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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 3 to 27 of 27. Go back in thread:
Posted by johnnystats on January 9, 2005, at 19:40:36
In reply to XANAX could give Euphoria (elation)?, posted by neo on January 9, 2005, at 18:57:53
I've never heard of benzos being prescribed for suicidal idealation/mood altering effects. Mainly they're used for their anti-anxiety properties. What i can tell you is I've tried both xanax and xanax xr and have found that regular xanax gave me a high so i had to keep increasing the dose to achieve the same effect. The key to a good benzo is a long half life, so it has a chance to build up in your system without causing rebound anxiety. Valium, Klonopin, and Xanax XR all fit this discription. My depression/anxiety has been better on xanax XR + nardil without any side effects besides the usual sedation that most benzos cause.
Posted by neo on January 10, 2005, at 6:18:29
In reply to Re: XANAX could give Euphoria (elation)? » neo, posted by Phillipa on January 9, 2005, at 19:22:24
1000 thanx for your help!
I wait if someone else has something to say about!Phillipa:
- I am not on any AD cause during the last years none of the classic Ad had ever helped me.
-...ahh..I'm from the north of Italy (near Venice).
Thanx you again, all the best for you all!!!
Neo
Posted by mmcconathy on January 10, 2005, at 19:18:44
In reply to 1000 thanx for your help!, posted by neo on January 10, 2005, at 6:18:29
But, im 17.
I'm on Klonopin .5mg which is a placebo, and is not stopping my panic attacks.
I dont know if these panic attacks are panic attacks or psychosis, all i know is im afraid something terrible with my thoughts is going to happen, im going to turn autistic, or develop psychotic sydromes, which are forming just becuase im thinking about it!!
Im asking my doctor for Ativan 1mg with Klonopin uped to 1mg, this may be effective.
I've tooken tequila shots on occations when i think im on the vergy of insanity, (dont tell my parents) and it usally makes me just feel "who cares", if it happens, it happens.
Why did your doc prescribe you Xanax in the first place?
Well i amy ask about Xanax XR, but for now i may go on Thorazine, or Respirdal just in case i lose my mind.
I've have dissociative attacks once and a while, stress gets so bad, that it seems to go numb and i dont recognize reality itself. My dad callsm me nothing, and im failure that i have issues, that danm narrcisst, i hope he burns in hell. My mom's world basically ends everyday, since she has stress breakdowns, i dont understand my doctor at all.
Good Day
Posted by darkhorse on January 11, 2005, at 5:45:02
In reply to XANAX could give Euphoria (elation)?, posted by neo on January 9, 2005, at 18:57:53
Hello Neo,
Yes, I experienced a sense of mood elevation and well-being after a few days of regular use of X.
Other benzos did not give this same feeling as such.
I really can not differniate between mood-elevation/anti-depressant/sense of well-being.To my mind they are very close in their meaning.Regards,
Dark Horse.
Posted by neo on January 11, 2005, at 13:21:02
In reply to Re: XANAX could give Euphoria (elation)?, posted by darkhorse on January 11, 2005, at 5:45:02
Thanx darkhorse for your helpful share!
any information too:
1) On Xanax did you have any sexual side effects?
2) When you was on X what was your dosage and timing? How long right effect lasts?
3) In your experience (reading your post) you could say that X had for you an antidepressant effect?
Thanx very much if you could answer to my questions!
All the best for you!
Neo
Posted by CareBear04 on January 12, 2005, at 2:22:09
In reply to XANAX could give Euphoria (elation)?, posted by neo on January 9, 2005, at 18:57:53
hey neo,
i've been on xanax 1mg 4x a day for over a year. i've never had any elation, but i definitely prefer it over klonopin or ativan. for me, it's less sedating than klonopin, and in this dose, which is probably high, it doesn't make me depressed as klonopin did when i took it as my primary benzo.
i've never experienced euphoria, but recently, i had a consultation with a dr who is known to be an expert in mood and anxiety disorders. he gave me a little bit of a hard time about xanax because he said it (the elation possibility, i guess) causes rapid cycling in bipolars. he said the same thing about tricyclic antidepressants, though, and i've chosen to kind of blow off his opinion. if it works for you, what does it matter if the rest of the world has a different reaction? good luck!
