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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 13 to 37 of 51. Go back in thread:
Posted by happyflower on December 8, 2005, at 0:18:58
In reply to Re: The Green Light and my T, posted by Phillipa on December 7, 2005, at 18:35:35
I like you no matter what!
Posted by Gabbix2 on December 8, 2005, at 0:18:59
In reply to Re: The Green Light and my T (Happy, don't miss th » Gabbix2, posted by allisonross on December 7, 2005, at 17:38:55
> > What you fantasize about is entirely up to you, when it's private
> > It's hard for me to see such a landmine of a subject as teasing, or harmless, especially considering who the audience is likely to be on a board like this.
>
> I'm not sure what you mean. This is a a board for "social" stuff, and there are many topics for conversation. Knowing the difference between my stuff and others' stuff is the key...if it bothers me, or I don't understand, I don't respond. I don't want to judge or criticize anyone. We all need to be gentle and kind to one another.
>
> Sorry I offended you. I was simply sharing my feelings for my therapist. That has been done by others here, also.
>Discussing attachement issues, or transference is different to me, than posting fantasy stories.
I was sharing how felt about the posts
I know you feel criticized, however I stated how I felt, I did *not* judge what you did.> I'd compare it to a high school student writing public fantasies of seducing a teacher.
>
> Well, you have a right to your opinion, as we all do. It sounds to me as if there is something else going on with your feelings.Please don't jump to conclusions, as I said to Tamar, I've read too many posts from people who are struggling with the aftermath of boundary crossing T's, that's exactly why I said what I did.
As I told my t (and he knows it), I am a natural....flirt; I do it with everyone (in a classy way).
>
> I felt criticized, and cannot bear those feelings, and that makes me sad. It doesn't feel safe. I just came out of a 31 year marriage of abuse (and childhood of the same), and am trying to heal.
>Well, as I said, it's a landmine of a subject, and those subjects tend to draw differing responses from others.
I would dare say, that many of of us here are trying to heal from abusive relationships, and that's why I'm asking that perhaps you could put a trigger warning on your posts.
> My best to you...Sincerely, Ally
>
> P.S. We really never know another person, and how much better to ask some good questions before criticizing (said as gently as I can)
>
Again, there was no criticism, I said how that it was hard for me to take what you said lightly. That's a statment of MY feelings, not a criticism of what you did, there's a vast difference between the two. I am entitled to say how something feels to me.
> P.S.#2...if this topic offends you, make sure you don't read Happyflowers posts :)It's not the topic, I've never had a therapist, I've never had transference issues, nor is the discussion of transference a problem. It's the playfulness toward a topic that has so much emotion attached to it for so many people.
Posted by muffled on December 8, 2005, at 0:18:59
In reply to Re: The Green Light and my T (Happy, don't miss th » allisonross, posted by Gabbix2 on December 7, 2005, at 19:30:32
Posted by daisym on December 8, 2005, at 0:54:53
In reply to Re: The Green Light and my T » Tamar, posted by Gabbix2 on December 7, 2005, at 17:21:18
Sometimes these kinds of threads make me jealous that I can't "lighten up" around my therapy and my feelings for my therapist. It feels so complicated and important and fragile to me.
Other times, depending on my mood, I find this kind of joking offensive -- like someone else said, disrespectful of the therapist as a person or insensitive to someone who may have been hurt by a boundary crossing. This response is rare for me but has happened. (I'm not criticizing, it is MY issue, not the writers.)
Mostly, like all things here on Babble, I think we learn to read and/or respond to certain threads and to avoid others. Whether it is the subject line or a specific poster. And it isn't about agreeing or disagreeing with content, it is about protecting yourself -- sometimes a poster's struggle is too close to home and calls up too much pain for some of us to respond to. Other times we can't relate, and have nothing to really say. So for me, I choose to avoid threads that upset me (and that changes from day to day) because I think everyone needs to feel that they can reach out for support, have fun or be serious as they need to. I would hate for the writers to have to worry about the readers. I think the readers have to take care of themselves.
