![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by ihatedrugs on June 15, 2009, at 20:27:03
Hi guys,
I'm just writing to let yu knwo that i think there is nothin outhere for me in terms of treatment. I have tried everything short of ect and no maois. but this journey has taken too long and it has taken a toll on who i am as a human being. My husband an kids although love me very much they just dont understand and I am beginning to fight this battle with someone else at my side.Sort of when you were little and your mom was your voice. I am supposed to go to all these doctors and tried all this stuff and then explain why it didn't work. My brainis too tired. I just want to sleep forever. But not even that I can accomplish. I took 6 1 mg clonazepan 2 tylenol pm and woke up 2 hours later. so i later took that last 5 clonazepan and 2 ambiem and stillwoke up 2 hours later. So now I took 3 ambien and lets if I can sleep through the night. I called my p doctor but cannotsee me until Wedneday. In the meantime I am out of clonazepan and don't even think the doctor is going to be able to do much. And to add insult to injury I have to go to Orlando on vacation for the kids. HOw am I even begin smile.
Meds I'm taking
Pristiq 50
Clonazepan 1-2 mg
ambien as needed
DeplinThe doctor is considering the emsam patch. What do you guys think.
Posted by shasling on June 15, 2009, at 21:19:46
In reply to giving up, posted by ihatedrugs on June 15, 2009, at 20:27:03
If your treatment resitant as you sound,and your doc is ready to go down the maoi route,i recomend either nardil or parnate.
I use parnate so of course id be partial to that
one but id say you def need to go to the old school hard ones emsam wont be good enough for ya,just my opinion.> Hi guys,
>
> I'm just writing to let yu knwo that i think there is nothin outhere for me in terms of treatment. I have tried everything short of ect and no maois. but this journey has taken too long and it has taken a toll on who i am as a human being. My husband an kids although love me very much they just dont understand and I am beginning to fight this battle with someone else at my side.Sort of when you were little and your mom was your voice. I am supposed to go to all these doctors and tried all this stuff and then explain why it didn't work. My brainis too tired. I just want to sleep forever. But not even that I can accomplish. I took 6 1 mg clonazepan 2 tylenol pm and woke up 2 hours later. so i later took that last 5 clonazepan and 2 ambiem and stillwoke up 2 hours later. So now I took 3 ambien and lets if I can sleep through the night. I called my p doctor but cannotsee me until Wedneday. In the meantime I am out of clonazepan and don't even think the doctor is going to be able to do much. And to add insult to injury I have to go to Orlando on vacation for the kids. HOw am I even begin smile.
>
> Meds I'm taking
> Pristiq 50
> Clonazepan 1-2 mg
> ambien as needed
> Deplin
>
> The doctor is considering the emsam patch. What do you guys think.
Posted by Phillipa on June 15, 2009, at 23:32:14
In reply to Re: giving up, posted by shasling on June 15, 2009, at 21:19:46
First you need to let the pdoc know how helpless you feel and that you took all your klonopin as you can't afford to withdraw cold turkey. I have a feeling your doc will see you on an emergency basis when you let him know what you did. You're depressed does your husband know what meds you've taken? Now is the time to confide in him and hope he can get you some help now not later. Love Phillipa ps you're in my thoughts
Posted by bleauberry on June 16, 2009, at 5:34:28
In reply to giving up, posted by ihatedrugs on June 15, 2009, at 20:27:03
The best thing you can do does not involve meds. It involves doctors.
Get a new one.
A second opinion at the very least.
Posted by ihatedrugs on June 16, 2009, at 11:27:10
In reply to Re: giving up, posted by bleauberry on June 16, 2009, at 5:34:28
I really do not know what else do do. Everyone around me is so sickof me. I try so hard. but nothing works
Posted by floatingbridge on June 16, 2009, at 16:29:02
In reply to Re: giving up, posted by Phillipa on June 15, 2009, at 23:32:14
I second Phillipa--don't go without your clonopin. Can your doc call in a days worth for you? There are other things to try. My friend says parnate was a miracle for her--20 years and still going--after nothing else worked. Thanks for writing and letting us know how you are. Don't give up--. If necessary, try another pdoc, though that's hard to do when one is feeling cr*ppy.
Posted by Frustratedmama on June 16, 2009, at 17:43:41
In reply to Re: giving up, posted by floatingbridge on June 16, 2009, at 16:29:02
I am with you! Hope you are able to get some releif soon- hang in there for the kids if nothing else! Keep writing and reading the posts- it keeps me going so I hope it will you too! Thinking of you!
