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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 11 to 35 of 35. Go back in thread:
Posted by pinkeye on March 11, 2005, at 13:45:24
In reply to therapy ending - my heart breaks, posted by Shortelise on March 10, 2005, at 23:55:22
Maybe you should agree with him for a more smoother termination plan. Like agree for one visit a month for the next 6 months, and then once in two. That will give you enough time to heal and move on with your own life, at the same time have soemthing to look forward to.
Your T does sound sensible, and I think he would agree to see you once in a month perhaps if you think it would help you.
I wish I had the same luxury with my ex T.
>
> I saw my T today, and I mentioned that sometimes I think I should just not see him anymore, that I should get on with my life.
>
> He thought it was a good idea. That it's time, that I'm ready, that continuing to see him keeps me regressed.
>
> I feel so hurt, so sad, so sick (too much chocolate, that would be. I was hoping to comfort myself with chocolate, but when the pain is so great, a person tends to overeat and feel sick afterwards).
>
> My heart is broken. Part of me wants to find a big stick and poke it in my eye and say, look at how bad I feel, I poked myself in the eye because I feel so bad.
>
> Another part of me wants to be the rational, gracious woman I know I can be, and see him a few more times, weep copiously, and go on my merry way.
>
> And yet another part of me wants to blame him, wants to hate him, wants to see him as a betrayer, the filthy swine. How could he seduce me into believing he cared, that he understood me, that he would stand with me, and now want me to go?
>
> Yes, he says I could see him every few months, call him if I need to, see him more often if something comes up. He says he would be there for me. He is kind, caring, gentle, and a filthy burp.
>
> I feel I did it all wrong, that if I were younger, prettier, kinder, thinner, more intelligent, better ... he would not send me away.
>
> Yet I know that he is right, it's time, and why can't I let these old feelings go...
>
> I am so so sad. I have cried so much today my head aches. My husband called and left him a message to please call, and he never called back. More betrayal.
>
> So, if I'm lucky, I'll see him two or three more times in the next couple of months. And then this part of my life will be over. I feel like an orphan. And I so want to hate him.
>
> ShortE
Posted by pinkeye on March 11, 2005, at 15:11:59
In reply to therapy ending - my heart breaks, posted by Shortelise on March 10, 2005, at 23:55:22
Another thing that always immensely helps me whenever I feel hurt and abandoned by my T is the thought that he is perhaps just like me.. as weak, as human, as troubled, and having emotional issues of his own perhaps to deal with. That thought always makes me see him in the correct perspective.. and removes the hurt.
When you said you want to feel angry towards him, I thought this might help you. For me, my old T was barely 3 years elder to me. So I keep trying to remember that, that he is just like me and that helps me not to hold anything against him. If you are feeling abandoned and left by your T, it might help you to realize he is probably feeling the same to an extent with you. That you came and leaned on him and grew, and now you are flying away and no longer need him. He probably feels a little bit of the empty nest syndrome that parents feel when the kids go away.
If you had a good relationship with your T, he would probably be missing you as well, and remembering that will remove some of the hurt that you are experiencing now.
Posted by Susan47 on March 11, 2005, at 18:46:58
In reply to therapy ending - my heart breaks, posted by Shortelise on March 10, 2005, at 23:55:22
Will the filthy burp let you see him once a month for a couple of months, first? Or maybe two times every three weeks and then once a month and then just as needed? Knowing you can see him if you need to might help you break free...?
Posted by Tamar on March 11, 2005, at 19:15:08
In reply to therapy ending - my heart breaks, posted by Shortelise on March 10, 2005, at 23:55:22
I'm in a similar situation - my final appointment with my T is now less than a week away. I feel for you.
> Another part of me wants to be the rational, gracious woman I know I can be, and see him a few more times, weep copiously, and go on my merry way.
Is that the person he sees when he thinks of you leaving therapy? A rational, gracious woman? That's a tribute to both of you.
> I feel I did it all wrong, that if I were younger, prettier, kinder, thinner, more intelligent, better ... he would not send me away.I know. I feel the same way. If only I were indispensable, my T wouldn't be able to let me go. He'd keep me in therapy for the rest of my life. Of course, what I actually desire is his friendship and love...
Also, I'm sure you're young enough, pretty enough, kind, thin, intelligent and good enough for your T. It's because you are valuable to him that he wants what is best for you, even if that means letting you go.
> I am so so sad. I have cried so much today my head aches. My husband called and left him a message to please call, and he never called back. More betrayal.Have you called him yourself? Would that make a difference?
> So, if I'm lucky, I'll see him two or three more times in the next couple of months. And then this part of my life will be over. I feel like an orphan. And I so want to hate him.
