![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 24 of 24. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by streetsk8er794 on September 15, 2008, at 22:43:56
I'm having a ROUGH time with life. Just got out of jail, drug abuse, rehab, law problems. I've been sober 1 1/2 years now, and I feel like sh*t and want to die. My meds are so f*ed up, and I need help. Please read the post and try to help.
I was diagnosed with Social Anxiety first and foremost (which is the worst of all my disorders/symptoms by FAR), OCD (I obsess about how I will fix my disorders at least 5 hours a day, and also have repeated phrases to perfect how I am performing socially), severe Perfectionism, and lastly ADHD.
I was an akward kid, and showed signs of ocd. I washed my hands till they bled, wore 2 pairs of underwear in case i cr*pp*d in one, had to touch the left side of something if I touched the right, etc, etc.
Somewhere down the line, the outward symptoms (compulsions) of my OCD vanished, but still have the Severe perfectionism, and the "phrases" that repeat in my mind. Even when not in social situations, they still repeat; like my mind is always trying to fine tune my performance in everything I do.
Anyways, all through school, I would stare into space, doodle, yell things out during class, get up and stand on my desk, start things and not finish them, and constantly got into trouble. I would get a detention almost everyday. Yet, when it came time to take a test, my teachers were amazed that I aced almost every one of them.
Because of my inattention and ADHD, I always found it hard to make friends. So.... I started doing drugs to "fit in" with a click of friends. The drugs alleviated my symptoms while I was on them, but the addiction made things worse. This is where my severe social anxiety started. It was a tremendous chore just walking through the hallways at school, talking to girls, etc, etc.
Fast forward to today. I got out of jail for a DUI w/ serious bodily injury 6 months ago. I've been on Klonopin 2mg /day, and trialed a bunch of different stims (now on 10 mg dex T.I.D). I hate the klon because it numbs me so much, and makes me want to do nothing (not to mention extremely depressed). I have been weaning off the klon, and am now on 1.5mg/day, and I feel a little less depressed. However, the stims are causing a great deal more anxiety and OCD. I've tried lowering the stims, but they just do not work when i try that. My social anxiety is very severe. I CANNOT function at work without something to treat it. However, I HATE klonopin and how unmotivating it is.
I used to be on Nardil, and it was pretty good for my social anxiety and perfectionism (best AD I've tried), but it definitely didnt cure my SP, and it was neutral on my ADHD. I did have a hypertensive crisis ONCE while on it when I took a friend's Adderall XR 20 mg. I have heard good things about MAOI's (Nardil specifically) when taken carefully with stims. But my dose of dex (10 mg 3 */day) might be too high with Nardil.
I've been obsessing over this situation on what med to add, reduce, take away, etc, etc, and need to know what to tell my doc so I can get going in the right direction.
My goal is to get off benzos completely, but I cannot do that without the help of another med to compensate for it (for its social phobia reducing properties). I work in sales based solely on commission, so if I am anxious, I will forget what to say, I will not get sales, get fired, and have no insurance to help with the meds.
I was thinking about adding Lexapro to compensate for the Klon, but personally I dont think it will be strong enough. Or instead, adding Nardil would help, but I would have less flexibility with my stims due to a potential hypertensive crisis (not fun).
I would like to get as much info, input, similar experiences, or ANYTHING that might help me make my decision. For me, I dont have the luxury of trial and error. If one thing doesnt work, I will not sell and get fired. Period. But, regardless, ALL input is appreciated. Thank you.
Posted by med_empowered on September 15, 2008, at 23:14:05
In reply to PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by streetsk8er794 on September 15, 2008, at 22:43:56
mixing uppers and downers is tricky business. The first thing that pops in my mind is that maybe you should try a different benzo...klonopin is kind of known for inducing depression in some people.
I think Ativan is more neutral on mood, but you'd have to take it more often (and I think more of it). Xanax xr might be a good call. Serax might also be a good option.
I personally wouldn't mess with an MAOI, especially w/ an amphetamine in the mix, but...sometimes that works. The fact that you've had a hypertensive crisis already would kind of make me think (as a non-professional) that its not the best idea, though--that'd be like giving prozac to someone who had suffered serotonin syndrome, or Zyprexa to someone who had gone through Neuroleptic Malignancy Syndrome.
I'm sorry you're having a rough time...I wish you luck.
