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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 10 of 10. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Alexanderfromdenmark on August 25, 2009, at 15:07:39
I spoke to a doctor at a psychiatric hospital today. According to him Wellbutrin is not a antidepressant, all my psychial problems are imagined and don't exist and they won't prescribe MAOI's, dopamine agonists or anything of that kind.
What do I do? I feel totally f*ck*d. I'm more or less suicidal for the time being, but it seems like I'll never get to try parnate and Co. I'm psychially and mentally ill, but I will be receiving no help from the medical sector here in Denmark. What do I do? I'm at the point where I can hardly get out of bed, I can't get rid of this depression just by trying hard enough. I'm at the end of my rope. I felt better when I read about your parnate experiences, but it seems I will never ever get the oppourtunity.
Posted by SLS on August 25, 2009, at 16:59:46
In reply to Help, posted by Alexanderfromdenmark on August 25, 2009, at 15:07:39
What would be necessary to find another doctor?
Don't give up yet. There are usually alternatives available to solving this problem. You are not the first person to encounter this situation. People here should be able to help you figure out what resources you have to work with.
Have you tried sertraline yet? You could try combining it with a tricyclic.
I believe you have the MAOI moclobemide available there (often considered to be a RIMA)? I don't think it is particularly effective long-term. However, it would probably help you when you first start taking it. If you can demonstrate to a doctor that you are a responder to moclobemide, maybe that would convince them to try Parnate once the moclobemide poops-out.
- Scott
Posted by Rdragon on August 25, 2009, at 20:06:06
In reply to Help, posted by Alexanderfromdenmark on August 25, 2009, at 15:07:39
> I spoke to a doctor at a psychiatric hospital today. According to him Wellbutrin is not a antidepressant, all my psychial problems are imagined and don't exist and they won't prescribe MAOI's, dopamine agonists or anything of that kind.
>
> What do I do? I feel totally f*ck*d. I'm more or less suicidal for the time being, but it seems like I'll never get to try parnate and Co. I'm psychially and mentally ill, but I will be receiving no help from the medical sector here in Denmark. What do I do? I'm at the point where I can hardly get out of bed, I can't get rid of this depression just by trying hard enough. I'm at the end of my rope. I felt better when I read about your parnate experiences, but it seems I will never ever get the oppourtunity.Wow, are you serious? That really makes me EXTREMELY pissed off at the doctors you're seeing. These problems are REAL, don't let ANYONE tell you otherwise. Although I have been fortunate enough to have GREAT doctors around me who are knowledgeable and willing to help me, I now see that this isn't necessarily the case everywhere.
Anyways, you need a new doctor, ASAP. Do whatever it takes to find one who suits YOUR needs. (I recognize that this could take awhile)
And as a final note, don't give up hope man, you can beat this thing. It may feel hopeless now, but your recovery is right around the corner, waiting for you.
P.S. What drugs have you tried exactly?
Posted by bleauberry on August 25, 2009, at 20:26:14
In reply to Help, posted by Alexanderfromdenmark on August 25, 2009, at 15:07:39
Wellbutrin is not viewed favorably as an antidepressant in most of the world because it did not pass their clinical trials convincingly. Why it did in the USA and nowhere else is a mystery. We could go for hours on the politics of how drugs get into the USA. Let's just say, it has some flaws.
Though I have seen some people do fantastic with Wellbutrin, for the most part, not. In the sporadic patient where it does work great, it doesn't seem to have lasting power for most of them.
If you want to try Wellbutrin, you are going to have to start smoking and then request it to stop smoking. They will prescribe it for that.
The statement that your physical symptoms are all in your head is not uncommon. Doctors who know what they are doing in terms of good bedside manners and in terms of medical skill would never say such a thing. That comment shows that particular doctor probably should not be a doctor. That clinician tarnishes the profession.
I don't know the way things are in your country so I do not know what options are available to you.
Can you see another doctor? If so, do so as fast as you can. A second opinion is always a good idea.
Can you mailorder meds from outside the country? I ask, because with a computer online you can easily order Parnate (Australia is a source) or Trivastal (antidepressnt dopamine agonist).
Can you buy herbs, such as St Johns Wort or Rhodiola Rosea? Both can be quite potent even in people who have failed many pharmaceutical drugs. This is evidenced at SJW forums where people with long sad psychiatric histories found magic in SJW or Rhodiola.
