![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 17 of 17. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by corafree on October 30, 2004, at 0:51:48
I am suffering terribly w/ attacks w/o precipitating events, and even upon awakening. Do not recall dreams/nightmares.
I am looking for something to take daily or at onset of a panic attack. I'm cannot take Xanax and Klonopin (which I do have) does not work.
I hyperventilate, and have a back injury, so breathing exercises useless at these times.
Can anyone share any experience/knowledge re: following list alternatives found researching Internet.
TheraStress
Becalm
Euphorx
Anxietol 7
HerbVal Supra
Prosera
Clarocet NRI
Amoryn
Relora
PinadolTotally appreciate any feedback. Corafree
Posted by JLx on October 30, 2004, at 9:56:38
In reply to Severe Panic Attacks Agoraphobia, posted by corafree on October 30, 2004, at 0:51:48
Hi Corafree,
Do you already take magnesium and B vitamins? Omega-3?
They won't be a quick fix, may take 4-6 weeks, but they seem to be some good basics for any type of nervous condition.
JL
http://www.wholehealthmd.com/refshelf/substances_view/1,1525,890,00.html> I am suffering terribly w/ attacks w/o precipitating events, and even upon awakening. Do not recall dreams/nightmares.
>
> I am looking for something to take daily or at onset of a panic attack. I'm cannot take Xanax and Klonopin (which I do have) does not work.
>
> I hyperventilate, and have a back injury, so breathing exercises useless at these times.
>
> Can anyone share any experience/knowledge re: following list alternatives found researching Internet.
>
> TheraStress
> Becalm
> Euphorx
> Anxietol 7
> HerbVal Supra
> Prosera
> Clarocet NRI
> Amoryn
> Relora
> Pinadol
>
> Totally appreciate any feedback. Corafree
Posted by corafree on October 30, 2004, at 17:17:46
In reply to Re: Severe Panic Attacks Agoraphobia » corafree, posted by JLx on October 30, 2004, at 9:56:38
>Hi...tks for response.
Do take Bs and Omega-3, but haven't added magnesium.
Do you mean a combo-B? The one I have sometimes gives me a bit of a headache; don't know why. I am a very slow metabolizer. Haven't been eating well...maybe could be why.
Any good readings on 'alternative medicine for anxiety'? Actually, like to hear personal stories, here, better.
Go to local health store and when mention anxiety ... could come out of there with $1000 worth of stuff; hard when already living on limited income.
best wishes cf
>
> Do you already take magnesium and B vitamins? Omega-3?
>
> They won't be a quick fix, may take 4-6 weeks, but they seem to be some good basics for any type of nervous condition.
>
> JL
>
>
> http://www.wholehealthmd.com/refshelf/substances_view/1,1525,890,00.html
>
> > I am suffering terribly w/ attacks w/o precipitating events, and even upon awakening. Do not recall dreams/nightmares.
> >
> > I am looking for something to take daily or at onset of a panic attack. I'm cannot take Xanax and Klonopin (which I do have) does not work.
> >
> > I hyperventilate, and have a back injury, so breathing exercises useless at these times.
> >
> > Can anyone share any experience/knowledge re: following list alternatives found researching Internet.
> >
> > TheraStress
> > Becalm
> > Euphorx
> > Anxietol 7
> > HerbVal Supra
> > Prosera
> > Clarocet NRI
> > Amoryn
> > Relora
> > Pinadol
> >
> > Totally appreciate any feedback. Corafree
>
>
Posted by JLx on October 31, 2004, at 9:07:03
In reply to Re: Severe Panic Attacks Agoraphobia » JLx, posted by corafree on October 30, 2004, at 17:17:46
Hi Corafree,
What I've learned about alternative med is that very rarely is there one or two things that substitute "this for that" for the drugs we used to take. Alt med really is holistic, most things work synergistically. Drugs treat the symptoms, while usually alt med addresses the causes of our symptoms.
I mentioned magnesium because most people eating the typical Western diet are deficient, and because magnesium is involved in over 300 fundamental enzymatic functions of the body. It's especially implicated in stress. http://www.healthy.net/scr/column.asp?ColumnId=5&ID=74
"Chronic stress depletes your body of magnesium. The more stressed you are, the greater the loss of magnesium. The lower your magnesium level to begin with, the more reactive to stress you become and the higher your level of adrenalin in stressful situations. Higher adrenalin causes greater loss of magnesium from cells. Administering magnesium as a nutritional supplement breaks this vicious cycle by raising blood magnesium levels and buffering the response to stress, building your resistance."
I understand your concern about costs, as I have the same problem. But experience has taught me that products like "beCalmed" are something of a rip off. For one thing if they don't work, you're left not knowing which ingredient was the problem one. Here's what's in it:
Each Capsule Contains:
D/L-Phenylalanine 300 mg
L-Glutamine 150 mg
5-HTP 5 mg
Vitamin B6(pyridoxine HCL) 1 mg
Calcium (chelate, citrate) 50 mg
Magnesium (chelate, oxide) 25 mg
Folic Acid 0.01 mgIt MAY be possible that this is just the exact combination of these things that you need, but I am doubtful. Those are really low levels of B-6, calcium, magnesium and folate for instance, and they're NOT necessarily the best forms of those supplements. Magnesium oxide is very poorly absorbed, for example, and the preferred form of Vit B6 is pyridoxal-5-phosphate. You're paying mostly for the amino acids, D/L-Phenylalanine and L-Glutamine. While the glutamine may be calming, DLPA is not known for that. 5-HTP may be helpful, but again, that is a tiny amount.
In my opinion, you'd be better off "bang for your buck" addressing the underlying stress response in your body first, as a panic attack is like an explosion of non-managed stress. It's not THE problem, it's a symptom of a body system problem. So, anything you can do to reduce stress from bubbling over like that will help.
Your attacks upon awakening might be due to the fact that cortisol is naturally high in the morning, for instance. Cortisol may be increased in general from chronic stress and may be due to exhaustion of the adrenal glands. So, anything that supports the adrenal glands would help in the long run such as Vit. C and pantothenic acid. In general, for stress, avoiding caffeine, aspartame, smoking, a hypoglycemia-inducing diet or just sugar itself would probably help.
Re supplements, if you said, "I only have x number of dollars to spend, what should I buy?". I would say magnesium first.
"Some studies have shown that certain phobic disorders like agoraphobia are associated with lower levels of magnesium, and other kinds of nervous system instability may also be involved. One clear symptom of magnesium deficiency is hyperreflexia -- a kind of heightened startle reflex marked by sensitivity to noise and exaggerated reflex responses. In fact, one of the symptoms of magnesium overdose is the suppression of normal reflexes. So the idea is to keep the body supplied with the ideal levels of magnesium -- though deficiencies are the real concern. In our high-stress post-industrial environment, daily stresses and shocks may literally leach away the magnesium we need to maintain our neurological equilibrium." http://www.consciouschoice.com/holisticmd/hmd1205.html
I'd recommend, magnesium glycinate, mg taurate, magnesium citrate, mag malate but NOT mag aspartate, mg glutamate or unless you want to mostly waste your money, mg oxide . Magnesium glycinate and magnesium taurate are both especially good for stress because they are both chelated with amino acids that are themselves calming. Mg citrate and mg malate are both good too and often easier to find (and not as expensive). Magnesium glycinate for me was like a magic bullet, I went off my meds (Zolof, Provigil) within 2 days, and besides a nightly regular dose I still use it during the day whenever I feel myself getting stressed out and irritable. (Mine is probably not a typical reaction though.) If you don't eat much calcium rich food you might also add a bit of calcium. But if you eat a lot of such things as dairy, you might then be overloaded with calcium, and the magnesium will help balance that.
