![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 21 of 21. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by saturn on May 2, 2007, at 18:50:06
http://blogs.wsj.com/health/2007/05/01/bristol-myers-exec-dishes-on-depression-patch/
Posted by Honore on May 2, 2007, at 20:16:34
In reply to Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online, posted by saturn on May 2, 2007, at 18:50:06
That's bad news. Probably badly priced, particularly given the troubles many people have with allergic reactions to the adhesive, etc. I''ve noticed that quality control on that is really poor, and it can be very uncomfortable. Plus Pdocs' unfamiliarity with Maois.
Honore
Posted by Phillipa on May 2, 2007, at 21:48:29
In reply to Re: Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online, posted by Honore on May 2, 2007, at 20:16:34
Definitely the price for me as not working and only medicaire which doesn't cover it now how could I possibly afford $500 a month? Ridiculous. They need to lower the price and come out with products for the skin allergies. Oh and something for sleep kind of like a packaged deal? Love Phillipa
Posted by Jeff81 on May 2, 2007, at 22:43:25
In reply to Re: Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online, posted by Honore on May 2, 2007, at 20:16:34
> That's bad news. Probably badly priced, particularly given the troubles many people have with allergic reactions to the adhesive, etc. I''ve noticed that quality control on that is really poor, and it can be very uncomfortable. Plus Pdocs' unfamiliarity with Maois.
>
> HonoreI have had the patch fall off. I can only place it on my upper thighs. The Emsam Company calls me none stop to go over it.
Do you think they will drop the drug? I work in the business world and understand these conference calls. This is a bad sign. This can lead to stop making the drug if it isn't profitable.
Posted by Johann on May 3, 2007, at 0:18:58
In reply to Re: Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online, posted by Jeff81 on May 2, 2007, at 22:43:25
The patch stays on my shoulders and arms excellently, through exercise and the steam room, and I have no allergic reaction. I would be very sad to see it go.
Posted by djmmm on May 3, 2007, at 7:23:44
In reply to Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online, posted by saturn on May 2, 2007, at 18:50:06
> http://blogs.wsj.com/health/2007/05/01/bristol-myers-exec-dishes-on-depression-patch/
Wake up Bristol-Myers!! It's too expensive...especially when you can get 2 months worth of liquid deprenyl citrate for about $60 :/
Posted by Honore on May 3, 2007, at 10:30:07
In reply to Re: Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online, posted by djmmm on May 3, 2007, at 7:23:44
I have no trouble with its sticking to my skin-- but I can believe that people with different skin types might. It's a shame you had that problem, Jeff. I remember our discussing it earlier.
I used Emsam for four months last spring/summer and had to stop. I started again and have used it this time since December. This time around, I've found several packages had much more reactive adhesive than any of the earlier packages. Since the reaction tends to be worse in hot weather, it should have been the reverse.
This time, there have been lots of patches that I've either had to take off after an hour or two, or have been ready to rip off, but left on despite terrible itching, for the whole time. I definitely think they're either putting on more adhesive, or not controlling the quality.. Whichever, it could, by itself, put the drug at risk.
I sure hope they figure out what they're doing wrong.
Honore
Posted by Shortstop on May 3, 2007, at 11:03:40
In reply to Re: Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online, posted by Honore on May 3, 2007, at 10:30:07
I've been on it a little over a month and have had no problems with the patches. They are sticky as hell, for sure -- sometimes it's like they've fused with my skin -- but I find the redness and irritation disappears within a day or two no matter where I place the patch.
Pricing is probably a factor for the drug's marketplace failure, but so is marketing. I've seen no ads for it in print or broadcast whatsoever. The anti-depressant field is crowded but the Emsam patch really does fill a needed niche. Lots of us have stomach reactions to all sorts of foods and oral drugs, including SSRI pills -- just look at sales of Prilosec! I'll be really disappointed if they let this fall away after not putting a serious marketing and PR pitch behind it. On the latter, they ought to be placing patch success stories on the morning news shows, for one thing. And where the hell are the ads during the evening news shows? Get with it, BMS/Somerset!
Posted by ttee on May 3, 2007, at 13:31:33
In reply to Re: Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online, posted by Shortstop on May 3, 2007, at 11:03:40
I would think they would have a hard time doing any TV ad for Emsam, given all the interactions they would have to include. It would need to be a 5 min. commercial for the disclaimers about the food and drug interactions. Hopefully by word of mouth between pdocs, it will eventually be more widely prescribed.
Perhaps a lower price will net them more profit, since more patients will be able to try it. Also, then some of the drug insurance companies might allow it.
Posted by Shortstop on May 3, 2007, at 13:54:11
In reply to Re: Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online, posted by ttee on May 3, 2007, at 13:31:33
Good point on the advertising hurdle, ttee. All the mandatory warnings would make the spot prohibitively expensive and hard to place. I doubt they'll lower the price, either, though. They're doing such low volume that they probably have to max out the margin on the small niche they have just to recoup costs. What they need is smart public relations. There should be articles in every health and general-interest publication out there, and the network medical reporters should be informing the public about "the depression patch" on The Today Show, Good Morning America and so on.
Does anyone know if Bristol-Myers is under any legal obligation to continue manufacturing the medication even if it doesn't make them much, or any, money? Or can they cut bait and discontinue it at any time?
Posted by ttee on May 3, 2007, at 17:31:50
In reply to Re: Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online, posted by Shortstop on May 3, 2007, at 13:54:11
I don't know for sure how this would work, but I suppose that if BMS wanted to get out of the Emsam business, they (with Somerset) could sell the rights to some smaller company, like one of those drug orphan companies. At least they could get something by selling the rights and then maybe the smaller company could do a better job with the free PR sources, since Emsam will be on of their only products. It seems to me that anymore, if a drug is not blockbuster (billions), then the big drug companies don't want to bother with it.