>
The word orphan strikes a chord with me. It's like a bereavement, isn't it? You might know it's coming and you might be able to prepare for it, but it's still a huge loss.I hope he calls you back.
Tamar
Posted by Shortelise on March 11, 2005, at 20:18:50
In reply to Re: therapy ending - my heart breaks » Shortelise, posted by Tamar on March 11, 2005, at 19:15:08
Today I went out of the city with a friend to buy roses bushes for my garden. Should anyone else require an afternoon of escapism, I would suggest a drive in the country. We went to a place where they actually grow a lot of the roses they sell, and the man who owns it helped us select the roses we bought. It was wonderful. There were chickens clucking, roosters crowing, the smell of dung in the air, and warm, fragrant plants all around. Tomorrow my husband and I will dig holes to plant these glorious treasures, so that will soothe my soul as well.
My husband talked with my T, who said that we will negociate how often I will see him, what an acceptable (acceptable for me as well as one he thinks appropriate)schedule for termination would be.
He said lots of other comforting stuff, and told my husband just to listen to me and love me - that is how he can help the most.
I am exhausted. It's astonishing how exhausting emotional stuff is. So tired. I only cried for a while this morning, but this sadness is so heavy, it's like carrying a huge weight all the time.
Thanks for your kindness. I wish I had the energy to answer each of you, but trust me, I am listening to you all, am grateful to each.
Susan, I'm glad you enjoy my "cursing" so much.
ShortE
Posted by gardenergirl on March 12, 2005, at 6:38:36
In reply to Husband talked with him, posted by Shortelise on March 11, 2005, at 20:18:50
That sounds like a wonderful day, ShortE. I'm glad you did that, and I hope the planting goes well. It's much too soon here for planting. I'm jealous! :)
I'm glad your husband talked to your T. It sounds as if he will be understanding and comforting. I so feel for you. My T and I haven't talked termination in awhile, but recently I've thought about how I would want a final session to go. I could not come up with anything acceptable. It was far too painful. All I could do was just cry.
In some ways, I think termination (when it's done right) is the biggest and hardest job in therapy. Perhaps it takes all that work just to be able to reach the point where you even can.
Keep doing good things for yourself and for the earth. It's very healing.
((((shorte)))))
gg
Posted by Dinah on March 12, 2005, at 8:15:11
In reply to therapy ending - my heart breaks, posted by Shortelise on March 10, 2005, at 23:55:22
((((((ShortE))))))
No matter how expected, loss always hurts. I hope you can work together on a tapering schedule that makes it easier (?!!!) for you.
Posted by Dinah on March 12, 2005, at 8:22:47
In reply to Re: therapy ending - my heart breaks, posted by alwayzblue222 on March 11, 2005, at 4:25:53
Oh, I am so sorry. That must be so scary for you.
Are you able to process your feelings about this with her? Or is it too hard to mention for fear of hurting her?
I think this is my biggest fear now that I no longer fear that my therapist will ever terminate me, and he seems happily married to a woman who won't move. (blessed woman) So now I watch his excessive cofee drinking and worry about his weight and if he's getting enough exercise and ask him what will happen to me if he dies.
It's hard enough for me to discuss those things with my therapist and he's well. It must be so much harder since she's sick.
I gave my therapist a printout from the internet yesterday about plans therapists should make for their incapacity or death. And his response was something along the line of some people don't like to make those plans, like making a will, because they don't like to think they can die. I happen to know he hasn't made those plans (hence giving him the printout), so I gave him a hard stare and told him that *some* people might, but that I expected better from *him*. No way I could have done that if he were currently ill.
How are you holding up under the stress? I'm sure, though, that your therapist is a wonderful example to you of persevering under difficult circumstances.
Posted by mair on March 14, 2005, at 11:24:42
In reply to Husband talked with him, posted by Shortelise on March 11, 2005, at 20:18:50
I think it's cool your husband spoke with him. It sounds like he's pretty involved.
I hope you're feeling better.
Mair
Posted by Shortelise on March 14, 2005, at 11:52:44
In reply to therapy ending - my heart breaks, posted by Shortelise on March 10, 2005, at 23:55:22
Thanks Mair, and all.
ShortE
Posted by Susan47 on March 14, 2005, at 12:09:25
In reply to Muddling through, posted by Shortelise on March 14, 2005, at 11:52:44
Everything you're feeling. (((Your feelings))) If I were in your shoes I think a good-bye letter, writing one that is, would really help me a lot. Hugely. I might not give it but I might... knowing I have my feelings down solidly on paper makes me feel more solid, more whole. It's really like a way of helping me accept my feelings and then work through them. You're having a lot of feelings right now, let them flow sweetie. (((Shortelise))) - who's very very wise.