Posted by darkhorse on January 12, 2005, at 9:01:16
In reply to Thanx darkhorse, any questions, please! » darkhorse, posted by neo on January 11, 2005, at 13:21:02
Hello neo ,
> 1) On Xanax did you have any sexual side effects?None.
> 2) When you was on X what was your dosage and timing? How long right effect lasts?o.5mg 3 times a day . 12-8-4.
The effects started to be felt nearly 2- 3 days.
I felt the good effect all day.No "brek through anxiety" like others posted (for me,that is).> 3) In your experience (reading your post) you could say that X had for you an antidepressant effect?
Well,as I said,I do not know a clear- cut difference between anti-depressant/elation/well-being.However I felt good,self-confident and sociable,but I do not know if X is useful "solo" for major depression.
I remember my close friends and my father noticing a real positive effect in my mood and behaviour,not like prozac.
> Thanx very much if you could answer to my questions!You are welcome,
> All the best for you!
Dark Horse.
Posted by phillipa on January 13, 2005, at 0:37:03
In reply to Thanx darkhorse, any questions, please! » darkhorse, posted by neo on January 11, 2005, at 13:21:02
?> 3) In your experience (reading your post) you could say that X had for you an antidepressant effect?
Xanax is the only benzo that has any AD effects.The only problem is it's short half life. Don't let anyone tell you that all benzos are the same...they are NOT!
Posted by darkhorse on January 13, 2005, at 7:36:22
In reply to Re: Thanx darkhorse, any questions, please! » neo, posted by phillipa on January 13, 2005, at 0:37:03
Hello all,
What is an antidepressant anyway???
If any substance that can provide an elevation of mood and a feeling-good attitude and a healthy positive look at life,sociability,motivation..will this be considered a bad thing,and immediatly be labeled "euphoria", "hypomania"..etc.
I do not believe this.
Are we stuck with this fixed idea that any substance that is considered an AD MUST affect serotonin/noradernaline?????
Is the human brain that simple and that limited,or are we being swept and brainwashed by those giant companies that want to profit from our misery????
Is ALL our "biological" symptoms which varies a lot,and all our agonies are that simple to be solved around 2 simple elements in our brain??
I do not think so...
Let us look back before this age of the SSRIs :
In the 50's and up until the 70's the word "depression" was very rarely encountered (same as OCD),but everybody was anxiuos and had neuorosis.
Every one used benzos for all their "neurosis"
Surprisngly,in 80's and until now, every one and all those who continued to live got "depressed","OCD" and every one was switched to the wonder SSRis ,SNRis,NRis..etc
Did people got better?? was there a real major improvement from the people who lived before the 80's,or are we more miserable??
Is it a coincedence that the whloe world suddnly realized that they are not anxious but depressed and that at the same time those giant companies gave the world the soluotin in an SSRi pill.(if it dose not affect 5ht , then it is not an AD).
When I took Prozac and all those antidepressant,it may have got rid of some of my symptoms but left me uncaring,unsociable,unmotivated,sexless&fat.
When I took Xanax and some other substances,it made me happy,motivated,self-confident..
(This is just an example,I'm not saying that BZ are better...just questioning this bainwashed fixed ideas about this 5ht/NA fixation ).
Is it a sin or wrong to have your mood lifted and be happy with a pill?
I think we are living in an age that lost its purity:
Drug companies are doing everything for the money,they keep on "invinting" disorders to fit a pill and magnify this "disorder" to profit,and I think that this example of anxiety/depression,benzos/SSRis are very clear example.
What do you think all of you.
Any ideas and input will be highly appreciated.
Dark Horse.
Posted by darkhorse on January 13, 2005, at 8:01:19
In reply to What is an antidepressant?Any input please?, posted by darkhorse on January 13, 2005, at 7:36:22
Any opinions?
Posted by ed_uk on January 13, 2005, at 10:13:04
In reply to Re: What is an antidepressant?Any input please?, posted by darkhorse on January 13, 2005, at 8:01:19
Hello!
>What is an antidepressant anyway???
Currently, an antidepressant seems to be any drug which the manufacturer decides to classify as an antidepressant! Drugs can be classified in many ways eg. based on use (antidepressant, antiepileptic), chemical structure (eg. phenylethylamine), pharmacological property (eg. SSRI)..............
I would say that an antidepressant is a drug which can relieve the symptoms of depression without inducing strong euphoria. ADs can sometimes produce a small elevation of mood in people who are not ill but they rarely induce euphoria (it has been said that this is because they are not very good!)