Posted by ParnateStarted2008 on June 16, 2009, at 19:25:25
In reply to giving up, posted by ihatedrugs on June 15, 2009, at 20:27:03
> Hi guys,
>
> I'm just writing to let yu knwo that i think there is nothin outhere for me in terms of treatment. I have tried everything short of ect and no maois. but this journey has taken too long and it has taken a toll on who i am as a human being. My husband an kids although love me very much they just dont understand and I am beginning to fight this battle with someone else at my side.Sort of when you were little and your mom was your voice. I am supposed to go to all these doctors and tried all this stuff and then explain why it didn't work. My brainis too tired. I just want to sleep forever. But not even that I can accomplish. I took 6 1 mg clonazepan 2 tylenol pm and woke up 2 hours later. so i later took that last 5 clonazepan and 2 ambiem and stillwoke up 2 hours later. So now I took 3 ambien and lets if I can sleep through the night. I called my p doctor but cannotsee me until Wedneday. In the meantime I am out of clonazepan and don't even think the doctor is going to be able to do much. And to add insult to injury I have to go to Orlando on vacation for the kids. HOw am I even begin smile.
>
> Meds I'm taking
> Pristiq 50
> Clonazepan 1-2 mg
> ambien as needed
> Deplin
>
> The doctor is considering the emsam patch. What do you guys think.
Hello ihatedrugs,
Dammit sounds like your in a rough spot. I feel for you, this must be hard.
How long until you take a trip to Orlando? Maybe you'll be able to get somewhat back on track for the trip.
I second Phillipa, Shasling, and Floatingbridge... I would definitely get your clonazepam today, isn't there a walk in clinic, or could your pharmacy give you a day or 2 worth of Clono?
Are you suffering from anxiety really bad? if so I would try Nardil and modafinil if your so tired.. problem is it takes weeks before Nardil starts working......> This is only my opinion and im not saying this is safe or a good idea for you but here goes: Prestiq half life is pretty short so you should be able to start the Nardil 2 days after cold turkey Prestiq. Since Nardil hits Serotonin aswell you shouldnt feel much of any withdrawl syptoms... if you tolerate Nardil side effects well then get to 45mg/day ASAP like by 2nd day or 3rd. at 45mg you shouldnt feel any prestiq withdrawl as there will be sufficient serotonin for the Nardil to move on where the Prestiq left off. I KNOW THIS SOUNDS A LIL CRAZY AND FAST AND DANGEROUS, most people here will probably totally disagree with my speed of changing AD's.. Its ONLY from my own biological traits that I can switch meds extreamly fast to avoid withdrawl [(sounds like Im boasting...but im not I just started doing it out of desperation and im so med resistant that I can do it, not that it helps much since im treatment resistant anyway:()] and so I dont loose the already "present" AD effect from the last drug. (no real dooown then uup), just a smouth change over and hoping to feel better from the new drug.Pozac I would never say such a thing because its long half life.. just saying so you dont think id be 'a go' to switch like that for any med. no way. but you may have an option here.
I switched from 300mg Effexor XR to 40mg Parnate overnight out of desperation.. man was I desperate, I was Paranois and thinking of just leaving society forever to a little discusting cabin I know of....(im from canada this cabin is far far from anyone) Anyway
PARNATE. I would try this first before Nardil because it is extreamly Notorious for making you feel great at the beginning of treatment for the first few days or first week. and each dose increase(10mg usually), the same thing happens, you feel wonderful for a couple+ days. So if your like me and can up the dose to 30mg quickly because of lack of side effects you may possibly get a full week or 2 of remission. Now when I started Parnate I took modafinil aswell and I was in complete remission and felt great at the beginning. I took 100mg BID for the first month on Parnate. And what a great month I had. I was up to 60 mg within 2 weeks of starting. Then I stopped the modafinil and waited for the REAL Parnate AD effect to kick in, it took not long, a day or so. I felt full of emotion, energy, feelings, totally the opposite from depression but it wasnt doing too good on anxiety so I raised to 70, then 80, now 100. The AD effect never left for a second but the anxiolytic effect was very transient. I went back on modafinil for 2 weeks (thats all the supply I had and I had complete Anxiety relief and SOOO much energy and very little social phobia. Then I ran out of modafinil and here I sit at 100mg/day with very minor anxiolytic effects but antidepression effect is powerfull and always there, the thing is tho, I was never depressed. SO Im waiting for my Pdoc to augment it with something to creat a magic for anxiety (it would be magic for me if I could go to town and shop in a store and see someone I know!! even have a conversation)
Right now Im taking 4mg-clonazepam/day with the 100mg Parnate and I added the clonazepam 2 weeks ago and it helps 30%, So I feel OK at home doing stuff(now I use more of the house , I talk to my parents [ya im back at home] and I have my ambitions back and am dying to get Parnate augmented. For me clonazepam is not the answer to augment my Parnate(because my dose would have to be too high [addiction risk] like 5,6 or 7mg/day. It may be a great combo for you if smaller clonazepam doses work for you (you'll have to try the combo to see I guess. I would Try the modafinil in conjunction with Parnate at first so you get all the energy you need and a smile on your face(start at 50mg twice daily before moving to 100mg twice daily incase 50x2mg modafinil is enough for you), rather then waiting 2-8 weeks for the real AD effect to kick in. Im just saying that because your so so tired. I took 100mgmodafinil at 8am and 100mg at 1200pm. It was the best for energy hands down for me. it should be ok to use for a moderately long term, unlike other stimulants (ritalin, dextro). BUY a home kit Blood Pressure Cuff! Manditory I say for anyone starting an MAOI. I use mine all the time still.
ok Ill stop talking now.