Posted by Phillipa on September 15, 2008, at 23:41:12
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by med_empowered on September 15, 2008, at 23:14:05
First welcome to babble great bunch of people here and great advise and you've already met one of the best and I totally agree with his above answer. But meds really don't work like that. There is always trial and error. If lucky your first med will work. But you're already on a number of meds. Do you have a psychiatriast monitoring your meds? Sales Is A Hard Profession And lots Of Stress So Find Something To help with anxiety first. Either ativan, valium. But will your doc prescribe a benzo for you? Cause of past addictions? Best Of luck to you. Phillipa
Posted by softheprairie on September 16, 2008, at 3:44:05
In reply to PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by streetsk8er794 on September 15, 2008, at 22:43:56
Wow. I understand some of what you're going through, the complicated mess, the contradictory desire for both stimulants and anxiety and depression relief, and how treating one makes another worse. Also job problems. I am currently on disability, as I wasn't able to keep up at work.
I was thinking Strattera/atomoxetine instead of a real stim. for your ADHD may allow you to get Nardil, but I looked up info. about Strattera, and it said it shouldn't be mixed w/ MAOIs.
A next thought I have that would allow you to keep the stim. is Luvox/fluvoxemine. It's not that strong as an antidepressant, but is approved for anxiety conditions like OCD, and may be your best best after Nardil for social anxiety (keeping in mind that I don't think there's any med. to really strongly kick social anxiety, nor OCD, for that matter, just that Luvox might be the most likely to help out of what's available).
Posted by Polarbear206 on September 16, 2008, at 10:14:45
In reply to PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by streetsk8er794 on September 15, 2008, at 22:43:56
> I'm having a ROUGH time with life. Just got out of jail, drug abuse, rehab, law problems. I've been sober 1 1/2 years now, and I feel like sh*t and want to die. My meds are so f*ed up, and I need help. Please read the post and try to help.
>
> I was diagnosed with Social Anxiety first and foremost (which is the worst of all my disorders/symptoms by FAR), OCD (I obsess about how I will fix my disorders at least 5 hours a day, and also have repeated phrases to perfect how I am performing socially), severe Perfectionism, and lastly ADHD.
>
> I was an akward kid, and showed signs of ocd. I washed my hands till they bled, wore 2 pairs of underwear in case i cr*pp*d in one, had to touch the left side of something if I touched the right, etc, etc.
>
> Somewhere down the line, the outward symptoms (compulsions) of my OCD vanished, but still have the Severe perfectionism, and the "phrases" that repeat in my mind. Even when not in social situations, they still repeat; like my mind is always trying to fine tune my performance in everything I do.
>
> Anyways, all through school, I would stare into space, doodle, yell things out during class, get up and stand on my desk, start things and not finish them, and constantly got into trouble. I would get a detention almost everyday. Yet, when it came time to take a test, my teachers were amazed that I aced almost every one of them.
>
> Because of my inattention and ADHD, I always found it hard to make friends. So.... I started doing drugs to "fit in" with a click of friends. The drugs alleviated my symptoms while I was on them, but the addiction made things worse. This is where my severe social anxiety started. It was a tremendous chore just walking through the hallways at school, talking to girls, etc, etc.
>
> Fast forward to today. I got out of jail for a DUI w/ serious bodily injury 6 months ago. I've been on Klonopin 2mg /day, and trialed a bunch of different stims (now on 10 mg dex T.I.D). I hate the klon because it numbs me so much, and makes me want to do nothing (not to mention extremely depressed). I have been weaning off the klon, and am now on 1.5mg/day, and I feel a little less depressed. However, the stims are causing a great deal more anxiety and OCD. I've tried lowering the stims, but they just do not work when i try that. My social anxiety is very severe. I CANNOT function at work without something to treat it. However, I HATE klonopin and how unmotivating it is.
>
> I used to be on Nardil, and it was pretty good for my social anxiety and perfectionism (best AD I've tried), but it definitely didnt cure my SP, and it was neutral on my ADHD. I did have a hypertensive crisis ONCE while on it when I took a friend's Adderall XR 20 mg. I have heard good things about MAOI's (Nardil specifically) when taken carefully with stims. But my dose of dex (10 mg 3 */day) might be too high with Nardil.
>
> I've been obsessing over this situation on what med to add, reduce, take away, etc, etc, and need to know what to tell my doc so I can get going in the right direction.
>
> My goal is to get off benzos completely, but I cannot do that without the help of another med to compensate for it (for its social phobia reducing properties). I work in sales based solely on commission, so if I am anxious, I will forget what to say, I will not get sales, get fired, and have no insurance to help with the meds.
