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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by McPac on November 4, 2003, at 22:13:48
In reply to Re: Lar, Re: Afraid about tryptophan » McPac, posted by Larry Hoover on November 4, 2003, at 9:29:55
> Lar,
> I took about 1,100 mg's of tryptophan and felt my moods lifted (happier) and also much less physical anxiety (more calm)....after ONE dose I felt a difference.....I then repeated this on 2 other occassions (each time spaced many days apart), again I felt the same way each time.How long did the positive effect last?
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I didn't monitor it too closely time-wise but it seemed to lift my mood for a couple of days...of course, that is while still on the Lexapro (if not on any Lex, who knows what the effect would be, maybe I'd need a larger dose and a more consistent supply to provide the positive effect?....one thing that I certainly noticed was that about a day-and-a-half or 2 days after taking it, I got a fairly bad headache each time (kind of like a withdrawal-type headache)....the 1st night I took it, I got one of those really fast 'twitchy things' in my deltoid (you know how sometimes you get those super-fast, little twitches, often around the side of the eye? Well, I got that exact same kind of super-fast twitch in my deltoid, lasted about a minute or so...it was rather amusing; it felt like no big deal at all but with being on an ssri I'm very cautious of combining the 2.
> I don't believe this was a placebo effect at all but I wonder how trytophan could cause this effect so quickly?
Pure aminos go into the blood quickly. The effect lags just behind the blood concentration.
>>>>>>>>> Lar, but why does it take AD's many WEEKS to affect some people...the drugs go into the blood rather quickly then too, don't they?
> Unfortunately, I'm taking an ssri now (Lexapro, 20 mg's/day) and am therefore VERY hesitant to take the tryptophan regularly at all...bummer. Thanks!
Why hesitate? You pay exquisite attention to how you feel. I pay attention like that, too. It's just how I am.....very sensitive.
>>>>>>>>>> I'm 'afraid' of this serotonin syndrome thingy, lol,.....I was reading recently on the Babble board where "Linkadge" believes he had serotonin syndrome..they admitted him to a psych unit for 2 or 2 1/2 weeks or so after he went to emergency room......I don't want that....yes, my body seems to typically be VERY sensitive to meds (that can be both Good and Bad at times).......Lar, I've really got to tell you something though...you know how I've been going to the Pfeiffer Treatment Center...well, it's been almost 11 months now that I've been following their prescribed treatment plan and taking LOTS of supplements..their plan may have done some good...but I can honestly say that it seems to me that just ONE single supplement, the TRYPTOPHAN, has single-handedly done MORE for uplifting my mood than ALL the others COMBINED! Now, here's my thinking of why Pfeiffer did NOT have me on tryptophan or 5htp...2 possible reasons: 1) they did not want me on an ssri + tryptophan/5htp due to risk of serotonin syndrome OR 2) their main goal was to lower my histamine levels and I'm not sure trypt/5htp fit into that objective....I get little feedback from Pfeiffer, so I'm left to ponder why they didn't try the tryptophan....after not feeling much effect from Pfeiffer's plan, I came across the www.neuroreplete.com site...it sounded pretty good to me so I got hold of a nearby doctor who does follow their protocol...I am supposed to go to him fairly soon....I like the idea of them using precise testing methods to closely align my neurotransmitter levels through urine testing of such levels (as opposed to my willy-nilly methods...I don't want to only feel good for a certain period of time while unknowingly causing certain other NT levels to deplete over time and eventually feeling like crap again.....I guess I would feel more secure with their know-how and help than trying to balance my crazy brain on my own.....but it looks like the neuroreplete folks use 5htp in their products NOT tryptophan...bummer...I don't know if 5htp will have such a fantastic effect..........my body can be so very, very sensitive---I took about 1,000 mg's of tryptophan this morning...once again, my mood has lifted very nicely...but I feel a little TOO-revved up (slightly...just slightly a tad hypo...nothing at all to worry about...just energetic and somewhat revved).......please let me know all of your thoughts on my replies Hoovermeister....particularly re: the serotonin syndrome thing...I would definitely be taking trypt DAILY if not for that and being on an ssri......you rule Lar....glad you stayed!!!!!!!!
