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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 12 of 12. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by milly on March 14, 2006, at 10:35:26
Hi
I'm all over the place so excuse if none of this makes senseI was waiting for my T to come and get me this morning and I had thought I might say how good I was, cr*p idea that was!
A guy from the day centre unit came and sat beside me (no problem normally at the moment) but then he he began to talk about 'old times' and then he knew my name and insisted we'd been inpatients together. Well as far as I know I haven't been an inpatient but throughout my therapy stuff has come back to me (horrid stuff)and now I don't know what is real and can be trusted. I just thought the blanks were normal or bad memory.
I couldn't move to get myself to a safe place just like I couldn't during the rape etc . When T arrived I just freaked and got really angry that he hadn't collected me early.
I really needed him to hold me and I know he was trying to but all i wanted to do was curl up in his lap IRL
Plus I'm as mad as hell that I only have 3 sessions left
He thinks i get into situations that i can't get out of because I always feel that the other persons feelings are more important than mine,
I couldn't move away today for fear of causing him to feel rejected, I got myself into a situation that culminated in the rape because i didn't want to appear rude. I'm such a stupid, stupid piece of worthless sh*t.milly
Posted by madeline on March 14, 2006, at 11:28:41
In reply to This was soooo wierd ***pos trigger****, posted by milly on March 14, 2006, at 10:35:26
I don't know if your T actually said "you got yourself in a position to be raped because you didn't want to be rude" or if that is something you are just thinking.
In either case, it is NOT true. What happened to you is a case of an evil person doing an evil thing. Period. You did nothing to "cause" him to rape you. If your T said that, then SHAME ON HIM.
Also, not wanting to be rude is a very natural thing. I mean NOBODY gets up in the morning and decides, you know I think I'm going to be rude all day.
Being civil and cordial to each other is what makes living with each other possible. In fact, I bet 99.9% of people sitting on that couch would have done the exact same thing you did. And most of them are not stupid people and neither are you.
Finally, there is a difference in being honest and in being rude. I think therein may lie the trouble for you (and for most people too, me included). If you think that being assertive is something you have trouble with, then role-playing is the best thing in the world. Try to engage your therapist in helping you to actually enact and internalize being honest and assertive with people.
I'm sorry you only have three sessions left. Hopefully your T can provide you with referrals that will help you develop a long-term, reliable relationship with a therapist so you can continue to heal.
Bottom line, I don't think you are stupid, I think you are a person doing the best she can.
Maddie
Posted by Racer on March 14, 2006, at 12:26:49
In reply to This was soooo wierd ***pos trigger****, posted by milly on March 14, 2006, at 10:35:26
That's something I can relate to: feeling as though the other person's feelings are more important than mine; not wanting to appear rude; and, in my case, not wanting to be embarrassed.
When I was a kid, on the bus I took to school, there was a man who used to come over to where I was standing, grasp the overhead bar on either side of me, and press up against me from behind. I knew what he was doing, I hated him doing it to me, it happened more than once, and I knew that I could yell out for the bus driver. You know why I didn't? I thought, if I did, the guy would totally deny it, he'd say that I was imagining things, the bus driver would believe him instead of me, and I'd be humiliated. (Looking back, wonder where I learned that reporting something like that wouldn't do me any good?) So, instead, I put up with it.
And that sort of thing escalates. Putting up with that man, I didn't learn to set physical boundaries enough to stop another man who followed me off another bus and assaulted me. (That time, I was on the way to a therapy appointment. The T told me, once I got there, that I must have been wrong. "You're 13 years old, you're just a child -- no one would sexually assault you. You only believe it because you're wicked." Very helpful.) And then, years later, was raped by an acquaintance, again because I couldn't stop things when I first became uncomfortable.
Milly, what you're describing is not all that uncommon. I read somewhere, don't remember where, that a study had shown more than half of all women over 25 had experienced unwanted sexual activity. Not necessarily rape, but sexual activity that they wanted to say no to, but didn't feel able to. More on the date rape scale, but still pretty damaging. You're not stupid, or wrong, or messed up -- you're a woman, and you've been socialized to "get along" with others. That does put you at risk -- but only because there are people out there who take advantage of that quality in you.
Remember: you didn't "get" raped. Someone raped you. Someone else did something bad to you. The more you can phrase it to yourself and others as something that someone else did, the less you call it something you did, the easier it will be for you. Yes, it's still nothing like easy -- especially because there's that feeling of helplessness, that someone did something to you. But it will be easier than blaming yourself.
Tell me, can you be angry at the man who raped you? Or are you turning much of that anger on yourself, for not protecting yourself? I ask that, no at all critically. I'm middle aged, and I still feel shame that I couldn't, at 11, fight off the man who molested me. And I still have a great deal of difficulty directing anger directly at the people responsible: him, for what he did, and my mother, for not protecting me. (In my case, I learned not to stop things earlier, because my mother saw problems, and didn't stop him. Even when I asked for her help, she just told me, 'Try not to react, and he'll give up.')