>
> I was thinking about adding Lexapro to compensate for the Klon, but personally I dont think it will be strong enough. Or instead, adding Nardil would help, but I would have less flexibility with my stims due to a potential hypertensive crisis (not fun).
>
> I would like to get as much info, input, similar experiences, or ANYTHING that might help me make my decision. For me, I dont have the luxury of trial and error. If one thing doesnt work, I will not sell and get fired. Period. But, regardless, ALL input is appreciated. Thank you.
The first thing that popped in my mind was Luvox for your OCD. Another poster also suggested this. I also agree that going the non stim route might be a better option. First and foremost, you need to concentrate on getting your OCD under control with an AD. Then worry about the ADHD. The right AD can also help with that and perhaps you might be able to get by with a minimal dose of an ADHD med. True, it is very tricky combining meds with dueling diagnosis. You don't want to do too many things at once. I would caution about not completely getting off the klonopin yet, until you are more stable with an AD. You got alot on your plate. I would HIGHLY recommend you work with a psychopharmacolgist instead of a psychiatrist. They are the experts when multiple meds may be needed and esp. with your situation. I hope this helps.
Posted by streetsk8er794 on September 16, 2008, at 11:48:42
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by Polarbear206 on September 16, 2008, at 10:14:45
Let me explain something. The stimulants help greatly with my social anxiety, as they allow me to concentrate on conversations. The stimulants also control my intense rage, and my impulsivity. But.... they also make my OCD much worse. I feel I MUST get things done, and in a certain order. Nardil helped me more than any other drug out there for my OCD. That I know for sure. And it also made me pro-social. Nardil, plus low-dose klon (.5 mg morning, .5 mg night), plus low dose stimulant I think will be the answer. Screw my last hypertensive crisis. I was drinking heavily back then, and eating everything I was not supposed to be. Now I'm sober. Whatcha all think?
Posted by desolationrower on September 16, 2008, at 12:00:32
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by Polarbear206 on September 16, 2008, at 10:14:45
Do you have bipolar? You seem to be out of control. A mood stabilizer might help you get things worked out and make life more manageable.
-D/R
Posted by Polarbear206 on September 16, 2008, at 13:14:49
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by streetsk8er794 on September 16, 2008, at 11:48:42
> Let me explain something. The stimulants help greatly with my social anxiety, as they allow me to concentrate on conversations. The stimulants also control my intense rage, and my impulsivity. But.... they also make my OCD much worse. I feel I MUST get things done, and in a certain order. Nardil helped me more than any other drug out there for my OCD. That I know for sure. And it also made me pro-social. Nardil, plus low-dose klon (.5 mg morning, .5 mg night), plus low dose stimulant I think will be the answer. Screw my last hypertensive crisis. I was drinking heavily back then, and eating everything I was not supposed to be. Now I'm sober. Whatcha all think?
You very well could have an underlying bipolar disorder as well. Your multiple symptoms do fit in the diagnostic criteria. Substance abuse, anxiety,rage, compulsions and OCD are not uncommon in the bipolar spectrum. Again it can be very tricky to treat if you do have bipolar and ADHD. http://www.psycheducation.org/
Posted by Jeroen on September 16, 2008, at 14:14:50
In reply to PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by streetsk8er794 on September 15, 2008, at 22:43:56
i once got OCD induced by lowering my Seroquel dose from 400 mg to 100 mg, i washed my hands obsessive
but when i upped my dosage back it went away
maybe you should give seroquel a try twice 100 mg a day or high dosage 400 mg of 2 weeks youll know youre cured
Posted by streetsk8er794 on September 16, 2008, at 14:15:14
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by Polarbear206 on September 16, 2008, at 13:14:49
Let me give you some more insight so you can help me more. When I was off my stims last month (took a break to reduce tolerance), I was a mess. All I wanted to do was stay home and play video games. At work, I had ZERO motivation, and was too nervous to approach customers. However, I had bouts of rage at times. I sell shoes, so there is the floor, and the stock room. I would break every hanger I could find, punch boxes, spit on things, and freak. I would also flex my tricep, and jab a tack in it for no reason other than rage. I didn't even feel the pain. It wasn't an action that people quite associate with a "cutter", because I don't sit around and wallow in self-pity and cut myself. I used to do the same thing when I used to work out and I was huge. I would look at myself in the mirror, flex, and stick needles in my arms just for the hell of it. I have no clue why. The stims seem to not make me want to do these things though. I can control myself, and dont go into bout of rage (which is common in OCD and ADHD).