Posted by Wolf Dreamer on November 5, 2003, at 10:03:26
In reply to Lar, Re: Afraid about tryptophan, posted by McPac on November 4, 2003, at 22:13:48
Just checked outside, and there it was today.
I ordered the pure brand on the horse webpage Larry Hover mentioned.
I took 1905 mg, plus whatever I licked off my fingers after pulling that little scoop off the bottom.
This stuff doesn't dissolve in anything it seems. I tried putting it in a cup with my sugar free lemondade mixed with refrigerated distilled water, but it just floated around, and I couldn't get it all out. Stirring didn't work, as it just floated there, and when I drank everything, there it was stuck to the little cup still. So I just scooped it up with my finger and ate it.
Whats this I hear about a capsule form? Please post a link to where you can order the capsule form online. I think that will help people interested in trying it.
Posted by matthhhh on November 5, 2003, at 11:00:17
In reply to got tryptophan... horse powder hard to mix, posted by Wolf Dreamer on November 5, 2003, at 10:03:26
Hey wolf, ive tried the horse brand too, it was great for me but now im taking capsules by prescription. So what kind of effect did it have on you?
Posted by JLx on November 5, 2003, at 12:11:29
In reply to got tryptophan... horse powder hard to mix, posted by Wolf Dreamer on November 5, 2003, at 10:03:26
> Whats this I hear about a capsule form? Please post a link to where you can order the capsule form online. I think that will help people interested in trying it.I mix my bulk aminos with a spoonful of applesauce.
Here's a couple places with capsules. The first link is the recovery center/web page for Joan Matthews Larson, who wrote, "Depression Free Naturally". The second one is the source she USED to have on that page.
http://www.healthrecovery.com/
http://www.biochemicals.com/orderonline.php3
Posted by matthhhh on November 5, 2003, at 16:18:20
In reply to got tryptophan... horse powder hard to mix, posted by Wolf Dreamer on November 5, 2003, at 10:03:26
Im not afraid that that the tryptophan is working- just that it is so potent. I mean I feel like im buzzed, but its a good feeling. I guess im wondering why only 1 gram day makes me feel this way, when a normal person supposedly takes 2-3 grams a day just in food alone. Is it just because its reaching my brain faster and does not have to compete with the other amino acids? Could it be possible that too much serotonin is in my system? I just took 1 gram pill this morning- and another 3/4 of one this afternoon and the effect was really strong- but a good feeling. Also since 5htp had no effect on me whatsoever, why would tryptophan be the complete opposite? thanks
Posted by Wolf Dreamer on November 6, 2003, at 11:05:25
In reply to Re: got tryptophan... horse powder hard to mix, posted by matthhhh on November 5, 2003, at 11:00:17
> Hey wolf, ive tried the horse brand too, it was great for me but now im taking capsules by prescription. So what kind of effect did it have on you?
As soon as I used it yesterday, I noticed my anxiety was no longer as severe. Now I could ignore the random thought that popped up, turn it off, or reshape into a daydream without anxiety at all.
Its like going through the motions from force of habit, but with no kick to it. Rather cool really. Took my dose against this morning, full scoop of it, and still doing fine. I'd recommend this to everyone.
So instead of daydreaming about something at random and worrying about every horrible thing that can happen to me to stress myself out, I now look at it and know that no matter what happens, I won't be bothered by it, and can find a quick way out, no stress.
I'm sure those with anxiety know what I mean. As to the fabled 5% of the people in this world not screwed up in some way like the vast majority of us are, let me explain it to you like this. We're all crazy, just some of us are in denial. No wait, that wasn't an explanation... I thought it sounded cool though. Lets see... get those racing thoughts, that obsessive compulsive thoughts, the whatever, and neuter it. From a solid object you were afraid of, to all the people being bad holograms you can walk though and ignore, because you finally convince part of your brain that they weren't real(fight or flight part wouldn't listen before) and can walk on through them without any worries at all.
Posted by McPac on November 6, 2003, at 15:42:56
In reply to Re: Lar, Re: Afraid about tryptophan » McPac, posted by Larry Hoover on November 4, 2003, at 9:29:55
> Lar,
> I took about 1,100 mg's of tryptophan and felt my moods lifted (happier) and also much less physical anxiety (more calm)....after ONE dose I felt a difference.....I then repeated this on 2 other occassions (each time spaced many days apart), again I felt the same way each time.How long did the positive effect last?
