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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 11 of 11. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Tabitha on June 17, 2008, at 1:33:00
I feel I've lost the plot. I don't even know what's happening. Slinky's death, and the feelings that brought up, I don't know, I guess probably memories of my mother. My romantic relationship is uncertain and has become a constant source of pain to me. It hurts to make contact, hurts to have none. Hurts to contemplate ending it, hurts to contemplate staying. The only comfort is, since it hurts equally either way, maybe I can accept the outcome.
I don't understand this degree of pain. I think I'd gnaw off my own foot to end it. I even try alcohol and it really doesn't help, just makes the pain fuzzy, but it comes back worse.
What is this reaction good for? Seems like pain from an unknown source to an unknown end. I think, Ok, I just need to treat this like the black thoughts of depression. It's just mental noise with no real meaning. That comforts me for a half hour or so. I try to take a spiritual approach, I ask the creator to let this pain have a purpose. To open my heart. Or something.
I try to go into it. It's like a dependency need, a fear of annihilation. Going into it doesn't make it stop. Waves come again and again. I watch TV for a couple hours, the pain is still there afterward.
I google. I find suggesions like "do something you enjoy" and "watch a funny movie". Thanks, internet.
My thoughts go, "I can't stand this". Before it got so overwhelming and formless, I think it was about loss and love. I can't be alone, but I can't love, because I can't endure the loss of another attachment.
I've tried to hide it from him, but it's not successful. I fear I've driven him away already. I try to forgive myself in advance for that. I've grown in this, maybe I've just reached my limit. Maybe this particular relationship is more triggering than another would be. Maybe I've done my best.
All of these thoughts only bring comfort for a few seconds.
He's going on vacation. Is that all this is about really? I thought I was past going unstable when people went on vacation. I swear, I was past this point. Why am I here again?
Posted by ClearSkies on June 17, 2008, at 7:55:07
In reply to Going under, posted by Tabitha on June 17, 2008, at 1:33:00
I don't think those internet suggestions were very helpful. It does sound more like something that you're being thrust into, and to turn to a distracting, happy-time activity would be like saying, "pay no attention to the man behind the curtain."
My take is that we have to honor these unhappy times we experience. We've experienced a loss; we've been triggered about past losses; we've been made to see the shortcomings of a relationship. Like Slinky's death has become a lens through with we suddenly see our lives. (That's how I'm feeling at the moment, anyway.) It continues to color how I see my world, and it's dismal and leeched of joy, though I go through the motions of everyday activities. I've been shaken and at the same time, I'm not rushing myself to Get Over this. My grief has its own timetable.
And the truth about trauma is that we are destined to experience it over and over again - that's what makes it traumatic. I think - I've been told - that it's supposed to get easier or less powerful as we are retraumatized. I can't see it in the moment, not at all.
Hang on, Tabitha. You can ride this one out, and come through the other side. (Do you have a therapist to talk to?)
ClearSkies
Posted by daveuk08 on June 17, 2008, at 8:30:17
In reply to Going under, posted by Tabitha on June 17, 2008, at 1:33:00
Dear Tabitha, I know exactly how your feeling, I wish I could give you an answer, I know that you and others knew her longer than I did, but in the 6mths that I did know Slinky the impact that she made on me was unbelieveable. I sit at home and I see her when she gets up, coming into the lounge, eyes not properly focusing with a coffee in her hand looking at me, but not focusing without her glasses, I remember all of the fun times we have had, at home and at other places. When I go to this site I hope and pray that she has posted a message, but I know that will never happen.God I`m so confussed,I can`t take in that she has left us, but I know she is at peace, no more pain.
I know we can`t turn back the clock, god I wish I could, but we can be here for each other, I thank all those here who have been here for me, thats why I logged in , so that in return like you all tried to help Slinky, I, if I can, will try to return that help and be there for you.
If you ever want to chat you have my mail address Tabitha, let me know.
Slinky`s Dave
Posted by Tabitha on June 17, 2008, at 9:34:30
In reply to Re: Going under » Tabitha, posted by ClearSkies on June 17, 2008, at 7:55:07
It doesn't seem easier at all lately, it seems more unbearable and I feel less able to cope.