Posted by Shortelise on March 14, 2005, at 12:44:15
In reply to (((Shortelise))), posted by Susan47 on March 14, 2005, at 12:09:25
Susan, that's a brilliant idea. I will write a goodbye letter. No, not for him, for me. Thanks,
ShortE
Posted by 10derHeart on March 14, 2005, at 22:26:13
In reply to Re: (((Shortelise))) » Susan47, posted by Shortelise on March 14, 2005, at 12:44:15
...is well known to me. As well as helpfulness, kindness, insight, empathy...oh I could go on.
The letter idea will help, I think. I've done it. But I actually gave mine to my T. 3 days prior to out last session. Then I mailed him another one three months later. He emailed back, and it was a good, good thing
Not recommending that, just reminiscing. I tend to do things in the most intense, dramatic way possible. Just the act of writing (and re-writing, and re-writing...) helped release a lot of the feelings - just have lots of tissues nearby to protect the paper... ((ShortE))
Posted by Susan47 on March 15, 2005, at 11:45:23
In reply to Re: Yes, Susan's brilliance..., posted by 10derHeart on March 14, 2005, at 22:26:13
But your words about me being helpful and kind and empathetic and insightful I hope I can take those words to my grave because they make me feel really really good.
10derheart, it sounds like you had a really good ending with your T.
I envy you that, and I'm sure though that you really earned it. Somehow, I never did. I was too messed up I guess.
Posted by pinkeye on March 15, 2005, at 12:48:29
In reply to Oh dear, she's not brilliant at all..... » 10derHeart, posted by Susan47 on March 15, 2005, at 11:45:23
You are really all that what 10derHeart said. I am noticing that in your posts now as well. It was probably there before as well, but past few days, I am noticing how capable you are at giving support to others.
Posted by Susan47 on March 15, 2005, at 13:54:30
In reply to Re: Oh dear, she's not brilliant at all..... » Susan47, posted by pinkeye on March 15, 2005, at 12:48:29
M-hm. And today I developed a brilliant new theory about using my therapist to self-injure. Now, btw, is that injure or inflict?
I thought I disgusted him on some level and then I was drawn to him over and over again and when I couldn't change his mind, in fact, he got really truly upset by me, then it became really stressful to see him, and my brain needs the stress so I can feel something, anything besides nothing, which is how I learned to feel about everything, so I kept re-creating the stress over and over and over again and then when I felt I needed a real JOLT of what I was creating, I went in to SEE him, you know, I would go to his office and SIT there or even just open the door and close it again (that was last week) and leave, because it made my heart pound, it made me feel excited and alive knowing he would be angry if he knew.
Ah-HAH and I HATE knowing these things about myself, it's really stressful, but valuable too because it's information about myself that I can change.
Posted by Susan47 on March 15, 2005, at 14:07:48
In reply to Yee-ha, or haw (very country, that) » pinkeye, posted by Susan47 on March 15, 2005, at 13:54:30
Because it's probably already been done. Whole theories abound, I'm sure, about the different ways, besides physical, that people can and do self-inflicted injury. Oh, yeah I suppose that's one of the basics of theory behind co-dependency right? Co-dependent might not just mean getting what you need because you really believe you need it, it might be gettting what you need in order to FEEL, period. No, that doesn't work. Theory out the window. Hmm. My thinker's thunk. Ker-plunk.
Posted by pinkeye on March 15, 2005, at 14:22:44
In reply to Well, there's another thesis. Out the window. » Susan47, posted by Susan47 on March 15, 2005, at 14:07:48
I don't understand too much of what you are saying, but regarding this self - inflicted injury, I do have some perception. I had a minor form of it - in the form of a disease. But then I realized, life throws us so much of pains by itself. And so much of suffering is there as it is, and I don't need to add to it myself. Without me causing me more suffering, life is going to put me through severe hell - my parents will die one day, I will get old, I will get sick, I will have problems with my husband, I might lose the job etc etc. So just managing all these and living a good life is going to be an extremely difficult thing. I don't need to add to it anything myself.
And I realized that construction is what takes effort and patience and ability. Destruction is just so very easy. You can destruct something you spent years in building up in a moment. And beauty lies in construction, not in destruction.
All these things stopped myself from doing any sort of destructive ness - both self and inflicting pain on others.
Posted by Susan47 on March 15, 2005, at 14:40:07
In reply to Re: Well, there's another thesis. Out the window. » Susan47, posted by pinkeye on March 15, 2005, at 14:22:44
Yes, absolutely, you have so much wisdom, it seems to me, It just seems impossible what you're saying about anybody not liking you in real life, like that therapist who was a friend, right? Or am I just getting that perception, that you feel misunderstood? Or is that all ME talking? Or is it you pinkeye? I'm so confused, my head's spinning because there're too many ideas in there right now, and there was something else I feel is true but I have to find the right post to refer to, because I'm afraid if I don't follow the thought through to the end, here, then I'll lose the concept and won't be able to apply it I need to heal, I want to heal so badly. There's so much beauty in the world, and I missed it so much for so many years, I've got a taste of happiness and I want it forever ....
