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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 27 to 51 of 495. Go back in thread:
Posted by alexandra_k on January 29, 2014, at 1:42:01
In reply to Re: horrible interview, posted by alexandra_k on January 28, 2014, at 22:49:38
aaaah. english chick is married to philosophy guy. or maybe they just have concidentally the same last name. haha. tis a small world.
Posted by europerep on January 29, 2014, at 16:23:38
In reply to Re: horrible interview, posted by alexandra_k on January 29, 2014, at 1:42:01
Hey alexandra...
I don't usually browse the social forum, but I just came here, mainly because I'm bored, and saw this thread.
I don't know the exact background to what exactly you were interviewing for, but it's about access to some type university course that has entrance restrictions, right? is it something med-related? I think I remember you wanting to get into that. If you like, you can just briefly explain what exactly it is you're trying to get in to... I would like to know that :-)...
Sometimes I can relate to things you say, for example this here:
> so the latter is trickier. because they might not understand quite about how i can't function so well outside the university.
For me it's kind of like, I myself don't understand how I function so badly outside of university while I'm doing so well "inside" it. I'm not even sure whether my teachers would say that I'm doing particularly well, but I do get good grades, so I must be doing something right.
But I'm not really sure how I can translate that into getting somewhere. I mean getting grades is one thing, but getting into a PhD program where you compete with other good students who have not spent a third of their life lying on their bed apathetically and wishing they were dead, is something else entirely. Plus I'm far from having actually recovered, I'm just doing better now. But noone is going to give me anything "because you've have come a long way", I'll either get somewhere on my own merits, or I won't get there at all. And I would do so much better if I were even just a little further on my path away from depression. Ugh, I don't know...Not sure whether this makes sense to you. But, yeah, as I said, sometimes you post things I think I can identify with, and since noone else had replied yet, I just thought I'd go ahead...
Posted by alexandra_k on January 29, 2014, at 22:31:58
In reply to Re: horrible interview » alexandra_k, posted by europerep on January 29, 2014, at 16:23:38
Hi. It is a sort of a bridging course. I didn't realize before how cumulative science was and just how much math was required to do university physics etc. So it is basically a year where I try and get from where I am now... To where the high school kids are at. So I have a chance competing against them for a place in medicine 2015. If I did the Bio-Med year this year... I wouldn't have a hope, really.
They say: 'This program is for people who want to begin studying at tertiary level but have left school with minimal or no qualifications'.
The selection criterion involves such things as, being motivated to do it, not having too many other demands to juggle. Etc etc. I've seen it. I'd score highly at it.
The sticking point (insofar as there is one) is the program co-ordinator. A sort of... Personality clash. Of the sort that I found at tech, really. She sends out emails with lots of FUNNY TYPE FONTS. Lots more text than strictly necessary and stuff in red, underlined etc. During the testing she was talking to us - saying we could start reading our test scripts - and saying we could start filling in an application form... All at once. I wondered at the time 'is she TRYING to overload people? is she TRYING to get people filling in their application form rather than spending their precious 30 minutes actually doing the test? Is she TRYING to weed out those with attention difficulties?'. She didn't seem to be trying to make it easy for anybody... Then when we had started doing the tests she started having a conversation with someone who asked her something... Then was wandering around talking to people...
I just... Really struggle with people like that. She's the program co-ordinator... The gatekeeper.. But... One voice in many. I think I got the English chick onside (she is the English tutor - and she seemed supportive of my not doing English). She was reluctant to tell me what score I got in Math... But she didn't seem... Appalled. So I think I did okay-ish. Okay-ish to be considered for science math. Maybe because x did = 2 after all.
I think the science people will want me.
Anyway... She is the program co-ordinator... Not the tutor. And a committee decides, of which she is one voice. So... She's just... She just represents the attitude I've had all along... People couldn't stop me being good at reading. SO they tried to prevent me doing other things. Because it wouldn't have been fair if I was good at other things too... They aren't like this with everybody, though. So... I don't quite understand why it is that people really turn on / don't like ME. Why they don't like ME succeeding or achieving or whatever.
She asked me how old I was too. Which you aren't allowed to do. And she asked me whether I thought I was too old to be a surgeon. And I said they weren't allowed to discriminate on the basis of age. And she said 'yeah, they can say that but they probably do that anyway'. And I was like 'yeah, and there really aren't any female engineers either, so I may as well just give up right now' (extending). And she was like... No... There are LOTS of female engineers. Which of course... There aren't. But I wasn't going to get into an argument with her about that anymore than I was going to get into an argument with the health science intake person after she said it was harder to get in here than it was to get into melbourne or sydney medical programs (there are stats on that, and there are rankings on institutions and that simply isn't true). why do people talk???
HOly crap.
If you get good grades then you are doing well. What do you do? What field are you in? Would you like to do a PhD somewhere? Getting a place in one is a lot about luck. I know someone who applied to, like, 9 places. She only got on offer: from her 'dream' institution. The lower ranked ones she thought she'd definately get an offer from passed her over. If you want to do it and your grades are good you should go for it. More grad students spend a much greater portion of their lives lying in bed apathetically wishing they were dead than you might think.
Posted by alexandra_k on January 30, 2014, at 14:41:38
In reply to Re: horrible interview, posted by alexandra_k on January 29, 2014, at 22:31:58
It is possible I'm not quite being fair... I did say that I was happy not to unenroll from the Bio-Med courses I'm currently enrolled in for a while yet since they have started to make course books available. If I can get all the course books... I can get a good head start on the material over next summer, you see... And if I get a place in this program.. Well.. Apparently they will take over my enrollment (not giving me any opportunity to hold off accepting a place).
But I do feel fairly angry that I wasn't given opportunity at primary school and... That this same attitude crops up now. At tech. And potentially at uni, too. I think... Honestly... It is an attitude mostly found in people who aren't particularly bright... And - actually most importantly - people who weren't taught / didn't themselves get the opportunity to acquire various skills.