Trying to suck support out of a person who can't or won't give it is adding to the crazy. Now he's starting to see me as a person who needs drama, who needs constant ego-stroking. Then I get desperate to fix that, to make him see my pain, and of course all attempts are seen as more drama and manipulation. Rock, meet hard place.
Ride it out. Hmmm. That sounds sensible. But it feels like I can't stand another second. It feels eternal. I'm afraid it's only going to be endless, and increasing. There's just no place to rest. I think I find a little resting place, and a few minutes later, it's gone. I try to stop resisting and just let it wash over me, and that's OK for a few minutes, but then it pops back up.
It has two flavors: sad and desperate. The sadness is better I think, because it's more pure. If I can just let that be, it's almost tolerable.
The desperate, on the other hand, is awful. My poor brain thinks it can do something to make this better. I make a plan, struggle to stick to that plan, and ten minutes later make an opposite plan. I try to predict the outcome and berate myself for things I've already done. The worst thing is thinking I've already ruined this. I've driven him away. I can fix it. No it's too late. The cycling just feels awful.
In a way, someone's death is easier for me to handle than a dying relationship, because there's truly nothing else to do.
Posted by Tabitha on June 17, 2008, at 9:37:28
In reply to Re: Going under, posted by daveuk08 on June 17, 2008, at 8:30:17
That's such a sweet image of her without her glasses. It's obvious how much you loved her.
Posted by ClearSkies on June 17, 2008, at 14:35:58
In reply to Re: Going under » ClearSkies, posted by Tabitha on June 17, 2008, at 9:34:30
> It doesn't seem easier at all lately, it seems more unbearable and I feel less able to cope.
>
> Trying to suck support out of a person who can't or won't give it is adding to the crazy. Now he's starting to see me as a person who needs drama, who needs constant ego-stroking. Then I get desperate to fix that, to make him see my pain, and of course all attempts are seen as more drama and manipulation. Rock, meet hard place.
>And the more we feel we need to suck support out of that person, the more they resist being able to give it. It's that whole "neediness" thang - I hate it. I see it as a way of trying to achieve a balance - the more you struggle and cry out, the quieter the other person becomes and draws away, tries to create the balance. So the more we say we need <attention> <help> <love> <understanding>, the less the other person is able to give these things to us. It makes itself worse and worse.
> Ride it out. Hmmm. That sounds sensible. But it feels like I can't stand another second. It feels eternal. I'm afraid it's only going to be endless, and increasing. There's just no place to rest. I think I find a little resting place, and a few minutes later, it's gone. I try to stop resisting and just let it wash over me, and that's OK for a few minutes, but then it pops back up.
>You are riding it through, though - that's what we're doing, just by breathing in and breathing out. And sometimes that's ALL that we're able to do, when it gets unbearable and we're hurting so badly, just breathe. But you are actually passing through this pain. It is washing over you. It changes, a bit better, a bit worse, it changes. It will get better, as it's done in the past. Just like it's gotten worse in the past too. We breathe through it - I hate having to do it. That's when I try to haul myself to a yoga class (I sure can't manage a practice on my own - I need to be shown the way, each time, through those breaths.) Can you try doing that, maybe? Or a mindfulness exercise - you can download some for free, there are some pretty decent ones out there. Very helpful for my weary mind.
> It has two flavors: sad and desperate. The sadness is better I think, because it's more pure. If I can just let that be, it's almost tolerable.
>
> The desperate, on the other hand, is awful. My poor brain thinks it can do something to make this better. I make a plan, struggle to stick to that plan, and ten minutes later make an opposite plan. I try to predict the outcome and berate myself for things I've already done. The worst thing is thinking I've already ruined this. I've driven him away. I can fix it. No it's too late. The cycling just feels awful.
>
> In a way, someone's death is easier for me to handle than a dying relationship, because there's truly nothing else to do.
Maybe this too is something that has to be breathed through. (It's not dead yet, like the Norwegian Blue parrot, nailed to its perch!) I know that clinging more tightly will make it hurt more, though. But perhaps just letting up slightly, giving it a little bit of air, will help it to revive? I don't know the circumstances or what you've been through with this person, so I can't say - but relationships can be resilient things if we give them some room.((((Tabitha)))) so sad to see you hurting.