>If any substance that can provide an elevation of mood and a feeling-good attitude and a healthy positive look at life, sociability, motivation... will this be considered a bad thing,and immediatly be labeled "euphoria", "hypomania"..etc.
Yes, some people will consider it to be a bad thing. A lot of people believe that all drug-taking is bad!
*I* think that such a drug could be a very useful treatment for depression. Few drugs seem to possess such properties though.........
SSRIs tend to reduce motivation and numb emotions.
Amphetamines may produce these effects for a while but tolerance usuallly occurs. Increasing the dose too much might lead to paranoia, delusions and hallucinations. Some people develop apathy and numbed emotions after a while. The problem with stimulants is that they are often a little too effective in 'motivating' people to take more of the drug!
I suppose that noradrenaline reuptake inhibitors like desipramine possess many of the properties you suggested. Sadly, for many people they just aren't adequately effecive. Certain of the 'dual' reuptake inhibitors like venlafaxine are too 'skewed' towards serotonin to boost motivation.... imipramine is more 'balanced' in this respect.... I know you like imipramine!!
>Are we stuck with this fixed idea that any substance that is considered an AD MUST affect serotonin/noradernaline?????I think many people probably don't realise how many neurotransmitters there actually are. I think some doctors are still stuck on the idea that everything is to do with serotonin- the neurotransmitter of the 90s. Their minds are still stuck on how good it is to be 'selective for serotonin'- 'selctive' is a word which has been a very effective marketing strategy. Today, big pharma is promoting the benefits of drugs which are not selective for serotonin. Remember imipramine!! Compared with serotonin, noradrenaline doesn't seem to have recieved much attention in recent years.
>Is ALL our "biological" symptoms which varies a lot,and all our agonies are that simple to be solved around 2 simple elements in our brain??
It annoys me when people talk about the brain as if it was like a pot of soup! Oh, if only I could add a bit more serotonin (salt) and a touch of dopamine (pepper) everything would be ok! As you well know, it is not that simple!
>In the 50's and up until the 70's the word "depression" was very rarely encountered (same as OCD),but everybody was anxiuos and had neuorosis.
I've looked at old English textbooks in the library. 'Clinical depression' was said to be a very rare illness, affecting a tiny fraction of the population. In psychiatry, frequency of diagnosis almost always seems to depend on the availability of drug treatments. When ADs were introduced, depression was diagnosed much more commonly.... when the SSRIs were marketed it was diagnosed even more extensively. Basically, psychiatrists will inevitably spend the most time looking for symptoms of disorders which can be treated with drugs. They're less likely to bother considering whether the patient has any symptoms of disorders which don't have drug treatments.
>Did people got better?? was there a real major improvement from the people who lived before the 80's,or are we more miserable??
I think people expect more than they used to. In the past I think people almost expected that there would be periods of extreme unhappiness in their lives- only rarely would this lead to a diagnosis of depression.
>Is it a sin or wrong to have your mood lifted and be happy with a pill?
No, I don't think it is- although many people would disagree. It starts to get problematic when addiction sets in and eventually, a person's entire life can be taken up with obtaining and using a drug. On their own, drugs are never enough to make a person happy in the long term. Euphoriants like methamphetamine can make people feel wonderful in the short term but it doesn't last. ADs can contribute toward happiness but they are never enough on their own. Many other things are needed to make people happy..... friends, family, food! etc.
>Drug companies are doing everything for the money,they keep on "invinting" disorders to fit a pill and magnify this "disorder" to profit,and I think that this example of anxiety/depression,benzos/SSRis are very clear example.
I think drug companies are very good at spotting profitable markets for their products. Panic disorder wasn't so commonly diagnosed until Xanax was introduced. Social anxiety wasn't so commonly diagnosed until the lauch of Paxil as a treatment. I don't think that drug companies invent disorders, but they do spend a lot of time 'educating' doctors and the public about problems which can now be treated with medication. You are right btw, drug companies are all about money. They are businessess, profit is their aim. They do not exist for the benefit of people with mental health problems!
Best Regards,
Ed.