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I didn't monitor it too closely time-wise but it seemed to lift my mood for a couple of days...of course, that is while still on the Lexapro (if not on any Lex, who knows what the effect would be, maybe I'd need a larger dose and a more consistent supply to provide the positive effect?....one thing that I certainly noticed was that about a day-and-a-half or 2 days after taking it, I got a fairly bad headache each time (kind of like a withdrawal-type headache)....the 1st night I took it, I got one of those really fast 'twitchy things' in my deltoid (you know how sometimes you get those super-fast, little twitches, often around the side of the eye? Well, I got that exact same kind of super-fast twitch in my deltoid, lasted about a minute or so...it was rather amusing; it felt like no big deal at all but with being on an ssri I'm very cautious of combining the 2.
> I don't believe this was a placebo effect at all but I wonder how trytophan could cause this effect so quickly?
Pure aminos go into the blood quickly. The effect lags just behind the blood concentration.
>>>>>>>>> Lar, but why does it take AD's many WEEKS to affect some people...the drugs go into the blood rather quickly then too, don't they?
> Unfortunately, I'm taking an ssri now (Lexapro, 20 mg's/day) and am therefore VERY hesitant to take the tryptophan regularly at all...bummer. Thanks!
Why hesitate? You pay exquisite attention to how you feel. I pay attention like that, too. It's just how I am.....very sensitive.
>>>>>>>>>> I'm 'afraid' of this serotonin syndrome thingy, lol,.....I was reading recently on the Babble board where "Linkadge" believes he had serotonin syndrome..they admitted him to a psych unit for 2 or 2 1/2 weeks or so after he went to emergency room......I don't want that....yes, my body seems to typically be VERY sensitive to meds (that can be both Good and Bad at times).......Lar, I've really got to tell you something though...you know how I've been going to the Pfeiffer Treatment Center...well, it's been almost 11 months now that I've been following their prescribed treatment plan and taking LOTS of supplements..their plan may have done some good...but I can honestly say that it seems to me that just ONE single supplement, the TRYPTOPHAN, has single-handedly done MORE for uplifting my mood than ALL the others COMBINED! Now, here's my thinking of why Pfeiffer did NOT have me on tryptophan or 5htp...2 possible reasons: 1) they did not want me on an ssri + tryptophan/5htp due to risk of serotonin syndrome OR 2) their main goal was to lower my histamine levels and I'm not sure trypt/5htp fit into that objective....I get little feedback from Pfeiffer, so I'm left to ponder why they didn't try the tryptophan....after not feeling much effect from Pfeiffer's plan, I came across the www.neuroreplete.com site...it sounded pretty good to me so I got hold of a nearby doctor who does follow their protocol...I am supposed to go to him fairly soon....I like the idea of them using precise testing methods to closely align my neurotransmitter levels through urine testing of such levels (as opposed to my willy-nilly methods...I don't want to only feel good for a certain period of time while unknowingly causing certain other NT levels to deplete over time and eventually feeling like crap again.....I guess I would feel more secure with their know-how and help than trying to balance my crazy brain on my own.....but it looks like the neuroreplete folks use 5htp in their products NOT tryptophan...bummer...I don't know if 5htp will have such a fantastic effect..........my body can be so very, very sensitive---I took about 1,000 mg's of tryptophan this morning...once again, my mood has lifted very nicely...but I feel a little TOO-revved up (slightly...just slightly a tad hypo...nothing at all to worry about...just energetic and somewhat revved).......please let me know all of your thoughts on my replies Hoovermeister....particularly re: the serotonin syndrome thing...I would definitely be taking trypt DAILY if not for that and being on an ssri......you rule Lar....glad you stayed!!!!!!!!
Posted by Wolf Dreamer on November 7, 2003, at 12:29:24
In reply to Larry Hoover, Re: Afraid about tryptophan, posted by McPac on November 6, 2003, at 15:42:56
How much of this stuff can I take and still be safe? I want as much of it is possible in me throughout the day, to increase its effects.
When I first take it, bam! Instant fix. So I thought if I could just pop some in throughout the day just to keep things going smoothly, it'd be great.