So -- I think trigger warnings would be really helpful. Something like "playful sexual content" or whatever. Or maybe these things belong on social?
Posted by allisonross on December 8, 2005, at 4:09:29
In reply to Re: The Green Light and my T, posted by daisym on December 8, 2005, at 0:54:53
> Hey, Daisy, sweetie: Thanks for what you said.
Sometimes these kinds of threads make me jealous that I can't "lighten up" around my therapy and my feelings for my therapist. It feels so complicated and important and fragile to me.
I know that only too well.
>
> Other times, depending on my mood, I find this kind of joking offensive -- like someone else said, disrespectful of the therapist as a person or insensitive to someone who may have been hurt by a boundary crossing. This response is rare for me but has happened. (I'm not criticizing, it is MY issue, not the writers.)
>
> Mostly, like all things here on Babble, I think we learn to read and/or respond to certain threads and to avoid others.I agree. That is what I stated. if someone says something I don't understand, or agree with, I remain silent. THe last thing anyone needs, is criticism.
Whether it is the subject line or a specific poster. And it isn't about agreeing or disagreeing with content, it is about protecting yourself --
I was upset; didn't think talking about flirting or buying a green lightbulb would elicit such a response.
sometimes a poster's struggle is too close to home and calls up too much pain for some of us to respond to. Other times we can't relate, and have nothing to really say. So for me, I choose to avoid threads that upset me (and that changes from day to day) because I think everyone needs to feel that they can reach out for support, have fun or be serious as they need to. I would hate for the writers to have to worry about the readers.
I'm afraid that is where I am right now.
I think the readers have to take care of themselves.
>
> So -- I think trigger warnings would be really helpful. Something like "playful sexual content" or whatever. Or maybe these things belong on social?
I put my post on social, but Dr. Bob moved it.
I will put in a trigger next time (that is, if there is a next time). I am trying to heal from 31 years of an abusive marriage, and need to feel safe to say what I want to.I think it is interesting, Happyflower (my buddy) posts this kind of stuff, and not too many people get upset (some do), but I seem to get the cricicism. It's very hurtful, so I probably won't do the playful stuff again.
It seemed---safe---to share what I did, but I see that it is not.
My t asked me how I was able to overcome a lifetime of abuse (physical, verbal and molestation),and I told him, 'my faith, sense of humor and wit." If it were not for my sense of humor, I would be drooling in a corner somewhere.
Again, thank you for your helpful, sensitive post.
Hugs, Ally
Posted by allisonross on December 8, 2005, at 5:24:21
In reply to (((((((((((((ally gurl)))))))))))))))))))))))), posted by happyflower on December 7, 2005, at 19:14:40
Posted by Tamar on December 8, 2005, at 6:07:32
In reply to Re: The Green Light and my T, posted by daisym on December 8, 2005, at 0:54:53
Gosh, I’m glad this discussion has happened. It’s been a bit painful, because there are some strong feelings involved. But maybe it needed to happen… and I sense there may be others who haven’t contributed but who have strong feelings about it.
It’s impossible to expect that we could all have the same sense of humour, so if those of us who like to make playful sexual jokes about our therapists can remember to put trigger warnings, other people can avoid those threads. Safe play can happen; others won’t be offended.
I think the idea of trigger warnings is a good compromise.
(((((everyone)))))
Tamar
Posted by caraher on December 8, 2005, at 7:34:04
In reply to The Green Light and my T (Happy, don't miss this, posted by allisonross on December 7, 2005, at 10:55:58
Posted by allisonross on December 8, 2005, at 10:41:15
In reply to But that's you giving *him* the green light(s)! ;) (nm), posted by caraher on December 8, 2005, at 7:34:04
Yes, I realize that, LOL
Which will have NO meaning; something fun to do; play on words!
Ally
Posted by allisonross on December 8, 2005, at 10:57:01
In reply to But that's you giving *him* the green light(s)! ;) (nm), posted by caraher on December 8, 2005, at 7:34:04
Much ado....about nothing; that is MY opinion, LOL
It's ironic. I've always been so careful with my words (Living with verbal abuse for a lifetime), and counseling people who have been verbally abused.