The next thing I'd recommend is niacinamide. Do a search on here and you'll see it mentioned often for anxiety. Vit B 1, thiamine, is also recommended for anxiety. Vit C also helps stress, is cheap and has a very short half life, so it can be taken it often.
Here's a recent thread you might find of interest: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/alter/20040928/msgs/403538.html
I had panic attacks many years go for a short time (until I had some effective therapy) but have certainly experienced a lot of anxiety in my day. I wish I knew years ago what I know now. :)
Keep hanging around here and you will pick up many good tips.
JL
> >Hi...tks for response.
>
> Do take Bs and Omega-3, but haven't added magnesium.> Do you mean a combo-B? The one I have sometimes gives me a bit of a headache; don't know why. I am a very slow metabolizer. Haven't been eating well...maybe could be why.
>
> Any good readings on 'alternative medicine for anxiety'? Actually, like to hear personal stories, here, better.
>
> Go to local health store and when mention anxiety ... could come out of there with $1000 worth of stuff; hard when already living on limited income.
>
> best wishes cf
>
> >
> > Do you already take magnesium and B vitamins? Omega-3?
> >
> > They won't be a quick fix, may take 4-6 weeks, but they seem to be some good basics for any type of nervous condition.
> >
> > JL
> >
> >
> > http://www.wholehealthmd.com/refshelf/substances_view/1,1525,890,00.html
> >
> > > I am suffering terribly w/ attacks w/o precipitating events, and even upon awakening. Do not recall dreams/nightmares.
> > >
> > > I am looking for something to take daily or at onset of a panic attack. I'm cannot take Xanax and Klonopin (which I do have) does not work.
> > >
> > > I hyperventilate, and have a back injury, so breathing exercises useless at these times.
> > >
> > > Can anyone share any experience/knowledge re: following list alternatives found researching Internet.
> > >
> > > TheraStress
> > > Becalm
> > > Euphorx
> > > Anxietol 7
> > > HerbVal Supra
> > > Prosera
> > > Clarocet NRI
> > > Amoryn
> > > Relora
> > > Pinadol
> > >
> > > Totally appreciate any feedback. Corafree
> >
> >
>
>
Posted by jujube on October 31, 2004, at 15:37:54
In reply to Re: Severe Panic Attacks Agoraphobia » corafree, posted by JLx on October 31, 2004, at 9:07:03
JL,
Question for you, if you don't mind. Is it also possible that chromium might also be a useful supplement? I ask because I had heard that it is useful in balancing blood sugar levels. I may be way off base here, but waking up with panic attacks/anxiety perhaps could be caused by a drop in blood sugar levels after the evening fast. I recently began taking 200 mg of chromium a couple of hours before bed, and I am finding that I am waking up a little less anxious. I had tried magnesium before bed, but woke up on night after taking 500 mg with the worst night terror I had had in a long time. Perhaps I took took much mag at once? Your views would be appreciated.
Thanks.
Tamara
> Hi Corafree,
>
> What I've learned about alternative med is that very rarely is there one or two things that substitute "this for that" for the drugs we used to take. Alt med really is holistic, most things work synergistically. Drugs treat the symptoms, while usually alt med addresses the causes of our symptoms.
>
> I mentioned magnesium because most people eating the typical Western diet are deficient, and because magnesium is involved in over 300 fundamental enzymatic functions of the body. It's especially implicated in stress. http://www.healthy.net/scr/column.asp?ColumnId=5&ID=74
>
> "Chronic stress depletes your body of magnesium. The more stressed you are, the greater the loss of magnesium. The lower your magnesium level to begin with, the more reactive to stress you become and the higher your level of adrenalin in stressful situations. Higher adrenalin causes greater loss of magnesium from cells. Administering magnesium as a nutritional supplement breaks this vicious cycle by raising blood magnesium levels and buffering the response to stress, building your resistance."
>
> I understand your concern about costs, as I have the same problem. But experience has taught me that products like "beCalmed" are something of a rip off. For one thing if they don't work, you're left not knowing which ingredient was the problem one. Here's what's in it:
>
> Each Capsule Contains:
> D/L-Phenylalanine 300 mg
> L-Glutamine 150 mg
> 5-HTP 5 mg
> Vitamin B6(pyridoxine HCL) 1 mg
> Calcium (chelate, citrate) 50 mg
> Magnesium (chelate, oxide) 25 mg
> Folic Acid 0.01 mg
>
> It MAY be possible that this is just the exact combination of these things that you need, but I am doubtful. Those are really low levels of B-6, calcium, magnesium and folate for instance, and they're NOT necessarily the best forms of those supplements. Magnesium oxide is very poorly absorbed, for example, and the preferred form of Vit B6 is pyridoxal-5-phosphate. You're paying mostly for the amino acids, D/L-Phenylalanine and L-Glutamine. While the glutamine may be calming, DLPA is not known for that. 5-HTP may be helpful, but again, that is a tiny amount.
>
> In my opinion, you'd be better off "bang for your buck" addressing the underlying stress response in your body first, as a panic attack is like an explosion of non-managed stress. It's not THE problem, it's a symptom of a body system problem. So, anything you can do to reduce stress from bubbling over like that will help.
>
> Your attacks upon awakening might be due to the fact that cortisol is naturally high in the morning, for instance. Cortisol may be increased in general from chronic stress and may be due to exhaustion of the adrenal glands. So, anything that supports the adrenal glands would help in the long run such as Vit. C and pantothenic acid. In general, for stress, avoiding caffeine, aspartame, smoking, a hypoglycemia-inducing diet or just sugar itself would probably help.
>
> Re supplements, if you said, "I only have x number of dollars to spend, what should I buy?". I would say magnesium first.
>
> "Some studies have shown that certain phobic disorders like agoraphobia are associated with lower levels of magnesium, and other kinds of nervous system instability may also be involved. One clear symptom of magnesium deficiency is hyperreflexia -- a kind of heightened startle reflex marked by sensitivity to noise and exaggerated reflex responses. In fact, one of the symptoms of magnesium overdose is the suppression of normal reflexes. So the idea is to keep the body supplied with the ideal levels of magnesium -- though deficiencies are the real concern. In our high-stress post-industrial environment, daily stresses and shocks may literally leach away the magnesium we need to maintain our neurological equilibrium." http://www.consciouschoice.com/holisticmd/hmd1205.html
>
> I'd recommend, magnesium glycinate, mg taurate, magnesium citrate, mag malate but NOT mag aspartate, mg glutamate or unless you want to mostly waste your money, mg oxide . Magnesium glycinate and magnesium taurate are both especially good for stress because they are both chelated with amino acids that are themselves calming. Mg citrate and mg malate are both good too and often easier to find (and not as expensive). Magnesium glycinate for me was like a magic bullet, I went off my meds (Zolof, Provigil) within 2 days, and besides a nightly regular dose I still use it during the day whenever I feel myself getting stressed out and irritable. (Mine is probably not a typical reaction though.) If you don't eat much calcium rich food you might also add a bit of calcium. But if you eat a lot of such things as dairy, you might then be overloaded with calcium, and the magnesium will help balance that.