Its found naturally in many types of food, but I'm not sure how much. I don't want to overdose, if it could be hazardous.
http://216.239.41.104/search?q=cache:34bjEp0MN_UJ:www.smart-drugs.com/JamesSouth-tryptophan.htm+tryptophan+doses+anxiety&hl=en&ie=UTF-8
This is odd. Not enough room on the bus, so don't try getting it from food.Wait... didn't someone say there was something that should be taken on an empty stomach to prevent competition with other amino acids? Doh! I need to stop taking it with breakfast. Then I'll get more to my brain.
I'm thinking I can take a bit more and see what happens. I'm reading that link now, and it has some good information.
Posted by McPac on November 7, 2003, at 21:28:15
In reply to Whats the maximum I can take of tryptophan?, posted by Wolf Dreamer on November 7, 2003, at 12:29:24
Serotonin is my key. As I knew all along. Yet I was always on ssri's, therefore I never tried tryptophan before. Recently I did sneak a little tryptophan in anyway and the result---AWESOME! The ssri's provided the serotonin brilliance I needed---but at a steep price. Many side effects, some very severe. Tryptophan RULES. Serotonin police, lol, better go after the norepinephrine or dopamine folks and become norepinephrine and dopamine police (how come I've never seen NE or dopamine police around these boards anyway? Or police of any other substance? Oh well, perhaps serotonin is not the key ingredient that works for them...hope they find their key.....I've found mine! I don't expect trypto to be the cure-all...you never know though....but it does pack an awesome punch (1000 Mike Tyson's couldn't stand a chance against it, lol).....we'll see how this all turns out...so far very good....no wonder those pharmaceutical company losers loved the almighty trypto being yanked off the shelves, paving the way for their synthetic alternatives (the ssri's)....GIVE ME TRYPTO OR GIVE ME DEATH! (and no, I don't mean serotonin syndrome!lol)
Posted by McPac on November 7, 2003, at 21:29:48
In reply to Whats the maximum I can take of tryptophan?, posted by Wolf Dreamer on November 7, 2003, at 12:29:24
Great link Wolf! Thanks!
Posted by McPac on November 7, 2003, at 21:34:52
In reply to Whats the maximum I can take of tryptophan?, posted by Wolf Dreamer on November 7, 2003, at 12:29:24
http://www.beautynhealth.com/tryptophan/
(Not cheap though)
Posted by matthhhh on November 7, 2003, at 22:01:24
In reply to 99.6% Pure Tryptophan link, posted by McPac on November 7, 2003, at 21:34:52
I am still taking tryptophan but tapering off wellbutrin. I feel very shaky (ie shaking hands) and have sweaty palms. Im wondering if this is due to the withdrawal from the wellbutrin or the tryptophan. Its hard to see how the sweaty palms could be do to the wellbutrin because I just started experiencing it when i started the tryptophan. Does anyone know?
Posted by McPac on November 9, 2003, at 21:49:23
In reply to Shaking and sweating, posted by matthhhh on November 7, 2003, at 22:01:24
I am still taking tryptophan but tapering off wellbutrin. I feel very shaky (ie shaking hands) and have sweaty palms. Im wondering if this is due to the withdrawal from the wellbutrin or the tryptophan. Its hard to see how the sweaty palms could be do to the wellbutrin because I just started experiencing it when i started the tryptophan. Does anyone know?
>>>>>>>>> Matt, the tryptophan may very well be causing the sweaty palms.....many of the serotonergic meds can cause increased sweating and since trypto is ultimately converted to serotonin, that would be my best guess (by the way, I also noticed some increased sweating after taking tryptophan)....tapering the Wellbutrin is also capable of causing withdrawal-type problems, so shaking certainly wouldn't surprise me, just taper very gradually and slowly if you need to.....one other thing that I've noticed, it seems, is that sometimes when I take the trypto, I get sort of 'hyper', like my body gets 'revved up'....even though I have felt drowsy and calmer after taking the trypto, there are other times when I get a bit hyper...for what it's worth....take care Matt!
Posted by Larry Hoover on November 10, 2003, at 7:21:40
In reply to Larry Hoover, Re: Afraid about tryptophan, posted by McPac on November 6, 2003, at 15:42:56
> > I don't believe this was a placebo effect at all but I wonder how trytophan could cause this effect so quickly?