I mean... With the email thing... I don't know why nobody tells her 'email them as you want them to email others. Teach them how to email professionally. Courteous greeting, keep the message as simple as possible, courteous goodbye'. Otherwise, how are they supposed to learn? You want to get a bunch of first assignments (too) in pretty colors on weird sorts of paper etc etc? Of course not! Preparing people for university study... Sigh.
Controlling your attention to focus on what is important IS hard. You need to start really small and only build up distractors once you have been taught how to focus. Why is it that the educationally disadvantaged are the ones to find themselves in the most scattered, distraction filled environments? Who are bombarded with emails telling them false things like "FINAL OPPORTUNITY TO SIT DIAGNOSTIC TESTING IF YOU DO NOT ATTEND YOUR APPLICATION WILL NOT BE FURTHER CONSIDERED" every few days. Teaching people how to ignore instructions (since they are filled with content that simply isn't true?) Reinforcing their current inability to follow instructions?
How do these people manage to get themselves into these employment positions? Or... How is it that they weren't sent on training courses etc etc etc in order to knock this sort of stuff out of them????? I simply... Don't understand. I don't understand. I really don't believe that I ever will understand this.
I remember at tech... People really seemed to hate... Or... sometimes grudgingly admire one of the guys there. He was the most athletic by a long shot. Tall guy, too. Big. Over 6 foot. Probably around 105kg. Boxer. He worked really very hard -- and he simply was better at most things. Everything, really. Flexibility, even. Balance. Weird stuff like that. Could triple under with a jump rope. Said he did years of jump rope for boxing...
What I didn't understand... Was why the tutors didn't get him into something REAL. Get NZ selectors interested in him or something. Because he was miles ahead of the other kids... And motivated... I didn't think he was particularly dumb... He had sports-smarts... And he'd sit up the front and really pay attention in class... And they just sort of mucked about with him after class etc. Instead of trying to get him into proper training. Introducing him to proper trainers. Why didn't they try and help him up?
Instead... They seemed to think he had enough already. He didn't really get anything from them... ANy extra encouragment or anything... Really... Nobody did. But the whole class (practically) would groan when he won a contest or something. Even though he was a nice guy. With never a bad word. Nobody delighted in his achievements or anything...
I don't understand how people can be so mean spirited. Clip the wings off angels people would. Get me far far far far far away from people such as these...
I would like to meet the tutors for the program. Because if this year turns out to be another year of being given instructions that nobody expects anybody to follow... If we are given ill information etc etc... Well... I have concerns.. Most of the lecturers have PhDs... But I also know it is NOT the end of the world if you don't (I tell myself)... I've met people who have done the program and they said it served them well... But they didn't come from university study to the program. I don't know how they would find going from university study to the program... Co-ordinator person isn't a tutor... She is an administrator (I think). Deep breaths. Deep breaths...
If I don't get a place... I can get the course books for bio-med. So I won't be going into next year cold. Got one of them... And there is a bunch of embryology (very early cell development) stuff I've never really seen... They are pretty clear on what stuff you need to know... Keeping it simple... The material... Accumulates into masses... Quite by itself... Without any need of you messing things up with your fonts and irrelevant information...
Do 'related but different' papers... Animal biology rather than human (since there is a lot of overlap). There is a prepratory physics paper and a prepratory chemistry paper, too. There isn't a lower level math paper. I guess I'd just cut myself back to part time status (would need to talk to accom people here... HOpefully it would be alright given some special pleading...) and learn the math in my own time.
What f*cks me off is that I f*ck*ng well DID go back to High School. Sort of. I bombed out my last year of High School. So I moved to a different school as an adult student. I went through a year of hell of all the high school social sh*t crap in order to get my entry to uni. The people applying for this program... Why don't they do that? It is an option for them, surely. WHereas me, now. 35 years old... C'mon... It isn't an option for me...
Posted by alexandra_k on January 30, 2014, at 15:59:47
In reply to Re: horrible interview, posted by alexandra_k on January 30, 2014, at 14:41:38
when i asked why she talked, i didn't mean *generally*. i meant... i didn't understand why she said certain particular things. like the thing about my age. what was the point of that? to see how i handle inappropriate questions in a formal setting? thats being a bit too charitable on my part, i think... i don't win empathy votes by wondering why people talk, too. i know that. i wondered it out loud to someone before and she... wanted to murder me, i think.
i must be the one who lacks empathy, yeah?
i worry a bit because they say this course is 9-5. if what they *mean* to say is something along the lines of - we expect that you will treat it like a full time job with the amount of study etc you do of it - then that is fine. of course.
if they mean we have to spend hours sitting in class because they are trying to keep us off streets in order to, say, keep the crime rate down, like what tech was all about... hours of sitting in noisy classrooms so that it took far longer than it needed to to do tasks (since you can't focus in such environments) all for the purposes of making busy-work for us... when i think of how much work i've actually got to do on math and on learning the stuff for embryology etc... don't even get me started on chemical functional groups... if they are planning on spamming up our lives into 9-5...
i'm scared.
Posted by alexandra_k on January 30, 2014, at 16:15:33
In reply to Re: horrible interview, posted by alexandra_k on January 30, 2014, at 15:59:47
i guess it is when i get scared :(
stuff is going up!!
there are lab manuals with extensive (boy do i mean extensive) instructions on how to use the microscopes and... everything. lmfao.
Posted by alexandra_k on January 30, 2014, at 19:54:52
In reply to Re: why am i so horrible?, posted by alexandra_k on January 30, 2014, at 16:15:33
why...
why oh why oh why....
have 90 billion (i exaggerate) files... when merging everything into one document will do?
?
??????
here's a thought:
let them spend a day sorting out making sure they have the stuff. you know... give them loads of files then they download them then they display in different order.. corrupt one... make them spend a good day sorting this stuff out...
i mean...
it isn't like they have better things to be doing with their time.
it isn't like they could actually be spending that time learning stuff that needs to be learned.
why is it that the 'hard option' presents the information most simply, most clearly...
that the 'easy passes' (yes, that is what that paper is supposed to be - no point getting more than B+ doesn't count for anything) can't... organise its way out of a paper bag??
simple and clear is HARD.
i forget that.
best students: get best teachers: get best contents: get clearest, most succinct, most LEARNABLE information to learn.
but you have to earn the right to get to there.