CS
Posted by zenhussy on June 17, 2008, at 16:07:00
In reply to Re: Going under » ClearSkies, posted by Tabitha on June 17, 2008, at 9:34:30
been reading lots of anne lamott to get through too many losses from the past several months. somehow her writings are bite sized for the attention span of someone medicated and grieving.
>>>Trying to suck support out of a person who can't or won't give it is adding to the crazy. Now he's starting to see me as a person who needs drama, who needs constant ego-stroking. Then I get desperate to fix that, to make him see my pain, and of course all attempts are seen as more drama and manipulation. Rock, meet hard place.<<<
is it possible you've been seeking emotionally unavailable partners? often it shows during times such as now and your above words resonated.
you're fine and not too needy or looking for ego strokes. don't let someone elses deal define how you think about yourself, k? if he's not able or willing to offer you support during a time when ANY human (and you qualify for that ; ) ) would need support and comfort then he doesn't much sound like someone who meets those needs.
needs are NOT bad. they just are.
>>>I try to stop resisting and just let it wash over me, and that's OK for a few minutes, but then it pops back up.
It has two flavors: sad and desperate. The sadness is better I think, because it's more pure. If I can just let that be, it's almost tolerable.<<<
sounds like grief. been up close and personal w/ it over past several months. riding it out is pretty much the only way. sorry there's not some magic answer of relief.
been away from online for bit. think often of you and others from here due to things lately and just ongoing life/disease/disorder stuff.
feeling adrift and understanding much of what you write ('cept for current relationship...this hussy is single) and thinking that you're being awfully hard on yourself.
thinking kindly of you Tabitha. fantasy day--when the lotto winnings come in you're going to UK w/ the hussy to get crazy hair put on/in. however they attach that wild stuff!
Posted by Tabitha on June 17, 2008, at 23:01:59
In reply to Re: Going under » Tabitha, posted by ClearSkies on June 17, 2008, at 14:35:58
Thank you ClearSkies, your calm wisdom is a help. Breathe, oh yes, I forgot about that. A yoga class would be lovely.
I got an extra session with my therapist today. That helped a lot. Now I feel exhausted enough that I think I may finally get a good night's sleep.
Posted by Tabitha on June 17, 2008, at 23:08:20
In reply to Re: Going under » Tabitha, posted by zenhussy on June 17, 2008, at 16:07:00
It's nice to see you, Hussy. I forgot about crazy hair UK! That does make a wonderful fantasy vacation.
Ride it out, ride it out, ride it out. That makes make a good mantra.
Yeah, I'm questioning my choice in potential partners about now (as always). This one is a huge improvement over the last candidate though.
Posted by zenhussy on June 18, 2008, at 8:34:58
In reply to Re: Going under » zenhussy, posted by Tabitha on June 17, 2008, at 23:08:20
>>>This one is a huge improvement over the last candidate though.<<<
baby steps. sometimes it takes learning lots of what we don't like to eventualy figure out what we do like, want, need, will tolerate and accept, etc. sounds like you're making good improvements along that path and that's *good*.and always nice to see your name around....there's much to be said for endurance 'round these here parts.
Posted by Gabbette on June 19, 2008, at 17:26:33
In reply to Re: Going under » Tabitha, posted by zenhussy on June 18, 2008, at 8:34:58
**Much to be said for endurance around these parts**
So true, it's always reassuring to see an old friend show up.
Although, it would be nice if circumstances were better.
Tabitha, I don't know what to say. That feeling is the only one that I find .. makes me wonder if the only way to get through it is the hospital.
For me it' s like I'm e caught in the jaws of some animal that's dragging me around and flinging me against the wall, and no matter what logic, or self talk I do, I just have to ride it out.Or have people tell me about their decorating for hallowe'en.
I was kind of disturbed when I mentioned how nice that was of you, and you apologized for talking about "such mundane things" when I was going through hell. I'd asked you to do that, that was what was so wonderful, they didn't seem mundane, they seems like life, and really beautiful.
I'm tempted to find that instant insult to yourself symbolic. But I won't go on..
This is the end of the thread.
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