But, even on stims, I am constantly irritated by my family, and can hardly stand to be around them. I am also plagued by CONSTANT, CONSTANT anxiety. For instance: I have an appointment for an evaluation in an hour for some DUI school. I'm having bad anxiety that it wont go PERFECT, even though I dont care AT ALL what this guy thinks of me. This I cannot attribute to social anxiety. I have a severe, SEVERE case of perfectionism, which has, over time, led to procrastination in almost every area of my life. I wont get started on something, because I'm afraid it wont be perfect.
Lemme know what you think, and thanks for the support guys.
Posted by softheprairie on September 16, 2008, at 16:18:08
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by streetsk8er794 on September 16, 2008, at 11:48:42
You might have a hard time getting your doctor to agree to mixing Nardil with stimulants. The med. incompatibility is more dangerous than the food and drinks that are not supposed to be mixed with Nardil. If you are allowed the combo., the safer way is to start Nardil first without any stim., then slowly add very small amounts of the stimulant and go up on it in small increments.
You mention doing badly when stopping stimulants. Keep in mind that some of the worsening is due to discontinuation/withdrawal, and will resolve with time. I know I was very depressed when going off of stimulants, even with a sensible taper.
You also mention a hard time with rage and impulsivity. Some poster(s) have suggested mood stabilizers. I also wanted to throw out the possibility that an antipsychotic may help with that. Many people who take antipsychotics have never been psychotic, but the meds. still help. I take an old one called perphenazine to help with my depression, and previously took Zyprexa, then Seroquel, then Abilify. The mood stabilizers and antipsychotics can be mixed with Nardil, but have other foul risks or side effects of their own. Still, they may be worth it.
I hear you on the perfectionism. It really impairs me. I had to drop out of a graduate/professional program partly because I had too high of an ideal and couldn't get my work started and finished. I was miserable with stress over the work. I have not found any med. or combo. to effectively treat it. (Tho' I admit I haven't been on Nardil, but was on a high dose of selegiline, which is also an MAOI.)
We're thinking of you and wish you luck.
Posted by Polarbear206 on September 16, 2008, at 17:11:24
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by streetsk8er794 on September 16, 2008, at 14:15:14
> Let me give you some more insight so you can help me more. When I was off my stims last month (took a break to reduce tolerance), I was a mess. All I wanted to do was stay home and play video games. At work, I had ZERO motivation, and was too nervous to approach customers. However, I had bouts of rage at times. I sell shoes, so there is the floor, and the stock room. I would break every hanger I could find, punch boxes, spit on things, and freak. I would also flex my tricep, and jab a tack in it for no reason other than rage. I didn't even feel the pain. It wasn't an action that people quite associate with a "cutter", because I don't sit around and wallow in self-pity and cut myself. I used to do the same thing when I used to work out and I was huge. I would look at myself in the mirror, flex, and stick needles in my arms just for the hell of it. I have no clue why. The stims seem to not make me want to do these things though. I can control myself, and dont go into bout of rage (which is common in OCD and ADHD).
>
> But, even on stims, I am constantly irritated by my family, and can hardly stand to be around them. I am also plagued by CONSTANT, CONSTANT anxiety. For instance: I have an appointment for an evaluation in an hour for some DUI school. I'm having bad anxiety that it wont go PERFECT, even though I dont care AT ALL what this guy thinks of me. This I cannot attribute to social anxiety. I have a severe, SEVERE case of perfectionism, which has, over time, led to procrastination in almost every area of my life. I wont get started on something, because I'm afraid it wont be perfect.
>
> Lemme know what you think, and thanks for the support guys.
I hope you will check out the web site I directed to you. Not that there isin't people here with tons of knowledge, but please educate yourself and take my advice. You haven't mentioned if you are seeing a psychiatrist? I forgot to mention, my nephew had just about everything you describe and was diagnosed with bipolar and is doing very well on an antipsychotic used as a mood stabilizer and a AD. This all started when he was going through puberty. He was also diagnosed with ADD, but turned out not to be the case.
Posted by streetsk8er794 on September 16, 2008, at 22:39:21
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by Polarbear206 on September 16, 2008, at 17:11:24
I am seeing a psychiatrist, but I've been a guinea pig for so many years with past psychiatrists, that this time around I'm basically making the shots. Thats why I'm trying to inform myself so much.