:(
i see...
i got a nice email (wonderful, ha!) from my phd... good administrators are so very very very very hard to find and worth (far more!!!!) than their weight in gold..... my annual report is due. oh. i .. thought they may have cut me.
i will do it. honestly.. truly.. genuinely. i don't want to burn bridges there. i would love to see them back off... and support (allow) me to do this. i don't know that it is possible. but i know it isn't if i don't be honest with them. if i don't ask.
so i'll say what i've got to (it will take me a lot of soul searching and work this weekend) and we will see.
Posted by alexandra_k on January 30, 2014, at 22:00:19
In reply to Re: why am i so horrible?, posted by alexandra_k on January 30, 2014, at 19:54:52
i...
can't get it out of my head that i have followers. on twitter... or whatever. stuff i don't even understand.
i do worry that people are following me that way. but i also... wonder sometimes... if my life may be going better because of it. i don't know whether it is unrealistic, grandiose, whatever whatever to think that people may be following me... sometimes it feels like it may make the best sense...
or maybe there just is some kind of order to the world that i don't quite see. maybe this is why people are spiritual. i don't know.
i was wrong about english chick. she isn't the partner of philosophy guy. i mean, she could be his third cousin or something but... whatever... i'm glad, actually...
i think most university support staff come from partners. to solve the 2 body problem. i always feel... some kind of ambivalence... about that when it comes to hires... i don't know...
i wouldn't like to be thought of as a spousal hire. i have thought that certain people were spousal hires before and felt... embarrased for them. even when... they probably weren't. or... they certainly were competent enough in what they did...
i think when i feel upset about things... i just need to spend more time hanging with my friends. social supports. whatever. there was a phil social function that i bailed on. felt badly about... ambivalent about... i really need to invest in clothing... get up the courage to do some of that at some point... just so i can do some of this stuff without feeling too self conscious... am there at the moment. too self conscious to do anythign.
i've realised why people don't leave me alone when i'm shopping. its because i bring my big gym bag so the shop theft people hound me. that is what that is about. i don't think they realise they are deterring me from browsing... and definately dettering me from buying... that my gym bag is actually awful hard to get hands etc into with the way the handles lock etc etc.
good to know, actually. i can do something about that.
had a talk today about foundation program to someone who did it. it WOULD be a good thing for me. yeah. i'm fairly sure. the english tutor was... great. really. someone who i think i could go have a cry to if i needed. the admin person is harder... but i need to get better at genuinely getting along. i mean... what? do i think i won't find people like that in med?????
?
?
Posted by alexandra_k on January 30, 2014, at 22:23:01
In reply to Re: why am i so horrible?, posted by alexandra_k on January 30, 2014, at 22:00:19
just for the record... i felt really f*ck*ng bad about missing the social thing. i'm not entirely sure who new person was... but if she was person i met last year, she was very nice indeed, and i would very much like to be friends. if there is a seminar: i will get to that. and drinks afterwards. but otherwise... the social thing is hard for me. and i don't have a go-to safety person yet. i'll come right eventually... i wills...
Posted by Partlycloudy on January 31, 2014, at 6:44:11
In reply to Re: why am i so horrible?, posted by alexandra_k on January 30, 2014, at 22:23:01
You are not horrible.
Just had to get that out of the way.
When will you know the results of the interview? It sounds so much like high school. Trying to fit square pegs through round holes, regardless of their abilities in one area or another. It isn't as if a balanced eduction, with equal comprehension in ALL disciplines, actually means something.I really disliked school. No room for individuality, intuition, and, at that level, creativity in whatever subject (unless it was theatre).
It's very messed up and unnecessary. Puts undue strain on you, who obviously is NOT stupid. And don't get me started on trigonometry. Never used it once since being force fed it in school. Gah.
Posted by alexandra_k on January 31, 2014, at 20:07:27
In reply to Re: why am i so horrible?, posted by Partlycloudy on January 31, 2014, at 6:44:11
i guess trig is only really useful for certain skilled professions... engineering, neurosurgery, land surveying, engineering etc... maybe handy for building things about the house... i don't know. i never learned any.
the us education system is fairly different from ours. much broader with math requirements on graduation. we are allowed to - if not actively encouraged to - specialize early. i think there are pros and cons with both systems... i actually think that the main reason ours is the way it is is more about economics more than anything else. us kids get more of an extended childhood.
i don't get how you are in the position to decide at 14 or 16 or even at 18 what it is that you want to do with the rest of your life. i don't think it is a good idea to cut off options...
if someone had sat me down and said 'math is required for science. if you stop math now / don't get caught up then you will have to come right back to where you are now down the track... or you will never be able to do science. it is cumulative like that' i think i would have been persuaded. if someone had said 'sure you want to be an english teacher NOW but do you really want to be an english teacher? How about all these other things you might be able to do... don't you want to at least leave options open for a while longer yet??'
actually... less than that... if my teachers had actually picked up that i didn't know my times tables (they did know that, actually) and, instead of taking great delight in the fact that i was struggling, actually, you know, teach me... then things probably never would have gotten to the point where they ended up with me.
i found plenty of opportunity to be creative. with creative writing in english, with art, with aspects of history narration... but i was channelled through the creative subjects and I didn't realize it was going to block off opportunity to study physics / chemistry until it was too late.
then realizing that medicine was ruled out because of that.
so feeling kinda stuck, really.
do you resent learning trig even though you don't use it? if you have kids... you are in the position to help and encourage them with their math homework... so that careers like that are more of an option for them... you don't really know if you are good at something / if you will come to like something unless you are exposed to it, and encouraged for a bit. my father said he resented being made to learn shakespeare because he wanted to be a builder... but years later he said he had learned to like such things now, and he still remembered a lot he learned in school about it, and was glad he was made to do it. just not so glad he wasn't really made to appreciate it. i did art history and thought it was a waste of time... but now... i remember my doric and ionic columns and i'm glad i did it.... seeing vases sometimes and being like 'oh hey! i know a little (really a very little) something about that!'.
