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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 35. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by ROO on October 17, 2002, at 11:12:51
This Damn Topamax has sexual side effects!
Do you think maybe god hates me or something? It's
listed as "rare", but of course I get it.Did you gain weight on Depakote and if so, how
much? Maybe I should try that one...
Posted by Dinah on October 17, 2002, at 11:16:13
In reply to Dinah Guess What?, posted by ROO on October 17, 2002, at 11:12:51
Darn! I didn't think most mood stabilizers have sexual side effects. Or at least they haven't for me. At all. :)
I didn't gain a pound on Depakote, but I had already gained 50 lbs from Luvox when I started it. I haven't lost any weight on Depakote.
Perhaps someone has some ideas on the meds board. It's such a shame since it worked for you. :(
Posted by Ted on October 17, 2002, at 12:14:30
In reply to Dinah Guess What?, posted by ROO on October 17, 2002, at 11:12:51
Roo,
I don't know how much is me, depakote, or zoloft, but I have gained about 40+ pounds in the past 3-1/2 years. In fact, since my depakote dose was raised about a month ago, my weight gain took another jump.
Uggh. I need new pants.
Ted
Posted by ROO on October 17, 2002, at 13:56:14
In reply to depakote weight gain » ROO, posted by Ted on October 17, 2002, at 12:14:30
I'm SO disappointed...why do these drugs DO this....
whaaaahhhhhhhhh.....just when I thought I'd gotten away
from those rascally ssri's, good ole Topamax goes and zings
my crotch as well....damn, damn, damn this screwed up brain of
mine....in my next life I want a DIFFERENT problem....
Posted by gabbix2 on October 17, 2002, at 14:22:26
In reply to Re: depakote weight gain, posted by ROO on October 17, 2002, at 13:56:14
Oh yeah, it is the worst.
My mom keeps saying, well at least you don't have this, or at least you don't have that..
she doesn't comprehend that it doesn't matter,
my brain is hapharzadly creating the same feelings that would occur if I DID have those problems.
Its one area where knowledge doesn't always help.I was told Depakote didn't cause weight gain as iswritten in the Pharmeceutical compendium. After reading personal stories though it sounds like more often than not it does. I know my appetite has increased for sure, but that could be because I'm more relaxed too.
Posted by Ted on October 17, 2002, at 15:38:52
In reply to Re: depakote weight gain, posted by gabbix2 on October 17, 2002, at 14:22:26
> I was told Depakote didn't cause weight gain as iswritten in the Pharmeceutical compendium. After reading personal stories though it sounds like more often than not it does. I know my appetite has increased for sure, but that could be because I'm more relaxed too.
Gabbi,Whomever told you this was either grossly misinformed or lying. It is clearly stated in my PDR (physician's desk reference) that depakote has a side effect of weight gain in something like 60% of patients. If you want, I can look it up and get the *exact* wording. Oh, and my PDR is something like the 2000 edition, so this isn't old information.
Ted
Posted by Ted on October 17, 2002, at 15:41:41
In reply to Re: depakote weight gain, posted by ROO on October 17, 2002, at 13:56:14
Hi Roo,
> Topamax goes and zings
> my crotch as well....damn, damn, damn this screwed up brain of
> mine....*Supposedly* depakote and neurontin don't mess with your crotch. Could you try one of them?
Ted
in my next life I want a DIFFERENT problem....
>
Posted by gabbix2 on October 17, 2002, at 16:14:23
In reply to Re: depakote weight gain » ROO, posted by Ted on October 17, 2002, at 15:41:41
Actually I saw it too, i was so angry when I went to the Dr's that he made quite a show of being interested and so very concerned, that when I asked about Depakote he looked it up right there.
It said "weight loss' actually.
I believe you, I've known other people on it which is why I asked in the first place.
