinah on March 19, 2006, at 14:48:47
In reply to Re: Not sure I'm quite ready to talk about this » JenStar, posted by Dinah on March 17, 2006, at 22:01:22
and Babble.
We have an agreement in principle.
My husband will take over some of my current expenses. I will cut down my hours to the things that I am most valuable to my company on, and let everything else go. This will bring my hours too low to qualify for our medical plan, but I can give my husband some money to put in his cafeteria plan for weekly therapy.
My bosses should jump at the idea because frankly I've been doing a crappy job for years, and they know it. This will enable me to concentrate my energy on what I'm best at, least easy to replace, and let me do a tremendously better job of it.
And the stuff I'm best at isn't the deadline driven stuff, especially if I keep up to date on it, so my health should improve.
It seems like a win-win-win situation.
I'd be very much surprised if my office said no, as long as I give them plenty of time to find someone else. In fact, it might be better for them, because they could hire someone full time instead of the part time person they're looking for now. And of course, I'd do a better job than I'm now doing.
Posted by fallsfall on March 19, 2006, at 16:07:41
In reply to A compromise that lets me keep therapy, posted by Dinah on March 19, 2006, at 14:48:47
That sounds really good
Posted by TherapyGirl on March 19, 2006, at 20:10:22
In reply to A compromise that lets me keep therapy, posted by Dinah on March 19, 2006, at 14:48:47
Way to think outside the box, Dinah. I like this plan. Keep us posted, okay?
Posted by annierose on March 19, 2006, at 22:05:06
In reply to A compromise that lets me keep therapy, posted by Dinah on March 19, 2006, at 14:48:47
Sounds like your husband is working with you on this too --- that's nice. I'll cross my fingers for you when you ask your bosses. Good Luck!
Posted by Dinah on March 20, 2006, at 17:11:49
In reply to Re: A compromise that lets me keep therapy » Dinah, posted by annierose on March 19, 2006, at 22:05:06
And at least some of them were thrilled because they knew I've been struggling, and that's not good for the work.
I think it might be harder for me to let go than I will expect.
But it won't happen anytime soon. The employee situation here isn't so good right now, and it will take several months to find someone, they think.
Posted by orchid on March 20, 2006, at 18:25:52
In reply to It's arranged, posted by Dinah on March 20, 2006, at 17:11:49
I hope it turns out to be a good decision for you. I have been out of job for the past nearly 6 months, and frankly it has been done me a lot of good. I have been able to get my RA under quite a bit of control, my emotional self has become so much better (perhaps there were other reasons to it as well), but overall I have been much more relaxes and emotionally well off. I am sure you will also feel much better in the long run. And if you want later, you can always do some part time work or work from home etc or go back to your job when you are better.
I think it is really a good decision that you made.
Posted by JenStar on March 20, 2006, at 19:58:34
In reply to It's arranged, posted by Dinah on March 20, 2006, at 17:11:49
hi Dinah,
well, I'm glad it worked out! I hope it turns out to be a good decision for you. I hope it reduces your stress level and gives you time to focus on yourself and doing some fun things for you.When I left my corporate job, it was really hard to let go. I mean, obviously it was easy to let go of the work itself, b/c I was gone and not actually doing the work.
But mentally, I had really welded myself to that company in my mind, and had tied up my self-identity with that of my job and my title. It was hard to suddenly introduce myself to someone and NOT say, "I do this." Now I had a new thing to say, and it didn't sound "me." I know that sounds like I cared more about what people think than I should, and it's true. I do still care too much about that, I think. But it made it very hard to go from corporate to not-corporate!
I love my new line of work, but I still sort of miss the corporate world. My stress level is a MILLION times better, though!!! -- even though the money is a lot less. My husband makes enough to support us even with my reduced salary. And of course I have great dreams that someday I'll make my old corporate salary doing what I'm doing now (unlikely, ha, but I can dream, right?)
So if it's hard to let go, don't punish yourself -- I guess that's my main point. If you find that you miss it, don't be hard on yourself, or chastise yourself for the decision. It DOES get better, and the lowered stress is certainly fantastic. :)
good luck with it all!
JenStar
Posted by Dinah on March 20, 2006, at 20:30:36
In reply to Re: It's arranged » Dinah, posted by JenStar on March 20, 2006, at 19:58:34
Work is so identified with Daddy to me. I took care of Daddy by taking care of work, and Daddy often took care of me through the work.
When I was discussing things today and discussing what I was suggesting I give up, and where I felt I was most valuable, and where I thought others could do as good a job as I do, it was just superhard. I kept thinking "No, I really can't give this up. Daddy really cared about this. No, not this. This was the first thing Daddy had me do. No, no. If I give up this, no one else will realize how important it really is, and give it the care that Daddy would want it to get."
And of course, it will be hard to give up the literal benefits that come with working a certain number of hours.
But the emotional tug came from feeling I'm letting Daddy down. He trusted me with this. He knew I didn't want to be in management, but he trusted me with the actual work. And maybe he trusted me to *keep* doing it. Even after he was gone. Maybe he trusted me to keep his memory alive that way. Maybe he trusted me to honor what he built, even if he hated it himself. I know I'll still be doing some of it, but I wonder if it's enough.
Posted by fallsfall on March 20, 2006, at 23:15:50
In reply to Why it's going to be hard, posted by Dinah on March 20, 2006, at 20:30:36
I'm glad it went over well with the bosses.
Your dad would rather you be happy and healthy than dragging along something that "he hated himself". You honor your father by being a good person and a good parent to your son.
I bet you wish you could just ask him if this is OK with him. You know him well enough, Dinah, you can hear his answer in your head.
Posted by Dinah on March 21, 2006, at 8:01:53
In reply to Re: Why it's going to be hard » Dinah, posted by fallsfall on March 20, 2006, at 23:15:50
I know him well enough, to know that his answer could go either way. :)
Posted by gardenergirl on March 21, 2006, at 13:46:40
In reply to Re: Why it's going to be hard » fallsfall, posted by Dinah on March 21, 2006, at 8:01:53
Change is pretty much always uncomfortable and scary to some extent. I think it's only natural that you would have a hard time with the details and what they mean.
I wish you the best on this new course for your life, though, and I hope it signficantly reduces your stress.
gg
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