Posted by Phillipa on May 3, 2007, at 18:20:33
In reply to Re: Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online, posted by Honore on May 3, 2007, at 10:30:07
Honore interesting as the only patient my pdoc put on the patch developed such a horrible rash that cortisone cream didn't touch that she had to go off it and it was working. One of the reasons she is reluctant to use it again. I do still have the two sample packages or boxes. Love Phillipa
Posted by Phillipa on May 3, 2007, at 18:24:04
In reply to Re: Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online, posted by Shortstop on May 3, 2007, at 13:54:11
Are they having problems with the Daytana??sp?? patch for ADD? And is the cost as high? Love Phillipa
Posted by jealibeanz on May 3, 2007, at 20:19:04
In reply to Re: Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online » Shortstop, posted by Phillipa on May 3, 2007, at 18:24:04
> Are they having problems with the Daytana??sp?? patch for ADD? And is the cost as high? Love Phillipa
I'd guess it's doing much better because:
1. There are magazine/internet ads.
2. It's marketed to be helpful for kids with ADHD. Parents and their pediatricians are probably willing to take the risk of trying the patch if it'll help the kid be more compliant and have better serum levels.
3. It's methylphenidate, the active ingredient in the well-known Ritalin. This isn't seen as a major leap, just another mechanism.
I know... selegiline is not a new drug, but it's not used normally in liquid or pill form for depression. Methylphenidate is very commonly used for ADHD.
Posted by jealibeanz on May 3, 2007, at 20:21:23
In reply to Re: Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online, posted by Shortstop on May 3, 2007, at 13:54:11
> Good point on the advertising hurdle, ttee. All the mandatory warnings would make the spot prohibitively expensive and hard to place. I doubt they'll lower the price, either, though. They're doing such low volume that they probably have to max out the margin on the small niche they have just to recoup costs. What they need is smart public relations. There should be articles in every health and general-interest publication out there, and the network medical reporters should be informing the public about "the depression patch" on The Today Show, Good Morning America and so on.
>
> Does anyone know if Bristol-Myers is under any legal obligation to continue manufacturing the medication even if it doesn't make them much, or any, money? Or can they cut bait and discontinue it at any time?I thiiiiink that whenever drugs are discontinued for reasons other than safety, the company works with current consumers/patients to assure that they have access to a supply for a reasonable amoung of time until they can taper off and find a new treatment if need be.
Posted by Phillipa on May 3, 2007, at 20:42:08
In reply to Re: Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online, posted by jealibeanz on May 3, 2007, at 20:21:23
I don't think this is fair as a lot of other folks I know are still watching Emsam and how it is working before going on it pdocs included. And there really is no other med like EMSAM a patch. A lot of people have phobias about a med in their mouth and some peoples's liver can't handle pills so there has to be a way to keep it being manufactured. Love Phillipa. As you know the appealing thing to me is the application of a patch something you can see and take it off if sides effects bad. I know it remains in your body for a number of days but it's the psychological component. And my pdoc had said that I'd only need a small portion of a patch so what now?
Posted by Phillipa on May 3, 2007, at 22:16:22
In reply to Re: Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online » jealibeanz, posted by Phillipa on May 3, 2007, at 20:42:08
Someone just wrote me that zyprexa and providgil are as expensive as EMSAM is this true? Love Phillipa
Posted by Jeff81 on May 3, 2007, at 22:27:33
In reply to Re: Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online » jealibeanz, posted by Phillipa on May 3, 2007, at 20:42:08
This is not definatly going to happen. We are just speculating. Like someone said earlier they might sell Emsam to a smaller company. They are a business and don't care about our well being. It's all about $$$. They did not hit the forcasted revenue for Emsam. I don’t think it was even close. It is probably more profitable for them to sell Emsam and is less of a hastle. I have heard (can't get into from who) that they may look into selling the product and they are frustrated with it.
My question is how would this potential smaller company handle the drug? Would they make changes?
Posted by Phillipa on May 3, 2007, at 22:30:42
In reply to Re: Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online, posted by Jeff81 on May 3, 2007, at 22:27:33
Still how can providgil and zyprexa cost more? They do I googled them. So how are they staying on the market? Love Phillipa
Posted by UgottaHaveHope on May 5, 2007, at 0:14:38
In reply to Emsam article on Wall Street Journal Online, posted by saturn on May 2, 2007, at 18:50:06
My pdoc is ONE of the founders of the Emsam patch, and this is what I have gathered (disclaimer: my pdoc did not say any of this):
1. It was never marketed. Go to your local grocery stores pharmacist and ask "How are people doing on Emsam?" They will say "Huh, what?" You never saw Emsam commercials like you did for Prozac (world's worst drug) and others. And those famous drug reps really never marketed Emsam to the pdocs when they brought them steak and chicken for lunch every other day.
2. It costs too much for patients ($500/month is ridiculous). That's more than just about any other meds, including stuff for diabetes and your heart.
3. Insurers dont like the price, therefore it is not on some approved med lists (It's on most, but not all, and it's because of price.)
HOWEVER, the GOOD news is that the EMSAM patch is the beginning of a new wave of antidepressants, etc., that can be taken through a skin patch. More to come, you can bet your house on that.
Posted by Phillipa on May 5, 2007, at 18:03:58
In reply to The reasons for EMSAM trouble (my pdoc = founder), posted by UgottaHaveHope on May 5, 2007, at 0:14:38
Yup medicaire doesn't have it on their approved list. Love Phillipa
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.