And I'm very sorry you're running towards the end with this T. What's the situation? Is it something that he can extend, maybe? Or can you get a good referral?
Good luck.
Posted by B2chica on March 14, 2006, at 12:42:02
In reply to 'nother likely trigger -- includes story » milly, posted by Racer on March 14, 2006, at 12:26:49
man, racer, you are one smart cookie.
-i really undrstand about the guy on the bus thing. i had a couple guys when i was younger always wanting to play sexually and i was uncomfortable but didnt feel 1-that i would be believed and 2-that i had a right to say no 3-that i would be blamed. so i too put up with it.
if you read my recent thread about work you will see that i still have this same problem.and what you said about 'getting r@ped' versus 'someone r@ped you'. i didn't realized that i always said the first. my initial blame is on me for letting it happen. for not stopping it when it first became uncomfortable.
you are wise.
thank you for your comments. they help me.
b2c.
Posted by Susan47 on March 14, 2006, at 15:58:02
In reply to This was soooo wierd ***pos trigger****, posted by milly on March 14, 2006, at 10:35:26
YOU ARE WORTHY AND YOUR FEELINGS ARE IMPORTANT.
Posted by fairywings on March 14, 2006, at 23:01:15
In reply to This was soooo wierd ***pos trigger****, posted by milly on March 14, 2006, at 10:35:26
(((milly)))
I agree with everyone milly, you aren't to blame for any of this. For some reason setting boundaries is so much more difficult for some of us - maybe more accurately non-existant for some of us. It s*cks that we weren't taught that it was okay to speak up for ourselves, we were discouraged to speak up or defend ourselves, and/or we were weren't protected by the ppl who should have made us feel safe when we were younger. Freezing when we feel threatened is really hard to overcome. I wish I had an answer for that. And I agree with the others - unfortunately we don't get mad at the ppl we should get mad at, we get mad at ourselves, but you're not to blame please know that.
Why do you have only 3 appts. left?! I hope there's some way you can get more help.
fw
Posted by milly on March 15, 2006, at 7:00:36
In reply to Re: This was soooo wierd ***pos trigger**** » milly, posted by madeline on March 14, 2006, at 11:28:41
Maddie, thanks for you post
> I don't know if your T actually said "you got yourself in a position to be raped because you didn't want to be rude" or if that is something you are just thinking.
To be fair i don't think he was refering to the rape more to the zillion other situations I put up with or blame myself for. I moved it on in my head to include the rape.
> In either case, it is NOT true. What happened to you is a case of an evil person doing an evil thing. Period. You did nothing to "cause" him to rape you. If your T said that, then SHAME ON HIM.> Also, not wanting to be rude is a very natural thing. I mean NOBODY gets up in the morning and decides, you know I think I'm going to be rude all day.
> Being civil and cordial to each other is what makes living with each other possible. In fact, I bet 99.9% of people sitting on that couch would have done the exact same thing you did. And most of them are not stupid people and neither are you.
>
> Finally, there is a difference in being honest and in being rude. I think therein may lie the trouble for you (and for most people too, me included). If you think that being assertive is something you have trouble with, then role-playing is the best thing in the world. Try to engage your therapist in helping you to actually enact and internalize being honest and assertive with people.I just can't seem to help myself seeing things from the other persons perspective and trying desperatly hard to ensure they don't feel the hurt, rejection, humiliation through my actions that i have known.
> I'm sorry you only have three sessions left. Hopefully your T can provide you with referrals that will help you develop a long-term, reliable relationship with a therapist so you can continue to heal.
I'm sorry too I'm not sure if I'm strong enough to 'start again' nor if I could cope with suffering the huge transference again should it occur.
> Bottom line, I don't think you are stupid, I think you are a person doing the best she can.
Thanks
Milly
Posted by milly on March 15, 2006, at 7:22:23
In reply to 'nother likely trigger -- includes story » milly, posted by Racer on March 14, 2006, at 12:26:49
Thanks Racer for your reply
> That's something I can relate to: feeling as though the other person's feelings are more important than mine; not wanting to appear rude; and, in my case, not wanting to be embarrassed.
I was brought up to be so 'nice' and it hasn't served me well!
> When I was a kid, on the bus I took to school, there was a man who used to come over to where I was standing, grasp the overhead bar on either side of me, and press up against me from behind. I knew what he was doing, I hated him doing it to me, it happened more than once, and I knew that I could yell out for the bus driver. You know why I didn't? I thought, if I did, the guy would totally deny it, he'd say that I was imagining things, the bus driver would believe him instead of me, and I'd be humiliated. (Looking back, wonder where I learned that reporting something like that wouldn't do me any good?) So, instead, I put up with it.
Oh Racer, that makes me so sad for you and it brought back to me how as a kid and my ballet clothers were advertised in the local paper because i was giving up and I answered the phone and it was some guy who had read the advert and made this obscene phone call on the pretence of enquiring after the advert and so as not to be rude by interupting him or putting down the phone I experienced 20 minutes of torture as he described what he'd do with me in my leotard!
