![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 24 of 24. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Kath on July 8, 2008, at 19:05:25
Well, I'm not doing great. Worrying a lot; having 'tight stomach' type anxiety when I think certain thoughts.
Having "I don't wanna do this" thoughts each day - would NOT do anything about them though. Just more, "I can't bear it" thoughts.
Three guesses........I'm sure I posted when hubby & I returned from our 1st-week-in-June holiday on the Bruce Penninsula. Got there Saturday. Tuesday nite got a phone call from son telling he had gotten 'kicked out' of his nice new place that he & 2 guys were sharing. I guess his noise production was the last straw for the landlord as to the downstairs tenants calling the police. It wasn't the first time they'd been called & the other times it wasn't always my son. So the other guys (who were away that weekend) told him he had to leave.
ANYway, my reaction was HUGE. It really ***ked up my holiday. I guess I should say that I wasn't able to rise above! Still, we went canoing with our new canoe & that day was nice. That was a few days later. While we were on the shore in the most wonderful cove that was just like some tropical haven, right down to turquoise water - my counsellor returned my call (on my cellphone)!!! She was able to help me calm down. I'm not saying I didn't have any enjoyment, but it was accompanied with heavy shadows from son getting kicked out LAST year, right near the same time. THAT time it was for cocaine use....this time it was for noise. BIGGG difference. However, I guess there's a part of me that doesn' "get it". I seem to react (emotionally) WAY out of proportion.
So son is staying with us. So he's here every day & part of what has helped me NOT dwell on him is keeping separate from him. ANYway, now he's waiting for his friend from a nearby town to get back to him as to son living at his place. So I get all bent out of shape about maybe he's changed his mind & they don't want my son there after all & what if this & what if THAT!!
AD NAUSEUM. I sometimes feel SO anxious & worried. I am finding it a tremendous challenge to "be in the NOW". I had Eckhart Tolle's "The New Earth" with me on my week away. Reading about The Pain Body helped me alot. I came home less 'messed up' than when I went. However, I am really finding it hard to control my anxiety.
And the thing is that right now, my son even has a part time job that he's GOING TO & there is nothing really bad happening (except that he spent all this month's money in 1 week! Good he has a pt time job that pays every Friday for a bit of extra money).
SO I guess I'm feeling worn down; upset; angry; sorry for myself; trapped; apprehensive; not knowing HOW I can cope with whatever happens next.
When if I can stand back I can tell myself, "This is DIFFERENT from last year. He's come Light Years from a year ago. For heaven sake, he even is able to stick with his job (even when it meant he had to shave off his little goatee). So he's with us right now. That is NOT the end of the world. Things have changed in the past. Things will change again." Etcetera. My mind seems to be able to at least SOMEtimes know that stuff. I wish my emotions & stomach muscles would know it also!
Anyway, I wanted to give an update.
I'm sorry I haven't been around. I feel out of touch with what is happening for people.
love, Kath
Posted by TexasChic on July 8, 2008, at 20:17:20
In reply to Update on me, posted by Kath on July 8, 2008, at 19:05:25
I've been wondering about you and am sorry I didn't try to contact you. I guess I've been wrapped up in myself lately.
Man, that sucks about your son getting kicked out when it wasn't even anything all that bad. But it sounds like he's still trying and not giving up, which is the key to everything! I can't imagine what its like to have a kid. I think I'd be a nervous wreck all the time! But your son will make his way one way or another, and there are bound to be bumps in the road.
I won't tell you not to worry because that wouldn't do any good, but take extra good care of yourself, okay? Plenty of bubble baths and giving yourself a break even when you don't think you need one yet.
I'm glad your holiday wasn't completely spoiled, it sounds awesome!!!
-T
Posted by Phillipa on July 8, 2008, at 20:18:22
In reply to Update on me, posted by Kath on July 8, 2008, at 19:05:25
Kath I'd call that a premonition that the same thing might happen again. Think a therapist might be able to help you talk through the feelings? Why not post a thread on psychology. I find the people great there and very supportive. They are here too. Love Phillipa
Posted by Kath on July 8, 2008, at 20:26:51
In reply to Re: Update on me » Kath, posted by TexasChic on July 8, 2008, at 20:17:20
Thanks TC,
That was nice advice about taking care of myself.
