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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 18 of 18. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Dinah on June 20, 2004, at 8:37:48
In reply to New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination (long, posted by 10derHeart on June 19, 2004, at 11:47:15
Originally posted by 10derHeart 6/19/04
> Hi all,
> I am new here, although I’ve been reading your posts on this board for months and feel like I “know” some of you…and it’s an honor. I’m facing a terribly difficult termination with a dearly loved therapist in less than 2 weeks. I feel very overwhelmed and out-of control, tearful most of every day lately. Any responses from those who have done this/are doing it now will help a little.
>
> Okay – a brief history (although brief is hard for me): I'm 44, female, twice divorced, live alone. Have a wonderful daughter – 22 – who got married 2 days ago. I love the guy, so that’s all great thing. I was diagnosed with ADD 2 years ago, as well as anxiety, depression, mood swings. Fortunately, I got to work with 2 wonderful therapists in 2002 and 2003 (LCSW, MSW) with my P-doc in the picture 1X per month for meds/supervision. That is, until Oct 03 when my P-doc became my only T - his suggestion and I agreed when the MSW left clinic and moved out of state. We’ve met about once every 2 weeks for 8 months, although lately it’s been once a week. I don’t regret the choice, because I sensed 8 months ago we were building a bond that could really be special (amazing what patience and intimacy can do, ‘cause 2 years ago I hated him and thought he was “crazy”!). I was right – we have achieved a level of rapport that surpasses anything I’ve ever imagined possible. He is extremely kind, gentle, empathic and very skilled in guiding me in and out of those hurt places deep inside from my past. Not to mention, sweet, smart, funny and incredibly good-looking (what better set-up for heartbreak, right?) My personal nickname for my T. is Dr. DDG (=drop dead gorgeous) <sigh> Doesn’t make things any easier.
>
> He is a T in the same category as some of the wonderful T’s you guys have described. I’ve tested and pushed and he has been perfectly consistent and never let me down. I consider the fact we ended up in each other’s path a blessing from God. But…and some of you will know what I’m about to say…HOW DO YOU GIVE UP/SAY GOODBYE TO SOMEONE LIKE THIS IN YOUR LIFE AND ACTUALLY LIVE THROUGH THE PAIN AND SADNESS??!! My intellect and experience tells me I can and I will, but my heart is quite completely broken. My main, deep issues – once the ADD was explored and managed w/meds and counseling – have been loneliness, isolation, abandonment, lack of connectedness, etc. I’ve spoken for hours w/this man about my mom’s death 25 years ago, and found a black hole of grief and fear I had no idea I was carrying around due to lack of ever dealing with it. Makes so much of life since then make sense, and my T. has been compassionately right there “holding me” (with eyes, soft voice) on this journey. We’re not done, I hate this, and I can almost NOT accept it (irrational, I know)
>
> In a nutshell, he’s leaving, changing jobs and moving across the country. I’ve known for the whole 8 months, and he is doing what he can guiding me through the anxiety and grief. Probably the best he can considering the intensity of my love/transference/attachment. He stops seeing patients July 1st – I have 2 sessions left – one next week, one on July 1st. I’m sick, terrified, depressed, obsessed, hurting…you get the picture. I could fill in tons more details and will in future posts, but I’ll stop for now. This is enough to get started, and to any of you lovely, brave, struggling folks who’d read this far – thank you.
>
> I am reaching out to this board as a lifeline. My one or two close friends (or are they? Still relearning how to do “close”) are great, and know I’m dealing w/other tough losses and separations at work and with my daughter moving away. They know only a bit about Dr. DDG -–they just don’t understand, having never been in therapy. Besides, hinting at or trying to articulate “therapy love” is dismissed many times w/a nervous laugh and the label “crush” (which it is, but that’s 1 small aspect) and I’m told to get over it and find a real relationship. You guys are my best hope for some relief without the lack of empathy. Just can’t take that right now. – 10derHeart :(
>
Posted by Dinah on June 20, 2004, at 8:45:01
In reply to Re: New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination (long » 10derHeart, posted by Dinah on June 20, 2004, at 8:37:48
Wow, so much loss at once. My heart goes out to you.
