![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 21 of 21. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by yellowbird01 on January 27, 2012, at 13:58:32
I started lamictal in late Oct and have been at 50mg since November-ish. In the past, I have recurrent major depression, nonresponsive to ADs... previously took stimulants (concerta) during my last major depression but stopped about a year ago and was off meds until starting the lamictal. Also some generalized anxiety and social anxiety ongoing but not severe. When I went back to pdoc in Oct, it was at the suggestion of my therapist for meds for social anxiety as my depression wasnt severe at the time. Pdoc suggested lamictal for mood stabilization so I took it.
The last few months, I find I'm feeling progressively more.. not myself. Just today it clicked that maybe this is related to the lamictal? I'm going to try to describe the changes I've noticed, as briefly as I can, and perhaps someone can point me in the right direction or share some ideas.
Like I said, I just dont feel right. I dont feel terribly depressed, not tearful, but do have a general wish to be dead often (although no serious desire to act on it). The biggest change in the last month or so is I frequently feel SO irritable... I find myself snapping at even my best friend over things that are totally ridiculous. I feel like I'm turning into a b****! I have days where I feel almost mildly hypomanic... more productive, more motivated to get things done, and it feels good.. but the irritability is almost always still there on some level if I'm interrupted by anything. Other days, I look at my to-do list and get totally overwhelmed and anxious with a sense of "this thing MUST be done", even things that are unimportant and can realistically wait for a few months or longer, but nothing gets done. Or I get fixated on one specific task (I must search every website high and low for the EXACT item I want to buy, etc). Again, nothing really gets done, but my anxiety and fixation on whatever it is is high. I've actually lost sleep a few nights while obsessing over the different ways to possibly do something (usually something minor). It's not productive at all. And there are days I feel normal... although not that frequent. I havent really identified a pattern to my moods/irritability/anxiety yet, but I am trying.
I've been reading a bit about "dysphoric hypomania" and also "agitated depression". Both terms resonate with me somewhat... but I'm not sure. I've never had manic episodes or these types of issues before. Could it be connected with the lamictal? Or is this just a new phase of my ongoing depression/etc issues? My next appt with pdoc isnt until March but I'm considering moving it up. Any thoughts would be very appreciated.
Posted by B2chica on January 27, 2012, at 15:35:02
In reply to Problems since starting lamictal, posted by yellowbird01 on January 27, 2012, at 13:58:32
in the post right above yours i talk aobut choosing between lamictal and nortryptaline. anyway i have been on several "mood stabilizers" and it seems that when im ON them i actually Have mood swings.
its possible that is whats happening, the anger aggitated depression, the overwhelming, depression, the hypomanic need to do things the obsessing etc.this Definately needs to be noted to your doctor. keep in mind they may want to put you on Moremeds to fix that. if i were you i'd ask to switch meds..
Posted by Phillipa on January 27, 2012, at 18:53:40
In reply to Re: Problems since starting lamictal, posted by B2chica on January 27, 2012, at 15:35:02
Lamictal at 50mg caused anger in me. Was on a short time due to another not serious reaction. So the mood swings could be from the lamictal? Phillipa
Posted by papillon2 on January 28, 2012, at 3:04:10
In reply to Re: Problems since starting lamictal, posted by Phillipa on January 27, 2012, at 18:53:40
I suspect it's not Lamictal, but rather worsening depression. Irritability often occurs with depression.
I'd speak with your pdoc, before writing off Lamictal.
Posted by bleauberry on January 28, 2012, at 8:00:50
In reply to Problems since starting lamictal, posted by yellowbird01 on January 27, 2012, at 13:58:32
Doesn't sound to me like lamictal is something your body wants or likes. It is creating problems you did not previously have, and it is not helping the ones you wanted. So if someone wanted to continue with that I would be scratching my head in disbelief. We like to blame everything on something else but not the meds themselves. I don't get that but it is a pretty common trap.
Posted by polarbear206 on January 28, 2012, at 9:32:33
In reply to Problems since starting lamictal, posted by yellowbird01 on January 27, 2012, at 13:58:32
Also I forgot to mention that a therapeutic response to Lamictal is at doses of 150-200mg for a majority of it's users.
Posted by polarbear206 on January 28, 2012, at 9:42:26
In reply to Re: Problems since starting lamictal, posted by polarbear206 on January 28, 2012, at 9:32:33
> Also I forgot to mention that a therapeutic response to Lamictal is at doses of 150-200mg for a majority of it's users.
