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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 8 to 32 of 32. Go back in thread:
Posted by rjlockhart37 on July 22, 2021, at 22:56:32
In reply to Re: 5-HTP instead of ADs. Good mood, posted by Lamdage22 on July 22, 2021, at 10:50:10
5-htp still does supply serotonin, psych SSRI's increase it syntheticly, 5-htp is natural. But still serotonin depletion in depression, when i took 5-htp i had to take it couple times a day because the serotonin would disappear. It get absorbed back up uptake, frequent dosing for me i had to do.
Posted by Lamdage22 on July 23, 2021, at 0:32:43
In reply to Re: 5-HTP instead of ADs. Good mood, posted by rjlockhart37 on July 22, 2021, at 22:56:32
It is more natural. You can feel it, too. Less numbing and it still makes days more bright in terms of mood.
Posted by Christ_empowered on July 23, 2021, at 14:51:25
In reply to Re: 5-HTP instead of ADs. Good mood, posted by Lamdage22 on July 22, 2021, at 10:50:10
I think the time release 5-HTP is to be taken with a meal. I don't think I'd try to go crazy high dose -if- I decide to try the time release formulations, its just that I've noticed that the time release products I've seen available tend to be 200mgs per tablet or so. I guess its for all day coverage?
Posted by Lamdage22 on July 24, 2021, at 1:34:50
In reply to Re: 5-HTP instead of ADs. Good mood, posted by Christ_empowered on July 23, 2021, at 14:51:25
As far as I know it is always good to take it with a meal. I would think that the 200mg ER capsules/tablets are to be taken once a day. Because 400mg/day is quite hefty.
Having discontinued Trazodone, I do eat more. That is the big drawback. I immediately lost 15 lbs upon the introduction of Trazodone. Maybe I can reduce the Neuroleptics soon. I dont want to surpass the 100kg border. Because then you are not just chubby but fat.
Posted by Lamdage22 on July 24, 2021, at 1:39:00
In reply to Re: 5-HTP instead of ADs. Good mood, posted by Lamdage22 on July 24, 2021, at 1:34:50
Thinking Rybelsus here. But it is so new... So not sure what to expect because the incidence of rarer side effects is not yet known.
Posted by undopaminergic on July 24, 2021, at 7:16:20
In reply to Re: 5-HTP instead of ADs. Good mood, posted by Lamdage22 on July 24, 2021, at 1:34:50
> I dont want to surpass the 100kg border. Because then you are not just chubby but fat.
>It depends on how tall and how muscular you are, but I'm sure you know that, so I assume you mean 100 kg would be "fat" for yourself? My weight peaked at 90 kgs or slightly more, and I didn't even feel "chubby". Now I'm down to below 70 kgs despite clozapine, and I feel "normal" weight-wise.
-undopaminergic
Posted by Lamdage22 on July 24, 2021, at 11:03:37
In reply to Re: 5-HTP instead of ADs. Good mood, posted by undopaminergic on July 24, 2021, at 7:16:20
Im not 100 kg worth of muscle and not 90 either.
Posted by Lamdage22 on July 27, 2021, at 3:45:39
In reply to Re: 5-HTP instead of ADs. Good mood, posted by Lamdage22 on July 24, 2021, at 11:03:37
The question is if it is really worth it to take an antidepressant just so I can shed some pounds? Trazodone had an appetite suppressing effect. I bet there is something less invasive out there that could help
Posted by Lamdage22 on July 30, 2021, at 11:32:13
In reply to Re: 5-HTP instead of ADs. Good mood, posted by Lamdage22 on July 27, 2021, at 3:45:39
It is a good thing before sleep but if I take too much during the day, Ill sleep it away!
Posted by undopaminergic on July 30, 2021, at 11:47:12
In reply to 5-HTP more than lowdose makes me REALLY tired, posted by Lamdage22 on July 30, 2021, at 11:32:13
> It is a good thing before sleep but if I take too much during the day, Ill sleep it away!
>Reminds me of my first antidepressant, paroxetine (Seroxat, aka. Paxil). Not sure I'd still react that way to it. It's maybe 20 years ago now. It's sad to think how much of my life depression has taken away. Yet for some people it has lasted even longer.
-undopaminergic
Posted by Lamdage22 on July 30, 2021, at 14:15:18
In reply to Re: 5-HTP more than lowdose makes me REALLY tired, posted by undopaminergic on July 30, 2021, at 11:47:12
I hear you. I really do. Maybe the people who are having a blast all the time are just very insensitive to what is going on around them. Oblivious almost?