Polarbear, did your nephew have the repeated phrases of how to be perfect running through his mind at all times? Or the severe social phobia I have? I just dont understand how bipolar would prevent me from being able to concentrate or be motivated.
Posted by Polarbear206 on September 17, 2008, at 14:45:21
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by streetsk8er794 on September 16, 2008, at 22:39:21
> I am seeing a psychiatrist, but I've been a guinea pig for so many years with past psychiatrists, that this time around I'm basically making the shots. Thats why I'm trying to inform myself so much.
>
> Polarbear, did your nephew have the repeated phrases of how to be perfect running through his mind at all times? Or the severe social phobia I have? I just dont understand how bipolar would prevent me from being able to concentrate or be motivated.He was obsessive and had some rituals. Listen, I have a soft form of bipolar and in my low periods, I could not concentrate, very foggy minded and would sleep alot and the simple things like taking a shower, etc.. were an effort. Without a mood stabilizer I would have anxiety, anger, sleep very poor, etc... I suggest you read a good book too, "Why Your Depression Isin't Getting Better"
Posted by streetsk8er794 on September 17, 2008, at 23:17:20
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by Polarbear206 on September 17, 2008, at 14:45:21
Polarbear,
I definitely believe that my depression is a direct result of my long term klonopin use. I've been on 2 mg a day for over 6 months. Before the klon, I was not really depressed. Depression seems to only be a problem when I'm in active addiction, or on any medication.
In jail, where I got no meds obviously, I got to really analyze myself without any drug (prescribed or legal), to really analyze myself.
The ONLY reason things like going to work, or getting visits, or talking on the phone were such a chore, was because of my social anxiety. I did not find it hard to get out of bed. I COULD enjoy things.
It all boils down to this: I cant just quit klonopin cold turkey, and I need the stimulants to counter the sedative/unmotivating side effects of the klonopin in order to function at work.
I just ran for about 3 miles, and I feel so motivated, less anxiety, more confident, more relaxed. I will keep running daily, but I dont know what to do about my meds.
The stims have made me break out with pimples everywhere (not good for confidence), made me lose tons of weight (I used to weigh a healthy 175 lbs, now I weigh 138), and made my OCD significantly worse. But, they have helped me tremendously to stay sober, do well at work, and get more things done in general.
The klonopin was great for anxiety at first, and its still helping somewhat; but I dont like how its creating depression.
Maybe i should just wean down to 1 mg klon per day, keep the stim dose, and add an anti-depressant like Lexapro or Nardil.
And yes, I have been looking into bipolar II, I'm just not sure I have it yet. I need to do some more research.
All I know is that my P-Doc appt is coming up soon, and I NEED to know what to tell him. I do not feel like waiting yet again another month to try something.
Input.
Posted by Polarbear206 on September 18, 2008, at 8:16:31
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by streetsk8er794 on September 17, 2008, at 23:17:20
> Polarbear,
>
> I definitely believe that my depression is a direct result of my long term klonopin use. I've been on 2 mg a day for over 6 months. Before the klon, I was not really depressed. Depression seems to only be a problem when I'm in active addiction, or on any medication.
>
> In jail, where I got no meds obviously, I got to really analyze myself without any drug (prescribed or legal), to really analyze myself.
>
> The ONLY reason things like going to work, or getting visits, or talking on the phone were such a chore, was because of my social anxiety. I did not find it hard to get out of bed. I COULD enjoy things.
>
> It all boils down to this: I cant just quit klonopin cold turkey, and I need the stimulants to counter the sedative/unmotivating side effects of the klonopin in order to function at work.
>
> I just ran for about 3 miles, and I feel so motivated, less anxiety, more confident, more relaxed. I will keep running daily, but I dont know what to do about my meds.
>
> The stims have made me break out with pimples everywhere (not good for confidence), made me lose tons of weight (I used to weigh a healthy 175 lbs, now I weigh 138), and made my OCD significantly worse. But, they have helped me tremendously to stay sober, do well at work, and get more things done in general.
>
> The klonopin was great for anxiety at first, and its still helping somewhat; but I dont like how its creating depression.
>
> Maybe i should just wean down to 1 mg klon per day, keep the stim dose, and add an anti-depressant like Lexapro or Nardil.
>
> And yes, I have been looking into bipolar II, I'm just not sure I have it yet. I need to do some more research.
