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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 46. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by karen_kay on December 13, 2006, at 8:19:45
i'm teaching myniece early (she's 5) that beauty is pain. i've somehow managed to squeeze my big feet into some size 8 1/2 painfully high heels. i explained to my niece that beauty is pain and shoes can be sexy. she4 tried on a pair of mine and agreed they were sexy. i'm not concerned with sending her the wrong message (no lectures please. ask anyone who plucks their eyebrows or any of the numerous other painful beauty rituals all of us do). most little girls (especially these) are concerned with beign pretty. but, maybe i should have waited a few years before reinforcing how concerned aunt kk is with looking beautiful. that's horrible, isn't it?
Posted by Phillipa on December 13, 2006, at 10:18:38
In reply to i'm horrible, posted by karen_kay on December 13, 2006, at 8:19:45
I don't understand why people like shoes so much. I hate them and they are usually off. Other than that sneakers are all I wear. Love Phillipa
Posted by Happyflower on December 13, 2006, at 10:40:32
In reply to Re: i'm horrible » karen_kay, posted by Phillipa on December 13, 2006, at 10:18:38
I guess it would depend what her mother would think about this. I would be bothered by this if SIL was telling my daugher this, especially at such an early age.
I for one tell my daughter that beauty is what is in the inside of you. You looks never will stay the same and I would rather have my daughter believe she is beautiful no matter how she looks because eventually you lose your looks, if you self esteem is just about how you look, then you will eventually crash.
I don't believe in sacraficising comfort for looks in shoes. I would rather see a women who is smiling because she is comfortable and happy then grinning, baring the pain of her feet because she wants to look good in shoes. Who do you think would be more fun to hang out with?
Maybe I am not the norm, but I really wish we could see the real beauty in a person, not on what they are wearing, the car they drive, or the house they live in. That stuff is just fluff to me. Real beauty isn't painful, it is natural.
Posted by TexasChic on December 13, 2006, at 10:43:02
In reply to i'm horrible, posted by karen_kay on December 13, 2006, at 8:19:45
All societies have some sort of ritual to that effect, and its up to the adults to teach them to the children so that they can fit in and function like everyone else. If you were to be fair and take away every ritual of this sort, you'd be going around unbathed and naked. So why draw the line at heels? Maybe you could give just a little reminder to your neice that we're beautiful without the heels, but its fun to dress up.
As for the pain, are the shoes too small? You can get a bigger size and still be sexy! You can also get those inserts that keep your feet from sliding forward and feeling squished. My problem is just managing not to fall down (which isn't very sexy).
-T
Posted by Happyflower on December 13, 2006, at 10:57:53
In reply to Re: i'm horrible » karen_kay, posted by TexasChic on December 13, 2006, at 10:43:02
I know I sound preachy , but I don't feel sexy should even be in a 5yr. olds vocabulary or teaching her to be sexy. This is so wrong in so many ways.
Posted by Happyflower on December 13, 2006, at 11:04:03
In reply to Re: i'm horrible, posted by Happyflower on December 13, 2006, at 10:57:53
Posted by LlurpsieBlossom on December 13, 2006, at 11:19:18
In reply to Re: i'm horrible, posted by Happyflower on December 13, 2006, at 10:57:53
How about teaching the 5 year old that wearing adult shoes is *fun* not sexy or painful?
My toddler neice LOVES to watch mommy (or me) put on makeup. I invited her over to me, and took a (clean) powder brush and put "magic fairy dust" on her cheeks and forehead. Then I told her how pretty she was. She was dancing all around it was so cute.
5 year olds are like little sponges. Maybe tell her that it's okay to wear fun shoes sometimes, but not all the time. Tell her that they are kind of like halloween, where big girls get to dress up pretty for special occasions.
just some ideas.
(she must have been so cute in the high heels!)
-Ll
Posted by kid47 on December 13, 2006, at 12:20:06
In reply to i'm horrible, posted by karen_kay on December 13, 2006, at 8:19:45
Do you think that females are the only ones to suffer in the name of beauty? First of all, I not only must pluck my eyebrows, but also have the excruciating task of yanking hair from my nostrils and my ears. Vain? Possibly.....but when was the last time you saw a man with furry ears, shrubery sprouting out of his nose, and eyebrows you could knit with, that made your heart go pitter patter? Plus I drag my tired old butt up to the gym 3 days a week.....yeah, yeah, it's supposed to be good for you....but I wouldn't set foot in the place, if I didn't think it made me LOOK better!! It is a shame we live in a superficial society...but thats the fact....Jack. As long as your teaching your niece age appropriate life lessons, tell her good looks, money and social station are not the best criteria when picking a mate...Love should be the main consideration.......you might also mention to her that it's just as easy to fall in love with a rich man as a poor one. Have a perfect day!!!
peace out
kidps....you are just a tad twisted ;)
> i'm teaching myniece early (she's 5) that beauty is pain. i've somehow managed to squeeze my big feet into some size 8 1/2 painfully high heels. i explained to my niece that beauty is pain and shoes can be sexy. she4 tried on a pair of mine and agreed they were sexy. i'm not concerned with sending her the wrong message (no lectures please. ask anyone who plucks their eyebrows or any of the numerous other painful beauty rituals all of us do). most little girls (especially these) are concerned with beign pretty. but, maybe i should have waited a few years before reinforcing how concerned aunt kk is with looking beautiful. that's horrible, isn't it?