Posted by CareBear04 on January 13, 2005, at 14:19:04
In reply to Re: Thanx darkhorse, any questions, please! » neo, posted by phillipa on January 13, 2005, at 0:37:03
hi phillipa-- when you speak about xanax's AD effects, what are they like for you? one dr suggested that xanax is BAD for BP because it promotes cycling through euphoria, but i've never had anything like that. the only AD effect i can identify is that xanax doesn't make me lethargic and down in long-term treatment like, say, klonopin when i took it during the day up to 3-4mg. maybe just by being less sedating and dulling, xanax protects my mood?
do you know about cross tolerance between benzos? i've been on xanax, klonopin, and ativan during the day and for sleep as well as the sleeping benzos like restoril and halcion. i developed a tolerance to ativan quickly, esp when i used it at 2mg for sleep, but until just recently, i've used xanax and klonopin at the same doses (up to 4mg of X and 2 of K per day) for over a year. for some reason, all the tolerances are kicking in at once-- the benzos for sure, also ambien, which has worked for sleep for almost two years. even trazodone, which i tried last night at 100mg and which used to be pretty effective for me at 50mg didn't keep me asleep for more than four hours.
i've never tried valium, which i've always been curious about. one dr suggested tranxene awhile back, which i know nothing about. if i'm tolerant to pretty high doses of the above-mentioned benzos, will i automatically be tolerant to something new? since you mentioned that X is different than other benzos, it gave me a glimmer of hope that maybe i can avoid cross-tolerance or get a different effect?
thanks if you have any answers!
Posted by phillipa on January 13, 2005, at 22:51:31
In reply to Re: What is an antidepressant?Any input please? » darkhorse, posted by ed_uk on January 13, 2005, at 10:13:04
ED, you always amaze me on how efficiently you research a topic so as to respond so professionally. I agree that5 the new strain of pdocs are trying to find the symptoms that a drug treats instead of listening to the patient first. HELLO!
Also, what is wrong with trying a first line defense of benzo's for the depression (which we know percipates the anxiety of why we feel so depressed)
dar4khorse, X is an B with AD qualities in that it doesn't let the downs of the "rollercoaster" be so low.
Valium is long acting and is also is a muscle relaxant so... if you have anxiety or stress that knots your back or other muscles of your bod, this would be a good choice. gnepig
Posted by darkhorse on January 14, 2005, at 4:45:14
In reply to Re: What is an antidepressant?Any input please? » ed_uk, posted by phillipa on January 13, 2005, at 22:51:31
Hello Phillipa :
> Also, what is wrong with trying a first line defense of benzo's for the depression (which we know percipates the anxiety of why we feel so depressed)I can not agree more.In fact I noticed that since I stopped all those AD's(and I have tried many many AD's),and relied on benzos I did not have major depression again,since benzos kill off all anxiety that can bring on a major depression (I had several episods of major depression,and I know how it feels).
In fact since I stopped all those AD's I never felt better:I became more human again : more aware of the real world,return of intrest in sex,better sleep quality,self-confidence,return of normal shape - no weight gain..etc.
When I feel I'm not in control,a couple of weeks of benzos get rid of any incoming major depression.
I think that AD's and in particular the potent TCA's should be reserved for people who have real classic severe major depression,and should not be taken more than a year since after that the side effects far outweight the benefits.
I think SSRis have no role for MD.In fact,I do not think they have an anxioylitic action either.BZ are far greater.SSRIS have long-term severe side effects that far outeight their benefits,especially for treatment of anxiety.SSris should be reserved as a 2nd or 3rd options or for pure OCD.
>
> dar4khorse, X is an B with AD qualities in that it doesn't let the downs of the "rollercoaster" be so low.Thank you P.I already know that.Believe me, I do not want to tell how the total amount of different psychotropic medications which I took or you'll be shocked.(And I'm not proud of it).
>
Best wishes and regards,Dark Horse.
Posted by darkhorse on January 14, 2005, at 5:39:40
In reply to Re: What is an antidepressant?Any input please? » darkhorse, posted by ed_uk on January 13, 2005, at 10:13:04
> Hello!
>
> SSRIs tend to reduce motivation and numb emotions.I can not agree more.In fact,if I may add : their therapeutic action is based on their potent effect at making people(any person for that matter) indifferent to everything.So their action would be to let you not care about doing any thing so in this case it works to kill OCD cycles..and since one does not care if he dies or live,anxious or not...etc,etc.One ends up does not care about anything!!!