>
> All I know is that my P-Doc appt is coming up soon, and I NEED to know what to tell him. I do not feel like waiting yet again another month to try something.
>
> Input.Can you give me a list of drugs that you have taken in the past?
If you feel you need the stim, I would go with something like Concerta instead of something like Ritalin. Give Lexapro a try. Don't completely wean off the klonopin while your adding new meds. Do it very slowly. Yes, 2mg a day can contribute to some depresssion. I only use it on a as needed basis when I get a little wired and can't sleep. I take Effexor and it has been the best AD I have ever been on. You really should keep a daily journal and keep track of your sleep, mood, anxiety levels, energy, etc... It really helps to get more of a clear cut picture of whats going on. It also helps your doctor to know all of this. I did this and would take it along to my appointments. How many times do we forget to tell the doctor things after we leave?? I know I have in the past. I also went jogging yesterday. Exercise is a great stress buster. Keep doing it!!
Posted by streetsk8er794 on September 18, 2008, at 8:40:24
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by Polarbear206 on September 18, 2008, at 8:16:31
I've been on Zoloft, Wellbutrin, Lexapro, Adderall, Adderall XR, Dexedrine IR, Dexedrine Spanules, Daytrana, Vyvanse, Nardil, Seroquel, Depakote, Klonopin, Librium.... I'm sure I left out a few, but those are most of them. Let me add, that the mood stabililzers I've tried like the Depakote and Seroquel did nothing but make me groggy. I think I actually felt worse on them. And of the anti-depressants I've tried, Lexapro was good with few side-effects, and wellbutrin I've never tried on its own so I cant say. Zoloft I just plain did not like. Oh yeh, Nardil was awesome, but the side effects were just plain baaaad...
Here's what I've come to realize. The klonopin 2 mg/ day was working great for my social anxiety, because it took away these "phrases" I get in social situations. 2 mg still keeps them away, but at the same time, I've become depressed from it. I think it is still working well, but because of the depression, my perceived effectiveness of it has lowered. I think I need to go back to my 2 mg per day (1 mg morning, 1 mg night), and address the depression.
When my stimulant doses were higher (100 mg vyvanse/day), my depression was much better, but my anxiety was out of control. 10 mg 3 times per day of Dexedrine IR is perfect. The only thing though, is that I basically need coffee with it for it to work. What I mean is, I feel much more focused with the dexedrine, but the klonopin is blocking some of the motivation, and maybe even the depression, is physically blocking me from getting up and doing anything. But when I drink coffee, it jump starts the dex, or something, and I get "get up and go." The only problem with this is that it increases my anxiety.
I think your right that I need to stay with my 2 mg klon per day, and stick with this stim dosage. I just need to add an anti-depressant. I think wellbutrin er might be good, because it will potentiate my stimulants like the coffee does, and work on my depression at the same time. What do you think?
Posted by Polarbear206 on September 18, 2008, at 10:17:54
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by streetsk8er794 on September 18, 2008, at 8:40:24
> I've been on Zoloft, Wellbutrin, Lexapro, Adderall, Adderall XR, Dexedrine IR, Dexedrine Spanules, Daytrana, Vyvanse, Nardil, Seroquel, Depakote, Klonopin, Librium.... I'm sure I left out a few, but those are most of them. Let me add, that the mood stabililzers I've tried like the Depakote and Seroquel did nothing but make me groggy. I think I actually felt worse on them. And of the anti-depressants I've tried, Lexapro was good with few side-effects, and wellbutrin I've never tried on its own so I cant say. Zoloft I just plain did not like. Oh yeh, Nardil was awesome, but the side effects were just plain baaaad...
>
> Here's what I've come to realize. The klonopin 2 mg/ day was working great for my social anxiety, because it took away these "phrases" I get in social situations. 2 mg still keeps them away, but at the same time, I've become depressed from it. I think it is still working well, but because of the depression, my perceived effectiveness of it has lowered. I think I need to go back to my 2 mg per day (1 mg morning, 1 mg night), and address the depression.
>
> When my stimulant doses were higher (100 mg vyvanse/day), my depression was much better, but my anxiety was out of control. 10 mg 3 times per day of Dexedrine IR is perfect. The only thing though, is that I basically need coffee with it for it to work. What I mean is, I feel much more focused with the dexedrine, but the klonopin is blocking some of the motivation, and maybe even the depression, is physically blocking me from getting up and doing anything. But when I drink coffee, it jump starts the dex, or something, and I get "get up and go." The only problem with this is that it increases my anxiety.