>
> Pure aminos go into the blood quickly. The effect lags just behind the blood concentration.
>
> >>>>>>>>> Lar, but why does it take AD's many WEEKS to affect some people...the drugs go into the blood rather quickly then too, don't they?Because they don't do the same thing as tryptophan. One reason we know that is *because* it takes weeks for ADs to work.
> > Unfortunately, I'm taking an ssri now (Lexapro, 20 mg's/day) and am therefore VERY hesitant to take the tryptophan regularly at all...bummer. Thanks!
>
> Why hesitate? You pay exquisite attention to how you feel. I pay attention like that, too. It's just how I am.....very sensitive.
>
> >>>>>>>>>> I'm 'afraid' of this serotonin syndrome thingy, lol,.....I was reading recently on the Babble board where "Linkadge" believes he had serotonin syndrome..they admitted him to a psych unit for 2 or 2 1/2 weeks or so after he went to emergency room......I don't want that....yes, my body seems to typically be VERY sensitive to meds (that can be both Good and Bad at times).......One way to avoid serotonin syndrome is to never try anything that is remotely associated with it. Or, you could carefully augment your pharmacological treatment with small doses of things like tryptophan. Dose makes the poison.
About Pfeiffer: There is no treatment that's right for everybody. Looks like it's time to move on.
About Neuroplete: You can use their supervision etc., but nobody says you have to use their products. If you don't want 5-HTP, don't take it.Bottom line (based on your own evidence), you feel better using tryptophan than not. If you get a headache, take an aspirin, tylenol, whatever. If you start feeling sicker than that, go to a doctor, and tell him what you've been taking.
Lar
Posted by matthhhh on November 10, 2003, at 7:31:59
In reply to Re: Shaking and sweating, posted by McPac on November 9, 2003, at 21:49:23
hey macpac thanks for the reply!
Posted by mileniumuk on November 10, 2003, at 9:56:21
In reply to Re: Afraid about tryptophan, posted by matthhhh on October 23, 2003, at 15:26:22
Matthhh,
Has anyone tried adding vit B3 (niacin) to tryptophan as a booster. Logic: It takes 60 molecules of tryptophan to produce 1 molecule of niacin, roughly speaking.
So using excess niacin should spare quite a lot of the consumed tryptophan.
Best wishes
Bob (chemically trained not medically qualified)
Posted by McPac on November 10, 2003, at 17:12:15
In reply to Re: Larry Hoover, Re: Afraid about tryptophan » McPac, posted by Larry Hoover on November 10, 2003, at 7:21:40
Posted by jparsell82 on November 12, 2003, at 11:07:47
In reply to 99.6% Pure Tryptophan link, posted by McPac on November 7, 2003, at 21:34:52
http://www.biogenesis.co.za/pi-l-tryptophan.asp
Have you tried Sceletium?? http://www.sceletium.com
You're supposed to notice the effects within an hour or 2 of taking a pill. It enhances Serotonin in some way. Some websites claim it's an Ssri but I don't believe so... wouldn't it take awhile to notice it's effects if only inhibited the reuptake of serotonin? Other have suggested it works in a way similar to Ecstasy. I've ordered some but haven't go it yet, I wish someone else on this board had experience with it.
Posted by matthhhh on November 12, 2003, at 15:49:39
In reply to My Tryptophan Link » McPac, posted by jparsell82 on November 12, 2003, at 11:07:47
Hey MacPac, yes ive ordered the real sceletium from Africa, and it really didnt do much for me, just made me a bit tired. Let me know how you find it.
Posted by McPac on November 12, 2003, at 16:42:49
In reply to My Tryptophan Link » McPac, posted by jparsell82 on November 12, 2003, at 11:07:47
"I wish someone else on this board had experience with it".
>>>>>>>>>>> J, someone does....ask Ame...he has taken it and knows a lot about it.
I've never tried the stuff.
Take care!
Posted by McPac on November 12, 2003, at 16:44:01
In reply to Re: My Tryptophan Link » jparsell82, posted by matthhhh on November 12, 2003, at 15:49:39
Matt,
I've never tried that stuff...Ame has though.
Take care!
