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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 17 of 17. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by marcus1968 on October 25, 2013, at 11:21:51
Hello, can anyone suggest a different med/approach for chronic insomnia. For years 1 mg klonopin at bed was all I needed but now days it helps anxiety but not sleep. I was put on low dose remeron in july which helps worderfully but I remain groggy/depersonalized most of the day also.. I go to pdoc on Tuesday and I have tried ambien etc. and that just makes me hyper believe it or not??? thanx so much for any input
Posted by gadchik on October 25, 2013, at 11:30:51
In reply to need help sleeping WITHOUT REMERON, posted by marcus1968 on October 25, 2013, at 11:21:51
Have u tried a small amt of melatonin? Have u tried just taking a sliver of remeron?
Posted by Sheilac on October 25, 2013, at 14:42:27
In reply to Re: need help sleeping WITHOUT REMERON, posted by gadchik on October 25, 2013, at 11:30:51
I have a terrible time sleeping on Geodon. I've found if I take 3mg of melatonin about an hour and a half before bed and then another 3mg right before bed I sleep great.
Mind you, I started with just 3mg before bed and it didn't help.
Play around with it and see.
I use the melatonin melt away tabs. Nice and fast.
Posted by linkadge on October 25, 2013, at 17:28:25
In reply to Re: need help sleeping WITHOUT REMERON, posted by Sheilac on October 25, 2013, at 14:42:27
I find that magnesium 50-200mg can really synergize with benzodiazapines. You might also want to take a tsp of olive oil for oleic acid (a natural sleep inducing substance).
clonazepam + magnesium (100mg) + niacin (50mg) + olive oil (1tsp).
You'll sleep like a baby.
Linkadge
Posted by Phillipa on October 25, 2013, at 17:32:59
In reply to need help sleeping WITHOUT REMERON, posted by marcus1968 on October 25, 2013, at 11:21:51
Tried a bit higher on the klonopin? I've never taken melatonin. I didn't know it made one sleep. Just reset time clock. Phillipa
Posted by doxogenic boy on October 26, 2013, at 11:39:17
In reply to need help sleeping WITHOUT REMERON, posted by marcus1968 on October 25, 2013, at 11:21:51
I have tried to find some solutions in this message:http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20131025/msgs/1053093.html
If you don't need an antidepressant that works for OCD, there are more options than SSRIs, SNRIs and clomipramine.
- doxogenic
Posted by Christ_empowered on October 26, 2013, at 22:37:33
In reply to Re: need help sleeping WITHOUT REMERON » marcus1968, posted by doxogenic boy on October 26, 2013, at 11:39:17
High dose c+b-complex+high dose niacinamide can help work with your benzo and calm you down and ease you into sleep. Usually, you take at least 500mgs/niacinamide x 3 daily, with at least that much C (if not more), plus a b-50 or b-100.You could take more at night, like: 1 gram c+500 niacinamide x2 daily, then a PM dose of 2 grams c+2 grams niacinamide. Adding taurine can help, too.
Posted by Hugh on October 28, 2013, at 18:25:12
In reply to need help sleeping WITHOUT REMERON, posted by marcus1968 on October 25, 2013, at 11:21:51
Try this breathing exercise, not just at bedtime but periodically throughout the day.
If this doesn't help, there are many other breathing exercises you can try.
Neurofeedback can help insomnia. And there's a new form or CES called Nexalin that's supposed to be very helpful for insomnia. You need to go to a Nexalin provider to try it.
Posted by Legm82 on October 28, 2013, at 19:19:42
In reply to need help sleeping WITHOUT REMERON, posted by marcus1968 on October 25, 2013, at 11:21:51
> Hello, can anyone suggest a different med/approach for chronic insomnia. For years 1 mg klonopin at bed was all I needed but now days it helps anxiety but not sleep. I was put on low dose remeron in july which helps worderfully but I remain groggy/depersonalized most of the day also.. I go to pdoc on Tuesday and I have tried ambien etc. and thaht just makes me hyper believe it or not??? thanx so much for any input
Hello Marcus,
Some options are Trazodone, another is low dose of Seroquel (quetiapine) .