Posted by undopaminergic on July 30, 2021, at 15:14:30
In reply to Re: 5-HTP more than lowdose makes me REALLY tired, posted by Lamdage22 on July 30, 2021, at 14:15:18
> I hear you. I really do. Maybe the people who are having a blast all the time are just very insensitive to what is going on around them. Oblivious almost?
>Sure, that is sometimes a factor.
Once, in a state of drug-induced mania, I impulsively took a few grams of memantine, with the intention of inducing brain-damage, thinking I'd suffer less as a consequence. I almost died.
The theory was plausible. The brain can be manipulated for greater happiness. Isn't that what we're trying to do with drugs and supplements?
-undopaminergic
Posted by Lamdage22 on July 30, 2021, at 15:43:05
In reply to Re: 5-HTP more than lowdose makes me REALLY tired, posted by undopaminergic on July 30, 2021, at 15:14:30
Freud held the opinion that depression is aggression turned against the self.
Posted by Lamdage22 on July 31, 2021, at 0:00:44
In reply to Re: 5-HTP more than lowdose makes me REALLY tired, posted by Lamdage22 on July 30, 2021, at 15:43:05
Acting out on that might give you temporary relief, but how about making a positive change in the world? Brain damage doesn't help with that. If everyone who is sensitive enough to sense that some things are wrong here just destroyed themselves enough so they don't anymore, is that a world you wanna live in?
Posted by undopaminergic on August 1, 2021, at 9:39:23
In reply to Re: 5-HTP more than lowdose makes me REALLY tired, posted by Lamdage22 on July 30, 2021, at 15:43:05
> Freud held the opinion that depression is aggression turned against the self.
I can see how that makes sense in some varieties of depression, eg. emotional self-flagellation in the shape of guilt, regret, and rumination.
-undopaminergic
Posted by Lamdage22 on August 1, 2021, at 11:28:16
In reply to Re: 5-HTP more than lowdose makes me REALLY tired, posted by undopaminergic on August 1, 2021, at 9:39:23
That guy was onto something much of the time. Penis envy set aside :) I recently heard that he had great success with some patients. Before that I only heard he made everyone worse.
Posted by SLS on August 1, 2021, at 15:34:27
In reply to Re: 5-HTP more than lowdose makes me REALLY tired, posted by undopaminergic on July 30, 2021, at 11:47:12
Hi, U_D
> It's sad to think how much of my life depression has taken away. Yet for some people it has lasted even longer.
Tell me about it.
Ages 17-61 with a 6-month remission in 1987.
I'm a newborn weighing in at 61 years. That's f_cked up. It has taken me about 3 months to grieve for the loss of my adolescence and adulthood. It was surreal at first.
Right now, I am in the process of tweaking nortriptyline. That damned dosage window. It's real.
- Scott
Posted by undopaminergic on August 2, 2021, at 4:49:57
In reply to Re: 5-HTP more than lowdose makes me REALLY tired, posted by Lamdage22 on August 1, 2021, at 11:28:16
> That guy was onto something much of the time.
Yes. I used to think his theory was "over-sexed" and that in particular he was too big on the Oedipus complex. I guess I still somewhat believe especially the latter, but the more I learn, the more it seems there is something to it (I don't recally why).
> Penis envy set aside :)
I think unconscious penis envy is common.
> I recently heard that he had great success with some patients. Before that I only heard he made everyone worse.
>There are many people, perhaps behaviourists in particular, who are more or less anti-Freudian, but it appears most people who had psychoanalysis have a positive opinion about it.
-undopaminergic
Posted by undopaminergic on August 2, 2021, at 5:12:02
In reply to Re: 5-HTP more than lowdose makes me REALLY tired » undopaminergic, posted by SLS on August 1, 2021, at 15:34:27
> Hi, U_D
Hi SLS.
> > It's sad to think how much of my life depression has taken away. Yet for some people it has lasted even longer.
>
> Tell me about it.
>
> Ages 17-61 with a 6-month remission in 1987.I've had some rare, occasional relief in the form of (hypo)mania, but every time but the first, it ended in other kinds of disaster, such as hospitalisation. Also, needless to say, the (hypo)manic episodes didn't last, and only my first episode offered relief from my cognitive impairment symptoms.
Thanks to medications, I've sometimes had brief relief of some of my symptoms. In particular, pramipexole worked briefly against the anhedonia, and stimulants worked (actually for substantial time) against the apathy.
> I'm a newborn weighing in at 61 years. That's f_cked up.
I feel nothing much has happened since I was 19, in 1997.