>
> I think your right that I need to stay with my 2 mg klon per day, and stick with this stim dosage. I just need to add an anti-depressant. I think wellbutrin er might be good, because it will potentiate my stimulants like the coffee does, and work on my depression at the same time. What do you think?I don't know how wellbutrin would do mixed with a stim. Wellbutrin is pretty stimulating for most on its own. I couldn't take it as my main AD because it exacerbated my anxiety and I had anger issues with it. It's good however as an add on with an AD. I take lamictal, which is excellent as a mood stablizer and to augment an AD. It doesn't cause the the blah side effects like the others. It is more stimulating and has AD properties as well. I'm just throwing some things you way here.
Posted by desolationrower on September 18, 2008, at 11:59:36
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by Polarbear206 on September 18, 2008, at 10:17:54
I think you should try one of the more activating antipsychotics like aripiprazole or ziprasidone. If you add a mood stabilizer, a tca might be very good for your depression and ADD and energy. I agree a mood chart would be good as I am concerned with possible bipolar. Bipolar depression can be very low energy and mixed states can cause irritability, poor decision making, racing thoughts, etc. Lamotrigine can be good for rapid cycling.
-D/R
Posted by streetsk8er794 on September 19, 2008, at 12:12:11
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by desolationrower on September 18, 2008, at 11:59:36
I've made my decision. I'm going to go back to 2 mg klonopin/day (1 mg morning, 1 mg night), and 60 mg Nardil (30 mg morning, 30 mg night).
I'm going to go down to dex 5 mg 3 times per day.
When I was last on Nardil, it was pretty stimulating in and of itself.
I've done some research, and it could be possible that I have Aspergers instead of ADHD. Or maybe Bipolar II like you guys mentioned.
Whatever I have, the diagnosis does not really matter. What matters is this : what medications work, and what you are doing to better yourself.
Thank you.
Posted by softheprairie on September 19, 2008, at 16:30:15
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by streetsk8er794 on September 19, 2008, at 12:12:11
> I've made my decision. I'm going to go back to 2 mg klonopin/day (1 mg morning, 1 mg night), and 60 mg Nardil (30 mg morning, 30 mg night).
>
> I'm going to go down to dex 5 mg 3 times per day.
I would find it odd if your dr. would agree to that. Even if the dex. amt. is a decrease from what you were on, I still think that dose is a safety risk when mixed with Nardil. If you get Nardil and happen to have old stims. at home, PLEASE start with smaller doses of the stim. and slowly work your way up. And/or, please talk to a pharmacist before you mix dex. and Nardil. (The Klon. is fine, I think.)> When I was last on Nardil, it was pretty stimulating in and of itself.
>
> I've done some research, and it could be possible that I have Aspergers instead of ADHD. Or maybe Bipolar II like you guys mentioned.
>
> Whatever I have, the diagnosis does not really matter. What matters is this : what medications work, and what you are doing to better yourself.
>
> Thank you.
Posted by streetsk8er794 on September 19, 2008, at 17:53:49
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by softheprairie on September 19, 2008, at 16:30:15
The only thing I can promise is that I will carry the anti-hypertensive crisis pills around with me; just in case something does happen.
Posted by Polarbear206 on September 19, 2008, at 18:38:13
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by streetsk8er794 on September 19, 2008, at 12:12:11
> I've made my decision. I'm going to go back to 2 mg klonopin/day (1 mg morning, 1 mg night), and 60 mg Nardil (30 mg morning, 30 mg night).
>
> I'm going to go down to dex 5 mg 3 times per day.
>
> When I was last on Nardil, it was pretty stimulating in and of itself.
>
> I've done some research, and it could be possible that I have Aspergers instead of ADHD. Or maybe Bipolar II like you guys mentioned.
>
> Whatever I have, the diagnosis does not really matter. What matters is this : what medications work, and what you are doing to better yourself.
>
> Thank you.
Keep me and the others updated, OK? Good Luck
Posted by streetsk8er794 on September 19, 2008, at 21:37:03
In reply to Re: PLEASE HELP ME!!! (I'm Desperate), posted by Polarbear206 on September 19, 2008, at 18:38:13
I will most definitely keep you updated.
I have high hopes for this combination, as Nardil by itself was incredibly effective by itself in the past. Wish me luck!!!
This is the end of the thread.
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