I can't even imagine the loss of my therapist. I think he's finally gotten what a huge deal it would be for me. I've heard a psychologist say that losing a therapist is like losing a parent. It's difficult enough to do when it's part of the natural progression, when you're ready to spread your wings and leave the nest. It can be devastating when you are knocked out of the nest, for whatever the reason, prematurely.
It sounds as if you are giving yourself to grieve this loss like any other major loss in your life, and that's good.
If you don't feel like you've completed your therapeutic work, have you considered trying to find a new therapist? I hesitate to suggest this because I would probably be maniacally resistant to such a suggestion myself.
You have my deep condolences on your loss.
Dinah
Posted by Aphrodite on June 20, 2004, at 9:48:01
In reply to Re: New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination (long » 10derHeart, posted by Dinah on June 20, 2004, at 8:37:48
My heart aches for you. I struggle sometimes with my therapist and keep him at bay, and I know it's because deep down I do not want to be close to him for fear of this very heartbreak you describe. I agree with Dinah that it is like the loss of a family member, and you need to grieve.
However, if your struggles have been with connecting with others, it sounds like you have managed to do that with him and is a skill you can take with you. But I know it's probably too hard to think about the future right now.
Did he refer you to another therapist? It may make for a better transition if he could speak to your new therapist and get him or her up to speed.
Again, I'm sorry for your loss. This board has been such a positive part of my life, so I hope you keep posting, and let us help you through it.
Posted by Aphrodite on June 20, 2004, at 9:51:34
In reply to Re: New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination ( » Dinah, posted by Aphrodite on June 20, 2004, at 9:48:01
Posted by rs on June 20, 2004, at 10:21:05
In reply to Re: New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination (long » 10derHeart, posted by Dinah on June 20, 2004, at 8:37:48
I am so sorry that you are going to face the lost. I will share with you being there at one time. First it does hurt. The pain, the feeling of abandoment etc. It hurts much. I was seeing a therapist for 6yrs once a week. Three years ago he moved across the country. I had a month to prepare. Cried so so much. It was like he was dead. I could not have any contact with him what so ever. From this day I still remember that last visit. End of the world. Anyway could not go to another T. Finally after about 2yrs hit bottom and needing much help. Saw this t and hated him. Well few months later went back. Still had issues. Stuck with him. Today see him twice a week and he is the best. Much better then old t in many ways. But like he says my old T showed me its ok to trust. Anyway with the great support from one of the members here I stuck this out. Also still had the issue of wanting so bad to talk with old T. The support person was able to find his adress for me. Wrote to him and he did reply. My T agreed this was ok. Also had his phone number. Finally oned day called left him a message. He called back said it was ok and I cried during the whole converstaion. Told him how much it hurt when he left etc. Anyway please know that I understand how you feel. I wish I could say something that will make this easier but cannot. It does get easier over time. Also if you find antoher T it is possible to build a relationship again. In a way it was best not to have contact because I think I would of not let go. Hope this makes sense and some kind of support. I again am so so sorry. Thinking of you. Please keep on posting the folks here are great. Also if this new T was ever to leave I do not think I could handle it again. I always have to ask that and have his support that he is not going anywhere.