>
> Right now, I am in the process of tweaking nortriptyline. That damned dosage window. It's real.
>I'm sorry you're still having to work on it. I thought you found the magic combo.
-undopaminergic
Posted by Lamdage22 on August 3, 2021, at 9:02:12
In reply to Re: 5-HTP more than lowdose makes me REALLY tired, posted by undopaminergic on August 2, 2021, at 4:49:57
Hm yeah thats fine, but I wouldnt spread that idea publicly :)
> I think unconscious penis envy is common.
Posted by undopaminergic on August 3, 2021, at 12:16:25
In reply to Re: 5-HTP more than lowdose makes me REALLY tired, posted by Lamdage22 on August 3, 2021, at 9:02:12
I understand it is not politically correct, but in any case, I want to clarify that I think the achievements that are secondary to it are just as valuable as if they had some other driving force at their root. It is sublimation, which is considered a "mature" defence mechanism. Indeed, the products of sublimation are, probably with few exceptions, more valuable and worthwhile than acting out the "raw" impulse that drives it. It's still a defence though, but that is little more than a technicality.
> Hm yeah thats fine, but I wouldnt spread that idea publicly :)
>
> > I think unconscious penis envy is common.
>
>
>-undopaminergic
Posted by Lamdage22 on August 3, 2021, at 13:01:46
In reply to Re: 5-HTP more than lowdose makes me REALLY tired, posted by undopaminergic on August 3, 2021, at 12:16:25
Ok you completely lost me there. I bought a book about him but never opened it. I just blindly believed he harmed everyone he touched. Everyone says it, so it must be true. I am now very sceptical of things that everyone says.
> I understand it is not politically correct, but in any case, I want to clarify that I think the achievements that are secondary to it are just as valuable as if they had some other driving force at their root. It is sublimation, which is considered a "mature" defence mechanism. Indeed, the products of sublimation are, probably with few exceptions, more valuable and worthwhile than acting out the "raw" impulse that drives it. It's still a defence though, but that is little more than a technicality.
>
> > Hm yeah thats fine, but I wouldnt spread that idea publicly :)
> >
> > > I think unconscious penis envy is common.
> >
> >
> >
>
> -undopaminergic
>
Posted by undopaminergic on August 3, 2021, at 13:55:40
In reply to Re: 5-HTP more than lowdose makes me REALLY tired, posted by Lamdage22 on August 3, 2021, at 13:01:46
I wanted to add that penis envy is relative. Men often are envious of those with a bigger penis. Some of them have greater penis envy than many (even a majority of) women. Worse, in many of these men, that envy is conscious.
I'm envious of you because of your language, German, which is the language of Freud. I'd like to read his original works. Failing that, I am in the process (though it is on ice for now) of reading a Swedish translation (a multi-volume set) of his collected writings. I think any biography about Freud is likely to be biassed, either for or against him. So, I want to recommend going to the source and judge for yourself.
I've seen people claiming that psychoanalysis set the field of psychiatry back several decades! It's hard to see how psychopharmacology is all that much better, at least in its current state, and worse, how it is normally practised (withholding MAOIs for example).
> Ok you completely lost me there. I bought a book about him but never opened it. I just blindly believed he harmed everyone he touched. Everyone says it, so it must be true. I am now very sceptical of things that everyone says.
>
> > I understand it is not politically correct, but in any case, I want to clarify that I think the achievements that are secondary to it are just as valuable as if they had some other driving force at their root. It is sublimation, which is considered a "mature" defence mechanism. Indeed, the products of sublimation are, probably with few exceptions, more valuable and worthwhile than acting out the "raw" impulse that drives it. It's still a defence though, but that is little more than a technicality.
> >
> > > Hm yeah thats fine, but I wouldnt spread that idea publicly :)
> > >
> > > > I think unconscious penis envy is common.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > -undopaminergic
> >
>
>-undopaminergic
Posted by Lamdage22 on August 19, 2021, at 12:04:02
In reply to Re: 5-HTP more than lowdose makes me REALLY tired, posted by undopaminergic on August 3, 2021, at 13:55:40
Ok, back from penis envy to 5-HTP. At 50-100mg, it really knocks me out.
Posted by Lamdage22 on August 19, 2021, at 12:07:57
In reply to Re: 5-HTP more than lowdose makes me REALLY tired, posted by Lamdage22 on August 19, 2021, at 12:04:02
It is a staple now to get me too sleep without too many pharmaceuticals. Taking 12-12-12-100. I am working on avoiding double posts. It may take some adjustment time.
This is the end of the thread.
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