> And that sort of thing escalates. Putting up with that man, I didn't learn to set physical boundaries enough to stop another man who followed me off another bus and assaulted me. (That time, I was on the way to a therapy appointment. The T told me, once I got there, that I must have been wrong. "You're 13 years old, you're just a child -- no one would sexually assault you. You only believe it because you're wicked." Very helpful.) And then, years later, was raped by an acquaintance, again because I couldn't stop things when I first became uncomfortable.
((((((Racer)))))))) no words just tears
> Milly, what you're describing is not all that uncommon. I read somewhere, don't remember where, that a study had shown more than half of all women over 25 had experienced unwanted sexual activity. Not necessarily rape, but sexual activity that they wanted to say no to, but didn't feel able to. More on the date rape scale, but still pretty damaging. You're not stupid, or wrong, or messed up -- you're a woman, and you've been socialized to "get along" with others. That does put you at risk -- but only because there are people out there who take advantage of that quality in you.
>
> Remember: you didn't "get" raped. Someone raped you. Someone else did something bad to you. The more you can phrase it to yourself and others as something that someone else did, the less you call it something you did, the easier it will be for you. Yes, it's still nothing like easy -- especially because there's that feeling of helplessness, that someone did something to you. But it will be easier than blaming yourself.I have never told anyone except this board and my T (actually it was well buried and only came up through T)He took my virginity and i have always felt like 'soiled goods'.
> Tell me, can you be angry at the man who raped you?
Nope, I was such a klutz I knew what he was like and looking back i see he engineered it that I would be alone that evening (it was my 19th b/day)and he arrived to help me celebrate. i shouldn't have let him in but i can remember thinking 'how sweet, he can't be all bad!!!
>Or are you turning much of that anger on yourself, for not protecting yourself? I ask that, no at all critically.
Yep
I'm middle aged, and I still feel shame that I couldn't, at 11, fight off the man who molested me. And I still have a great deal of difficulty directing anger directly at the people responsible: him, for what he did, and my mother, for not protecting me. (In my case, I learned not to stop things earlier, because my mother saw problems, and didn't stop him. Even when I asked for her help, she just told me, 'Try not to react, and he'll give up.')
> And I'm very sorry you're running towards the end with this T. What's the situation? Is it something that he can extend, maybe? Or can you get a good referral?Because I'm in UK I was offered 6 months and it has been 7. I asked yesterday if it was negotiable but it's not. he has tried to talk about me getting extra help but I just want to stay with him and get very distressed if he starts to talk about it.
>
> Good luck.Thanks
Posted by milly on March 15, 2006, at 7:23:56
In reply to Re: This was soooo wierd ***pos trigger**** » milly, posted by Susan47 on March 14, 2006, at 15:58:02
> YOU ARE WORTHY AND YOUR FEELINGS ARE IMPORTANT.
thanks I wish I could believe it
Posted by milly on March 15, 2006, at 7:36:56
In reply to Re: This was soooo wierd ***pos trigger**** » milly, posted by fairywings on March 14, 2006, at 23:01:15
Thanks fairywings
your post helped
I find it so hard to defend myself, others I seem to be able to do, and child protection is a massive issue for me. I lost my job & my sanity last year over knowing that I HAD to report a situation to the police and social services whilst working in a school.I could do that but defending myself over what the perpetrater subsequently did to me was impossible because it was what i would expect to happen to me
The termination of my therapy is because i'm in the uk and so have very little say in what I need it is all around money and I was offered 6 months (crisis therapy) and my T has squeezed it to 7 his hands are tied. I think he knows it is wrong and will be detrimental to me. he is trying to sort out further help but it won't be with him and I'm not sure I can face 'starting again' I have only just got to the point of trust with him. The system stinks
milly
Posted by B2chica on March 15, 2006, at 8:53:28
In reply to Re: This was soooo wierd ***pos trigger**** » Susan47, posted by milly on March 15, 2006, at 7:23:56
isn't it ironic that we can hear bad things about us once and believe it and hear good things about us 100 times and still don't?
that's where i'm at.anyway, i thought i'd ditto these words. maybe if i say it enough you might allow for the possibility that it's true.
YOU ARE WORTHY AND YOUR FEELINGS ARE IMPORTANT.
YOU ARE IMPORTANT.
b2c> > YOU ARE WORTHY AND YOUR FEELINGS ARE IMPORTANT.
>
> thanks I wish I could believe it
Posted by fairywings on March 15, 2006, at 9:27:12
In reply to Re: This was soooo wierd ***pos trigger**** » fairywings, posted by milly on March 15, 2006, at 7:36:56
I'm so sorry your therapy is ending. The system really s*cks! I agree, building trust and staying consistent is so important, but how do you do that when the health care syst. won't let you? Something really needs to be fixed! I'd think that way of doing care would only make a lot of ppl worse.I remember what happened to you at the school, and how they've tried to catch this guy. I hope they do, and justice is served. Unfortunately you can't get back what he took from you.
I"m so sorry.
((((Milly))))
fw
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