It must be a different book, how very reassuring.i think I'm going to switch to Topomax
Posted by Ted on October 17, 2002, at 16:27:53
In reply to Re: depakote weight gain, posted by gabbix2 on October 17, 2002, at 16:14:23
Gabbi,
> i think I'm going to switch to Topomax
Please don't. You need some stability, and you won't get it if you are constantly switching meds. Depakote *works* in most people. Give it a chance. Besides, I'll bet you would rather have a couple extra pounds than a numb crotch. Ask Roo to be sure.
Ted
Posted by Dinah on October 17, 2002, at 16:30:30
In reply to Re: depakote weight gain, posted by gabbix2 on October 17, 2002, at 16:14:23
Posted by Dinah on October 17, 2002, at 16:31:21
In reply to Re: depakote weight gain » gabbix2, posted by Ted on October 17, 2002, at 16:27:53
And Gabbi, Ted's right. Depakote is a good med.
Posted by gabbix2 on October 17, 2002, at 19:25:56
In reply to Re: Nice to see you around again. » Ted, posted by Dinah on October 17, 2002, at 16:31:21
Unfortunately now I'm freaked about weight gain.
Its, I'm afraid a side effect that would absolutely counteract any positive effect of the drug. I can't tolerate it. I'm only on a low dose though 500mgs so I'm not sure if that would lessen the risk.
Oh the joke, there was a time when the thought of taking one tablet of Paxil a day scared the hell out of me..
(such innocent times those were)
Posted by Dinah on October 17, 2002, at 19:35:16
In reply to A funnier joke.. Dinah, posted by gabbix2 on October 17, 2002, at 19:25:56
Hmmm. I think I'd rather have a bit of weight and orgasms. (OK I know I would.) But if it really bothers you, you could try Topamax.
OK, OK, Dr. Bob, I know this isn't the meds board.
So Gabbi, have you seen any good movies lately? My husband and I have been watching Monk nonstop, an episode a night. I think he is relieved to find someone whose OCD is worse than mine.
I'm trying to decide whether to go see the new movie with Greg Kinnear about the life and death of Bob Crane (Hogan of Hogan's Heroes). I had a massive crush on him in middle school and would hate to have reality mess with some really fond memories.
(OK that should be sufficiently social. :) )
Posted by gabbix2 on October 17, 2002, at 20:15:20
In reply to Re: A funnier joke.. Dinah » gabbix2, posted by Dinah on October 17, 2002, at 19:35:16
Say no I haven't seen- ORGASMS Monk-
Is it television ARE NOT or at the HAPPENING
Theatre? ANYWAY.And I already have a bit of weight. No more or they may never happen...
Posted by Dinah on October 17, 2002, at 20:35:38
In reply to Re: A funnier joke.. Dinah, posted by gabbix2 on October 17, 2002, at 20:15:20
Yes, Monk is a TV show, about an ex-detective with OCD. It's quite funny really.
And you poor dear. :( I consider it part of my anti-anxiety regimen.
A sympathetic,
Dinah
Posted by gabbix2 on October 17, 2002, at 20:46:09
In reply to Re: A funnier joke.. ROFLMAO » gabbix2, posted by Dinah on October 17, 2002, at 20:35:38
You do so Dang much, I'm always glad to make you smile.
Yeah, they are good for anxiety aren't they, I think I remember.(sigh) deeep sigh deeper sigh oh yes even deeper sigh)Okay I'm stopping now..
Posted by ROO on October 18, 2002, at 8:24:08
In reply to Re: A funnier joke.. Dinah » gabbix2, posted by Dinah on October 17, 2002, at 19:35:16
Yeah, I'll ask my p-doc about the depakote...thing
is I've finally stabilized on SOMETHING...I've been trying
something new practically every month this past summer (it's been a rough damn summer
let me tell you...been suicidal, etc....
I hate to try yet another drug because of something so "minor" (although
it's not minor to me...I'm not even in a relationship, but it's still
not minor to me...)...but I'll mention it anyway. I sure hope I wouldn't
gain 40 pounds on it though! That's a whole lot of weight! Do you
work out and everything and still gain that much?