i feel sad that... i have never really been encouraged by those whose job it was supposed to be to encourage me. i feel sad that they didn't try and give me to other people who might have been in better position to (e.g., get me externally tested, try and get me scholarships to study better places)... instead they just took great delight in holding me back and seeing me struggle.
i feel angry, actually, too.
i think it comes back to this tension... on the one hand, people want to believe that some are naturally talented or gifted or whatever. it justified their own apathy. it is like 'well, they succeed because they are gifted, i could never do that because i am not, so i don't need to give myself a hard time at all for not even trying or working at it even a little bit'. on the other hand people want to believe that those who excel work really very very very very hard. that they aren't naturally talented or gifted or anything like that. rather... they are deserving of their success because of how hard they work. we like to hear of how people really fought for their success against the odds. that athletes get up really crazy early to train etc etc etc. it isn't that they are ... just naturally or intrinsically better people.
there is this tension... and if you don't manage to regulate peoples emotions just so... then they will turn...
and i suspect it has really rather a lot to do with the people around you... i feel... envious? of the kids who get to go home to help out with the production of a home cooked meal being all like 'so mum, today in embryology the proff was saying and can you tell me more about what is up with......'
in the first day of physics the proff was like... if you have a jar and it weighs x and a fly and it weighs y... and you put the fly in a jar and the fly is buzzing about in the jar and you put the fly and the jar on the scales then does the scale weight register x or x+y
?
and he was like 'and go home and ask that to your parents folks!' and the point being... and then we can predict who is likely to do well / try hard / be motivated to succeed in their education...
Posted by alexandra_k on January 31, 2014, at 20:23:21
In reply to Re: why am i so horrible?, posted by alexandra_k on January 31, 2014, at 20:07:27
i think i didn't get to see my math test (when i showed interest she sort of grabbed it back away from me) was because there was a typo in it.
one of the questions asked us to fill in the blank on the basis of some info they gave us. it was basically... demonstrating the associative or perhaps commutative property of addition. a question like that. only... they left a 0 off one of the numbers - so... it didn't actually demonstrate whatever property i suspect it was supposed to, after all. anyway... i said 'if there is supposed to be a zero there then this. otherwise i'm going to have to try and balance these somehow (since i was supposed to use the previous info to help me) and... whatever. did something.
sigh.
one of the things was about captain cook, too... about how he noticed that the ships mast disappeared into the horizon in the distance. that that PROVED to him that the earth was round. Which of course, it didn't. while it was evidence in SUPPORT empirical evidence isn't at all the right sort of thing to count as a proof (category error, people!)
we have to do 'english language dx screening'. first question: a theory is equivalent to:
the answer is supposed to be:
a hypothesis.
why do English people get to make up these tests?????
Posted by alexandra_k on January 31, 2014, at 23:46:46
In reply to Re: why am i so horrible?, posted by alexandra_k on January 31, 2014, at 20:23:21
perhaps it is about... upsetting the natural order.
you aren't supposed to be able to do well, coming from my background.
it has to be about helping people (who wouldn't do anything otherwise) get entry to scrape through a degree. first in family sort of a thing.
it can't be about helping people (who wouldn't get in otherwise) do programs like... medicine.
i mean... that is what private schools are for. a lot of people invested a lot in their children over the years... helping them do their homework... encouraging them... supporting them... loving them... taking delight in them... sending them to private schools... getting them doing extra-curricular... setting them up with compatible friends...
if people from disadvantaged backgrounds have any chance at all it is when they are identified early enough to get to go to the good schools... to get good, supportive teachers behind them, at the very least. you know... expensive schools. expensive teachers.
if people like me (low decile public schools) stand a chance against people like them then... well...
no.
that simply can't be.
it is too late for me, they tell me. i'm good at english! why do i need to be good at anything else for? i mean, sheesh... who do i think i am???
being a high school english teacher is a suitably respectable thing to do. what do i ?? i think i'm better than that? some people don't have enough to eat. and some people never even get to go to school. who am i??? ungrateful little bitch...
Posted by alexandra_k on February 1, 2014, at 0:00:36
In reply to Re: the natural order, posted by alexandra_k on January 31, 2014, at 23:46:46
because the 'different breed of people' thing... that is how that goes down.
sigh.
(of course *it doesn't*. that is what is wrong / upsetting about that)
just thinking aloud...
sigh.
*just thinking aloud*.
i'm not particularly upset. a little stressed that year 6 math is getting harder and i simply don't see how to do various things (though i finally finished all of year 5!!!!!) i... do need this program. i mean... i'll make things work if i don't get in because there isn't anything else to be done except that, but i really do need this program.
maybe the math teacher will let me audit the class anyways ahaha. actually... that's not so silly...
i'm scared that i won't get in. and then, i'm also scared that i will get in, and that it will turn out to be like tech.
all i need for it to be okay: is for them to let me learn. for them to understand that it isn't about me aiming to be the best of my cohort... it is about me aiming to be as well prepared to do the best in bio-med as i possibly can. so... i'll do my very best to power through the work and... if at all possible... do some extension stuff. along the lines of those other functional groups etc etc. head-start stuff. because even if i ace the program... it is still a huge jump from there to bio-med. being proficient with a microscope will help heaps for labs. practice with chemistry equations...
if they are like 'you have learned enough' so i'm expected to spend all my time... sitting quietly in the corner. or helping others. then i don't know what i'll do. i mean... helping other is really important -- so long as i get to learn too. that is the thing.
if it is okay to excel anywhere at all in this whole stupid country... it is here. it is just that this program. well, it is supposed to be a bridge. so it... isn't quite there yet.
anyway... year 6 math... ticking along, i am. just some trouble dividing smaller numbers by bigger numbers (long division / decimals) and converting funny fractions (yeah, x by 25!!! why didn't that occur to me!!) and some freaky sh*t just happened with geometry... dilations... wtf??? getting there, i am, though. half way through, actually. only 6 more years to go. yah.
i've been reading this engineering book and it had some stuff on visuo spatial skills and was describing how to... do plans (I forget the terminology). how you draw 2d top and front and side so the person can reconstuct a 3d image... *in their mind*. how you learn to do that. how you learn to translate 3d mental pictures into these 2d images... starting with staircase blocks and simple stuff, of course. eventually... well... building up to things like organic molecules and bones, i guess. like learning to read music... there was stuff on how you learn to get better at drawing, too. how to draw elipses and circles of various diameter and archs... way cool.
math is very visual. can't really describe a lot of it. have to see or be shown... way cool.