>
> The next thing I'd recommend is niacinamide. Do a search on here and you'll see it mentioned often for anxiety. Vit B 1, thiamine, is also recommended for anxiety. Vit C also helps stress, is cheap and has a very short half life, so it can be taken it often.
>
> Here's a recent thread you might find of interest: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/alter/20040928/msgs/403538.html
>
> I had panic attacks many years go for a short time (until I had some effective therapy) but have certainly experienced a lot of anxiety in my day. I wish I knew years ago what I know now. :)
>
> Keep hanging around here and you will pick up many good tips.
>
> JL
>
> > >Hi...tks for response.
> >
> > Do take Bs and Omega-3, but haven't added magnesium.
>
> > Do you mean a combo-B? The one I have sometimes gives me a bit of a headache; don't know why. I am a very slow metabolizer. Haven't been eating well...maybe could be why.
> >
> > Any good readings on 'alternative medicine for anxiety'? Actually, like to hear personal stories, here, better.
> >
> > Go to local health store and when mention anxiety ... could come out of there with $1000 worth of stuff; hard when already living on limited income.
> >
> > best wishes cf
> >
> > >
> > > Do you already take magnesium and B vitamins? Omega-3?
> > >
> > > They won't be a quick fix, may take 4-6 weeks, but they seem to be some good basics for any type of nervous condition.
> > >
> > > JL
> > >
> > >
> > > http://www.wholehealthmd.com/refshelf/substances_view/1,1525,890,00.html
> > >
> > > > I am suffering terribly w/ attacks w/o precipitating events, and even upon awakening. Do not recall dreams/nightmares.
> > > >
> > > > I am looking for something to take daily or at onset of a panic attack. I'm cannot take Xanax and Klonopin (which I do have) does not work.
> > > >
> > > > I hyperventilate, and have a back injury, so breathing exercises useless at these times.
> > > >
> > > > Can anyone share any experience/knowledge re: following list alternatives found researching Internet.
> > > >
> > > > TheraStress
> > > > Becalm
> > > > Euphorx
> > > > Anxietol 7
> > > > HerbVal Supra
> > > > Prosera
> > > > Clarocet NRI
> > > > Amoryn
> > > > Relora
> > > > Pinadol
> > > >
> > > > Totally appreciate any feedback. Corafree
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Posted by JLx on October 31, 2004, at 16:53:48
In reply to Re: Severe Panic Attacks Agoraphobia » JLx, posted by jujube on October 31, 2004, at 15:37:54
> JL,
>
> Question for you, if you don't mind. Is it also possible that chromium might also be a useful supplement? I ask because I had heard that it is useful in balancing blood sugar levels. I may be way off base here, but waking up with panic attacks/anxiety perhaps could be caused by a drop in blood sugar levels after the evening fast. I recently began taking 200 mg of chromium a couple of hours before bed, and I am finding that I am waking up a little less anxious. I had tried magnesium before bed, but woke up on night after taking 500 mg with the worst night terror I had had in a long time. Perhaps I took took much mag at once? Your views would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks.
>
> TamaraThat's a good idea! I think I will try it myself. More and more I'm convinced that blood sugar, insulin and the whole hypoglycemia thing has a major impact on mental/emotional issues.
It's hard to say about the magnesium and night terrors. I remember you saying that on that other thread. I suspect the magnesium is affecting some other action, increasing something, throwing something else out of balance. Now that Larry's back, maybe it's worth asking him. Otherwise, I'd try taking less and also try adding some calcium. I take 500 mg of magnesium at night now and I take about 100 mg of calcium too. I'm sensitive to calcium or I would probably take more.
JL
Posted by jujube on October 31, 2004, at 17:09:44
In reply to Re: Severe Panic Attacks Agoraphobia » jujube, posted by JLx on October 31, 2004, at 16:53:48
> > JL,
> >
> > Question for you, if you don't mind. Is it also possible that chromium might also be a useful supplement? I ask because I had heard that it is useful in balancing blood sugar levels. I may be way off base here, but waking up with panic attacks/anxiety perhaps could be caused by a drop in blood sugar levels after the evening fast. I recently began taking 200 mg of chromium a couple of hours before bed, and I am finding that I am waking up a little less anxious. I had tried magnesium before bed, but woke up on night after taking 500 mg with the worst night terror I had had in a long time. Perhaps I took took much mag at once? Your views would be appreciated.
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Tamara
>
> That's a good idea! I think I will try it myself. More and more I'm convinced that blood sugar, insulin and the whole hypoglycemia thing has a major impact on mental/emotional issues.
>
> It's hard to say about the magnesium and night terrors. I remember you saying that on that other thread. I suspect the magnesium is affecting some other action, increasing something, throwing something else out of balance. Now that Larry's back, maybe it's worth asking him. Otherwise, I'd try taking less and also try adding some calcium. I take 500 mg of magnesium at night now and I take about 100 mg of calcium too. I'm sensitive to calcium or I would probably take more.
>
> JL
Thanks JL. I think I will try the magnesium again, but at a lower dose this time. As for the calcium, I may consider adding a small dose. However, a few months ago when I had blood work done (I was being treated for iron deficiency at the time), it showed my calcium levels as being slightly elevated. I do eat a lot of yogurt and cheese, so maybe I don't need extra calcium.Tamara
Posted by corafree on October 31, 2004, at 18:08:33
In reply to Re: Severe Panic Attacks Agoraphobia » JLx, posted by jujube on October 31, 2004, at 15:37:54
JLx & jujube:
Thanks so much for the sharing. I really want to stay away from benzo. My printer isn't workin', so since can't keep all info in mind for any period of time, have saved to print out when get new cartridge.
Oh how I would love to see a holistic doc', but NOT. Your experiences are like a guide that one may/may not give me, but they come from your heart, I know, and that's better than from anywhere. Be well, as I will try cf
> JL,
>
> Question for you, if you don't mind. Is it also possible that chromium might also be a useful supplement? I ask because I had heard that it is useful in balancing blood sugar levels. I may be way off base here, but waking up with panic attacks/anxiety perhaps could be caused by a drop in blood sugar levels after the evening fast. I recently began taking 200 mg of chromium a couple of hours before bed, and I am finding that I am waking up a little less anxious. I had tried magnesium before bed, but woke up on night after taking 500 mg with the worst night terror I had had in a long time. Perhaps I took took much mag at once? Your views would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Tamara
>
> > Hi Corafree,
> >
> > What I've learned about alternative med is that very rarely is there one or two things that substitute "this for that" for the drugs we used to take. Alt med really is holistic, most things work synergistically. Drugs treat the symptoms, while usually alt med addresses the causes of our symptoms.