Yellowbird see my above post on the other thread.
Posted by torrid2 on January 28, 2012, at 10:24:47
In reply to Problems since starting lamictal, posted by yellowbird01 on January 27, 2012, at 13:58:32
I had a bad reaction to lamictal and became suisidal. I was on low dose and kept saying I don't feel right and the nurse who was writing it kept raising the dose and I just got worse. I had a lot of vertigo and balance issues from lamictal and those eymptoms accompanied the emotional decline. It wasn't exactly depression more anxiety but not exactly. I just wasn't write and gave up in my periferal contiousness. I wasn;t planning suicide but I saw what I was doing getting my affairs inorder kinda behavior. I think my subcontious mind desided that if I had just a little more pressure that I'd check out.
Now I'm going to say a liittle about what the situation was, Gosh it's so hard. I don't mean to be criptic but I'm not sure what my next sentence is going to be...
I had no family support, I had a child who had a number of surgerys the year prior. I broke down from the stress and lost my son when I was hospitalized. When there was no family member to take my son he went into foster care. Ok I said it. He was 2 years old and he's 8 now. My very serios suicide attempt on lamictal happened about 2 years after this and they just don't give your child back to mothers that have attempted suicide in the very very small county about an hour north of NYC.
Ok, not at all criptic.
Twice in my life I got suisidal from AD's in my 20's on prozac I felt either I needed a higher dose or the prozac was the cause, so I doubled my dose. I immediately felt worse and stopped takin the prozac and the suisidal feeling went away. It's not like me to ever give up and the two times AD's caused me to become suisidal, I didn't recognise myself. It wasn't depression it was just that on a subcontious level I'd become a quitter. All I can say is I DID NOT FEEL RIGHT.
OK now there's something I'd like to ask the readers. My son has been in foster care since he was 2 and 5-6 years later I'm on trial, my third trial in this case, yeas three bits at the apple. I'm on trial for the termination of my parential rights bassed on metal illness The on;y thing all the tests say is personality disorder NOS. Even though Borderlins personality didn't show on those tests, my 2 highest scores were avoidant and masocistic, they have an expert testifing that I'm BPD, you see there is legal president to terminate parential right on a BPD diagnosis.
Trial continues this Monday and the next trial date hasn't been schedualled. What I want to ask you is to pray or just send out your feeling of goodwill to me this Monday.
Posted by alchemy on January 28, 2012, at 10:32:08
In reply to Re: Problems since starting lamictal, posted by bleauberry on January 28, 2012, at 8:00:50
Lamictal and agitation - a strange confusing relationship with me.
For most of my life I had agitated depression, like what you are describing. Easily irritated. Somewhere between "blah" depression & angry/agitated depression. Being depressed without the agitation is preferable to me.
Some doctors have said it is a type of mania. I'm not sure how it can be put into the same category, but I guess they could be related somehow (I've never had real mania, just depression).
But for years I haven't been as agitated. That was the only thing that I have felt like meds have actually worked for. And I think it is because of Lamictal. (and i've tried a most of the meds)
Ironically, when starting Lamictal and increasing it, I would become more agitated initially. (I would also get acne flare-ups).
I was on 400mg of Lamictal for quite a while. I decided to slowly go down to 375 and then to 350. And it seemed that as I decreased it, I had more agitation and acne. But it hasn't abated, so I've actually thought about going back up. My agitation isn't like it use to be, I just find a little less tolerance for stupid things.
So, from what I've observed from my body:
- Initial agitation when starting or increasing
- After the "side effect" stage, it helps the agitation.
- Decreased it, had a tiny bit if withdrawal agitiation, but it has lingered? (doesn't make sense)
Posted by polarbear206 on January 28, 2012, at 13:16:48
In reply to Re: Problems since starting lamictal))Yellowbird, posted by polarbear206 on January 28, 2012, at 9:42:26
Have you added an AD to the lamictal? It works best in cojunctive with an AD. If you have not trialed this combo, I would highly suggest you give it a try. Go to psycheducation.org you will see a link for moodswings without mania and link for soft bipolar. Dr. Phelps is a well known for his wealth of knowledge and research in this field. Along with Dr. Ivan Rosenfield from Depression Central web site. Good luck.