Posted by toomuchpain on June 20, 2004, at 11:57:08
In reply to Re: New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination (long » Dinah, posted by rs on June 20, 2004, at 10:21:05
hi ... i am so sorry u r going through this .. i was wheer ur at too not that long ago ... the pain is sometimes to much to bear but it will get easier ... it seems like ur t is a great person ..u r lucky come ppl dont get that lucky .... like me .. but after my expreince wit my former t of almost 4 years it has been 7 months since i have left him ... yes the pain is still there but i have let go and i have new t now that i building a HEALTHY realtionship wit ... i still think of my former t now and then but i kno if it wasnt for him i wouldnt be where i am today which makes it a lil more easier ...my situition is alil different then yours but all in all it is still painful and hurtful ... u will make it thorugh it i kno this .. the ppl on babble are very supoortive and very knowlegable alot of them have been where ur at and understand ,,, keep us posted .. we are here for u and my thoughts r with u through this painful time
(((((tmp)))))
Posted by gardenergirl on June 20, 2004, at 13:20:06
In reply to Re: New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination (long, posted by toomuchpain on June 20, 2004, at 11:57:08
I'm sorry you have to go through this right now. Termination is hard whenever it happens, but when it is due to external circumstances, it is really hard. And like others have said, it does need to be grieved. I hope you can spend your last two sessions grieving with him over this loss. It may help you to have some support in the process before he goes.
Also, if you are going to be transferred, it may be helpful if the new T could join you and your pdoc for a few minutes in a session. That way, you can "connect" your new T to your old T. In my experience, that helps ease the transition. At the clinic where I worked recently, a new crop of trainees comes in every year. We do these "meet and greet" transitions for transfers whenever we can make it happen. I think it does help to have the trusted person introduce the new person.
However it works out for you, please know that this would be very hard for anyone. You are not alone in this as long as you have Babble. And please take extra gentle care.
gg
Posted by Klokka on June 20, 2004, at 22:14:11
In reply to Re: New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination (long » 10derHeart, posted by Dinah on June 20, 2004, at 8:37:48
I am so sorry that you have to go through this. I can only imagine how painful it must be - I might have to stop seeing my pdoc in August (if I can't get a few things worked out, otherwise it will be when I turn 18 next fall since I see him at a clinic for children/adolescents) and I already break down every time I think about it. I don't have any advice for coping since I haven't yet been through it, but just wanted to say that I understand, at least to some extent.
Can you think of some things/people you can turn to for comfort or a little distraction when needed? Please take extra good care of yourself in this difficult time. You'll be in my thoughts and prayers.
Posted by rockymtnhi on June 20, 2004, at 22:28:40
In reply to Re: New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination (long » 10derHeart, posted by Dinah on June 20, 2004, at 8:37:48
10derheart,
My heart goes out to you. Like many of the other posters here, I offer my support and prayers.
Posted by pegasus on June 21, 2004, at 0:24:47
In reply to Re: New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination (long » 10derHeart, posted by Dinah on June 20, 2004, at 8:37:48
Your post made me cry; There is just so much pain in this situation. I've been through it myself recently, with my old T moving away after 2 years of work. I had 8 sessions between when he decided to leave and my last session. It was really hard. That was last December, and I still cry about it frequently. It's just so painful to lose someone who you've come to depend on and like so much. It did break my heart.
Fortunately (in the long run), a broken heard is not fatal. I've survived it, even though I'm still grieving a lot. Some advice that people here gave me at the time helped:
1. Come up with some kind of ritual that reminds you of your T, so you can feel connected after they are gone. Someone suggested going to their coffee shop and ordering their favorite coffee drink, and journaling. I sometimes go to a certain location that he mentioned often that I know he loved, and think about him.
2. Maybe keep in touch? I know it's not always possible. I've been emailing my old T, and it's been immensely helpful. I know that there's some chance that it's keeping me from bonding with a new therapist as quickly, but I really don't think so. If he'd just abandoned me, with no communication, *then* I'd have a lot of trouble attaching to a new therapist. But since things ended well between us, and I still hear from him now and then, I feel like therapy might still be safe for me. If it happens again (a T leaving), it doesn't necessarily mean that I lose the entire relationship.
3. Talk to another therapist, if you can. I know it sounds awful. But maybe try not to see them as a replacement for you current therapist. I saw a new T for a few months after my old T left, and while I ended up not fitting that well with her, and have moved on to a new better fitting T (or at least I hope - the relationship is very young) having someone to talk to really helped. I got to express the depth of my sadness and anger that I held back from my old T (somewhat) because I didn't want to make his leaving any harder for him or me. So having someone new to talk to was a way for me to work on what *I* needed out of the whole thing. And to hear that it was OK for me to be devastated, even while I also supported his decision and wished him well. And a place to just cry my heart out for at least an hour every week.
