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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 13 of 13. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by pinkeye on May 23, 2005, at 15:06:14
Yesterday I wrote an email after sometime to my ex T again.
And I started having nightmares.. Yesterday night I woke up at 4 and started crying in the bathroom again.
Part of me deeply associates my exT with my dad. I was so scared of his anger yesterday night.. I was really scared like he would shout at me, or reply and use extremely cruel words or tell me he hated me etc.
And I think it is complete trasnsference from my dad. I used to be so very afraid of my dad when I was young.. pretty much the only thing I remember from childhood so much is fear about my dad. Fear that he would be angry with me, that he would not like me, that he would hate me.. And I am projecting it onto my ex T big time.
PArt of me relates on a more adult level with my exT, but a part of me still thinks I am a child. And such a scared child. I have cried 4 times since yesterday already.
Posted by JenStar on May 23, 2005, at 15:14:33
In reply to Nightmares about my ex T - transference?, posted by pinkeye on May 23, 2005, at 15:06:14
hi Pinkeye,
I'm sorry about the nightmares! It sounds to me like you're going through an emotional upheaval - you're stirring up all kinds of feelings and thoughts that were sort of "under wraps" for years. It sounds from all your posts (not just this one) that you're thinking about serious issues - going to India, whether you're happy with your husband, what kind of relationship is right for you, and whether you had mutual respect with your T. These are huge, difficult questions, and it's no surprise that asking them will be difficult and will make your emotions go haywire for a while.I'm hoping, though, that as you start to find the answers, everything will even out.
I think all of us are childlike at time, needing comfort, crying when we're sad/scared. And that's OK. I hope you can also find it within yourself to be the adult too, and take care of yourself the way you deserve.What is your T situation like now? Is there a current T who can help you through this?
thinking of you!
jenStar
Posted by pinkeye on May 23, 2005, at 15:25:55
In reply to Re: Nightmares about my ex T - transference? » pinkeye, posted by JenStar on May 23, 2005, at 15:14:33
Thanks JenStar.
I am understanding things more and more now..
I have projected stuff on to him from my father a lot. Yesteday I was feeling so guilty and ashamed of myself for liking him.. and I realized that is the same feeling that my current T has been telling me that I have towards my fahter. She says because of my confusion with my father, I have lot of guilt and shame towards liking men, and that is playing a huge role in my relationship with men. My current T (I have a good one), says that even though I didn't like my relationship with my father, a part of me still longs for the deep intimacy with him and that I am ashamed of myself for it. She says I keep projecting that to everyone I meet.
Hmm.. I am working through multiple serious issues as you said. And my mind is all in a complete mess right now. Thanks for the support.
Posted by pinkeye on May 23, 2005, at 18:52:06
In reply to Re: Nightmares about my ex T - transference? » JenStar, posted by pinkeye on May 23, 2005, at 15:25:55
I am having lot of confusing feelings nowadays.
I am so terrified of my ex T nowadays.. almost shivering with fear when I think of him. And somehow I feel he will be cruel to me, mean to me, and extremely angry with me. I am completely terrified and afraid and scared. And so ashamed and guilty also.. I am so scared to even open my mail box. What if he scolds me so much in an email?
I haven't been so afraid of anyone like this. And he hasn't shown me any inclination of any anger.
I don't understand my feelings at all. I think I am intensely projecting my experience with my dad towards him. Any idea how to stop? I don't like it.
Posted by JenStar on May 23, 2005, at 19:03:23
In reply to Is anyone scared/terrified of their Ts?, posted by pinkeye on May 23, 2005, at 18:52:06
hi pinkeye,
it sounds like there is still a big power imbalance in the relationship if you told him honestly how you feel, and yet you're afraid of his reaction. Does that mean you don't quite trust him, or that his reactions to your revelations have been less than professional & caring in the past? In any case, you should be proud of yourself for reaching out and communicating things that are difficult. to me, that seems like such a big thing!Since you are a person who finds this very important, you'll probably only get closure once you DO hear from him, whether it's good or bad. Once you get a response from him, you can determine how to feel, I think. And if his response is positive or neutral, hopefully that will help you separate your feelings about him from your feelings about your father.