Posted by Maxime on November 12, 2003, at 22:35:14
In reply to Whats the maximum I can take of tryptophan?, posted by Wolf Dreamer on November 7, 2003, at 12:29:24
hello. I realise I am late on this one ....
Anyhow, Canadian gal here who has been prescribed 1 gram of Tryptan (canadian pharmaceutical version of of L-tryptophan) a day. I do remember reading that for bipolar (which i am) up to 8 grams a day can be taken.
And I have been told to take it with food to prevent stomach upset.
I hope this helps.
Maxime
> How much of this stuff can I take and still be safe? I want as much of it is possible in me throughout the day, to increase its effects.
>
> When I first take it, bam! Instant fix. So I thought if I could just pop some in throughout the day just to keep things going smoothly, it'd be great.
>
> Its found naturally in many types of food, but I'm not sure how much. I don't want to overdose, if it could be hazardous.
>
> http://216.239.41.104/search?q=cache:34bjEp0MN_UJ:www.smart-drugs.com/JamesSouth-tryptophan.htm+tryptophan+doses+anxiety&hl=en&ie=UTF-8
> This is odd. Not enough room on the bus, so don't try getting it from food.
>
> Wait... didn't someone say there was something that should be taken on an empty stomach to prevent competition with other amino acids? Doh! I need to stop taking it with breakfast. Then I'll get more to my brain.
>
> I'm thinking I can take a bit more and see what happens. I'm reading that link now, and it has some good information.
>
Posted by sheelanagigs on November 13, 2003, at 14:11:34
In reply to Lar, Re: I feel GREAT on tryptophan! !, posted by McPac on October 21, 2003, at 18:55:18
i get my doc to write a prescription for tryptophan and a compounding pharmacist makes capsules for me.....go to the PCCA website to find a compounder near you...the geniuses of health care, as far as i am concerned....
oh, yes and meds in PLO gel...wonderful!
Posted by Wolf Dreamer on November 18, 2003, at 3:26:21
In reply to Re: got tryptophan... horse powder hard to mix » matthhhh, posted by Wolf Dreamer on November 6, 2003, at 11:05:25
I don't get the instant results as I did the first couple of days.
I take it every day, except once when I forgot and couldn't do it before bed without waking up to urinate since the powder takes a lot of liquid to swallow.
Thats also why other than my claritin D, I take all my medications in the morning now, not at night.
Anyway, I do feel my anxiety is better, either from it, or a combination of other things.
Anxiety still happens, but not nearly as severe, and it is easier to stop if I concentrate.
Posted by CraigD on November 18, 2003, at 12:42:50
In reply to Re: got tryptophan... horse powder hard to mix, posted by Wolf Dreamer on November 18, 2003, at 3:26:21
I just got this off Healthrecovery.com. It is a site primarily to help alcoholics recover and they sell bundled supplement kits as well as individually.
I am psyched to get my first bottle in two days (I paid $30 for 60 pills, including the 2-day shipping) and see if I can feel better without returning to SSRIs.
And speaking of SSRI's, read this excerpt...
Is It Safe?
Tryptophan has been widely used by orthomolecular physicians, clinics like Health Recovery Center and the general population, in doses of one to four grams daily. Since you can't store it in your body, you cannot accumulate toxic levels. However, taking high amounts of tryptophan can produce some side effects:
Feeling drowsy the next morning
Bizarre or strange dreams (rare)
increased blood pressure in persons over sixty who already have high blood pressure.
Aggressiveness (this rare side effect can occur in the absence of sufficient co-nutrients needed for the normal conversion of tryptophan to serotonin)
Warnings:Do not use tryptophan if taking MAO inhibitors.
Do not use tryptophan if you have liver damage, or you are restricted from taking phenylalanine, tyrosine, or histadine.
Tryptophan cannot break down into serotonin without B6. Without adequate serotonin there will be erratic sleep and ongoing irritability.
Can Tryptophan Be Combined With An SSRI Anti-Depressant?
Combing SSRI drugs and tryptophan is inviting a deluge of serotonin into the brain...it's dangerous to do, and in most cases not recommended. However a recent client is taking a very small dose (5 milligrams) of Prozac in conjunction with daily tryptophan and the result has been exactly right for her. Warning: Do not play with this or any combination of tryptophan and anti-depressant drugs. Your doctor MUST be supervising such an experiment.
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