Posted by ROO on October 18, 2002, at 8:29:11
In reply to It pleases me to no end to make you laugh Dinah.., posted by gabbix2 on October 17, 2002, at 20:46:09
You might want to wait and see if it actually makes
you gain weight first...it doesn't everyone...it didn't
Dinah and I've talked to a few people on the med board who
didn't gain weight on it. I wouldn't give it up for crotch
numbing Topomax before giving it a chance (although Topomax might
not numb your crotch...apparently that's a rare thing that lucky
me got...like I said, I think God hates me and decided it would be
fun to give that side effect to me...He said "yeah, she really likes sex,
and she's been depressed for a really long time....let's give her this drug
that works pretty well but that zaps her ole pleasure zone whaaahahahahahah".I'm a bitter, bitter woman right now.
Posted by Dinah on October 18, 2002, at 9:10:03
In reply to Re: Gabbi, posted by ROO on October 18, 2002, at 8:29:11
I hate to be chipper, but there is good news in all of this. You've discovered that mood stabilizers are an effective class of meds for you. Now you have narrowed your search.
An less than chipper (really!)
Dinah
Posted by Ted on October 18, 2002, at 11:54:26
In reply to A funnier joke.. Dinah, posted by gabbix2 on October 17, 2002, at 19:25:56
Hey Gabbi,
> I'm only on a low dose though 500mgs so I'm not sure if that would lessen the risk.
Maybe, but here is what I have found: IF you are susceptible to the weight gain (and like Roo said, not everyone, in fact nearly half on average, is) then you won't gain weight UNTIL you take a therapeutic dose. I can guarantee that your 500mg dose in not therapeutic unless you are an anorexic waif -- it's just too little. I needed 1000mg just to reach the bottom end of therapeutic and that still wasn't enough. Now I'm at 1500mg and it is working.
Ted
Posted by Ted on October 18, 2002, at 12:04:47
In reply to Re: Ted, posted by ROO on October 18, 2002, at 8:24:08
Roo,
No, I don't work out. For a while I rode my bicycle to work (9 miles per day; we have showers here) but even that made no difference at all. I am just plain disenchanted. I have given up. If I'm going to be fat, then so be it. I went on a hiking/camping trip with a friend last weekend and I did fine keeping up with my friend who is in *much* better shape, but I was quite tired at the end of the day.
I also take zoloft and it causes weight gain for some as well.I *think* I have a binge eating disorder too. I'm not as bad as most clinical cases, but I'm bad enough. I took an eating disorder self-assessment in a women's magazine at the doctor office a couple years ago and I was borderline -- "talk with your doctor" level. I mentioned it to my previous pdoc and I think he just wrote that I was a hypocondriac in my chart. :-)
I think my biggest problem is that I am bored with everything -- work, home, life -- everything.
Ted
Posted by ROO on October 18, 2002, at 13:06:44
In reply to depakote weight gain » ROO, posted by Ted on October 18, 2002, at 12:04:47
Ted--
So you just eat a ton out of boredom? (just purely
curious...) I can relate...I've had eating disorders
before. Have you always ate a lot and the weight just didn't
come on until the zoloft (or the depakote, whichever the case may
be). How much zoloft do you take? Does the zoloft zap your crotch?
Seems like it would, being an ssri and all that.The camping trip sounds fun.
Do you think the boredom is part of how your depression manifests
itself? Food is part of the search through satisfaction through the
senses syndrome...? I've had those days where I'll compulsively binge eat, smoke,
among other sensory things, all in the same day...and i'll just say to myself..."Ruth...you're doing that
trying to fill the void through the senses thing and it's NOT working...".
Posted by Ted on October 18, 2002, at 13:57:38
In reply to Re: depakote weight gain, boredom, etc--Ted, posted by ROO on October 18, 2002, at 13:06:44
Roo,
<sorry -- long>
> So you just eat a ton out of boredom? (just purely
> curious...)Yeah, that's pretty much it.
>I can relate...I've had eating disorders
> before.How do you get over them? I even mentioned it to my therapist and she didn't seem to consider it a problem.