> >
> > I mentioned magnesium because most people eating the typical Western diet are deficient, and because magnesium is involved in over 300 fundamental enzymatic functions of the body. It's especially implicated in stress. http://www.healthy.net/scr/column.asp?ColumnId=5&ID=74
> >
> > "Chronic stress depletes your body of magnesium. The more stressed you are, the greater the loss of magnesium. The lower your magnesium level to begin with, the more reactive to stress you become and the higher your level of adrenalin in stressful situations. Higher adrenalin causes greater loss of magnesium from cells. Administering magnesium as a nutritional supplement breaks this vicious cycle by raising blood magnesium levels and buffering the response to stress, building your resistance."
> >
> > I understand your concern about costs, as I have the same problem. But experience has taught me that products like "beCalmed" are something of a rip off. For one thing if they don't work, you're left not knowing which ingredient was the problem one. Here's what's in it:
> >
> > Each Capsule Contains:
> > D/L-Phenylalanine 300 mg
> > L-Glutamine 150 mg
> > 5-HTP 5 mg
> > Vitamin B6(pyridoxine HCL) 1 mg
> > Calcium (chelate, citrate) 50 mg
> > Magnesium (chelate, oxide) 25 mg
> > Folic Acid 0.01 mg
> >
> > It MAY be possible that this is just the exact combination of these things that you need, but I am doubtful. Those are really low levels of B-6, calcium, magnesium and folate for instance, and they're NOT necessarily the best forms of those supplements. Magnesium oxide is very poorly absorbed, for example, and the preferred form of Vit B6 is pyridoxal-5-phosphate. You're paying mostly for the amino acids, D/L-Phenylalanine and L-Glutamine. While the glutamine may be calming, DLPA is not known for that. 5-HTP may be helpful, but again, that is a tiny amount.
> >
> > In my opinion, you'd be better off "bang for your buck" addressing the underlying stress response in your body first, as a panic attack is like an explosion of non-managed stress. It's not THE problem, it's a symptom of a body system problem. So, anything you can do to reduce stress from bubbling over like that will help.
> >
> > Your attacks upon awakening might be due to the fact that cortisol is naturally high in the morning, for instance. Cortisol may be increased in general from chronic stress and may be due to exhaustion of the adrenal glands. So, anything that supports the adrenal glands would help in the long run such as Vit. C and pantothenic acid. In general, for stress, avoiding caffeine, aspartame, smoking, a hypoglycemia-inducing diet or just sugar itself would probably help.
> >
> > Re supplements, if you said, "I only have x number of dollars to spend, what should I buy?". I would say magnesium first.
> >
> > "Some studies have shown that certain phobic disorders like agoraphobia are associated with lower levels of magnesium, and other kinds of nervous system instability may also be involved. One clear symptom of magnesium deficiency is hyperreflexia -- a kind of heightened startle reflex marked by sensitivity to noise and exaggerated reflex responses. In fact, one of the symptoms of magnesium overdose is the suppression of normal reflexes. So the idea is to keep the body supplied with the ideal levels of magnesium -- though deficiencies are the real concern. In our high-stress post-industrial environment, daily stresses and shocks may literally leach away the magnesium we need to maintain our neurological equilibrium." http://www.consciouschoice.com/holisticmd/hmd1205.html
> >
> > I'd recommend, magnesium glycinate, mg taurate, magnesium citrate, mag malate but NOT mag aspartate, mg glutamate or unless you want to mostly waste your money, mg oxide . Magnesium glycinate and magnesium taurate are both especially good for stress because they are both chelated with amino acids that are themselves calming. Mg citrate and mg malate are both good too and often easier to find (and not as expensive). Magnesium glycinate for me was like a magic bullet, I went off my meds (Zolof, Provigil) within 2 days, and besides a nightly regular dose I still use it during the day whenever I feel myself getting stressed out and irritable. (Mine is probably not a typical reaction though.) If you don't eat much calcium rich food you might also add a bit of calcium. But if you eat a lot of such things as dairy, you might then be overloaded with calcium, and the magnesium will help balance that.
> >
> > The next thing I'd recommend is niacinamide. Do a search on here and you'll see it mentioned often for anxiety. Vit B 1, thiamine, is also recommended for anxiety. Vit C also helps stress, is cheap and has a very short half life, so it can be taken it often.
> >
> > Here's a recent thread you might find of interest: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/alter/20040928/msgs/403538.html
> >
> > I had panic attacks many years go for a short time (until I had some effective therapy) but have certainly experienced a lot of anxiety in my day. I wish I knew years ago what I know now. :)
> >
> > Keep hanging around here and you will pick up many good tips.
> >
> > JL
> >
> > > >Hi...tks for response.
> > >
> > > Do take Bs and Omega-3, but haven't added magnesium.
> >
> > > Do you mean a combo-B? The one I have sometimes gives me a bit of a headache; don't know why. I am a very slow metabolizer. Haven't been eating well...maybe could be why.
> > >
> > > Any good readings on 'alternative medicine for anxiety'? Actually, like to hear personal stories, here, better.
> > >
> > > Go to local health store and when mention anxiety ... could come out of there with $1000 worth of stuff; hard when already living on limited income.
> > >
> > > best wishes cf
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Do you already take magnesium and B vitamins? Omega-3?
> > > >
> > > > They won't be a quick fix, may take 4-6 weeks, but they seem to be some good basics for any type of nervous condition.
> > > >
> > > > JL
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > http://www.wholehealthmd.com/refshelf/substances_view/1,1525,890,00.html
> > > >
> > > > > I am suffering terribly w/ attacks w/o precipitating events, and even upon awakening. Do not recall dreams/nightmares.
> > > > >
> > > > > I am looking for something to take daily or at onset of a panic attack. I'm cannot take Xanax and Klonopin (which I do have) does not work.
> > > > >
> > > > > I hyperventilate, and have a back injury, so breathing exercises useless at these times.
> > > > >
> > > > > Can anyone share any experience/knowledge re: following list alternatives found researching Internet.
> > > > >
> > > > > TheraStress
> > > > > Becalm
> > > > > Euphorx
> > > > > Anxietol 7
> > > > > HerbVal Supra
> > > > > Prosera
> > > > > Clarocet NRI
> > > > > Amoryn
> > > > > Relora
> > > > > Pinadol
> > > > >
> > > > > Totally appreciate any feedback. Corafree
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Posted by jujube on October 31, 2004, at 18:23:45
In reply to Re: Severe Panic Attacks Agoraphobia » jujube, posted by corafree on October 31, 2004, at 18:08:33
Corafree,
I know how frightening and debilitating anxiety and panic can be. And, once we get caught up in the cycle again (panic/anxiety - fear of next attack), it is hard to break the cycle. The worst thing is that you can be free of it for years, and then it just kind of creeps back into your life. My initial bouts of anxiety/panic were actually caused by situational (I don't know if that is the right term) hypoglycemia. I was quite the caffeine addict, plus I used daily over-the-counter sinus medication which contained a stimulant and I was drinking quite heavily. The caffeine and the stimulant suppressed my appetite, so I didn't eat sometimes all day and would be very active during the day. My body would then react. My doctor told me that these types of blood sugar drops mimic panic/anxiety (she is also a panic sufferer). So, she told me that when I get that anxious/panicky feeling to first eat a little something like nuts, cheese with crackers, peanut butter with celery and see if the feelings pass. This often helps. She does the same thing. Sometimes its just our blood sugar sending us a message, and it can be a very strong and angry message. Now, I always carry a little bag of unsalted almonds or those handy packs of cheese and crackers with me in my purse just for emergencies.