And YES - I am a restroactive HEAVY DUTY PROPONANT (Is that the word???) of HEAVY DUTY birth control. LOL
If I'd known............ of course I love them both, but if I'd known was emotional stuff was involved, I dunno!!
Thx for understanding about the worrying. I'm actually trying to do better. I learned some good stuff tonite on Babblechat about CBT & am going to try to apply it.
I think I do a lot of "fortune telling" & "magnifying" (or as I tend to call it 'awfulizing'.)
luv & hugs, Kath
Posted by fayeroe on July 8, 2008, at 21:17:15
In reply to Re: Update on me, posted by Kath on July 8, 2008, at 20:26:51
I'm in with TC..I sure am glad you posted because I had become concerned about you.
You know, they are never, ever grown. Mine are hitting 41 and 39 and they still get on my nerves.
The young one lectured me today for 10 minutes about what her 9 year old can and cannot do here this weekend. I so wanted to say something like, "you mean I can't let her play in the street?".......How old is the son now? I forgot.
Under the circumstances, if the stay lasts alittle longer, I would suggest that you have him give you part of his paycheck so he'll have $ to move out with. Even saving it for him is enabling.....but what the hell? It is as much for your good as it is his.
I feel for you, I really do. Been there. As you know. :-)
Take care of yourself. A long hot bubble bath will do wonders..a glass of white wine, maybe?
xoxox pat
Posted by llurpsienoodle on July 9, 2008, at 11:20:12
In reply to Re: Update on me » Kath, posted by fayeroe on July 8, 2008, at 21:17:15
Kath,
been SO good to touch base with you. I'm so sorry that things are rough. It sounds like you have a deep groove of worry that it is easy to fall into. It's gonna be hard to make a new groove, one that won't have your body in a tizzy.Know that we are here for you and that we care. Your long post is WONDERFUL, because it gave me a sense of what's going on. Don't feel bad about unloading your stuff here on babble. You give plenty of support. Let us support you every once in a while. It's a privilege.
((((((KAth))))))
-ll
Posted by Kath on July 11, 2008, at 21:51:39
In reply to Re: Update on me » Kath, posted by Phillipa on July 8, 2008, at 20:18:22
Hi Phillipa,
Thanks for your support. I am not sure that I have the energy to post another thread on psychology. I feel like I have so very little energy lately. This week I have been tremendously tired.
thx for caring. luv, Kath
Posted by Kath on July 11, 2008, at 22:11:07
In reply to Re: Update on me » Kath, posted by fayeroe on July 8, 2008, at 21:17:15
- he liked it! They said it's due to his health (they don't know about his mental health issues & I doubt it would have been obvious, as he 'presents well'.) I think they hired too many people & just decided to let him go. He missed one day, nearer to the first, with kidney pain. Apart from that, he's always been there & always arrived quite early & clean, etc. And he's quite friendly with people, so I don't know! He was working in lunch-type shop. He is VERY disappointed - said it's the first job he's had that he really liked.
I was VERY upset when it happened on Wednesday. Then yesterday HE was VERY depressed & said he ruined his life by going out to BC 2 years ago & if he'd just cleaned up his life he wouldn't have gotten really messed up & lost so much....that he has ruined his life & now he just get's drunk to hide from things. I was surprised to hear him say THAT. I guess at least a part of him is in touch with what he does. But that didn't stop him going out drinking. Oh well.
> I'm in with TC..I sure am glad you posted because I had become concerned about you.
***oh Thanks Pat :-) Sorry if I worried anyone. I'm just now reading these new posts & you know, it feels so NICE having this "family"!! I don't have parents living, or siblings, or any family who I'm really in touch with, so it feels good to have special people who know "my stuff" & care about me & are so supportive. Thank you all.***
>
> You know, they are never, ever grown. Mine are hitting 41 and 39 and they still get on my nerves.