It's easy to tell you that you "should" feel a certain way, but I know it's soooo much harder to actually "feel" the way you want to! But I think you're worth a lot more than you give yourself credit for. Even if he were to be mad or angry at you, that would not mean that you deserve such treatment. Sometimes T's are wrong or make mistakes. You don't deserve to be treated badly. Maybe you are having transference, a sort of cultural transference for your T? I mean, you mentioned before that both your father & husband are demanding and have certain expectations, and get mad if those expectations are not met. You could definitely be projecting that onto your T too, esp. if he is familiar with the same culture.
Please let us know when you hear from him.
take care!
JenStar
Posted by pinkeye on May 23, 2005, at 19:25:58
In reply to Re: Is anyone scared/terrified of their Ts? » pinkeye, posted by JenStar on May 23, 2005, at 19:03:23
He hasn't been less than professional or uncaring. I am 100 % positive it is my projection towards him.
Unfortunately for me, I realized my transference's nature (that it was lots about my dad) only after I terminated with him. Before that I thought it was jsut a romantic trasnference, and it really didn't have its roots anywhere. So I didn't work on things with him which I could have worked on if I knew. Only after I terminated (possibly triggered by the loss from termination) I began telling my current T all the feelings that I had towards my exT, and my growing up experiences towards my dad, and she helped me identify that a huge portion of my transference towards my exT is actually a projection from my dad.
BUt my exT stopped all correspondence with me after termination, so I won't be getting a reply and no closure. Taht is what I am trying to get a closure mostly by other means (babble, my current T). But it is very hard. I wish I could hear somethign from my exT, and that it would give me some good closure and healing. That might really help me move on.
Posted by JenStar on May 23, 2005, at 19:32:43
In reply to Re: Is anyone scared/terrified of their Ts? » JenStar, posted by pinkeye on May 23, 2005, at 19:25:58
I think it sucks that we often can't get closure! It just really, really sucks. I guess the best alternative is to do what you're doing - talk here, try to work it out with words & support from friends. If there's anything we can do, please ask! :) I know that another babbler asked people here to write an imaginary letter to her from her ex-T's standpoint, in order to help her get closure. I think that is a really interesting exercise. Do you think that would help at all for you?
Remember that you're a really cool, interesting intelligent person, and I'm SURE your ex-T saw that too. If we can see it after reading your posts, he must surely have seen it as well. And there's no doubt that he learned from you...all T's learn something from each patient.
I'm sorry that you won't get closure from him.
((Pinkeye))JenStar
Posted by pinkeye on May 23, 2005, at 20:11:28
In reply to Re: Is anyone scared/terrified of their Ts? » pinkeye, posted by JenStar on May 23, 2005, at 19:32:43
> I think it sucks that we often can't get closure! It just really, really sucks. I guess the best alternative is to do what you're doing - talk here, try to work it out with words & support from friends. If there's anything we can do, please ask! :) I know that another babbler asked people here to write an imaginary letter to her from her ex-T's standpoint, in order to help her get closure. I think that is a really interesting exercise. Do you think that would help at all for you?
Thanks so much JenStar. I might end up asking babblers to write me imaginary post I guess. What Tamar did was pretty good. But I somehow want it from my ex T.>
> Remember that you're a really cool, interesting intelligent person, and I'm SURE your ex-T saw that too.Add miserable and unhappy person to that :-)
>
> I'm sorry that you won't get closure from him.
> ((Pinkeye))Thanks a lot JenStar.. I have been trying to heal myself.. but right now I think I am stuck in a repetetive loop. I hope I can get somehow unstuck and move on.