I never expected one comment, and saying I was going to buy a green lightbulb, would elicit such a response.
Any thoughtful, loving, kind responses; great
I (as most people) can't take any more criticism.
I should probably leave; As I said before, healing from 31 years of verbal, physical abuse., other kinds of abuse I won't mention....alone now for only 5 months after divorce; HUGE transition in my life, but because of my faith and...resilience, doing well.
Without my sense of humor, I would be drooling in a corner somewhere. It is necessary for me....to live!
I don't take much seriously----unless...obvious things; life is too short, and can be so tragic; so much pain and misery in life.
Living is hard, dying is mean, get all the love....you can...in between!
Trying to have fun.
PLEASE, if you have something upllifting, nice to say; now's the time!
Anything I perceive (which is a lot, being hypersensitive to cricicism)........will be deleted from my memory, LOl, LOL, LOL
Posted by happyflower on December 8, 2005, at 11:16:58
In reply to Re: Green Light-Tempest in a t - pot/TriggerAbuse, posted by allisonross on December 8, 2005, at 10:57:01
Don't ever lose your sense of humor, it is what I really enjoy about you. If you can't laugh at life, then what is the point in living, ya know? I say post what you want, if it is nessary to put trigger warnings on our fantasies, then we must to protect others, but please don't stop posting. I am so glad to have "met" you, and you know summer is coming soon, we need to start planinng for our double wedding! LOL :)
Posted by Tamar on December 8, 2005, at 11:22:27
In reply to Re: Green Light-Tempest in a t - pot/TriggerAbuse, posted by allisonross on December 8, 2005, at 10:57:01
Hey Ally,
Don't let it get you down! I don't think any of the comments anyone made were intended as any kind of personal criticism of you. (Or Happyflower or me - I think of the three of us as the usual suspects for this kind of stuff; hope I haven't left out anyone who wanted to be included!)
I guess it's just a fact that even when people understand different points of view they don't always feel comfortable about it. It's just one of the hazards of relating to other people. Fortunately the rewards outweigh the difficulties!
I'm trying not to think of it as criticism... I'm thinking of it as discomfort. I really don't think anyone is suggesting we're doing anything bad. They just don’t like to read it.
I guess the joking was a bit more emotive than we anticipated. And people have all kinds of different triggers. I know you're a sensitive person who would never hurt anyone on purpose, and I wouldn’t want to either.
You take care, and remember that if people feel a little uneasy about those joking posts it’s because they don’t want you to get hurt.
Tamar
Posted by one woman cine on December 8, 2005, at 11:25:17
In reply to Re: Green Light-Tempest in a t - pot/TriggerAbuse, posted by allisonross on December 8, 2005, at 10:57:01
Hi,
I am sorry you are feeling criticized. I think you can possibly have alot to add to discussions b/c you have so much experience. I personally don't think anyone was criticizing you. Life is hard, & no one wants to make it any harder for anyone else. I do hope you continue to post - I would sincerely hope, however, you do so keeping in mind what previous posters have said - that being lighthearted is necessary, but some joking can be construed by others as hurtful and offensive - depending on where a person happens to be on their journey in life.
I think it's really important to try to see things from someone else's perspective and respect their particular boundaries, even if you may not agree with it or understand it.
Abuse is rough & can really do a number on you, I think alot of people can relate to that. But just as you may be sensitive to criticism, some folks here are sensitive to sexual issues regarding their therapist. I hope you are able to strike a balance. Best of luck.
Posted by cricket on December 8, 2005, at 13:39:43
In reply to The Green Light and my T (Happy, don't miss this, posted by allisonross on December 7, 2005, at 10:55:58
Okay, here goes.
Normally I would stay miles away from this topic because it is irrelevant to me and because I respect people's need to joke and have fun.
However I have to say that it does make me cringe.