> The young one lectured me today for 10 minutes about what her 9 year old can and cannot do here this weekend. I so wanted to say something like, "you mean I can't let her play in the street?".......******I guess it never ends, right?***
> How old is the son now? I forgot.
******He's 24. Actually you know, he's on a disability pension due to schizophrenia & we have a joint bank account & I 'take out' the rent part & the payment for his cellphone. So I did take that part out & am saving it. Since last June, he hasn't had a bank card & I've been giving his his money weekly. I agree - I need to do what I can to help make MY (& my husband's) life as sane as possible!! *******
> I feel for you, I really do. Been there. As you know. :-)
******I sorta forget your details Pat, but I know you've been able to relate to 'waiting for the next shoe to fall' or whatever that saying is.**
> Take care of yourself. A long hot bubble bath will do wonders..a glass of white wine, maybe?
>
> xoxox pat
************Thanks Pat. I've been so tired this week & today had a daytime nap - something I never do, as I'm hardly EVER tired in the daytime (have trouble getting up, but usually once I'm up I have a lot of energy!)
I love bubble baths, so will increase their frequency. I don't drink - but I LOVE tea & especially Tim Horton's 'steeped tea' - LOL - & tonite I suggested hubby & I go out for Indian dinner - yum.
I've been having trouble making myself eat over the last few days. So I've been trying to nibble on trail mix...am going to buy some apricot juice tomorrow; I love that.Thanks for your support. It means the world to me.
xoxo Kath
Posted by Kath on July 11, 2008, at 22:15:08
In reply to Re: Update on me, posted by llurpsienoodle on July 9, 2008, at 11:20:12
> Kath,
> been SO good to touch base with you. I'm so sorry that things are rough. It sounds like you have a deep groove of worry that it is easy to fall into. It's gonna be hard to make a new groove, one that won't have your body in a tizzy.
******Oh thanks Llurps. I talked with my doctor tomorrow & he said that if I find out what our local hospital offers re: CBT he'll refer me if they have a program. He's so nice. He said that he thinks I'm really worn out because of not having had enough down time in between crisis. he said it's like a rechargeable battery that you charge, but only a little bit...if it doesn't have enough time to recharge, it's weaker.**> Know that we are here for you and that we care. Your long post is WONDERFUL, because it gave me a sense of what's going on. Don't feel bad about unloading your stuff here on babble. You give plenty of support. Let us support you every once in a while. It's a privilege.
***Oh thank you Lllurps. Yup - I'm QUITE prepared to be supported right now. Thx for your kind words :-)***
> ((((((KAth))))))
> -ll******** & thx for the hug!!! I wish we were all close enough to have them in person! luv, Kath
Posted by Kath on July 12, 2008, at 12:54:53
In reply to Re: Update on me » llurpsienoodle, posted by Kath on July 11, 2008, at 22:15:08
I hope I'm not breaking the 3-post rule here. I don't think I am, as the previous ones were replying to posts on the thread.
This morning my son called for a ride home. Said he needed to talk about some stuff, but needed some sleep first. I said if we talked, Dad would be involved also. He said he had a cocaine slip last night. Doesn't owe money though.
Jeez.
Just wanted to tell it here so you'll know what is up for me.
:-( Kath
Posted by fayeroe on July 12, 2008, at 14:31:26
In reply to Son had 'c' slip last night. :-(, posted by Kath on July 12, 2008, at 12:54:53
> I hope I'm not breaking the 3-post rule here. I don't think I am, as the previous ones were replying to posts on the thread.
>
> This morning my son called for a ride home. Said he needed to talk about some stuff, but needed some sleep first. I said if we talked, Dad would be involved also. He said he had a cocaine slip last night. Doesn't owe money though.Believe half of what you see and none of what you hear when it comes to a drug addict. I learned that the very hard way!
What do you have planned for the talk? Have the talks worked before? Get a plan, Kath.....and stick to it. If he is old enough to buy it, he is old enough to bottom out.
love you, Pat
>
> Jeez.
>
> Just wanted to tell it here so you'll know what is up for me.