Posted by europerep on February 1, 2014, at 15:19:04
In reply to Re: the natural order, posted by alexandra_k on January 31, 2014, at 23:46:46
> perhaps it is about... upsetting the natural order.
>
> you aren't supposed to be able to do well, coming from my background.
>
> it has to be about helping people (who wouldn't do anything otherwise) get entry to scrape through a degree. first in family sort of a thing.
>
> it can't be about helping people (who wouldn't get in otherwise) do programs like... medicine.
>
> i mean... that is what private schools are for. a lot of people invested a lot in their children over the years... helping them do their homework... encouraging them... supporting them... loving them... taking delight in them... sending them to private schools... getting them doing extra-curricular... setting them up with compatible friends...
>
> if people from disadvantaged backgrounds have any chance at all it is when they are identified early enough to get to go to the good schools... to get good, supportive teachers behind them, at the very least. you know... expensive schools. expensive teachers.
>
> if people like me (low decile public schools) stand a chance against people like them then... well...
>
> no.
>
> that simply can't be.
>
> it is too late for me, they tell me. i'm good at english! why do i need to be good at anything else for? i mean, sheesh... who do i think i am???
>
> being a high school english teacher is a suitably respectable thing to do. what do i ?? i think i'm better than that? some people don't have enough to eat. and some people never even get to go to school. who am i??? ungrateful little bitch...Ha, for once there's a post of yours that I understand from A to Z. Or at least I think that I do...
There are two things I'd like to say.
One, I think I kind of identify with how you feel vis-à-vis your university's "establishment", or more generally the people who tell you - explicitly or implicitly - that it's too late, or that you should aim lower, or whatever. I'm not really in the same situation, socio-economically speaking, because I come from a solid middle class family. Maybe even a hint more than solid... but not rich. But my parents invested a lot in me and my sister's education. The thing is, my past has taken a toll on my grades, especially at the end of high-school, and so on paper I look less privileged than I actually am. And I also "lost a few years."
But when I look around, or especially when I read about great thinkers or scientists on the internet, so many of them also have a "weird" history. I think that, sometimes, being privileged is actually kind of something that can hold you back, simply because you are already privileged. Had I not had to really fight to survive my disease, I think I'd be more successful on paper but less ambitious and motivated to fight to show everyone, not least myself, that I do have something going for me.
And I see that you fight. I don't understand every part of every of your posts, but it is completely clear that you do fight. That's what matters. And not just "matter" in the sense that it's the right thing to do even if you fail, but if you keep going like you are, you will not fail.
So, in short I guess my point is, fuck them lol.
The second thing is about what you said here:
> i mean... that is what private schools are for. a lot of people invested a lot in their children over the years... helping them do their homework... encouraging them... supporting them... loving them... taking delight in them... sending them to private schools... getting them doing extra-curricular... setting them up with compatible friends...
Are you sure about the "loving them" part? And even the encouraging and supporting and helping them with their homework all too often looks to me like parents investing in their children so they will pay off, especially in terms of prestige. ("My son is studying law, la-di-da") I am very glad that I wasn't sent to a private school (there are very few of them here anyway, much less than in Britain for example). And here too, feeling entitled is probably not the ideal condition in which to excel.
Ok, that's all ;)...
Posted by alexandra_k on February 1, 2014, at 17:24:28
In reply to Re: the natural order » alexandra_k, posted by europerep on February 1, 2014, at 15:19:04
i know you are right. people from 'privileged' backgrounds often have a very hard time of things, too, in a bit of a different way. there can be considerable pressure on them to do well and to become doctors or engineers or whatever... and sometimes they might really want to become something like a High School English Teacher because they really relish the thought of working with kids and getting them doing drama and writing poems and...
Or they might want more of a 9-5 job. Something... More of a job. They want to be able to walk away from their job at the end of the day and be able to invest a lot more in their family / their social / their extracurricular stuff.
Try explaining that to some parents... I think that is part of why people are happy to believe 'it is so really very hard!!!' because then it gives people an out. They can say to their family 'I tried but I failed!' then hopefully they will feel bad for them and not give them a hard time.
And you are right about the love thing, too, of course. I've met many a ... soulless?? Upper class house. And just because Mum knows about embryology doesn't mean she wants to talk about it with you at the end of the day. Assuming she isn't still in the lab, at any rate.
Life sucks for everybody, heh.
I think it is more about acceptance vs expectation.
Keep coming back to that speech... Don't mourn for us / me... Whatever it was... Don't mourn for your child that your child is autistic / an artist / a wanna be scientist / a boat builder / a gymnast / whatever... Mourn for the ideal you had of the child you wanted... Mourn the loss of that... Then put it away... And there is your child.
I think things will be okay for me. The English chick was fine... Piecing things together now... I think she is an advocate for me. The admin chick... Well... I think I'm supposed to be finding excuses to email her about this and that and I think I'm supposed to be loitering in her hallway trying to suck up... I think that is the expectation. Which is probably why English chick asked me about Autism... And left the interview criterion on the table before leaving to ask admin chick something for a minute... They need to prioitise my application because I"m an applicant with disability. I score highly on their criterion because I have my life in order: I will prioritise the program. I don't have kids / family to juggle. I don't have transport issues. Someone just needs to be clear with admin chick that the point of her getting a vote isn't for her to vote for the kids who suck up to her the most. There is an actual criterion...