Looking back,I was locked inside this zombie or trance living...> I suppose that noradrenaline reuptake inhibitors like desipramine possess many of the properties you suggested. Sadly, for many people they just aren't adequately effecive.
Yes,you are correct.
> I think many people probably don't realise how many neurotransmitters there actually are. I think some doctors are still stuck on the idea that everything is to do with serotonin- the neurotransmitter of the 90s. Their minds are still stuck on how good it is to be 'selective for serotonin'- 'selctive' is a word which has been a very effective marketing strategy. Today, big pharma is promoting the benefits of drugs which are not selective for serotonin. Remember imipramine!!
So, the more things change,the more things stay the same.
> It annoys me when people talk about the brain as if it was like a pot of soup! Oh, if only I could add a bit more serotonin (salt) and a touch of dopamine (pepper) everything would be ok! As you well know, it is not that simple!Yes ,you expressed what I wanted to say so well.If I may add that this belief is so humilating to our great massive and complex organ that we call brain.
On their own, drugs are never enough to make a person happy in the long term.
Well said.We are getting used that everything must be totally fixed with the magic bullet.There is more to life than pills,and we should never underesimate how humanbeings are a suvival species and that we developed through the ages the most powerful weapon;the brain.
> I don't think that drug companies invent disorders, but they do spend a lot of time 'educating' doctors and the public about problems which can now be treated with medication. You are right btw, drug companies are all about money. They are businessess, profit is their aim. They do not exist for the benefit of people with mental health problems!If I may add that drug companies are trying all the time to take a normal human reaction,and label it into a "disorder" and magnify it until it is a "chemical imbalance" and "mental illness".e.g. social anxiety "disorder",was never heared of before,and now it is a very common mental illness.
Yes I believe that social anxiety do exist but it is not a disorder that needs to be fixed with more serotonin or GABA,and that would be it!!
people who feel very uncomfortable in social situations(me included),may need a drink or a benzo occasionally to smmoth things a bit or be more educated and trained how to deal with situations,but to be put indiffenetly on powerful medications such as Paxil in the belief of this chemical imbalance with few if any positive results,and if not,more and more medications....ughhh.
Sorry for the long chat,and sorry for my bad english and spelling mistakes!
>
> Best Regards,D H .
> Ed.
>
>
Posted by ed_uk on January 14, 2005, at 12:11:52
In reply to Re: What is an antidepressant?Any input please? » ed_uk, posted by darkhorse on January 14, 2005, at 5:39:40
Hello,
>Sorry for the long chat,and sorry for my bad english and spelling mistakes!
The long chat was fun! I didn't notice any mistakes!
>their therapeutic action is based on their potent effect at making people(any person for that matter) indifferent to everything.
Yes, I have thought that! I think NRIs like desipramine (let's ignore the inexplicable reboxetine) are much less destructive in their long term effects on a person's psychological state and personality.
>.....take a normal human reaction, and label it into a "disorder" and magnify it until it is a "chemical imbalance" and "mental illness".e.g. social anxiety "disorder",was never heared of before,and now it is a very common mental illness.
As you may know, I'm not the world's greatest fan of the DSM!
>people who feel very uncomfortable in social situations(me included),may need a drink or a benzo occasionally to smmoth things a bit or be more educated and trained how to deal with situations,but to be put indiffenetly on powerful medications such as Paxil in the belief of this chemical imbalance with few if any positive results,and if not,more and more medications....ughhh.
I think many people with severe social phobia do need medication. Paxil's not great though! It's generally dumb when doctors tell people that they've got a chemical imbalance!
Are you on Lexotanil at the moment? If you got severely depressed in the future would you choose imipramine?
Regards,
Ed.
Posted by ed_uk on January 14, 2005, at 12:14:43
In reply to Re: What is an antidepressant?Any input please? » ed_uk, posted by phillipa on January 13, 2005, at 22:51:31
Hello!
>ED, you always amaze me on how efficiently you research a topic so as to respond so professionally.
Thank you very much :-)
>Also, what is wrong with trying a first line defense of benzo's for the depression (which we know percipates the anxiety of why we feel so depressed)
I think benzos can be useful for anxious depression. Not everyone with depression suffers from anxiety though so benzos are often unhelpful.