>Have you always ate a lot and the weight just didn't
> come on until the zoloft (or the depakote, whichever the case may
> be).The answer to that question is multipart.
Until I had my last *major* depressive episode, in early 1985, I ate normally. For a week at the start of that 1985 episode, I ate nothing and lost 10 pounds. Ever since the end of that first week, I have had difficulties with eating, specifically overeating.
I have bipolar, and until I went loopy in May 1999, I got a reasonably large amount of exercise and I was active and though not particularly "thin", I wasn't particularly overweight either.
After my hospitalization and medication in 1999, I have had continual lethargy (not medical -- I get tested regularly), lack of interest in most everything, and ever more difficulty with overeating. Boredom became a major issue. I wonder if it is related to my bipolar mania being gone through meds....
>How much zoloft do you take? Does the zoloft zap your crotch?
I was taking 200mg/day (as 100 mg bid). I went off to try lexapro last summer. Lexapro failed, so I returned to zoloft because it works well for my OCD. I am currently taking only 50 mg but I plan to raise that to 75-100 mg. Yes, at doses over 50 mg, it does zap (rather numbs) my crotch. BUT: zoloft has a very short half-life and I can stop taking it for just 1 day and do OK crotch-wise. At 200 mg, I have to stop for 2 days.
> The camping trip sounds fun.
It was.
> Do you think the boredom is part of how your depression manifests
> itself?I think so. I mentioned exactly that to both my pdoc and my therapist and neither had a comment.
> Food is part of the search through satisfaction through the
> senses syndrome...?Maybe, but it really doesn't do much for the senses for me. It's more just something to do that is less boring than anything else. I also have the problem that my wife has chronic major depression (runs in her family) and her continually poor mood hurts mine by osmosis alone. She is taking meds and it helps her (ok, us) lots, but maybe I need more from her.
*However* last night I looked in the junk food cupboard and decided to clean out my truck from the camping trip instead. SO, I managed something productive while managing not to do any extra eating. If only I could do that more often.....
Ted
Posted by ROO on October 18, 2002, at 14:52:34
In reply to Re: depakote weight gain, boredom, etc--Ted » ROO, posted by Ted on October 18, 2002, at 13:57:38
> How do you get over them? I even mentioned it
to my therapist and she didn't seem to consider
it a problem.I don't know if you ever get over them, you just learn how
to manage them...I think for me, I just figured out "healthier" ways
to manage my boredom...ways that were more gratifying to me...and I became
kind of "bored" with overeating...it didn't really do it for me anymore.
Sometimes I still do it, sure, but not nearly to the extent that I used to
binge eat....and I used to have bullemia and the whole nine yards.I think for me, it was a big metaphor...there was a big void in me I was trying
to fill...and it became painfully obvious that food wasn't going to do it...so I began
searching for things that would come closer to the mark...painting, hiking....stuff that
"fed my soul" more...not to be too Oprah or anything, but hey, I am a girl.>
> Until I had my last *major* depressive episode,
in early 1985, I ate normally. For a week at the
start of that 1985 episode, I ate nothing and
lost 10 pounds. Ever since the end of that first
week, I have had difficulties with eating,
specifically overeating.That must be frustrating...having had a relatively normal past...
>
> I have bipolar, and until I went loopy in
May 1999, I got a reasonably large amount of
exercise and I was active and though not
particularly "thin", I wasn't particularly
overweight either.You had your first manic episode in 1999?