I hope you find relieve soon.
Tamara
> JLx & jujube:
>
> Thanks so much for the sharing. I really want to stay away from benzo. My printer isn't workin', so since can't keep all info in mind for any period of time, have saved to print out when get new cartridge.
>
> Oh how I would love to see a holistic doc', but NOT. Your experiences are like a guide that one may/may not give me, but they come from your heart, I know, and that's better than from anywhere. Be well, as I will try cf
>
> > JL,
> >
> > Question for you, if you don't mind. Is it also possible that chromium might also be a useful supplement? I ask because I had heard that it is useful in balancing blood sugar levels. I may be way off base here, but waking up with panic attacks/anxiety perhaps could be caused by a drop in blood sugar levels after the evening fast. I recently began taking 200 mg of chromium a couple of hours before bed, and I am finding that I am waking up a little less anxious. I had tried magnesium before bed, but woke up on night after taking 500 mg with the worst night terror I had had in a long time. Perhaps I took took much mag at once? Your views would be appreciated.
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Tamara
> >
> > > Hi Corafree,
> > >
> > > What I've learned about alternative med is that very rarely is there one or two things that substitute "this for that" for the drugs we used to take. Alt med really is holistic, most things work synergistically. Drugs treat the symptoms, while usually alt med addresses the causes of our symptoms.
> > >
> > > I mentioned magnesium because most people eating the typical Western diet are deficient, and because magnesium is involved in over 300 fundamental enzymatic functions of the body. It's especially implicated in stress. http://www.healthy.net/scr/column.asp?ColumnId=5&ID=74
> > >
> > > "Chronic stress depletes your body of magnesium. The more stressed you are, the greater the loss of magnesium. The lower your magnesium level to begin with, the more reactive to stress you become and the higher your level of adrenalin in stressful situations. Higher adrenalin causes greater loss of magnesium from cells. Administering magnesium as a nutritional supplement breaks this vicious cycle by raising blood magnesium levels and buffering the response to stress, building your resistance."
> > >
> > > I understand your concern about costs, as I have the same problem. But experience has taught me that products like "beCalmed" are something of a rip off. For one thing if they don't work, you're left not knowing which ingredient was the problem one. Here's what's in it:
> > >
> > > Each Capsule Contains:
> > > D/L-Phenylalanine 300 mg
> > > L-Glutamine 150 mg
> > > 5-HTP 5 mg
> > > Vitamin B6(pyridoxine HCL) 1 mg
> > > Calcium (chelate, citrate) 50 mg
> > > Magnesium (chelate, oxide) 25 mg
> > > Folic Acid 0.01 mg
> > >
> > > It MAY be possible that this is just the exact combination of these things that you need, but I am doubtful. Those are really low levels of B-6, calcium, magnesium and folate for instance, and they're NOT necessarily the best forms of those supplements. Magnesium oxide is very poorly absorbed, for example, and the preferred form of Vit B6 is pyridoxal-5-phosphate. You're paying mostly for the amino acids, D/L-Phenylalanine and L-Glutamine. While the glutamine may be calming, DLPA is not known for that. 5-HTP may be helpful, but again, that is a tiny amount.
> > >
> > > In my opinion, you'd be better off "bang for your buck" addressing the underlying stress response in your body first, as a panic attack is like an explosion of non-managed stress. It's not THE problem, it's a symptom of a body system problem. So, anything you can do to reduce stress from bubbling over like that will help.
> > >
> > > Your attacks upon awakening might be due to the fact that cortisol is naturally high in the morning, for instance. Cortisol may be increased in general from chronic stress and may be due to exhaustion of the adrenal glands. So, anything that supports the adrenal glands would help in the long run such as Vit. C and pantothenic acid. In general, for stress, avoiding caffeine, aspartame, smoking, a hypoglycemia-inducing diet or just sugar itself would probably help.
> > >
> > > Re supplements, if you said, "I only have x number of dollars to spend, what should I buy?". I would say magnesium first.
> > >
> > > "Some studies have shown that certain phobic disorders like agoraphobia are associated with lower levels of magnesium, and other kinds of nervous system instability may also be involved. One clear symptom of magnesium deficiency is hyperreflexia -- a kind of heightened startle reflex marked by sensitivity to noise and exaggerated reflex responses. In fact, one of the symptoms of magnesium overdose is the suppression of normal reflexes. So the idea is to keep the body supplied with the ideal levels of magnesium -- though deficiencies are the real concern. In our high-stress post-industrial environment, daily stresses and shocks may literally leach away the magnesium we need to maintain our neurological equilibrium." http://www.consciouschoice.com/holisticmd/hmd1205.html
> > >
> > > I'd recommend, magnesium glycinate, mg taurate, magnesium citrate, mag malate but NOT mag aspartate, mg glutamate or unless you want to mostly waste your money, mg oxide . Magnesium glycinate and magnesium taurate are both especially good for stress because they are both chelated with amino acids that are themselves calming. Mg citrate and mg malate are both good too and often easier to find (and not as expensive). Magnesium glycinate for me was like a magic bullet, I went off my meds (Zolof, Provigil) within 2 days, and besides a nightly regular dose I still use it during the day whenever I feel myself getting stressed out and irritable. (Mine is probably not a typical reaction though.) If you don't eat much calcium rich food you might also add a bit of calcium. But if you eat a lot of such things as dairy, you might then be overloaded with calcium, and the magnesium will help balance that.
> > >
> > > The next thing I'd recommend is niacinamide. Do a search on here and you'll see it mentioned often for anxiety. Vit B 1, thiamine, is also recommended for anxiety. Vit C also helps stress, is cheap and has a very short half life, so it can be taken it often.
> > >
> > > Here's a recent thread you might find of interest: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/alter/20040928/msgs/403538.html
> > >
> > > I had panic attacks many years go for a short time (until I had some effective therapy) but have certainly experienced a lot of anxiety in my day. I wish I knew years ago what I know now. :)
> > >
> > > Keep hanging around here and you will pick up many good tips.
> > >
> > > JL
> > >
> > > > >Hi...tks for response.
> > > >
> > > > Do take Bs and Omega-3, but haven't added magnesium.
> > >
> > > > Do you mean a combo-B? The one I have sometimes gives me a bit of a headache; don't know why. I am a very slow metabolizer. Haven't been eating well...maybe could be why.
> > > >
> > > > Any good readings on 'alternative medicine for anxiety'? Actually, like to hear personal stories, here, better.
> > > >
> > > > Go to local health store and when mention anxiety ... could come out of there with $1000 worth of stuff; hard when already living on limited income.
> > > >
> > > > best wishes cf
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Do you already take magnesium and B vitamins? Omega-3?
> > > > >
> > > > > They won't be a quick fix, may take 4-6 weeks, but they seem to be some good basics for any type of nervous condition.