The other option is to try a TCA like amitiptiline or Doxepin or Trimipramine, old-fashioned but effective.
If you want to keep trying Remeron, sometimes higher doses are more tollerable than smaller, 30mg for example, discuss it with your doctor.
Posted by jrbecker76 on November 5, 2013, at 14:56:08
In reply to Re: need help sleeping WITHOUT REMERON, posted by Christ_empowered on October 26, 2013, at 22:37:33
>
> High dose c+b-complex+high dose niacinamide can help work with your benzo and calm you down and ease you into sleep. Usually, you take at least 500mgs/niacinamide x 3 daily, with at least that much C (if not more), plus a b-50 or b-100.
>
> You could take more at night, like: 1 gram c+500 niacinamide x2 daily, then a PM dose of 2 grams c+2 grams niacinamide. Adding taurine can help, too.In my experience, B and C are counterproductive for sleep.
Posted by former poster on November 8, 2013, at 23:33:45
In reply to Re: need help sleeping WITHOUT REMERON » Christ_empowered, posted by jrbecker76 on November 5, 2013, at 14:56:08
Magnesium taurate works for my insomnia. Another option is Doxylamine succinate, available in some Unisom formula's but much cheaper is a generic equivalent aailable at one Walmart called "Nighttime Sleep Aid". Doxylamine and Diphenhydramine formulas available. Doxylamine is 2x stronger than diphenhydramine imho.
Posted by Hugh on November 11, 2013, at 11:09:29
In reply to need help sleeping WITHOUT REMERON, posted by marcus1968 on October 25, 2013, at 11:21:51
I've read that the amino acid ornithine can help sleep.
http://www.livestrong.com/article/542405-ornithine-for-sleep/
Posted by sigismund on November 17, 2013, at 16:56:27
In reply to Re: need help sleeping WITHOUT REMERON, posted by Hugh on November 11, 2013, at 11:09:29
Speaking of that kind of stuff I had immediate unmistakable good effects from Agmatine, but had to stop because of the cold sores.
Posted by Hugh on November 19, 2013, at 18:58:32
In reply to Re: need help sleeping WITHOUT REMERON » Hugh, posted by sigismund on November 17, 2013, at 16:56:27
> Speaking of that kind of stuff I had immediate unmistakable good effects from Agmatine, but had to stop because of the cold sores.
Too bad. Lysine is supposed to be good for cold sores, but it competes with arginine.
Posted by nix on November 21, 2013, at 0:42:21
In reply to need help sleeping WITHOUT REMERON, posted by marcus1968 on October 25, 2013, at 11:21:51
Have you tried ...a higher dose of Remeron? I had the same problem at 15mg, but with higher doses (45mg-60mg) I felt fine. This "paradoxical" effect with Remeron is actually rather well documented, I believe.
Also maybe, try switching benzos?
Or have others have mentioned, a good ol' fashioned first generation antihistamine like diphenhydramine/doxylamine (which are basically the same thing; one is a prodrug of the other, though I forget which is which). In US pharmacies, the price is usually much higher when labeled as a sleep aid rather than an anti-allergy medication for some reason, so keep that in mind.
Or, chlorpheniramine (a green bottle usually in US pharmacies) can be a really good choice. It is in fact a potent antidepressant/anxiolytic as well, but was never marketed as such. Theoretically though you might have to watch out for serotonin storm if you're taking a high dose SSRI already.
Posted by phidippus on December 5, 2013, at 16:34:46
In reply to Re: need help sleeping WITHOUT REMERON » Hugh, posted by sigismund on November 17, 2013, at 16:56:27
I highly recommend 12 mg of Tiagabine
Eric
Posted by sigismund on December 5, 2013, at 23:31:31
In reply to Re: need help sleeping WITHOUT REMERON » sigismund, posted by phidippus on December 5, 2013, at 16:34:46
One report on Erowid was really bad, but then he took 72mg.
Is this in reference to the agamtine? Or sleep?
This is the end of the thread.
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