>
> After my hospitalization and medication in 1999
, I have had continual lethargy (not medical
-- I get tested regularly), lack of interest in
most everything, and ever more difficulty with
overeating. Boredom became a major issue. I
wonder if it is related to my bipolar mania being
gone through meds....So until 1999, you had a fair amount of energy and vigor, and after
that, you've felt pretty lethargic...wow...that's about 4 years of feeling
lethargic...what sorts of things have you tried to counteract the
lethargy? It must be awfully frustrating...."treated" for your illness...but
lethargic and care less about anything having been active and energic in the past...>
> I think so. I mentioned exactly that to both
my pdoc and my therapist and neither had a
comment.I don't think anyone knows how to deal with that one...they only
know how to deal with the suicidal tendencies...I know when I'm feeling
suicidal I only WISH I were feeling bored...but then when I'm feeling bored
it feels like a different kind of death.Sometimes I wonder how much of it is a SPIRITUAL problem...not in the
sense of religion or jesus or anything like that...but the other day I
was thinking it had been forever since I'd done anything half way adventurous.
But then you just went on a camping trip the other day, so maybe it's not that
for you...were you bored on the camping trip?She is
taking meds and it helps her (ok, us) lots, but
maybe I need more from her.Depression sure is hard on relationships. Scares me.
>
> *However* last night I looked in the junk food cupboard
and decided to clean out my truck from the
camping trip instead. SO, I managed something
productive while managing not to do any extra
eating. If only I could do that more often.....Sometimes I've wondered if I could just FORCE myself to
do certain things if it would make me feel a lot better...things
like you just mentioned...just little things like that can make
you feel more alive...like a normal human being...
>
>
Posted by Ted on October 18, 2002, at 15:59:44
In reply to Re: depakote weight gain, boredom, etc--Ted, posted by ROO on October 18, 2002, at 14:52:34
> I don't know if you ever get over them, you just learn how
> to manage them...I think for me, I just figured out "healthier" ways
> to manage my boredom...ways that were more gratifying to me...and I became
> kind of "bored" with overeating...Wow -- bored with overeating? That would be nice. I once had a coworker who, as a result of a medical problem, felt no hunger and had remember to eat meals. If only....
> I think for me, it was a big metaphor...there was a big void in me I was trying
> to fill...and it became painfully obvious that food wasn't going to do it...so I began
> searching for things that would come closer to the mark...painting, hiking....stuff that
> "fed my soul" more...not to be too Oprah or anything, but hey, I am a girl.I understand. My if I were a girl it would help? :-) I could always pretend (I live near San Francisco). :-)
> That must be frustrating...having had a relatively normal past...I was never "normal", but as far as eating is concerned, yes, you're right.
> You had your first manic episode in 1999?
Classic, yes. I had dysphoric mania for about 5-6 years prior. Earlier, I had brief (hypo)manic episodes separated by long depressions. I call myself bipolar 1.5 -- worse than II, but not as bad as I.
> So until 1999, you had a fair amount of energy and vigor, and after
> that, you've felt pretty lethargic...wow...that's about 4 years of feeling
> lethargic...what sorts of things have you tried to counteract the
> lethargy?- Sleep (10 hours per night). Then I'm wide awake and lethargic.
- Exercise. Then I'm exhausted and lethargic.
- Yardwork & home maintenance. Then I'm frustrated and lethargic.> It must be awfully frustrating...."treated" for your illness...but
> lethargic and care less about anything having been active and energic in the past...Yup. Now you understand.
> Sometimes I wonder how much of it is a SPIRITUAL problem...not in the
> sense of religion or jesus or anything like that...Good -- I'm atheist.
> but the other day I
> was thinking it had been forever since I'd done anything half way adventurous.I do stuff others would call frighteningly adventurous. Yawn. I don't think that's the problem.
> But then you just went on a camping trip the other day, so maybe it's not that
> for you...were you bored on the camping trip?Not for about half of the first day. Went downhill pretty fast after that, though.
> Depression sure is hard on relationships. Scares me.
We agree that at least we each know how the other feels and don't have to try to explain it or anything. But it is difficult much of the time.
> Sometimes I've wondered if I could just FORCE myself to
> do certain things if it would make me feel a lot better...things
> like you just mentioned...just little things like that can make
> you feel more alive...like a normal human being...Yeah. Maybe just a little polite nagging from my wife would help. So much I could (and should) do just doesn't dawn on me. Then again, the last thing I need is to become a CNP (chronically normal person).
Ted
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