Posted by ClearSkies on December 13, 2006, at 13:25:03
In reply to Re: i'm horrible, posted by Happyflower on December 13, 2006, at 10:40:32
My mom stressed how unimportant "outside" beauty is to the point where I think I am ugly. I know that if she had touched my hair when I was a little girl and told me that it was lovely; or that I looked pretty in a special outfit, that I would have a very different view now of what I look like.
Even now, my mom's view of makeup and keeping my hair styled is that it's extravagant and vain.
Needless to say, I don't call her for fashion advice...
ClearSkies
Posted by karen_kay on December 13, 2006, at 13:27:58
In reply to Re: i'm horrible, posted by Happyflower on December 13, 2006, at 10:57:53
sometimes i don't realize the way things come out. i'm actually very careful about my vocabulary around the kids (even the swearing). i realize that the way i wrote what was said makes it look like i used the word sexy. i didn't. i can't quite recall whether i actually said beautiful or pretty irl. sorry agin if it came out that way.
i woudln't buy the girls high heels (even if toy companies made them). (moreso due to having little walking experience) but, i don't see a problem with teaching the girls to have confidence and realize that they are beautiful. i also like the idea of taking pride in your appearance, and that's what i feel i teach them as well.
i'm not lecturing either. i just wanted to make certain that i made an effort to explain my point of view.
i'll reply more later, but i always thought twisted was good? am i wrong?
Posted by madeline on December 13, 2006, at 13:45:35
In reply to i'm horrible, posted by karen_kay on December 13, 2006, at 8:19:45
oh please,
she has to learn it sometime. Women's bodies are high maintainence.
Shoes hurt, plucking hurts, crest whitening strips cause shooting pains to run up your face, doing your hair is a pain. The endless buffing, polishing, shaving, flossing. It sucks.
Oh yeah, it's all about what's on the inside, but there really isn't any reason not to put your best food forward, except for the polishing, waxing etc...
God I'm so depressed.
Posted by Happyflower on December 13, 2006, at 14:08:05
In reply to Re: i'm horrible, posted by madeline on December 13, 2006, at 13:45:35
We are talking about a five year old, not 10 or ever 15. What if when buying shoes with her mother she wants to buy a size smaller so she can look sexy?
Dressing up is fine, imagination play is great, my kids did it all the time, but teaching her how to be sexy, talking about being sexy at 5 years old, is on the fine line of sexual abuse. If this was her uncle and he wanted her to dress up in sexy pj's would you feel differently? Why not let her watch Sex and the City? Just because this stuff if in our life, doesn't mean it it right to expose a 5 year old to it. What is next, how to talk and walk sexy?
Kids should be playing outside and having fun, not worried about if they look sexy. I feel it is setting a poor example for a 5 year old. I as a mother would be upset if this happened to my daughter and would questioned someone's intentions on saying things like this to her, it sends red flag up to me as a mother.
Posted by Happyflower on December 13, 2006, at 14:15:54
In reply to Re: i'm horrible » Happyflower, posted by ClearSkies on December 13, 2006, at 13:25:03
I don't feel stressing that outside beauty isn't important is a right thing to do either, there is a happy medium. It is okay to tell your kids that they are beautiful, but other comments should be there too to develop a healthy self esteem.
I am sorry your mother didn't compliment you, they should tell you that you are beautiful to them for many reasons. Doing this and teaching them how to be sexy is two different things. I tell my daughter all the time how proud I am of her on her talents, etc, and if she when she gets her hair cut, I tell her it looks nice. But I am not going to teach her how to turn on a guy because it is the real world and she might as well learn at a young age.
Posted by Happyflower on December 13, 2006, at 14:25:01
In reply to Re: i'm horrible » Happyflower, posted by karen_kay on December 13, 2006, at 13:27:58
I think Llurpse gave some good way to teach that dress up is fun, without making it focus on being beautiful has to hurt. Five year olds are very impressionable at that age, and telling them that being beautiful has to hurt, is really sending some wrong messages.
Do you want her to be starving herself at 10 so she can not look developed like all the models out there, so she can look sexy?
Playing sports, games, art activities, etc, will give her more self confidence than telling her she looks pretty. We don't teach our boys that they have to look handsome at five so they can be self confident.