>
> JenStar
Posted by Tamar on May 24, 2005, at 4:13:54
In reply to Is anyone scared/terrified of their Ts?, posted by pinkeye on May 23, 2005, at 18:52:06
I’m sorry to hear about your nightmares and about the crying. That’s awful. It does sound like transference, mixed with stress.
No wonder you feel like a child. It sounds as if you don’t know how to feel; whatever you do, you fear rejection, whether that’s a rejection of your childlike impulses or your adult femininity. How can you know whether to be a kid or a woman, when your dad’s responses to you were so often inappropriate?
I wanted to respond earlier, but there was something I wanted to mention only I didn’t know what it was, if that makes sense. But it came to me eventually: I think it’s significant that you’ve emailed your ex T quite soon after speaking to your father and forgiving him.
You said that your father denied everything and denied terrorizing you. So I’m wondering if you’re partly afraid that your father is angry with you for what you said to him about your childhood, even though your mother validated it. Maybe that’s part of the reason you feel so upset and afraid of your ex-T right now.
I hope he does reply, though often ex-Ts just don’t reply. He might think that replying would stir up all the transference again, but as you say, you need closure. But the complicated thing is that maybe you still need some closure with your father too.
I’m sorry you’re so unhappy and afraid. Sending you hugs.
Tamar
Posted by pinkeye on May 24, 2005, at 12:58:10
In reply to Re: Is anyone scared/terrified of their Ts? » pinkeye, posted by Tamar on May 24, 2005, at 4:13:54
> I’m sorry to hear about your nightmares and about the crying. That’s awful. It does sound like transference, mixed with stress.
Thanks Tamar. I think what you have said is perfectly right.
>
> No wonder you feel like a child. It sounds as if you don’t know how to feel; whatever you do, you fear rejection, whether that’s a rejection of your childlike impulses or your adult femininity. How can you know whether to be a kid or a woman, when your dad’s responses to you were so often inappropriate?
True. That is the problem I have now. There are lots of confusing feelings now, and I don't know how to make sense out of it myself.A part of me relates to my ex T like a perfect adult, and at the same time, I am also feeling this intense need to relate to him like a kid, and am scared and hurt and rejected also - both as a child and as a woman. And there is lot of shame and guilt - for still liking him. Sometimes I feel I would never want to even touch him in my life, sometimes I feel I would give anything to be with him. I even feel like sleeping in his lap like a kid many times. There is extreme amounts of confusion from what I can say.
And you are right - all these are brought upon by my father's extremely confusing and inappropriate behaviour towards me. And I am just projecting everything.
>
> I wanted to respond earlier, but there was something I wanted to mention only I didn’t know what it was, if that makes sense. But it came to me eventually: I think it’s significant that you’ve emailed your ex T quite soon after speaking to your father and forgiving him.
>
> You said that your father denied everything and denied terrorizing you. So I’m wondering if you’re partly afraid that your father is angry with you for what you said to him about your childhood, even though your mother validated it. Maybe that’s part of the reason you feel so upset and afraid of your ex-T right now.
It could be that as well. My father has been denying lots of it .. and my mother has been telling me all my memories are 100 % correct. And I think I have forgiven my father in my mind, but emotionally it is not completely healed. I still feel confused. IT could be that I am just projecting everything onto my ex T now.
>
> I hope he does reply, though often ex-Ts just don’t reply. He might think that replying would stir up all the transference again, but as you say, you need closure. But the complicated thing is that maybe you still need some closure with your father too.That is the hard part - I don't think I will get either. Not from my father, and not from my ex-T. My father is never going to acknowledge everything, and my ex-T won't reply either. So babble is my only helping source.
>
> I’m sorry you’re so unhappy and afraid. Sending you hugs.Thanks Tamar. You are so extremely wise. Have you considered becoming a T? You seem to enjoy this also.