Posted by phidippus on January 28, 2012, at 16:23:48
In reply to Problems since starting lamictal, posted by yellowbird01 on January 27, 2012, at 13:58:32
Studies have shown that Lamictal can produce OCD symptoms in patients with Bipolar II disorder.
You sound mixed. Have you tried increasing your Lamictal?
You may have to add an AAP to further help your mood.
Eric
Posted by Phillipa on January 28, 2012, at 18:48:27
In reply to Re: Problems since starting lamictal, posted by torrid2 on January 28, 2012, at 10:24:47
Torrid I hear you and my thoughts are with you. I ask if need someone to talk to babblemail me. Phillipa
Posted by torrid2 on January 28, 2012, at 19:11:24
In reply to Re: Problems since starting lamictal » torrid2, posted by Phillipa on January 28, 2012, at 18:48:27
If you could get some press on this case doc 7733 Putnam county family court other then that send out your positive energy into the court room this Monday.
Posted by sleepygirl2 on January 28, 2012, at 20:38:00
In reply to Re: Problems since starting lamictal, posted by alchemy on January 28, 2012, at 10:32:08
I relate to much of what you've said, but I haven't had withdrawal agitation since I haven't decreased it yet.
Posted by alchemy on January 29, 2012, at 0:40:13
In reply to Re: Problems since starting lamictal » alchemy, posted by sleepygirl2 on January 28, 2012, at 20:38:00
> I relate to much of what you've said, but I haven't had withdrawal agitation since I haven't decreased it yet.
Good to know. So do you think Lamictal helps your agitation after your body adjusts to it?
Posted by SLS on January 29, 2012, at 7:12:20
In reply to Re: Problems since starting lamictal, posted by torrid2 on January 28, 2012, at 10:24:47
> I had no family support, I had a child who had a number of surgerys the year prior. I broke down from the stress and lost my son when I was hospitalized.
I am very sorry for your losses.
- Scott
Posted by SLS on January 29, 2012, at 7:37:59
In reply to Problems since starting lamictal, posted by yellowbird01 on January 27, 2012, at 13:58:32
I have no sage advice to give you regarding your dosing of Lamictal. One would think that you would have reacted badly to Lamictal more immediately than being a few months latent. Who knows? Psychopharmacology is an inexact science right now, and experimentation with drugs is often necessary to determine how to best treat someone.
Lamictal dosage increase or decrease?
Yes. :-/
I would probably perform a quick experiment and reduce the dosage to see how you react. If the agitation disappears, you have your answer. If it does not disappear and your mood becomes unstable, you might then commit to a full trial of Lamictal.
Lamictal by itself is not such a good drug to control mania in most people. It is more likely to aid in the treatment of depression. For true mixed states, I don't know to what degree Lamictal is helpful. I have seen Topamax work well for mixed state hypomania. There are less than a handful of reports of Lamictal precipitating or making worse OCD. When OCD is comorbid with BP, it seems that Lamictal helps more than it hurts.
- Scott
Posted by sleepygirl2 on January 29, 2012, at 9:11:21
In reply to Re: Problems since starting lamictal » sleepygirl2, posted by alchemy on January 29, 2012, at 0:40:13
Yeah, but the startup was rough, as well as increases.
Posted by torrid2 on January 29, 2012, at 11:16:53
In reply to Re: Problems since starting lamictal, posted by SLS on January 29, 2012, at 7:12:20
The part of the glass that is half full is that it was throught my grief that the deepest parts of my recovery came from. I tell my self that without my loss, I would not have successfully overcome my problems. It doesn't matter if it's true or not because, whos to say that recovery wasn't in my cards with this tragic situation or not. I chose to see it this way to stay postitive, half full, I find this statagy a very successful way to get throught life.
Posted by yellowbird01 on January 29, 2012, at 23:29:23
In reply to Re: Problems since starting lamictal » SLS, posted by torrid2 on January 29, 2012, at 11:16:53
Thank you everyone for the many responses! I'm sorry for not responding earlier... I work noon-midnight Sat and Sundays so I just havent had a chance to write anything meaningful. I just got home and I have to be back to work in 7 hours, so not much time now either.
Briefly, I do really appreciate all the responses. Many things to think about. I am going to go back and reread them tomorrow when I have more time and I'll write something more meaningful. Thanks again...
Posted by Jeroen on February 3, 2012, at 17:04:33
In reply to Problems since starting lamictal, posted by yellowbird01 on January 27, 2012, at 13:58:32
caused a manic psychosis in me
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.