>
> :-( Kath
Posted by TexasChic on July 12, 2008, at 16:52:15
In reply to Re: Son had 'c' slip last night. :-( » Kath, posted by fayeroe on July 12, 2008, at 14:31:26
I've been reading your posts, but I just haven't been in the correct frame of mind to respond lately. I'm sorry you're having such a hard time. I wonder though, why did he tell you about this slip up? Is he asking for help or is it just a way of making himself feel better? I found my brother seemed to tell my Mom everything once he confided about the drugs. Sometimes I would just be thinking, "Why are you telling her this??? She doesn't need to know that!!!" I sometimes felt it was his way of getting it off his chest, but at Mom's expense.
Anyway, that's my two cents. I hope your talk goes well - I'll be sending you stay strong vibes.
-T
Posted by Phillipa on July 12, 2008, at 19:00:10
In reply to Re: Son had 'c' slip last night. :-(, posted by TexasChic on July 12, 2008, at 16:52:15
Kath a lot of truth in what Pat and T are saying been there done that also. Love Phillipa
Posted by Kath on July 12, 2008, at 21:13:19
In reply to Re: Son had 'c' slip last night. :-(, posted by Phillipa on July 12, 2008, at 19:00:10
Thanks all,
Good point Pat.
TC I appreciate your support given what you're going through.
I'm not sure why he told me! He is certainly not getting any money from us regarding cocaine...that's for darn sure.
I suspect that he's going to ask if he can stay living with us until........ I just don't know what the until will be.
I think my main 'stand' is going to be to ask him, 'ok so what do you plan to do in your life now? I'm not interested in being involved unless you're going forward in your life.' or something.
I don't know. I guess any suggestions are welcome. Because last year, he had planned to go to rehab & was living here & then didn't go, my husband doesn't want him to live here even if he IS going forward with plans for rehab. Last year, I don't think it was my son's 'idea' about rehab....I think we 'fed' him the idea. I'm not going to do that this time. He has to be the one to come up with it, although, I must admit, I did leave a book on the hall table where he'll see it - it's called "Step Zero" (as in Twelve Step Groups).
I feel like I am just being slapped & slapped & slapped again by life. Or actually it feels more like being either punched in the stomach or kicked while I'm on the ground.
Thank you all for being my supports.
xoxo to you all, luv, Kath
Posted by fayeroe on July 13, 2008, at 9:01:40
In reply to to you all............, posted by Kath on July 12, 2008, at 21:13:19
Posted by Kath on July 13, 2008, at 20:45:48
In reply to how did the talk go? (nm) » Kath, posted by fayeroe on July 13, 2008, at 9:01:40
Thx for asking Pat.
Turns out it's one of those situations where I worked myself up BIGTIME for no reason.
He just wanted to tell us that he had a c-slip last night & also tell us that he was using between January & March. (We thot he stopped in early January.)
He wanted to tell us because he is living here & by telling us, he's taking responsibility for it, and also, by telling us about last night in particular, it helps him view it as a one-time slip & go forward NOT using. Today, he says that yes, he had a slip last night...he was really drunk & made a stupid decision & now he's okay.
He slept all day yesterday, last night & until noon today. Meanwhile hubby & I had gone out for a lovely walk, so we didn't hear this until this afternoon, so I was viewing the situation as it was last year, which was BAD. So I was in quite a state!!!!!!!!!!
BUT.....we went for a walk in a foresty area in the country, to a beautiful quite large pond. We always take our chairs & books with us & plonk down to read. It was so INCREDIBLY peaceful, we ended up just basking in the peace & beauty ...didn't even take our books out of the bag! There was a Mama duck with about 9 babies going here & there in the pond; dragonflies galore, chickadees & the odd mosquitoe!
It was very therapeutic, but as we were walking back out, the anxiety was coming back.