>
> Tamar
>
>
Posted by Tamar on May 25, 2005, at 17:12:29
In reply to Re: Is anyone scared/terrified of their Ts? » Tamar, posted by pinkeye on May 24, 2005, at 12:58:10
> A part of me relates to my ex T like a perfect adult, and at the same time, I am also feeling this intense need to relate to him like a kid, and am scared and hurt and rejected also - both as a child and as a woman. And there is lot of shame and guilt - for still liking him. Sometimes I feel I would never want to even touch him in my life, sometimes I feel I would give anything to be with him. I even feel like sleeping in his lap like a kid many times. There is extreme amounts of confusion from what I can say.
Oh yes, I’m familiar with that confusion! The kid/adult thing is so hard to sort out!
> It could be that as well. My father has been denying lots of it .. and my mother has been telling me all my memories are 100 % correct. And I think I have forgiven my father in my mind, but emotionally it is not completely healed. I still feel confused. IT could be that I am just projecting everything onto my ex T now.
Maybe you feel so disappointed by your father’s failure to admit the things he did wrong that your feelings towards your ex-T are even more intense? It’s great that you felt able to forgive your father, but maybe there are one or two things that are difficult to forgive until your father admits his errors. And if he doesn’t admit he was wrong, it might just take a bit more time.
> That is the hard part - I don't think I will get either. Not from my father, and not from my ex-T. My father is never going to acknowledge everything, and my ex-T won't reply either. So babble is my only helping source.
We’re always here for you! But also… what about your current T? Are you still talking about all this with her?
> Thanks Tamar. You are so extremely wise. Have you considered becoming a T? You seem to enjoy this also.
I don’t think I could be a T! I’d never manage to do that blank slate thing. And I’d get really upset if people experienced negative transference with me. But I certainly do enjoy talking to nice people who are as willing to support me as I am to try to support them. What about you? Would you like to be a T? You’re pretty wise too!
Posted by Susan47 on May 27, 2005, at 23:33:56
In reply to Nightmares about my ex T - transference?, posted by pinkeye on May 23, 2005, at 15:06:14
Ow, this resonates Pinkeye, that's pretty much exactly my feelings about my last therapist as well. I had a lot of nightmares, when I couldn't see him anymore, when he shut me out, a lot of nightmares about a house with unfinished and neglected parts; some of the house was beautiful, stunning, the location of this house, everything about the dreams were about unfinished business and so on, and I was so afraid of this ex-T's bad feelings about me. Before he shut me down totally, you know, I was terrified of his bad feelings about me. And he had to be angry and frustrated with me, I was acting out terribly, the worse I behaved the more afraid of him I became. Sheesh. This is therapeutic.
How're you doing with this, now, this fear of your ex-T's anger? It has to be totally transference; you never did anything that would get a rational professional person angry with you, did you, and even if he were angry with you that doesn't mean he'd hurt you like your dad did. You're shedding light on my situation as well. Our fathers actually sound remarkably alike in some ways.
Posted by Susan47 on May 27, 2005, at 23:45:23
In reply to Re: Is anyone scared/terrified of their Ts? » JenStar, posted by pinkeye on May 23, 2005, at 20:11:28
Well that's what I've been trying to get from my ex-T for a year now. I think. Close to, anyway. He knows it and refuses me any more help and most of the world would agree that he's a wonderful person and I'm just an eff-up. But they'd be wrong, because his job, his life's mission in his work ethic, is to help people. But he has the right to refuse. He has the right to do what he wants. It's a big lesson for me to learn. I can't seem to get it. But I'm hoping I can move on, I'm hoping that I'm not going to ever repeat the pattern of self-abuse and anger towards myself. I'm hoping that somehow by osmosis I've learned this lesson and I won't mistrust a good man again. Some men are just insensitive and selfish, but so women are like that also, and just as I don't mistrust all women, I can no longer distrust all men. Huge huge lesson. I hope I'm learning it, because rationally thinking about it, and trying not to feel the extreme pain of rejection anymore, is really not getting me anywhere very fast. You know? See, I'm venting again, don't take me too seriously. This is your thread, anyway. It's a good one.
This is the end of the thread.
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