Posted by alexandra_k on February 1, 2014, at 17:52:12
In reply to Re: the natural order, posted by alexandra_k on February 1, 2014, at 17:24:28
of course the 'upper class' thing is relative... or, more, i need to adjust to it turning out to be quite different from what i initially took it to mean. and so i still get that wrong sometimes.
it used to be about:
royal.
the first son got the inheritance. a life of leisure.
the second son went to the university? lawer? doctor? profession. 'middle class'. working.
the third went to the church.or something like that.
university professor... is considered to be a... humble thing. i guess some could earn a lot more in industry / private business. not so for philosophy ahahahaha.
but you need a patron. someone to... pay you. support your life. to whatever standard you manage to get... so they feel good about... being around you...
i don't suppose trophy wives do wonders for their childrens educational prospects... i guess that is what those private boarding schools are for... thats whats good about getting wives into caring things... education... midwifery...
and getting your hair done your nails done your spray tan having your personal training etc etc etc is totally a full time job. caring what the twits are tweeting about you...
and of course that is different from royal. having a private business operating out of the basement of a million dollar cottage in ponsonby (for the tax breaks on your house and your car etc etc) is different. the strain of having to decide whether your kids should go to private school x or private school y is different. whether this or that school gets more people into bio-med, into med...
i would have loved boarding school. i thought. but that's probably because of reading too much mallory towers and the like. i would have had to have taken up lacrosse.
things are going to be okay... they are... its going to be okay. i'm mostly away from these people... those people... people who... are made uncomfortable by my existance. i am okay here. mostly. i think.
this just kind of threw me because i really wasn't expecting...
Posted by alexandra_k on February 5, 2014, at 16:06:36
In reply to Re: the natural order, posted by alexandra_k on February 1, 2014, at 17:52:12
been feeling this horrible... gnawing... scratchy feeling. have been getting to the gym over the past couple days, and that certainly is giving me some respite, but not really fixing things up the way it sometimes does.
i think it is a bunch of stuff just sort of... grinding at me. wearing me down...
everything is just turning out to be so very much more of a mission than it needs to be. like renewing my passport... the system not accepting the photo... so my trying to get internal affairs to take a look and upload it because there was nothing wrong with it (and i couldn't face another trip back to the photo store - so very hard to muster up the... whatever... to get it done in the first place). so the whole thing drags out over a couple weeks...
then about here... it is sorted now. i can stay in my room and they have even moved my contract over to the cheaper rate. so, perfect, really. but took a few days to sort that... and half a day to understand the rent account... the way they bill things etc etc... basically... they make us be / stay HEAPS in advance. which is fine by me. good security / enforced savings for me. but a little tricky to maneuver things into their appropriate state in the first place...
i think mostly what is getting to me is not having heard anything about whether i have a place in the foundations program or not... i've just kept myself enrolled in bio-med for now. hoping to collect anything they put up as online resources while i'm enrolled... helping me get a head start over next summer... but i need to enroll in the alternative courses i will take if i don't get into foundations... before they fill up and i'm well and truly screwed...
i don't know what to do about the math. i don't have an alternative plan. i... can't think of one. i'm... about 85% of the way through year 6 (about 8 skills to go, i think) and about 20% of something through year 7. which is... intermediate. about age... 11. so.... still not even ready for high school. sigh. mostly... okay. need to get my times tables more automatic... freeing up cognitive resources for other stuff... mostly okay. good progress actually, yeah. just a bit demoralized that often times it feels so slow.
and probably a lot demoralized that i work best at home in my room... which means i basically only get out to get to the gym. this is why my view helps a lot... helps me feel connected / part of things but enough distance (13 floors) to feel safely stowed away from it.
i guess i was really looking forward to summer school and then it didn't work out... seems like doing what i'm doing is the most productive use of my time, really.
i have to do my annual report for my phd. i'm dreading that. absolutely dreading it. i don't entirely know why. if anybody understands they will. it is my opportunity to think about / narrate / get clear on what has gone on for me over this last year. i need to remind myself... i am not a bad person. i am not a lazy slacker. i do not need to feel like a little weasel who is making up stories or casting about for excuses... but part of me feels a bit like this... like people will roll their eyes and be like 'and here she goes AGAIN'. and of course... i really don't think people view it that way. i'm just being... my own worst enemy. and i feel afraid.
and of course this year i have stuff to say... about how the sensory processing issues that screwed me over... well, about how they think i'm on the autistic spectrum. about how i'm getting accommodations for that and it is making my life a lot better. about how i need to study something here...
i don't know if it is possible for me to ... just give them my thesis when it is bloody well done. for them to.. not require me to do annual reports and stuff.. maybe it will be 5 years and maybe it will be 10. it might be when i'm retired ffs. but can't i just get it to them when i'm able? when i feel like i've got something worth saying / worth submitting? that was how things used to be... before degree factory... before... why can't it be like that again?
i don't know.
but it is making me feel yucky. and from here... it was bad of me to not have gotten to this phd socializing thing here from this end.... i'm just really bad at doing social stuff that requires effort. because the effort... brings on panic... if it is more spontaneous i don't have the opportunity to get myself wound up into a state about it... anyway.. emails from them about how i should have visiting status... blah.. there is a subtext i don't entirely understand. that i'm welcome? i appreciate that. that there is an expectation that i go? i feel ambivalent about that. i don't think they expect it of their own... so i don't suspect it is about that... i think they are reassuring me i'm welcome... even if i do foundations... that is nice of them. it is always possible that i'll bomb out. trying to do math / science. i mean... i won't. but nice for that pressure to be somewhat lifted.
dread...
i think i was taken off mailing lists etc too... but just been put back on... i don't entirely know. i don't entirely know what to say.
i don't have anyone to talk to. the guy from mental health... said he would email me in a couple weeks and then he didn't. so i emailed him a reply and quoted him saying that and was like 'yeah, right'. and he got back with me to have an appointment with this other person.... just stalling me... drawing things out for as long as possible... pissing about... pissing about... sigh. i'll see how it goes. maybe i will ask to see the doc after all. i'll see how this goes. i feel... i need someone to help me process some of the academic demands i have on me. i need someone who... understands the nature of the academic demands for them to have any hope in understanding what is likely going on in these situations that are unclear to me. so they can help me figure the range of appropriate responses or something like that. or help me figure appropriate ways in which i can seek clarification about what is expected / required of me or whatever. little help, people. but they keep assigning me to people who... are grossly unsuited to working with me.