> > > > >
> > > > > JL
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > http://www.wholehealthmd.com/refshelf/substances_view/1,1525,890,00.html
> > > > >
> > > > > > I am suffering terribly w/ attacks w/o precipitating events, and even upon awakening. Do not recall dreams/nightmares.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I am looking for something to take daily or at onset of a panic attack. I'm cannot take Xanax and Klonopin (which I do have) does not work.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I hyperventilate, and have a back injury, so breathing exercises useless at these times.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Can anyone share any experience/knowledge re: following list alternatives found researching Internet.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > TheraStress
> > > > > > Becalm
> > > > > > Euphorx
> > > > > > Anxietol 7
> > > > > > HerbVal Supra
> > > > > > Prosera
> > > > > > Clarocet NRI
> > > > > > Amoryn
> > > > > > Relora
> > > > > > Pinadol
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Totally appreciate any feedback. Corafree
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Posted by sabre on November 1, 2004, at 0:13:26
In reply to Re: Severe Panic Attacks Agoraphobia » jujube, posted by corafree on October 31, 2004, at 18:08:33
Hello JL
I can relate to the startled rabbit syndrome... jumping at the slightest provocation. You mentioned that Magnesium helps. I have some Mg carbonate. How does it rate compared to the other forms of Mg?
Your information is v.useful and interesting. Thanks
sabre
Posted by JLx on November 1, 2004, at 7:45:38
In reply to Re: Severe Panic Attacks Agoraphobia, posted by sabre on November 1, 2004, at 0:13:26
> Hello JL
>
> I can relate to the startled rabbit syndrome... jumping at the slightest provocation. You mentioned that Magnesium helps. I have some Mg carbonate. How does it rate compared to the other forms of Mg?
>
> Your information is v.useful and interesting. Thanks
>
> sabreHi Sabre,
Yes, that's interesting about the startle response, isn't it? I wish I'd known that might signal a magnesium deficiency years ago. I recall being that way around the time I was having anxiety attacks, and again when I was diagnosed with PTSD years later. Over sensitivity to sound is another one.
"Magnesium chelated with amino acids is probably the most absorbable form. Less absorbable forms include magnesium bicarbonate, magnesium oxide, and magnesium carbonate. Magnesium oxide is probably somewhat better than magnesium carbonate (dolomite). The newly available salts of magnesium aspartate or citrate, both known as mineral transporters, have a better percentage of absorption." http://www.healthy.net/scr/article.asp?ID=2060
Since we know from info that Larry has posted on here before that mg oxide is very poorly absorbed, that means mg carbonate is really pretty useless. I would definitely try something else (but not aspartate or glutamate). According to George Eby, of this website, http://www.coldcure.com/html/dep.html, Rapid Recovery From Depression Using Magnesium Treatment, mg aspartate and mg glutamate are contraindicated for depressive conditions as they are excitatory. It was Eby's site that first clued me in to magnesium. I don't take everything he says as gospel, but he's more often right than wrong in my experience and I trust him on that one.
Elson M. Haas M.D. in that link referenced above says,
"Calcium and magnesium are both alkaline minerals, so they are not taken with or after meals, as they can reduce stomach acid as well as being absorbed poorly when taken with food. They are absorbed better when taken between meals or on an empty stomach, especially with a little vitamin C as ascorbic acid. Many calcium-magnesium combinations are formulated with hydrochloric acid and vitamin D to aid the mineral absorption. And taking them before bedtime may be very helpful in increasing utilization of both these important minerals and lead to a sleep-filled night."
That is good info that contradicts what you usually hear but is also what Carolyn Dean, M.D. says in "The Miracle of Magnesium" (which I have read).
I currently take magnesium glycinate and mg malate as mg citrate was likely to give me diarrhea. I'm going to next try mg taurate (which is what Eby recommends these days) as the price has just come down a lot. It's at Vitamin Shoppe (and also at Amazon) for $7.17 a bottle, it used to be $11.95, as 60 tablets of 125 mg.
JL
Posted by JLx on November 1, 2004, at 9:06:41
In reply to Re: Severe Panic Attacks Agoraphobia » JLx, posted by jujube on October 31, 2004, at 17:09:44
> Thanks JL. I think I will try the magnesium again, but at a lower dose this time. As for the calcium, I may consider adding a small dose. However, a few months ago when I had blood work done (I was being treated for iron deficiency at the time), it showed my calcium levels as being slightly elevated. I do eat a lot of yogurt and cheese, so maybe I don't need extra calcium.
>
> TamaraSure, most likely not.
I'm always trying to understand the calcium/magnesium thing. My understanding is that if you take/eat too much of each and not enough of the other, you perversely don't even get enough of the one you're taking too much of. If you follow.... :)
I suspect that I wasn't actually getting much calcium for years despite my high calcium diet because I was getting so little magnesium (and a lot of phosphorus). Then I went the opposite direction. Now I'm trying to figure out the happy medium, while also still being sensitive to calcium supplementation (it makes me irritable). Dietary calcium doesn't have the same effect on me although I've cut dairy products out almost entirely. (I'm very suspceptible to the casomorphin thing, I think, as they're very addictive for me.)
Did your doctor tell you why your blood calcium was high? Was the high calcium causing your iron deficiency? (I've read that it interferes with iron absorption.)
Btw, I took some chromium last night, and although my dog woke me up once and I woke up again later briefly for no reason, I slept more hours overall. So, thanks. I'm going to keep trying it. Did you know that cinnamon lowers blood sugar? WebMD even had an article about it, but this is a better one: http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=68
JL
Posted by jujube on November 1, 2004, at 9:41:39
In reply to Re: Magnesium/calcium/chromium » jujube, posted by JLx on November 1, 2004, at 9:06:41
> > Thanks JL. I think I will try the magnesium again, but at a lower dose this time. As for the calcium, I may consider adding a small dose. However, a few months ago when I had blood work done (I was being treated for iron deficiency at the time), it showed my calcium levels as being slightly elevated. I do eat a lot of yogurt and cheese, so maybe I don't need extra calcium.
> >
> > Tamara
>
> Sure, most likely not.
>
> I'm always trying to understand the calcium/magnesium thing. My understanding is that if you take/eat too much of each and not enough of the other, you perversely don't even get enough of the one you're taking too much of. If you follow.... :)
>
> I suspect that I wasn't actually getting much calcium for years despite my high calcium diet because I was getting so little magnesium (and a lot of phosphorus). Then I went the opposite direction. Now I'm trying to figure out the happy medium, while also still being sensitive to calcium supplementation (it makes me irritable). Dietary calcium doesn't have the same effect on me although I've cut dairy products out almost entirely. (I'm very suspceptible to the casomorphin thing, I think, as they're very addictive for me.)
>
> Did your doctor tell you why your blood calcium was high? Was the high calcium causing your iron deficiency? (I've read that it interferes with iron absorption.)
>
> Btw, I took some chromium last night, and although my dog woke me up once and I woke up again later briefly for no reason, I slept more hours overall. So, thanks. I'm going to keep trying it. Did you know that cinnamon lowers blood sugar? WebMD even had an article about it, but this is a better one: http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=68
>
> JLThanks JL. The slightly elevated calcium levels were actually detected by the gastrointerologist I was seeing (it was thought that I may have had a malabsorption problem because I was not responding to the months of iron supplementation to correct the iron deficiency). When I told my gp about the elevated calcium level, she immediately did some tests (parathyroid and another I think). All was normal, so it may have just been a blip. From what I have read, high calcium (hypercalcemia) can cause a whole host of problems (anxiety, depression . . .).