I felt badly after the talk, because before he started to talk, I said that I was really doing pretty badly; felt very worn down. At some point - I can't remember when, I said that I really wanted to see him going forward & that it was all very hard for me & that some days I didn't even want to be alive. I now feel TERRIBLE for saying that - his face went - well sorta feeling ashamed or something. I said, "I'm not trying to make you feel guilty; I'm just saying how I feel." but now I feel awful. I feel like I shouldn't have said it. My husband says it was the truth & maybe it's good for our son to know the impact on me. I dunno.
I understand that shame is part of the addiction cycle, so I hope I haven't contributed to that. I did tell him afterwards that when he said he relapsed, my mind went right back to last year at this time & all the awful memories.ANYway, I hope that one day I will remember to just try to take things as they present themselves & not work myself all up. Somehow, I suspect it'll be a long time before I succeed at that!
Thx for your ongoing support. love,Kath
Posted by TexasChic on July 13, 2008, at 21:39:26
In reply to OK but I said something I feel badly about..... » fayeroe, posted by Kath on July 13, 2008, at 20:45:48
> I felt badly after the talk, because before he started to talk, I said that I was really doing pretty badly; felt very worn down. At some point - I can't remember when, I said that I really wanted to see him going forward & that it was all very hard for me & that some days I didn't even want to be alive. I now feel TERRIBLE for saying that - his face went - well sorta feeling ashamed or something. I said, "I'm not trying to make you feel guilty; I'm just saying how I feel." but now I feel awful. I feel like I shouldn't have said it. My husband says it was the truth & maybe it's good for our son to know the impact on me. I dunno.
I agree wholeheartedly with your husband. Your son needs to know how his actions affect you and take responsibility for that as well.
> ANYway, I hope that one day I will remember to just try to take things as they present themselves & not work myself all up. Somehow, I suspect it'll be a long time before I succeed at that!
Wow, if you ever figure out how to do that please let me know! Thats one huge thing I'd love to overcome!
-T
Posted by fayeroe on July 14, 2008, at 9:03:55
In reply to Re: OK but I said something I feel badly about...., posted by TexasChic on July 13, 2008, at 21:39:26
I want you to think about this, Kath...why are you trying to tiptoe around this young man? Hasn't your life been turned upside down, turned around and generally been made miserable by his behavior?
*****I felt badly after the talk, because before he started to talk, I said that I was really doing pretty badly; felt very worn down. At some point - I can't remember when, I said that I really wanted to see him going forward & that it was all very hard for me & that some days I didn't even want to be alive. I now feel TERRIBLE for saying that - his face went - well sorta feeling ashamed or something. I said, "I'm not trying to make you feel guilty; I'm just saying how I feel." but now I feel awful.*****
It is time that he feels ashamed and starts trying to do something about it!
He admitted to you that January through March was a lie....you believed one thing (because you wanted to) and he was doing something else!
Kath, as long as he can see that he has your power he will use it. You may not believe me but that is what addicts do.
At some point we have to detach and first know that we are dealing with an addict. Then the "he's my child" comes next. Addicts don't care about bloodlines. They care about their next fix.
I know that I am not telling you what you want to hear....but if he's old enough to buy and use, he is old enough to support his habits.
As long as they have the parental safety net, why change? xoxoxo pat
Posted by Kath on July 14, 2008, at 12:53:31
In reply to Re: OK but I said something I feel badly about.... » TexasChic, posted by fayeroe on July 14, 2008, at 9:03:55
WOW Pat - THIS post is getting printed & carried in my purse & read numerous times daily.
It's short, clear, concise & although I'm sure I know that stuff somewhere, I don't know it "up front" enough in my mind.
Thank you VERY much. You're VERY right....I DO feel like I've been tiptoeing for ages. I guess afraid that if I "make him" feel a certain way he'll go off the rails!!! As IF I can MAKE anyone feel anything; and as IF he needs my help to use!
Thank you so much.
love, Kath
> I want you to think about this, Kath...why are you trying to tiptoe around this young man? Hasn't your life been turned upside down, turned around and generally been made miserable by his behavior?