Posted by Susan47 on March 15, 2005, at 14:40:54
In reply to Re: Well, there's another thesis. Out the window. » Susan47, posted by pinkeye on March 15, 2005, at 14:22:44
Posted by pinkeye on March 15, 2005, at 15:04:10
In reply to Re: Well, there's another thesis. Out the window. » pinkeye, posted by Susan47 on March 15, 2005, at 14:40:07
Ok, once again, your post is way over my head, but I will reply to whatever t*t bits of it I can understand.
First all this wisdom is something I picked up from my therapist :-). And I do think he would perhaps have liked me to a good extent. Atleast if he knew what I have grown into this past 4 - 5 weeks. Maybe not too much, or not in the ways I wanted, but now I honestly think he didn't dislike me ever. And if he did, it would have been a mistake on his part. Atleast in the past couple of weeks that is what I am realizing. I think lot of it was just my own sense of not liking myself that I projected on to him - because in the past 4 - 5 weeks, I have changed in ways I never believed myself to be possible. I have just got this wisdom as you said, I am realizing it myself, and now I am trying to use it for constructive purposes which before I used all the insight only to ruminate and get depressed. Maybe that is why I didn't like myself at that time, and I projected it onto my therapist as well and thought that he didn't like me. Now that I like myself, I think he likes me too. See how your own perception of yourself plays so much role in the way you look at the world and the world looks at you?
That is what happens to happiness also.. For some reason, when we go through traumas and negative things in childhood, we start reflecting the same thing in our lives - and seek pain and negativeness ourselves. Maybe that is the way our brain is wired - to reflect what it sees. But once you stop that and change it and start grabbing onto happiness, automatically the world starts reflecting happiness back onto you.
I don't know if I am making too much of sense here.
> Yes, absolutely, you have so much wisdom, it seems to me, It just seems impossible what you're saying about anybody not liking you in real life, like that therapist who was a friend, right? Or am I just getting that perception, that you feel misunderstood? Or is that all ME talking? Or is it you pinkeye? I'm so confused, my head's spinning because there're too many ideas in there right now, and there was something else I feel is true but I have to find the right post to refer to, because I'm afraid if I don't follow the thought through to the end, here, then I'll lose the concept and won't be able to apply it I need to heal, I want to heal so badly. There's so much beauty in the world, and I missed it so much for so many years, I've got a taste of happiness and I want it forever ....
Posted by Susan47 on March 15, 2005, at 18:04:58
In reply to Yee-ha, or haw (very country, that) » pinkeye, posted by Susan47 on March 15, 2005, at 13:54:30
Well and there's another thing, you see, about hurting yourself with another person. The person you're using, the person you're using to make you feel something, is bound to be resentful and pissed off.
Posted by pinkeye on March 16, 2005, at 12:33:43
In reply to Re: Yee-ha, or haw (very country, that), posted by Susan47 on March 15, 2005, at 18:04:58
> Well and there's another thing, you see, about hurting yourself with another person. The person you're using, the person you're using to make you feel something, is bound to be resentful and pissed off.
Do you keep wanting to do it again and again? Sometime, it might just be the time to let go and make peace with things. I am finding myself more and more in that state nowadays - kind of "why bother" attitude. Life is too short for all these games and longings and frustration. If your therapist had liked you, and wanted to keep in touch with you and see you casually, there might be point in trying to be friends. But why use him to hurt yourself? Instead you might want to emerge into a strong person, and one day he might look at you and say, "Wow, Is this the Susan that I knew?" And to win his honest appreciation.
Posted by Susan47 on March 16, 2005, at 13:51:12
In reply to Re: Yee-ha, or haw (very country, that) » Susan47, posted by pinkeye on March 16, 2005, at 12:33:43
Well, now, here's a step forward. I don't really care for or about his appreciation!
Posted by pinkeye on March 16, 2005, at 13:58:21
In reply to Re: Yee-ha, or haw (very country, that), posted by Susan47 on March 16, 2005, at 13:51:12
> Well, now, here's a step forward. I don't really care for or about his appreciation!
Then so much the better :-). Then try to occupy your mind with other things and people so you will not let him bother you.. All of us go through setbacks in life and what we make out of it defines who we are and where we end up. Life, love, relationships, success - everything is what we make out of what life throws us. (You should recognize that I am trying to speak to myself as well:-)).. When we get hurt in life - either in job or relationships or health, the quicker we rebound and move no, the better we end up. That is all life is about.
This is the end of the thread.
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