I went to therapy because of serious issues with my self. I do not attribute any of these issues to anything anyone did or did not do to me in the past. These were issues of who I am, why I am and what I can possibly do with the rest of my life.
Although my therapy relationship was certainly rocky, I developed profound respect for my therapist and the way he struggled to help me find answers. I am not a conventionally religious person but therapy room certainly seemed other wordly at least or even a sanctuary.
And despite all our struggles, if I step back and define my therapy relationship I would say it was sacred, set apart.
Not something I can bear to have desecrated. Not that that is anyone's intention. But my own issues make me feel like that when these threads dominate babble.
Posted by allisonross on December 8, 2005, at 14:45:46
In reply to ((((((((((((ALLY)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))), posted by happyflower on December 8, 2005, at 11:16:58
>Hey, Happy! Don't worry, can't lose my sense of humor---it's all that si keeping me "sane"----LOL!!
Don't ever lose your sense of humor, it is what I really enjoy about you. If you can't laugh at life, then what is the point in living, ya know? I say post what you want, if it is nessary to put trigger warnings on our fantasies, then we must to protect others, but please don't stop posting.
Okay!
I am so glad to have "met" you, and you know summer is coming soon, we need to start planinng for our double wedding! LOL :)
I am looking forward to that! Now just gotta ask "him" to marry me, LOL, LOL
Hugs and Love, PIC, Ally
Posted by allisonross on December 8, 2005, at 14:51:30
In reply to green lights (***various possible triggers***) » allisonross, posted by Tamar on December 8, 2005, at 11:22:27
> Hey Ally,
> Hey, Tamar!
> Don't let it get you down!I'll get over it. Takes me time.
I don't think any of the comments anyone made were intended as any kind of personal criticism of you. (Or Happyflower or me - I think of the three of us as the usual suspects for this kind of stuff; hope I haven't left out anyone who wanted to be included!)
>
> I guess it's just a fact that even when people understand different points of view they don't always feel comfortable about it.I'm different, I guess (well, I've been told that ALL of my life, LOL).....if I don't understand something or agree, i don't say anything.
It's just one of the hazards of relating to other people. Fortunately the rewards outweigh the difficulties!
>
> I'm trying not to think of it as criticism... I'm thinking of it as discomfort. I really don't think anyone is suggesting we're doing anything bad.Talking about ones' feelings isn't bad; just normal.
They just don’t like to read it. So, what kind of a trigger do you use? There's so many things that someone may not want to read; it could boggle ones' mind.
>
> I guess the joking was a bit more emotive than we anticipated. And people have all kinds of different triggers. I know you're a sensitive person who would never hurt anyone on purpose, and I wouldn’t want to either.Thankyou, that is true.
>
> You take care, and remember that if people feel a little uneasy about those joking posts it’s because they don’t want you to get hurt.But I didn't hear anything like concern, etc., it was criticism that I was somehow being disrespectful to my t---Nothing could be further from the truth. Our relationship is unbelievable. Things were read into what I said...as my t says: "We all construct our own versions of reality." This is true, LOL!
Thankyou, (((Tamar))))....hugs, Ally
>
> Tamar
>
>
Posted by allisonross on December 8, 2005, at 14:56:26
In reply to Re: Green Light-Tempest in a t - pot/TriggerAbuse » allisonross, posted by one woman cine on December 8, 2005, at 11:25:17
> Hi,
Hi! Thankyou. That comment "I am sorry you are feeling criticized" is perfect. Tells me you heard me. That's all we really need......to be heard.
>
> I am sorry you are feeling criticized. I think you can possibly have alot to add to discussions b/c you have so much experience. I personally don't think anyone was criticizing you.yes, it was a criticism...not important to go into again.
Life is hard, & no one wants to make it any harder for anyone else. I do hope you continue to post - I would sincerely hope, however, you do so keeping in mind what previous posters have said - that being lighthearted is necessary, but some joking can be construed by others as hurtful and offensive - depending on where a person happens to be on their journey in life.
I understand that, but how is one to know what is/is not offensive, etc.? This is difficult to know.