>
> *****I felt badly after the talk, because before he started to talk, I said that I was really doing pretty badly; felt very worn down. At some point - I can't remember when, I said that I really wanted to see him going forward & that it was all very hard for me & that some days I didn't even want to be alive. I now feel TERRIBLE for saying that - his face went - well sorta feeling ashamed or something. I said, "I'm not trying to make you feel guilty; I'm just saying how I feel." but now I feel awful.*****
>
> It is time that he feels ashamed and starts trying to do something about it!
>
> He admitted to you that January through March was a lie....you believed one thing (because you wanted to) and he was doing something else!
>
> Kath, as long as he can see that he has your power he will use it. You may not believe me but that is what addicts do.
>
> At some point we have to detach and first know that we are dealing with an addict. Then the "he's my child" comes next. Addicts don't care about bloodlines. They care about their next fix.
>
> I know that I am not telling you what you want to hear....but if he's old enough to buy and use, he is old enough to support his habits.
>
> As long as they have the parental safety net, why change? xoxoxo pat
Posted by fayeroe on July 14, 2008, at 13:33:42
In reply to Re: OK but I said something I feel badly about.... » fayeroe, posted by Kath on July 14, 2008, at 12:53:31
I wish someone had told me this. Our family would have been very, very different and the teenagers/20s would have been in a different space entirely.
Posted by TexasChic on July 14, 2008, at 18:49:40
In reply to Re: OK but I said something I feel badly about...., posted by fayeroe on July 14, 2008, at 13:33:42
My Mom was the same way about my brother. She kept giving him money until she was completely broke. When we had that family session she finally admitted (with a little shove from me) that because he has been suicidal in the past, she's afraid if she doesn't help him she may cause him to go into a downward spiral that might lead to that outcome. The counselor told her that she couldn't MAKE him do ANYTHING! And sometimes a person has to hit rock bottom (without the parental safety net) before they really GET IT and are able to make a change.
-T
Posted by Phillipa on July 14, 2008, at 18:56:57
In reply to Re: OK but I said something I feel badly about...., posted by TexasChic on July 14, 2008, at 18:49:40
Guess that's why my Son threw out my Granson who is l8 and using. He nastily said that he was very manipulative. He should know as when he was the same age he did the same thing to me. Don't take this wrong but his blindness from Desert Storm was the catalist for him getting better and going on to go to college on VA disability benefits and now is very involved with the VA all over the country. I was so niave with him didn't see it. But he said he used to hide his stuff in my curtin poles in my bedroom cause he knew I wouldn't look there as he knew I used to search his room. Love Phillipa
Posted by Kath on July 24, 2008, at 19:15:19
In reply to Re: OK but I said something I feel badly about...., posted by TexasChic on July 14, 2008, at 18:49:40
> My Mom was the same way about my brother. She kept giving him money until she was completely broke. When we had that family session she finally admitted (with a little shove from me) that because he has been suicidal in the past, she's afraid if she doesn't help him she may cause him to go into a downward spiral that might lead to that outcome. The counselor told her that she couldn't MAKE him do ANYTHING! And sometimes a person has to hit rock bottom (without the parental safety net) before they really GET IT and are able to make a change.
>
> -THi TC - I just read this now! Yes, I tend to walk on eggshells sometimes. I wish I could not care!
I hope your brother is doing well.
luv, Kath
Posted by Kath on July 24, 2008, at 19:17:21
In reply to Re: OK but I said something I feel badly about.... » TexasChic, posted by Phillipa on July 14, 2008, at 18:56:57
Dear Phillipa,
It must be hard for you regarding your Granson. I've often imagined having grandkids & having them call & say, "Gramma, Mom & Dad kicked me out & I have nowhere to go........." etc!!!
Yikes, love, Kath
> Guess that's why my Son threw out my Granson who is l8 and using. He nastily said that he was very manipulative. He should know as when he was the same age he did the same thing to me. Don't take this wrong but his blindness from Desert Storm was the catalist for him getting better and going on to go to college on VA disability benefits and now is very involved with the VA all over the country. I was so niave with him didn't see it. But he said he used to hide his stuff in my curtin poles in my bedroom cause he knew I wouldn't look there as he knew I used to search his room. Love Phillipa
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