Best Regards,
Ed :-)
Posted by CareBear04 on January 14, 2005, at 16:30:35
In reply to Re: What is an antidepressant?Any input please? » phillipa, posted by ed_uk on January 14, 2005, at 12:14:43
hi, interesting posts. someone mentioned that serotonin is the neurotransmitter of the 90s. i'm not up to date with the new drugs, but what are the new trendy neurotransmitters these days? i know that i was on effexor for a long time, which is supposed to hit more than serotonin. it didn't much for me for depression; was more helpful for anxiety. i was on 150mg max, and i don't know if you need a higher dose for better results. that's why i've been more keen on tricyclics because they hit more neurotransmitters. out of the SSRIs, the only one that has worked for me is zoloft. i tried strattera for awhile as an ADD drug, and when it didn't do anything, i think my pdoc suggested that my depressions must be serotonin based since the NE didn't help. but if that's the case, why have my experiences with other SSRIs just made me crazy and psychotic or else a depressed zombie? any thoughts? thanks.
Posted by zeugma on January 16, 2005, at 10:28:12
In reply to Re: What is an antidepressant?Any input please? » ed_uk, posted by darkhorse on January 14, 2005, at 5:39:40
Hi Darkhorse (And Ed),
Your questions and observations are very on target. there is a historical answer to your question: the term 'antidepressant' was coined by Roland Kuhn, who observed the effect of imipramine on depressed patients and thought he saw a specific effect on the illness that was different from the stimulatory action of the amphetamines.
Nathan Kline, an American psychiatrist, had observed the effects of the first MAO inhibitor and coined the term 'psychic energizer' to describe its actions. Kuhn's term became more popular and imipramine and other TCA's became more widely used anyway because of incidences of serotonin syndrome and hypertensive crisis with MAOI use, which were more alarming because the reactions were so unexpected given the state of medical knowledge in the early 60's.
David Healy, in "The Antidepressant Era", says that since the SSRI's are more like the MAOI's in terms of being effective for OCD, that the current meaning of 'antidepressant' is more like the 'psychic energizer' concept, although Healy is also very aware that the MAOI's have an overall action that is very different. he also draws attention that clomipramine, which is the TCA with the strongest effects on serotonin, puzzled clinicians for many years because it seemed to have an effect closer to a 'psychic energizer' than a pure 'antidepressant' ('thymoleptic' was actually Kuhn's preferred term, but 'antidepressant' is a fair translation and is catchier).
In terms of my own observations, SSRI's do not seem to be like what Kuhn describes, or like what I have experienced on nortriptyline.
I think it's especially important to pay attention to these early conceptions, because they were formed in ignorance of their relationship to the biogenic amines, and so they were 'purer' because the clinicians were taken by surprise and didn't see what they thought they should see- in fact Kuhn expected imipramine to be an antipsychotic!
-z
Posted by darkhorse on January 17, 2005, at 8:46:19
In reply to Re: What is an antidepressant?Any input please? » darkhorse, posted by ed_uk on January 14, 2005, at 12:11:52
> Hello,
>
> Are you on Lexotanil at the moment? If you got severely depressed in the future would you choose imipramine?I'm not on any drug for the moment,and it feels nice to let my body and mind function naturally.But I know that I'll be back with some benzo use,maybe some bromazepam or alprazolam..etc
.
If MD hit me again real nasty,I'm not going to waste my time with all those new wonder drugs..I'll go back to the most balanced and true AD:imipramine...but this time I'm not going to stay on it for long,just to aid through the hard times.I hope I will never ever going to need an AD again,and more important an MD episode.
> Regards,
D.H.
Posted by darkhorse on January 17, 2005, at 8:51:52
In reply to Re: What is an antidepressant?Any input please? » darkhorse, posted by zeugma on January 16, 2005, at 10:28:12
> Hi Z,
>
> In terms of my own observations, SSRI's do not seem to be like what Kuhn describes, or like what I have experienced on nortriptyline.
Yes, I agree. AD's and especially SSRIs are hardly psychic "energizers".Thanx for youe useful input,and BTW,I like "thymoliptic" more than "antidepressant" bec it is more general.
Best wishes,
D.H.