As for the chromium, when I first starting supplementing, I tried taking it during the day for a few days as well as at night, but daytime dose seemed to make feel fatigues. So, now I only take about 200 - 300 mg just before bed. I was not aware that cinnamon lowered blood sugar levels. Thanks, its something to keep in mind. I think the chromium works differently in that it regulates blood sugar. So, I would think that it would probably be suitable for those with high or low blood sugar. I am beginning to think that some of my problems may be blood sugar related, although a glucose tolerance test did not indicate diabetes or hypoglycemia. Even though I eat a good, well-balanced meal in the evening and try to eat well during the day, I wake up in the morning feeling anxious and like I haven't eaten for days. That feeling is lessening since I added the chromium about a week ago. The other thing about chromium is that it is supposed to reduce carb cravings and help with weight loss (at least that is what I have read - who knows).
With respect to magnesium, I had been using oxide (in some of my readings I had read that you get more elemental mag from oxide, but that other forms are more bioavailable). I think I will switch to a different form. What do you think of Magnesium Taurate or Magnesium chelate? Would I be getting more bang for my buck if I tried either of those?
I am just in the process of educating myself about the use and benefits of vitamins, minerals and supplements above the RDA values. I am glad to have found this board to further educate myself and to share experiences and successes.
Thanks again, and take care.
Tamara
Posted by JLx on November 1, 2004, at 11:16:15
In reply to Re: Magnesium/calcium/chromium » JLx, posted by jujube on November 1, 2004, at 9:41:39
> Thanks JL. The slightly elevated calcium levels were actually detected by the gastrointerologist I was seeing (it was thought that I may have had a malabsorption problem because I was not responding to the months of iron supplementation to correct the iron deficiency). When I told my gp about the elevated calcium level, she immediately did some tests (parathyroid and another I think). All was normal, so it may have just been a blip. From what I have read, high calcium (hypercalcemia) can cause a whole host of problems (anxiety, depression . . .).Well, that's good it's not your parathyroid or something serious. I think too much calcium and/or not enough magnesium is an overlooked factor in many people's (especially women since we're often supplementing) depression and anxiety symptoms. Calcium can be excitotoxic to the brain in high doses. And perhaps for some of us what's a "high dose" is less than we've been lead to believe. I used to have suicide ideation quite often, for many years, sometimes was symptomatic of my deepest depression and sometimes didn't seem related to terrible depression. Since I've been taking magnesium (and cut way, way down on calcium foods) I have not been suicidal at all -- in 2 1/2 years now. That's something like a miracle to me.
> As for the chromium, when I first starting supplementing, I tried taking it during the day for a few days as well as at night, but daytime dose seemed to make feel fatigues. So, now I only take about 200 - 300 mg just before bed.Hmm...interesting. I've been taking it with meals but maybe now I will only take it later in the day.
> I was not aware that cinnamon lowered blood sugar levels. Thanks, its something to keep in mind.
I mix it up with applesause, very heavy on the cinammon and have a spoonful to end meals. It's also good for digestion, I think. And it warms you up a little. Nice in the winter where I live (Michigan).
>I think the chromium works differently in that it regulates blood sugar. So, I would think that it would probably be suitable for those with high or low blood sugar. I am beginning to think that some of my problems may be blood sugar related, although a glucose tolerance test did not indicate diabetes or hypoglycemia. Even though I eat a good, well-balanced meal in the evening and try to eat well during the day, I wake up in the morning feeling anxious and like I haven't eaten for days. That feeling is lessening since I added the chromium about a week ago. The other thing about chromium is that it is supposed to reduce carb cravings and help with weight loss (at least that is what I have read - who knows).
I've read that too but haven't noticed it especially myself. I, too, think that hypoglycemia has a big part to play in depression and anxiety. An interesting site I've run across just lately is this Australian one: http://www.hypoglycemia.asn.au/index.html
If I am remembering your correctly, you said something recently about quitting smoking? Joan Matthews Larson's "Depression Free Naturally" is one I liked and I consult her website sometimes to refresh my memory. She has an article on her site http://www.healthrecovery.com/ that recommends Alka-Selzter Gold to help smoker's quit. This was so unusual that it stuck in my head. :) She also says this:
"Glutamine: Did you know that cigarettes are up to 75 percent sugar? Tobacco is cured with beet, corn, and cane sugars. A long as these sugars are entering their bloodstreams with any regularity, hypoglycemic smokers won't be able to bring the blood sugar under control. Glutamine, an alternative source glucose, can alleviate hypoglycemic reactions among smokers.
Zinc: Smokers are usually deficient in zinc because the body uses a lot of it to remove the buildup of cadmium, a metal contained in cigarette papers (it makes them white). Increase your total zinc intake to fifty milligrams per day for six weeks."
I've taken glutamine with some success, but only at lower doses. When I went over 1500 in one day, I felt terrible. I think it must have been converting to glutamic acid instead of GABA.
> With respect to magnesium, I had been using oxide (in some of my readings I had read that you get more elemental mag from oxide, but that other forms are more bioavailable). I think I will switch to a different form. What do you think of Magnesium Taurate or Magnesium chelate? Would I be getting more bang for my buck if I tried either of those?
Oh, definitely, but watch out for anything that just says "magnesium chelate" because the question is, chelated with what? If it doesn't say, I wouldn't take it. Magnesium taurate and magnesium glycinate are chelated with the amino acids taurine and glycine, for instance. Taurate is supposed to be good, haven't tried it myself yet. Mg citrate is good too, as is mg malate. I suggest you experiment, see which ones feel good and which might be more or less apt to induce diarrhea. (That's citrate for me.) Mg malate is the one that is specifically recommended for fibromyalgia and CFS too, I believe. I take it and like it. It's less sedating/calming in my experience than mg glycinate.
> I am just in the process of educating myself about the use and benefits of vitamins, minerals and supplements above the RDA values. I am glad to have found this board to further educate myself and to share experiences and successes.
>
> Thanks again, and take care.
>
> TamaraYes, indeed, lots of good info and people hanging around here. :) I learn a lot. It helps keep my motivated too to not slack off on my supplementing.
JL
Posted by jujube on November 1, 2004, at 11:45:49
In reply to Re: Magnesium/calcium/chromium » jujube, posted by JLx on November 1, 2004, at 11:16:15
> I'm glad to hear the magnesium supplementation has had such a positive effect on you. It's nice to find something, particularly when it is natural, that provides relief.
I had also read that chromium may help with anxiety (must be the blood sugar thing). Anyways, I will keep taking it before bed, and may try again in the morning. One site I visited (The Way Up) actually suggested taking the chromium in the morning upon rising.
Another thing that is good for digestion is ginger. A friend of mine used to experience severe nausea on a regular basis. I always had ginger tea on hand (I took it for cold symptoms), and gave her some one day. It helped her nausea a lot, and she continued to use the ginger tea when nausea struck. Apparently, ginger is used as a natural remedy for sea sickness. I got my mom drinking ginger tea as well, and it has helped her digestive problems.
