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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 5 of 5. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by shrinking violet on April 17, 2006, at 18:21:15
I have no idea where I'm going with this, just to warn you all in advance.
I had a rather upsetting session today with the new-ish T (it's been a few months now, at least....is she still new?). We somehow migrated into talking about my former T (very difficult/painful topic) and I totally lost it and ended up sobbing in my car, where my T came out and asked me if I was okay, etc. I told her I didn't want to schedule another appointment. :-/
Anyway, during our conversation about former T (for those of you who remember: possible entwined relationship, very close with her, blah blah) my current T asked something and in my response I mentioned that no hard-and-fast rules or laws exist about post-therapy contact or relationships, just guidelines (the 2 year rule, etc). My T disagreed, said at least for psychologists (my former T was a social worker) that there are explicit rules/laws that forbid any post-therapy contact or relationships, and she said she was pretty sure that some form of rules/laws exist for anyone practicing clinical therapy. I didn't disagree right then, but made a mental note to research it online. I have, a bit, but have only found ethical rules that forbid sexual contact between current or former therapists, but nothing that explicitly states that a former client and therapist cannot form some sort of relationship outside of the therapy realm if the two are agreed.
Now, being stubborn and proud, I'd love to find evidence to the contrary of what she says and bring it in to show her lol. But, for now, for my own learning, does anyone know whether rules or laws exist that explicitly state that there cannot be post-therapy contact or relationship (non-sexual) between a former T and client? I've sent my former T cards and letters (as she said I could write to her), although she's never responded. So, it's okay for her to hear from me but not vice versa (that's not very fair, lol)? Plus, I guess if there does turn out to be a rule/law forbidding this sort of thing, then maybe I'll have to give up hope and face the fact that I'll probably never see or hear from my former T again. :-( Not sure if I'm ready for that, but anyway.....
Then, of course, just saying all of this makes me feel like some huge stalker, or something. Is there something wrong with me? What's wrong with not wanting to give up hearing from someone who meant something to you? I personally think life is too short to shut people out of your life for silly reasons. Would meeting for coffee once or twice a year, or her sending me a letter every Christmas really get her into that much trouble, if she ever decided to do so? Seems illogical to me.....
Oh, and I think I've decided I hate my former T for doing this to me. :-( Except for the times I really miss her, which is a lot, too. *sigh*
Thanks,
sv
Posted by orchid on April 17, 2006, at 18:33:51
In reply to ethics/laws? and a bunch of, er, babble, posted by shrinking violet on April 17, 2006, at 18:21:15
I don't think your ex T stopped responding to you because of ethical rules or reasons.
If it is unethical to continue contact post therapy, it is even more unethical to let a patient suffer, and knowing full well that she caused you this suffering in the first place, and not doing anything to make it easier for you.
I don't think it has as much to do with ethics as it has to do with irresponsibility and recklessness. Your ex T was a bit of a jerk in the way she terminated you, and though she might have been a good person otherwise, and generally means well, that doesn't change the fact that she knowingly caused you this suffering, and didn't apologize or take any action to make it better.
You don't have to hate her for it, but acknowledging that she was very highly irresponsible and that it was her fault, will help you move on. I still have regards for my first T and think good of him, but at the same time, I realize how irresponsible and reckless he was in terminating me like that. And that knowledge helps me move on, but at the same time I still have gratitude towards him for all his help.
And no, there is no hard coded rule which says there is to be no contact post termination. If there was, then, that rule is wrong.
Posted by Poet on April 17, 2006, at 18:41:43
In reply to ethics/laws? and a bunch of, er, babble, posted by shrinking violet on April 17, 2006, at 18:21:15
HI SV,
I'm glad you're back posting, but sorry to hear that things aren't going so well with your new T. I remember what a tough time you were having when old T terminated you.
I found this website on patient-therapist relationships. It's all too much for my brain to concentrate on right now, but it looks pretty detailed.
http://www.drzur.com/dualrelationships.html
I have always thought my T and I would make good friends if I ever get done with therapy, but never have told her. I'm afraid she'd say it's a boundary. Plus she knows so much that I would hate anybody else to know. Sigh.
Take care.
Poet
Posted by pseudoname on April 18, 2006, at 9:22:59
In reply to ethics/laws? and a bunch of, er, babble, posted by shrinking violet on April 17, 2006, at 18:21:15
(Poet-- great link.)
Violet--
It's surprising how misinformed professionals can be about the laws & regulations that directly affect them. I've run up against that myself with pdocs. (And, I should admit, in my own business I was completely unaware of an important new regulation for the last 2 years. Yike! “Dummy!”)
According the American Psychological Association official ethics guidelines, therapists can even engage in *sexual* relationships with their former clients. (http://www.apa.org/ethics/code2002.html#10_08) There are strict requirements that try to ensure it's non-exploitative, but it clearly refutes the claim that *no* relationships are allowed.
The guidelines also say “Multiple relationships that would not reasonably be expected to cause impairment or risk exploitation or harm are not unethical” — and that's talking about with CURRENT clients, let alone former.
I've heard of state legislatures considering banning sexual relationships with former therapy clients, but I don't know if any ever passed. I think they would violate Constitutional freedom of association rights.
Posted by gardenergirl on April 18, 2006, at 22:15:52
In reply to contact w former clients NOT unethical, posted by pseudoname on April 18, 2006, at 9:22:59
Violet,
You'll also want to check your state psychology licensing laws. Different states have different rules, but I'm not aware of any that differ dramatically from the basics.If you want to babblemail me with your state, or the state your old T is licensed in, and what her credentials are (I forget if she was a psychologist, counselor, etc.), I can help you find out what your state law says.
And by the way, my yard is full of wild violets right now. So beautiful. As are you. :)
Take care,
gg
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