I don't know if any of these suggestions will fit for you, but they helped me a lot. It will hurt a lot to lose your beloved therapist, but you *will* survive it. We'll help you. Write as much as you can to us, if it seems helpful.
pegasus
Posted by Dr. Bob on June 22, 2004, at 16:27:31
In reply to Re: New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination (long » 10derHeart, posted by Dinah on June 20, 2004, at 8:37:48
Re: New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination ( » 10derHeart
Posted by Raindancer on June 21, 2004, at 18:49:47
In reply to New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination (long, posted by 10derHeart on June 19, 2004, at 11:47:15
Hello, I'm so sorry you are in such pain and my thoughts and prayers are with you. There isn't really anything I can add to what Pegasus has said - she writes from experience and with great thoughtfulness and sincerity. Your relationship with your T has been so special in your life and both of you will be changed because of it. No-one can take it away from you - it's yours for ever. I agree with the others that you would feel better if you could talk about your feelings with someone else to ease the sharpness of your grief. I shall be thinking of you constantly. Keep posting. Everyone here cares very much. Warm Hugs. Raindancer.
--
Gratitude isn't a strong enough word..
Posted by 10derHeart on June 21, 2004, at 21:57:30
In reply to Re: New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination ( » 10derHeart, posted by Raindancer on June 21, 2004, at 18:49:47
Thanks to you all.You responded so thoughtfully, openly and quickly, and to a total stranger...wow! I have things to say to each of you, but so busy for next 1-2 days w/work I can't do you justice..so it must wait a bit. I am overwhelmed – in the good sense of that word – with the warmth, acceptance and understanding. And to think I was so insecure about posting. I will print out all of these and re-read them for comfort in the next tough days. Little less tearful today and more centered, but see T. tomorrow (2nd to last time) so that will be a trigger to a wave of sadness afterwards, no doubt. Wish me strength to say and ask what I need from him, instead of just sitting there, crying, with this huge ache in my chest..<sigh> 10derHeart
Posted by Klokka on June 22, 2004, at 20:46:34
In reply to Redirected: Awfully Painful Termination, posted by Dr. Bob on June 22, 2004, at 16:27:31
Hi, how did it go? What a horrible time to be so busy at work! I hope things get better for you soon.
> Gratitude isn't a strong enough word..
>
> Posted by 10derHeart on June 21, 2004, at 21:57:30
>
> In reply to Re: New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination ( » 10derHeart, posted by Raindancer on June 21, 2004, at 18:49:47
>
> Thanks to you all.You responded so thoughtfully, openly and quickly, and to a total stranger...wow! I have things to say to each of you, but so busy for next 1-2 days w/work I can't do you justice..so it must wait a bit. I am overwhelmed – in the good sense of that word – with the warmth, acceptance and understanding. And to think I was so insecure about posting. I will print out all of these and re-read them for comfort in the next tough days. Little less tearful today and more centered, but see T. tomorrow (2nd to last time) so that will be a trigger to a wave of sadness afterwards, no doubt. Wish me strength to say and ask what I need from him, instead of just sitting there, crying, with this huge ache in my chest..<sigh> 10derHeart
Posted by 10derHeart on June 29, 2004, at 19:59:07
In reply to Re: New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination (long, posted by Dinah on June 20, 2004, at 8:45:01
Great words, Dinah. Many of your wise posts have already given me strength. Yes, I am grieving this, and will as long as it takes. Denial gets me nowhere, and this loss is so raw, can't be denied anyway. And, as surprising as it is to me, I have already had 2 "mini" sessions w/a new T. at the same clinic. My T. was so concerned w/my fear/sadness over him leaving, he really encouraged it. She is nice and we did connect pretty quickly. We'll see - I still can't picture sharing the "real stuff" w/her or anyone but him. But I think she'll let me talk about him at length if that's what I need...so I might do that. OMG - last session in 2 days, trying to stay strong :( -10derHeart (aka Deb)
Posted by 10derHeart on June 29, 2004, at 20:04:46
In reply to Re: New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination ( » Dinah, posted by Aphrodite on June 20, 2004, at 9:48:01
Such gentle words really mean so much. Yes, it's even worse than losing a family member, I mean, depending on the closeness you've had with family,,,I'm an only child and lost my Mom many years ago, sort of close to Dad...but not really. I'll have to admit my T. has been mom/dad/best friend and sig. other all rolled into a wonderful package. It's so hard. But you are right, I have really connected, and already see little signs of doing that with old and new friends. He has truly been a huge part of some real healing. Thanks again.
