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Re: Vicodin and Percocet for Depression

Posted by linkadge on August 15, 2007, at 20:29:57

In reply to Re: Vicodin and Percocet for Depression linkadge, posted by Quintal on August 15, 2007, at 18:24:05

>You don't have to alter your posting style on my >account, but I think it is common courtesy to do >so when demanding care and clarity from others.

I don't think I demanded anything of you.

>Do you understand why I might be confused and >alarmed by posts that have no apparent purpose?

I don't think 'alarmed' is the right word. They might be confused. I have read many posts that I have not understood. I usually ask a followup question and things become more clear.

>Is this linked to the role of BDNF is the >mesolimbic dopamine pathway? I see from the >first article you provided (and thank you for >doing so) that increased BDNF expression in this >pathway also produces a behavioral depressant >response. Since dopaminergic input from the VTA >modulates activity in the NAcc, and does this >via the mesolimbic pathway, it would seem that >BDNF has an inhibitory role on dopaminergic >transmission in the mesolimbic pathway, and >thereby the NAcc, which would then produce a >behavioral depressant response?

Not sure how it works. I do know that repeated administration of many drugs of abuse such as cocaine upregulates such transcripts in the mentioned regions.

>This is slightly confusing because drugs of >abuse, like the amphetamine example in the >previous post, have been used, and are indeed >used, in treatment resistant depression because >of their 'mood elevating' effect, which seems >quite the opposite of a behavioral depressant >response.

Depression is a documented possable side effect of long term amphetamine administration. I see where you are going with this, so let me just say that I am not the one who has chosen to classify drugs as they have been classified. Yes, in some models amphetamines pass as antidepressants. Indeed, some of the early researchers of the TCA's noted that they shared with the amphetamines the ability to inhibit the reuptake of certain monoamines.

To me, the bottom line is wheather the effect is sustainable. If amphetamines work for you, long term, as an antidepressant, then all the power to you.

>Yes, achieving the same level of euphoria from a >fixed dose of oxycodone taken continuously for >two years would be very unusual. It's also >possible though, that the level of euphoria did >decline over the course of treatment, but that >he still felt, and was grateful for, the small >relief still provided. I believe a similar thing >occurs with long-term benzodiazepine use. For >me, after almost one year of continuous use >codeine still has some small euphoriant effect, >I'd estimate less than 1/10th of what it was in >the beginning, yet I still manage better with >this small mercy than having no relief at all.

Thats what it should be all about. Using what works for you.

Some believe the real danger in adopting a liberal attitude about the use of opiates for depression is that individuals become addicted.

But, as it is becoming clearer, and clearer to some, conventional antidepressants somtimes fair no better on such domains.

Tollerance, dosage escalation, poop out, withdrawl, are terms that unfortunatly apply to SSRI's SNRI's TCA's MAOI's for some people.





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