Posted by kid47 on December 13, 2006, at 15:42:19
In reply to i'm horrible, posted by karen_kay on December 13, 2006, at 8:19:45
twisted, but in a VERY good way. I think thats why I like you so much;)
kid
Posted by ClearSkies on December 13, 2006, at 17:04:53
In reply to Re: i'm horrible » ClearSkies, posted by Happyflower on December 13, 2006, at 14:15:54
OK, I am talking about poor self esteem, and you are talking about sexuality. Different subjects - although I can say that my mother has never acknowledged that there is even such a thing as sexuality. Shoes or no shoes, it's not there la-la-la-la-la!!!!
I think we have beaten this one quite soundly.
CS
Posted by henrietta on December 13, 2006, at 19:00:08
In reply to i'm horrible, posted by karen_kay on December 13, 2006, at 8:19:45
the very fact that you're concerned about this proves you're not horrible. you're thinking. you're questioning. you're moving toward responsibility, and away from narcissism. you deserve rewards! you deserve self-congratulations. you are growing UP!!! (and passing it on) it's fantastic! keep it up!
Posted by henrietta on December 13, 2006, at 19:17:35
In reply to Karen, Karen, Karen, posted by kid47 on December 13, 2006, at 12:20:06
my god, don't PLUCk your nose hairs. trim them a tad from the outside if they bother you, but be d%%m grateful you've got'em. i've got none, and i'm susceptible to any passing germ, any flying ambient spray, any stray nastiness. nose hairs are there for a reason. they're protection. they're the moat, the battlements, they're your fortress. you lucky dog, you.
Posted by TexasChic on December 13, 2006, at 19:31:17
In reply to Re: i'm horrible » karen_kay, posted by Happyflower on December 13, 2006, at 14:25:01
I think pretty much everyone would agree with what you're saying about the harm that can be caused by teaching a child that looks are more important then anything else. I just didn't get the impression that's what KK REALLY intended her post to imply (she said in a later post she didn't actually use the word sexy). I took it more as a lighthearted post.
Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong KK, just thought I'd try to help.
-T
Posted by madeline on December 13, 2006, at 19:55:51
In reply to i'm horrible, posted by karen_kay on December 13, 2006, at 8:19:45
Okay, when she was six months old she won a gun in a raffle. Some kind of ultra expensive 22 rifle.
Now she's seven and after a wonderful romp through the world of rainwear, all she wants to do is shoot the gun. She wants to go hunting, have her picture made with the gun, shot trees with the gun, load the gun, clean the gun. You know. Her dad, allegedly, also bought her a membership in the NRA - but I thought you had to be 18 to do that.
Well anyhoodle, I got a picture of her today holding the gun with this really evil look on her face. I'm afraid that one day I'll see that picture again on 60 minutes or something after she's gone postal.
Now that my friends is something to be concerned about.
Posted by Phillipa on December 13, 2006, at 19:58:06
In reply to Re: i'm horrible » Happyflower, posted by TexasChic on December 13, 2006, at 19:31:17
Just want to add that I was brought up to focus on looks. Hence I'm having a very hard time aging. If only I could find a therapist to help me relearn what I was taught. I went so far as to have a facelift. What did it accomplish? Nothing but complications and more depresssion. It was a nightmare. I am older . My 40's were my prime. I looked and felt good. Love Phillipa
Posted by LlurpsieBlossom on December 13, 2006, at 20:57:43
In reply to Let's talk about MY niece, posted by madeline on December 13, 2006, at 19:55:51
Archery is my thing. I prefer NOT to take life. Remember that Nick Cage movie, The Weatherman? That movie gives me fantasies... (lol not THAT kind of fantasy!)
I also enjoy shooting very much. Usually a pellet rifle or .22. I have shot a handgun a few times, but I prefer a rifle.
If I lived out in the country, I'd set up part of my yard for archery. I even took it in college as my p.e. lol
shhhhhTHWAcKKKKK!
It's so satisfying.
-Ll
Posted by verne on December 13, 2006, at 21:08:16
In reply to i'm horrible, posted by karen_kay on December 13, 2006, at 8:19:45
I'm as vain as they come yet never understood women and the shoe thing. I identify with the Princess and the pea and Goldilocks bit though.
Perhaps, the need to squeeze one's foot into a glass slipper that only fits one woman in the kingdom, caused this shoe angst. Cinderella I don't get.
I think barefeet and sensible shoes are *sexy* (not that I would ever actually use that word) I love: real, natural, not-trying-to-fit, uncontrived women - and men.
verne
Posted by karen_kay on December 14, 2006, at 6:00:01
In reply to Re: i'm horrible, posted by verne on December 13, 2006, at 21:08:16
did i mention the shoes are small for my large (huge, huge, man-sized) feet? i guess it's ok for a lady to reveal her shoe size, right? i actually wear a size 9 1/2 to 10 (i know, i know, i'm like a frickin amazon.) that's the thing behind me squeezing into shoes, they were given to me as gifts in the wrong size. and they are fabulous shoes!
i'll finish more replies today.
Posted by TexasChic on December 14, 2006, at 12:32:58
In reply to Re: i'm horrible, posted by karen_kay on December 14, 2006, at 6:00:01
I wear 9 1/2! How dare you insult my foot size! ;-)
-T
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