Posted by alexandra_k on February 10, 2014, at 2:48:10
In reply to Re: horrible scratchiness, posted by alexandra_k on February 5, 2014, at 16:06:36
horrible scratchy still.
feeling... cross with myself today. grumpy in my interactions with others. others who are trying to help me.
i'm not sure what to do about the stuff that happened with the foundations application. maybe the best thing is for me to just let it go. i've got a lot on my plate right now and i don't want to get caught / entangled in that. i don't want to become known as person who complains about discrimination. i don't want to make more of a deal than needs to be made i... i don't think that spending more time thinking on it is likely to help me.
so... i need to drop back to part time. since i've been declined the only level math class was suitable. though... was it even? who knows. whatever. dropping back to part time has all kinds of ramifications... that i need to sort through. problematises accommodation etc etc and paying for it etc etc. a nice bonus (sort of) that i was going to get to get some clothes and sort out a phone and sort out the rest of my moving costs... i won't get that now. can't apply for the overdraft i was going to get now either. there it is.
i don't expect i'll lose the accommodation. if i don't tell them i'm moving to part time they will probably never even know. i won't be able to get the course books i was going to get... anyway... whatever.
whatever.
i went for a swim today. which was good. after i haven't been swimming since some guy was trying to be friendly before... which was even worse than when people try and talk to me in the gym. ugh.
i need to... do some classes. have some more structured people contact. i can barely string sentences together anymore.
Posted by Twinleaf on February 10, 2014, at 12:04:02
In reply to Re: horrible scratchiness, posted by alexandra_k on February 10, 2014, at 2:48:10
It sounded as though you had worked everything out so well in terms of housing, financial support and possibilities for graduate studies. Would you lose that security if you switched to part-time?
You are not alone in feeling a lot of stress - probably most of us have been there during our most difficult times. I certainly have. Would it help to rely a bit more on whatever psychological or psychiatric support is available - for example, to request an anti-anxiety medication for a short while?
Posted by alexandra_k on February 10, 2014, at 21:55:16
In reply to Re: horrible scratchiness » alexandra_k, posted by Twinleaf on February 10, 2014, at 12:04:02
hi. thanks for responding. yes, i think i'll take a pill tonight. try and have a chilled out day tomorrow.
i have decided i will email the disability guy about how i don't wish to lay complaint about the whole foundations thing... leave it be.
i am in the process of changing my enrollment back to part time. i have... a lot of math to be catching up on. it is just about... not becoming too much of a crazy hermit while i get it done.
i need to plan little things. walks. gym. and i will have a couple classes from march 3 so that will help me a lot.
i have an appointment to see a skills training lady on friday. i think i'm fairly stressed about that... and... just feeling awful exposed and vulnerable after hearing something that was so personal and hard for me... just bandied about over a couple days...
i think there is some back story about people knowing... what people know... i don't know. i feel... vulnerable. exposed. like... like a stereotype. like i don't know how to be anymore. like 'should i wash my hair it is looking a bit greasy if i don't wash it people will think i need help with self-care'... i don't know... probably being my own worst enemy... edge of paranoia...
tail end of my period.. which never helps. that really does affect me so. but yeah... i need more people contact. only trouble is it needs to be very structured to be bearable for me right now. i mean... i've basically been mostly solitary since... since i bombed out of weltec. so since... around october 2012.
i knew it wasn't good for me. then looking forward to physio and then getting exempted from those courses... then looking forward to summer school and needing to unenroll from those...
:-/
i will be alright. thank you. i still love my house. yes. love it very much indeed. they shampooed the carpets the other day. yay.
Posted by alexandra_k on February 11, 2014, at 23:37:24
In reply to Re: horrible scratchiness, posted by alexandra_k on February 10, 2014, at 21:55:16
the uni gym is AWESOME. i haven't seen so many squat racks! they have strength bags and kettlebells and:
they have a women's (or maybe a training i can't tell yet...) i think it might be women's... Eleiko bar.
:-0
i don't know how to describe... it is like driving a ferrari. maybe. i don't drive. it is just... a wonderful magical bar. the knurling is just perfect and the sleeves rotate just so. and it sits perfect in your hip crease when you get your grip width just right...
i think it's a women's bar. i was so happy i cried. i haven't had one since leaving australia... had a women's bar at weltec - but not an eleiko... and the grip on others isn't as good. had an eleiko power bar at aut but not a women's bar... it is wider and i can't wrap my hands about it as much, feels like it's trying to pull out of my hands whereas with the womens you just grip it and really throw your body around the bar... which i did. i'm so happy.
they have a couple sets of training bumpers...
:-0
oh wow. i can train oly lifting again. oh wow. just... wow. oh wow. i am so unbelievably happy.
and i still have my gym in the city. so when one pisses me off (e.g., as people get to know my routine and i start to feel harrassed) i can mix things up a bit by going to the other one. and i can pick and choose classes...
i feel like i'm about the luckiest person in the world right now...
home made chicken soup from my slow cooker... spent most of the day pottering about doing maths / cooking / cleaning. wonderful time at the gym. battling ropes!!! i forgot about them!!! crash mats, too. back flip - here i come!!!
perhaps i might find an exercise science class to enroll in.. hur...