Posted by 10derHeart on July 4, 2004, at 23:00:40
In reply to Re: New Poster/Help -Awfully Painful Termination (long » 10derHeart, posted by Dinah on June 20, 2004, at 8:37:48
First, especially for rs, TMP, GG, Klokka, rockymtnhi and pegasus: Pplz, plz, accept my apology for not personally answering each of you back in June. I only managed to write to Dinah and Aphrodite before I shut down. I’ve had to do whatever it takes to keep my mood stable enough to work , etc., and that meant not writing about the sorrow of my T. leaving. I am in the military, so no option of staying home and so forth - I have to function at some level...Just threw myself into work, sleep, etc. I chose to let that override my instinct to always connect with anyone who reaches out to me so kindly as you all did. Doesn’t mean it feels right (it doesn’t), but I’m trusting you all can try to understand…just the reminder of writing about it was too much many days, so I just couldn’t.
For all,...it’s now been 3 days since last session wih T., and I badly want to write all the details of that day, but I can’t quite yet. It’s just too hard. Please bear with me as I process this alone for a while longer. It’s a roller coaster, and w/my situation, (he’s still “around” (cleaning out office, etc), and not moving out of town for a few weeks, so I’m not 100% sure we won’t speak one more time by phone or email…it’s so confusing right now) I didn’t even cry until afterwards, and THAT is causing me anguish wondering if he understood that…it was…unreal. I’m hanging in there, reading your posts and hoping to offer a shoulder and some help instead of just my own pain. You are all wonderful – 10derHeart
Posted by gardenergirl on July 4, 2004, at 23:51:31
In reply to Apology and (sort of) Update re: my T, posted by 10derHeart on July 4, 2004, at 23:00:40
Sweetie, please don't worry about not responding directly. I understand perfectly about not having all the resources to reach out to others. It sounds like focusing your energy into work and self-care is a good thing right now. We'll still be here.
About crying after your session. I think your T would understand. I'm sure he could get a sense of what you were feeling whether there were outward signs or not. It does sound like a confusing situation. Perhaps if you do talk to him again, you could let him know how you are doing, and how hard this is. If you don't, try not to worry. I'm sure he "got it" anyway.
And on this day celebrating Independence, I want to thank you for serving our country. That's an admirable thing to do.
Take care of yourself. Post when you can, and glad to know you are getting by.
gg
Posted by rs on July 5, 2004, at 10:06:59
In reply to Apology and (sort of) Update re: my T, posted by 10derHeart on July 4, 2004, at 23:00:40
I am sorry how you are feeling. Also no need to apologize. Just want to share with you that I understand once again because lost my T once. Yes it hurt but if this is any support it will get easier. To me it was like loosing my best friend. Please hang in there and when your ready we will all be here for you.
Thanks for a wonderful job you are doing for us.
Posted by pegasus on July 6, 2004, at 11:32:00
In reply to Apology and (sort of) Update re: my T, posted by 10derHeart on July 4, 2004, at 23:00:40
No worries at all about not replying. I'm just really glad that you're doing what seems right for taking care of yourself now. That's the important thing. Even if you can't write any more about it for a while (or ever), I hope you know that we'll be thinking about you and wishing you well. This is really difficult stuff, and I support any way you can find to get through it in one piece.
(((10der)))
pegasus
This is the end of the thread.
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