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Re: Did I Give Parnate Enough Time? Ron Hill

Posted by bulldog2 on August 23, 2009, at 11:22:06

In reply to Re: Did I Give Parnate Enough Time? bulldog2, posted by Ron Hill on August 23, 2009, at 1:17:38

> > After surgery will be on morphine with a pump and back to percocet. Don't if that combo can be used with parnate or I have to get totally off to start.
>
> Hi Bulldog,
>
> As you know, percocet is a combination of oxycodone and acetaminophen.
>
> At the top of page 14 in the following document, it states that oxycodone, acetaminophen, and morphine are all okay to take with an MAOI.
>
> http://www.psy-world.com/1008CNS_Stahl.pdf
>
> Read the entire section of the paper that starts on page 12 and continues on to page 14. The title of the section is "MECHANISM OF DANGEROUS DRUG INTERACTIONS WITH MAIOs: COMBINING MAOIs WITH SEROTONIN REUPTAKE BLOCKADE"
>
> The entire document is a good read with really cool diagrams. It's worth the read. It is a recent document, published in 2008.
>
> The main author is Stephen M. Stahl, MD, PhD. Dr. Stahl is a great researcher. He's the guy that conducted the studies on Omega 3 fish oil as a tx for bipolar disorder.
>
> If I recall correctly, the link to this article was posted on PB in the recent past. But, I can't be sure because Lamictal (lamotrigine) kills my memory.
>
> Lastly, I recently discontinued Nardil and conducted a three month Parnate trial. The three reasons for my attempted change from Nardil to Parnate was: 1) I hoped to lose my 50 pound Nardil-induced weight gain; 2) I hoped Parnate would give me more energy that Nardil and; 3) I hoped Parnate would negate my Nardil-induced erectile dysfunction.
>
> I did a three week washout of Nardil and ramped up quickly to 80 mg/day of Parnate. I stayed at this dosage for three months. But, it was three months of hell; ZERO energy, NO motivation, apathy, and etc. The only benefits Parnate provided was an increased libido and greatly reduced erectile dysfunction.
>
> Like you, Bulldog, I wonder if Parnate would have started to work for me if I had stuck with the trial for several more months. But, the fact of the matter is I had no choice but to stop the trial and return to my plump friend Nardil. I had to become functional again because I was falling behind in ALL of my responsibilities.
>
> Therefore, I did a one week washout of Parnate, restarted Nardil, and ramped my Nardil up to 90 mg/day within a week.
>
> Ever since the Parnate withdrawal symptoms abated, I have been doing very well. I have been staying well instead of falling into my usual depressive stage associated with my bipolar ultra rapid cycling.
>
> -- Ron
>
> dx: Bipolar II with ultra rapid cycling (15 day cycle; six days depressed and nine days of a normal mood state) and mild OCPD
>
> 600 mg/day Trileptal
> 200 mg/day Lamictal
> 500 mg/day Keppra
> 90 mg/day Nardil
>

Are there any studies that show how nardil and parnate differ? As maois they both are supposed to destroy the enzymes that would metabolize the various neurotransmitters and thus build them up. I do know that nardil builds up gaba where parnate apparently does not.
So we have norepinephrine, serotonin and dopamine. Are there studies that show to what degree nardil and parnate build up each neurotransmitter? The fact is there must be a significant difference in the way each maoi works on the various neurotransmitters. If there wasn't a difference than most depressed people would respond equally well to either parnate or nardil. For some reason I get the feeling that nardil has a more profound effect on serotonin than parnate does.

 

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poster:bulldog2 thread:913502
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20090818/msgs/913630.html