Posted by Dr. Bob on February 12, 2014, at 22:39:58
In reply to Re: happy happy happy, posted by alexandra_k on February 11, 2014, at 23:37:24
Posted by alexandra_k on February 14, 2014, at 1:02:57
In reply to Re: happy happy happy, posted by alexandra_k on February 11, 2014, at 23:37:24
I've decided / discovered it is a training bar (what you teach kids on) rather than a woman's bar. So I'm not ecstatic anymore... But I'm happy enough.
The community mental health meeting went alright. The lady seems nice. She's an OT apparently. I asked her if she has a sensory gym and she said yes but looked surprised. I guess they are supposed to be for kids.
I don't want to get my hopes up or anything... Been there, done that. But she seemed nice, yeah. Have a meeting with her next week, so will see how that goes.
Still having problems sorting out logistics. Or... I don't suppose it is actually that I'm having any sorts of special problems, it is just that I'm not used to / have become impatient in dealing with... Well... The sort of crap that mostly fills most peoples lives, I suppose. I have been spoiled, rather.
Just... Organizing. I guess. Organizing. Most students wait until about now-ish to start sorting accommodation / moving in... Etc... I had all that organized. Most students don't buy their books until they get given their course outlines all printed off and stapled together and presented into their hands. I like to have 3 summer months with mine... Or I'm chomping at the bit for my course related costs to come through (2 weeks before course start date) to purchase what I've been borrowing incessantly from the library...
Am I more organized??? Perhaps... Perhaps in a way I am. But in other ways... It is more of an over-compensation for my actual lack of organizational ability, I think. More of that...
I need to write a proper letter to the folks down in Wellington. Or... I don't *need* to, actually. But... It would be in my best interests to. Perhaps. There is this new thing (just introduced early last year) about how you can apply for limited full time status even though you only have a part time workload. One of the grounds for applying... Is that you have been advised to do so from someone in authority at the institution... And that it is in your best academic interests not to undertake a full time load (e.g., because you will likely fail).
They are actually honest (first time ever???) about who they share information with. Pretty much every government department (it seems to me). Except possibly fishing... And maybe the electricity authority. I jest... But really it does make sense. Immigration. Customs. Tax department. The usual suspects...
Anyway... They say... Something about how you can provide additional information (should you choose) about ... Your life aspirations. You can provide more information about your personal circumstance (should you choose) and that that can weigh into a decision.
I'm thinking... That I should really take the time to do it properly. Basically... Put in a proper application. To say that I do really want to do medicine, but of course I can't do it without the support of others. Without the support of the country... The government. I need one part time year for sure. Worst case (should know within the first two weeks) I can't handle the baby physics and chem courses till next year (e.g., even they might require too much math - physics doesn't require calculus but does require math and lots of balancing equations in chem). I... Don't suspect they will because I am making good progress now on ratios / proportions etc and I'm really seeing why they are important (e.g., drawing to scale what you see down a microscope, figuring out the magnification when you have some equation to do with both lenses) blah blah... I think I can kludge together enough math skills to get through... But I need to be a bit humble since what happened with summer school...
Anyway... Apply properly. I mean... I guess I'm basically asking them to loan me a big f*ck*ng chunk of money over the years... It costs a lot to train a doc. Still... I'm certainly not likely to be one who'll set up shop in private practice and enjoy my riches... Or even to bail for better working conditions... I really have been fairly inspired by what people like Fred Hollows and Tropodoc and the like have managed to do... And I'm not at all sure what I can do... If anything very much... But I'd surely like the opportunity to try...
Anyway...
I figure they probably will give me a year... Then I bloody well better have some stellar grades to show them...
This should get me a smartphone / organiser / over my fear of phones / moving to a more normal keeping in touch arrangements with friends / colleagues / small relations and the like... Not falling too far behind in the technology game... Something a bit... more discrete to practice my math on... Which will get me out of the house a bit more (which I need). It will get me course books and a lab coat and some comfortable shoes so I can focus on things other than blisters... Hopefully some compression stuff to... Help hold me together. I think that is what it does... And I do need to enroll in at least one course per semester or I'll go f*ck*ng nuts.
Anyway... I won't let it take more than half a day... But do it properly I will. Those folks know how much work goes into applications / reports. Two half days. Damn them.
I think I can talk to the people down in Wellington... Especially since it is the social development people who wouldn't give me a f*ck*ng job after I failed their f*ck*ng maths test ahahahahaha.
Posted by alexandra_k on February 14, 2014, at 1:13:34
In reply to Re: happy happy-ish, posted by alexandra_k on February 14, 2014, at 1:02:57
while i was killing some time before the appointment i was sitting in the park and it turned out that there was a kindergarten (pre-school) right there (fenced off) in the middle of it. so i was watching the little kids play. there were two... i think they were twins. they did everything together. mostly they were playing in threes or whatever... there was one kid who liked to play by herself. she kept trying to get things / pull things / stack things because she wanted to... swing upside down. like on a seated swing how you can hold on with your arms and lie back... and relax your shoulders / neck / head... swing like that.
she couldn't really, though. because stacking things up under the gymnast rings wasn't going to help lift her butt up so she could lie back properly... after a while she tried the monkey bar. to lie back over that... but can't really do it without flipping around / over the bar.
i remember that feeling...
the place i grew up... the hospital is fairly central. there is a fairly large lake that is close. close to the hospital. close to the city. they have had swings there since... forever. big swings, too. grown up swings. a large / oversized frame so the arc of the swing is... graceful. not jerky / jolty. and the seat high enough from the ground so you don't risk snapping your legs when you try and slow down. and you hold on with your arms and lie back so you are nearly horizontal... and as you ascend the arc you end up nearly upside down.
that feeling...
i think that was what she wanted to do.
i wonder what it is about it...
weightlessness? i get something like that from weightlifting... when i get it just right (requires a good bar to feel merged with it)... a good swing set to the right height... water doesn't do it for me... but i freak out now with water in my ears and eyes. something vestibular, i guess...
i wonder if i'd like space. maybe i should be an astronaut. i jest.
i wonder if the sensory gym has a swing.
i wonder if there is a sensory gym. sometimes people say 'yes' as a matter of reflex...
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