>
> I think it's really important to try to see things from someone else's perspective and respect their particular boundaries, even if you may not agree with it or understand it.I agree.
>
> Abuse is rough & can really do a number on you, I think alot of people can relate to that. But just as you may be sensitive to criticism, some folks here are sensitive to sexual issues regarding their therapist. I hope you are able to strike a balance.It's best that I don't mention the therapist/me relationship again, cause I have no idea what I should/should not post; way too confusing. Best of luck.
Thankyou, and hugs, Ally
>
>
>
>
>
>
Posted by cricket on December 8, 2005, at 15:38:36
In reply to Sex Jokes about Ts, posted by cricket on December 8, 2005, at 13:39:43
Sorry
No offense or criticism of anyone intended.
I think this place is not for me anymore.
Posted by Dinah on December 8, 2005, at 16:19:20
In reply to Re: Sex Jokes about Ts, posted by cricket on December 8, 2005, at 15:38:36
Cricket, please don't go anywhere.
I appreciated your input. Actually, I didn't realize that I echoed your feelings somewhat until I read your post. I make a lot of jokes about my therapist, that's true, but I do see the therapeutic space (if not my therapist) as more than a bit sacred. This topic aside, I think that's an important realization for me, and I thank you for that.
Posted by gardenergirl on December 8, 2005, at 17:15:48
In reply to Re: Sex Jokes about Ts » cricket, posted by Dinah on December 8, 2005, at 16:19:20
Please don't go.
gg
Posted by Tamar on December 8, 2005, at 17:39:47
In reply to Re: Green Light-Tempest in a t - pot/TriggerAbuse » one woman cine, posted by allisonross on December 8, 2005, at 14:56:26
Hey everyone,
Just wanted to post some hugs. (((((Everyone)))))
I know I’m finding this quite painful, and I think a few others are too.
But I would hate to see anyone leave…
And I would also hate to see people feeling very distressed...
We can work it out, right? I don’t think we can make it perfect for anyone, but can we make it tolerable for most?
Tamar
Posted by happyflower on December 8, 2005, at 17:51:47
In reply to triggers and pain, posted by Tamar on December 8, 2005, at 17:39:47
Posted by Dinah on December 8, 2005, at 18:10:14
In reply to triggers and pain, posted by Tamar on December 8, 2005, at 17:39:47
I certainly hope we can work it out.
I would hate to see *anyone* leave too. I'm not sure I made that clear. And I hate to see *anyone* hurt.
As Tamar said, it may be impossible to make it perfect or even not painful for everyone. But I add my wish that the situation can become tolerable.
Maybe the key to that is recognition of and regret for the pain on the part of everyone who is feeling it. Maybe even for those who aren't posting about it.
It's hard to see conflict here on Babble isn't it? But my therapist would say that's part of life, and I need to learn to tolerate being angry or having others angry with me, while still keeping the overall relationship in mind. Then I'd probably would say something either very whimpery about not liking anger, or something very direct and to the point about his words depending on my mood. And then... Well, in the end we'd work it out.
So I'll duck now in case anyone has the same reaction to my words that I have towards his. And yet be fairly confident that we can work it out.
Posted by sleepygirl on December 8, 2005, at 18:46:02
In reply to Sex Jokes about Ts, posted by cricket on December 8, 2005, at 13:39:43
I know what you mean, because I have a tremendous amount of respect for the therapy relationship too. I know people are joking here, and having a good time, but it's over the top for me too. I hope you don't go though....maybe skip these threads?? I know it's hard not to see them though.
Posted by Dr. Bob on December 8, 2005, at 21:40:48
In reply to Re: Green Light-Tempest in a t - pot/TriggerAbuse, posted by allisonross on December 8, 2005, at 10:57:01
> Much ado....about nothing; that is MY opinion, LOL
Please respect the views of others and be sensitive to their feelings.
If you or others have questions about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternative ways of expressing yourself, please see the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Follow-ups regarding these issues should be redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration. They, as well as replies to the above post, should of course themselves be civil.
Thanks,
Bob
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