I do intend to quit smoking, and will probably feel a whole lot better when I do. I have not yet visited Joan Larson's site, but I will. I have heard a lot of good things about her approaches. I had not heard about the Alka Selzer remedy. Might be worth a try. I seem to recall reading something about baking soda being helpful for nicotine withdrawal. Perhaps its the bicorbonate that helps in some way. Interesting. I certainly didn't know that cigs had so much sugar in them. I was aware that Glutamine was good for blood sugar and helping with addictions. Actually, I took Glutamine for a brief period and found that my cravings for cigs were greatly reduced. Maybe something to try again, particuarly when I muster up the mental and emotional fortitude to quit.
Thanks again. I will certainly be checking out the websites you recommended. Have a good day.
Tamara
> > Thanks JL. The slightly elevated calcium levels were actually detected by the gastrointerologist I was seeing (it was thought that I may have had a malabsorption problem because I was not responding to the months of iron supplementation to correct the iron deficiency). When I told my gp about the elevated calcium level, she immediately did some tests (parathyroid and another I think). All was normal, so it may have just been a blip. From what I have read, high calcium (hypercalcemia) can cause a whole host of problems (anxiety, depression . . .).
>
> Well, that's good it's not your parathyroid or something serious. I think too much calcium and/or not enough magnesium is an overlooked factor in many people's (especially women since we're often supplementing) depression and anxiety symptoms. Calcium can be excitotoxic to the brain in high doses. And perhaps for some of us what's a "high dose" is less than we've been lead to believe. I used to have suicide ideation quite often, for many years, sometimes was symptomatic of my deepest depression and sometimes didn't seem related to terrible depression. Since I've been taking magnesium (and cut way, way down on calcium foods) I have not been suicidal at all -- in 2 1/2 years now. That's something like a miracle to me.
>
> > As for the chromium, when I first starting supplementing, I tried taking it during the day for a few days as well as at night, but daytime dose seemed to make feel fatigues. So, now I only take about 200 - 300 mg just before bed.
>
> Hmm...interesting. I've been taking it with meals but maybe now I will only take it later in the day.
>
> > I was not aware that cinnamon lowered blood sugar levels. Thanks, its something to keep in mind.
>
> I mix it up with applesause, very heavy on the cinammon and have a spoonful to end meals. It's also good for digestion, I think. And it warms you up a little. Nice in the winter where I live (Michigan).
>
> >I think the chromium works differently in that it regulates blood sugar. So, I would think that it would probably be suitable for those with high or low blood sugar. I am beginning to think that some of my problems may be blood sugar related, although a glucose tolerance test did not indicate diabetes or hypoglycemia. Even though I eat a good, well-balanced meal in the evening and try to eat well during the day, I wake up in the morning feeling anxious and like I haven't eaten for days. That feeling is lessening since I added the chromium about a week ago. The other thing about chromium is that it is supposed to reduce carb cravings and help with weight loss (at least that is what I have read - who knows).
>
> I've read that too but haven't noticed it especially myself. I, too, think that hypoglycemia has a big part to play in depression and anxiety. An interesting site I've run across just lately is this Australian one: http://www.hypoglycemia.asn.au/index.html
>
> If I am remembering your correctly, you said something recently about quitting smoking? Joan Matthews Larson's "Depression Free Naturally" is one I liked and I consult her website sometimes to refresh my memory. She has an article on her site http://www.healthrecovery.com/ that recommends Alka-Selzter Gold to help smoker's quit. This was so unusual that it stuck in my head. :) She also says this:
>
> "Glutamine: Did you know that cigarettes are up to 75 percent sugar? Tobacco is cured with beet, corn, and cane sugars. A long as these sugars are entering their bloodstreams with any regularity, hypoglycemic smokers won't be able to bring the blood sugar under control. Glutamine, an alternative source glucose, can alleviate hypoglycemic reactions among smokers.
>
> Zinc: Smokers are usually deficient in zinc because the body uses a lot of it to remove the buildup of cadmium, a metal contained in cigarette papers (it makes them white). Increase your total zinc intake to fifty milligrams per day for six weeks."
>
> I've taken glutamine with some success, but only at lower doses. When I went over 1500 in one day, I felt terrible. I think it must have been converting to glutamic acid instead of GABA.
>
> > With respect to magnesium, I had been using oxide (in some of my readings I had read that you get more elemental mag from oxide, but that other forms are more bioavailable). I think I will switch to a different form. What do you think of Magnesium Taurate or Magnesium chelate? Would I be getting more bang for my buck if I tried either of those?
>
> Oh, definitely, but watch out for anything that just says "magnesium chelate" because the question is, chelated with what? If it doesn't say, I wouldn't take it. Magnesium taurate and magnesium glycinate are chelated with the amino acids taurine and glycine, for instance. Taurate is supposed to be good, haven't tried it myself yet. Mg citrate is good too, as is mg malate. I suggest you experiment, see which ones feel good and which might be more or less apt to induce diarrhea. (That's citrate for me.) Mg malate is the one that is specifically recommended for fibromyalgia and CFS too, I believe. I take it and like it. It's less sedating/calming in my experience than mg glycinate.
>
> > I am just in the process of educating myself about the use and benefits of vitamins, minerals and supplements above the RDA values. I am glad to have found this board to further educate myself and to share experiences and successes.
> >
> > Thanks again, and take care.
> >
> > Tamara
>
> Yes, indeed, lots of good info and people hanging around here. :) I learn a lot. It helps keep my motivated too to not slack off on my supplementing.
> JL
>
>
Posted by corafree on November 1, 2004, at 21:07:38
In reply to Re: Magnesium/calcium/chromium » jujube, posted by JLx on November 1, 2004, at 9:06:41
I'm forever anemic; cannot take iron as have constipation chronically.
Really interesting - Blood calcium high. Was the high calcium causing your iron deficiency? Calcium interferes with iron absorption.
I am lactose intolerant, so calcium is already low. Don't know lab term for blood calcium level.
In past was semi-dx'd w/ pernicious anemia. PCP said supplemental iron was not metabolized, offered no treatment, just sent me away.
I have limited $, or would go to endocrinologist(?) or holistic.
Posted by jujube on November 1, 2004, at 21:18:52
In reply to Re: Magnesium/calcium/chromium » JLx, posted by corafree on November 1, 2004, at 21:07:38
Corafree,
Pernicious anemia is actually caused by vitamin B-12 deficiency, not iron. So, you might not need extra iron at all. However, you may want to consider adding a B-complex and extra B-12 to your vitamin regime. B-12 deficiency can cause emotional symptoms such as moodiness and depression.
I don't think the elevated calcium level was causing the iron deficiency. It was only a slight elevation, but the doctor wanted to check things out anyway. I believe the term for high calcium is hypercalcemia whereas the term for low calcium is hypocalcemia.
You can probably get calcium from other sources other than milk products. Also, there is lactose-free milk that is now available in grocery stores. You might want to investigate alternate sources of calcium and perhaps get some lactose-free milk to help ensure you are getting calcium daily.
Tamara
> I'm forever anemic; cannot take iron as have constipation chronically.
>
> Really interesting - Blood calcium high. Was the high calcium causing your iron deficiency? Calcium interferes with iron absorption.
>
> I am lactose intolerant, so calcium is already low. Don't know lab term for blood calcium level.
>
> In past was semi-dx'd w/ pernicious anemia. PCP said supplemental iron was not metabolized, offered no treatment, just sent me away.
>
> I have limited $, or would go to endocrinologist(?) or holistic.
>
>
This is the end of the thread.
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