Who would ever think a herb could trounce a medicine? Well, it happens more than we think it does. In a nearby country, Germany, herbs for depression are prescribed first-line and far more frequently than medications. Germany is a leader in herbal research. I forget the exact number, but their prescriptions of SJW (it is a prescription in Germany) outnumbers Prozac at a rate of something like 6 to 1.
You are near Sweden, so you have access to the world's best Rhodiola (SHR-5 made by The Swedish Herbal Institute in Gothenburg, Sweden, SHR-5 is called Arctic Root). It is hard to find anyone who has tried it that did not find benefit from it. It was the most amazing ultra fast acting antidepressant I ever took. Life was all downhill after I couldn't get it in the USA anymore. If you are looking for dopamine stuff, Arctic Root is in that category. A randomized double blind placebo controlled study showed significant antidepressant activity in both dose groups of SHR-5 but no activity in the placebo group after a placebo run-in.
I have a feeling you will figure this out pretty quickly. A jerk doctor like that will serve to only make you stronger and more creative. The will to get better is very powerful. You have a lot of hope. I am cheering for you.
Posted by Phillipa on August 25, 2009, at 22:03:25
In reply to Re: Help, posted by bleauberry on August 25, 2009, at 20:26:14
There are not that many doctors in the USA that prescribe MAOIS. None of mine every would even consider them EMSAM was an exception and soon that was discared as well by my doc when she had patients with bad reactions. Why not stick with safer meds. Have you been through loads of meds? Phillipa
Posted by morganator on August 25, 2009, at 22:57:08
In reply to Re: Help, posted by bleauberry on August 25, 2009, at 20:26:14
I second that you might want to give SJW a try. It may just be as powerful as many other antidepressants. I think the Kira brand is the one used most often in Germany. I just started Zoloft again but I wish I had started a trial of something else like Kira or Parnate(not that SJW is as powerful as Parnate) instead. There is another brand of SJW that has been mentioned here but I can't remember the name of it.
Posted by tropicalmanna on August 27, 2009, at 17:49:21
In reply to Help, posted by Alexanderfromdenmark on August 25, 2009, at 15:07:39
I was in a similar situation for a long time, living also in Scandinavia. Eventually, I got a chance to try Parnate and Nardil which I preferred. Turn your babblemail on or drop me a pm, I may be able help you out!
-TM
Posted by JohnJ777 on August 28, 2009, at 14:24:28
In reply to Re: Help, posted by bleauberry on August 25, 2009, at 20:26:14
Bleauberry said: "You are near Sweden, so you have access to the world's best Rhodiola (SHR-5 made by The Swedish Herbal Institute in Gothenburg, Sweden, SHR-5 is called Arctic Root). It is hard to find anyone who has tried it that did not find benefit from it. It was the most amazing ultra fast acting antidepressant I ever took. Life was all downhill after I couldn't get it in the USA anymore. If you are looking for dopamine stuff, Arctic Root is in that category. A randomized double blind placebo controlled study showed significant antidepressant activity in both dose groups of SHR-5 but no activity in the placebo group after a placebo run-in."
Bleauberry, I used to love that product as well until I read the ingredients in it. My naturopath said that there was enough chemical garbage in that tablet to choke a horse. Personally, I was glad when the same company came up with Verde Botanica brand. That Mind Body & Spirit is a remarkable antidepressant.I've had on and off success with SJW but for the most part I'd recommend Rhodiola. Rhodiola has so much more uplift - when I take a capsule (I mix mine with juice) I can get results in about 10-12 minutes. It's like waking from a snooze -- I feel like I want to go do something exciting, or get some work done in my office. Anyway, SJW doesn't do that.
Posted by ColoradoSnowflake on August 28, 2009, at 21:46:54
In reply to Re: Help, posted by JohnJ777 on August 28, 2009, at 14:24:28
Could this Rhodiola be taken with Parnate??
Thanks,
Gayle
Posted by CaptainAmerica1967 on August 30, 2009, at 12:52:40
In reply to Help, posted by Alexanderfromdenmark on August 25, 2009, at 15:07:39
Fire that doctor and find one that is willing to work with you.
This is the end of the thread.
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