>
> -z
>
>
Posted by CareBear04 on January 17, 2005, at 10:55:59
In reply to Re: What is an antidepressant?Any input please? » ed_uk, posted by darkhorse on January 17, 2005, at 8:46:19
hey darkhorse,
i read your post and related immediately to what you said about letting the drugs wash out and becoming yourself again. i've been staying off the heavy duty prns like antipsychotics and narcotic painkillers and taking only the bare minimum-- lamictal, prozac, zoloft, and adderall (still a lot!-- and my mind feels so much clearer, and if there's such a thing as knowing myself (i've been medicated for so long) this seems like it. i hope your clarity lasts!
Posted by darkhorse on January 18, 2005, at 4:22:52
In reply to Re: What is an antidepressant?Any input please? » darkhorse, posted by CareBear04 on January 17, 2005, at 10:55:59
> hey darkhorse,
> i read your post and related immediately to what you said about letting the drugs wash out and becoming yourself again. i've been staying off the heavy duty prns like antipsychotics and narcotic painkillers and taking only the bare minimum-- lamictal, prozac, zoloft, and adderall (still a lot!-- and my mind feels so much clearer, and if there's such a thing as knowing myself (i've been medicated for so long) this seems like it. i hope your clarity lasts!Thank you CareBear 04.
You know,after taking many many psychotropic medications,I have come full circle with my attitude with those medications.I think that all of us who post here are not in the extreme poles i.e. we are not extremely severly miserable,and not totally well.From my experience,if I was severely depressed,I would not have the mood or motivation to read and concentrate.
I would have been living inside myself,and not botherd with anything else.Also, if I was fully content and happy I also wouldn't have bothered to read about medications.
I hope the best for you.
D.H.
Posted by CareBear04 on January 18, 2005, at 19:54:40
In reply to Re: What is an antidepressant?Any input please? » CareBear04, posted by darkhorse on January 18, 2005, at 4:22:52
darkhouse, yeah i totally agree with you about our all being between extreme poles of some variant of sickness and health. we all surely do care about getting better, and that's why we're here to learn about each others' experiences asnd advice. like you, i've come 180 in two years. when i first started lexapro two years ago, i was told that it was the greatest and newest drug ever and that i absolutely needed meds. that started a long journey that is still going on that has so far involved at least 30 psych meds, currently 14 at the same time. two years after my first experience with meds, i wish to God that i'd never started them. sure, there's convincing evidence of biological factors and a family tree that would contribute depressive or bipolar genes. still, i was 19, and i wondered about the meaning of life. in a previous hypomanic state, i had taken on more than anyone could manage and got an average of 3hrs of sleep a night. my close friend died, i felt like i could have prevented it, and i felt appropriately guilty and grieved. who wouldn't be depressed? winter break helped and time off helped, but during that time, i was increasingly pressured to start lexapro. my worst mood states, especially my blackest and most dangerous depressions have all been drug-induced. my moods used to be pretty stable with ups that lasted weeks or months followed by normalness followed by depression. meds have messed with the regularity of this cycle. now that i can't pare down the meds and no pdoc seems to be able to help, i would give almost anything to have refused the meds right off and tried to get better through any other means. my mind isn't intact anymore. the sharpness and mental acuity i used to have is in deep hiding if still existent. my drs i've asked are optimistic that i will regain baseline brain function, but i don't know when they mean-- when all the hits my brain has taken from lithium toxicities have worn off, when i get off certain meds like antipsychotics, when i get off all meds altogether (which one dr said will never happen.) they criticize me for being obsessed with the possibility of permanent brain damage, but as people who rely heavily on their brains to get through med school and training, who are they to tell me that i'm overly fixated on my future functioning? i'm 22, and i want to go to grad school and work in a professional capacity. i don't want to be dependent and loopy like i am right now.
it was good to read your post, and it encouraged me to know that people do recover from these illnesses, some with meds but some without, too. they say i can have a normal, high-functioning life if i just take the meds, but like i said, i've been on so many meds at such a formative period in my life, that i'm not even sure who i am when i'm not on meds, not depressed or manic. i guess the best i can hope for is to be at my best and to maximize my potential, which i haven't done to this point.good to hear from you!!!
Posted by phillipa on January 18, 2005, at 20:46:26
In reply to darkhorse-- about not being ourselves » darkhorse, posted by CareBear04 on January 18, 2005, at 19:54:40
Your Post "touched" my heart. You caused me to question the necessity of my own meds since my dx is depression/anxiety, and my med list =3. I sincerely hope you accomplish your dreams. You're so young to have been through so much. Fondly, Phillipa
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