I hope you got/get some klonopin for tonight or at least a substitute benzo.
I hope your Pdoc is open to trying new methods of attack.
If not get rid of him.
I used to put myself on my own drugs from lying at walk in clinics(saying i need a refill of something ive never had etc)... thats too tiring now so Ill just be patient and honest with my New Pdoc, he seems good, but slow .. ahhh who knows if I can wait, I hate being on so much clonazepam with limited benefit.
Let us know how your doing, and if you have made any progress at all..
sorry for the long post , I never do this but its this clonazepam and Parnate working together for me right now, I feel like actually writing a post rather then debating, and then not doing it.. this will be short lived I bet.
Hope I helped maybe a little....
Sorry if you think my ideas are way to far fetched.
talk to you soon.
Posted by Phillipa on June 16, 2009, at 19:54:38
In reply to Re: giving up, posted by ParnateStarted2008 on June 16, 2009, at 19:25:25
Parnate great post now where is IHatedrugs? Could you let us know how you are? Phillipa
Posted by ihatedrugs on June 17, 2009, at 15:49:13
In reply to Re: giving up, posted by Phillipa on June 16, 2009, at 19:54:38
Hello everyone,
I went to the doctor today and we decided to ditch Pristiq. She said that we could go up to 100 mg but everything I read says that a higher dosage is not necessarily more effective. So I have taken a leap of faith and she recommended Savella which many of us know is now advertised for Fibromyalgia but is considered a very effective antidepressant overseas. She even had a started packet she got from her GP husband. She also said that we should begin tapering off klonopin but not until I am stabilized. So I got a prescription for it. Also, she added Seroquel to help with insomnia although I am a little aprehensive because of the possible weight gain and Ambien was not working. I am doing better in terms of optimism. I really hope this new regimen works. I will keep you posted about Savella as I am sure a lot of you are curious as how it works.
As for ParnateStarted you made me laugh for the first time in several days. Thank you so much to all for caring.
Posted by bleauberry on June 17, 2009, at 17:54:22
In reply to Re: giving up)to all, posted by ihatedrugs on June 17, 2009, at 15:49:13
Savella. Cool. I am in your corner cheering for you.
My doctor also prescribed Savella for me yesterday. Though my doses will be extremely lower than yours. I'll probably be dividing a 12.5mg tab into quarters and doing just two or three spread out in a day, with a long timeframe of increasing if needed.
For me Savella has an almost instant boost beginning day 2 or 3. Then it goes sour, feeling maybe more depressed and definitely fatigued. But then gradually toward the end of week 2 I realize I have come a long way and things are on the right path.
Side effects have stopped me in the past because I was too aggressive with dosing. Lack of appetite and difficulty going pee were tough. I've heard those go away if you can stick with it for a month. I will try.
Sleep. The first two or three nights, your sleep may not be very good. But from that point forward, Savella actually provides a very good quality sleep. It is not a sedative. It doesn't help you fall asleep. But once you are asleep, you really sleep. Unlike the bizarre frightful dreams I usually had on benzos, antipsychotics, and sleep meds, Savella gives me these long pleasant or neutral interesting dreams that just go on and on. I was surprised to see insomnia as a side effect, because it really is very positive for good sleep architecture. I guess they had to report those side effects since they probably did happen frequently within the first few days of trials. I doubt anyone toward the end of those trials was having any problem sleeping. My experience says the final dose should be taken with the evening meal, not at bedtime. A bedtime dose messed with sleep, but an earlier evening dose enhanced sleep.
At askapatient.com there are already 2 reports from people who have just tried Savella. One, they felt great for two weeks, got extremely fatigued, and stopped. I think that was a mistake. They should have reduced the dose instead and given it time. The second said it worked good and they felt like their old self again, but had to stop due to high blood pressure.
I have read reports of various people who were in the clinical trials. The moral of the story with Savella is...the longer you stay patient with it, the better it gets. One person didn't respond until 3 months. Another not until 9months. Most responders do so within 4 to 12 weeks. But when it kicked in, it kicked in full. Some people dropped out due to side effects. You and me have the luxury of modifying our dose so as to buy some time. In a clinical trial they showed that low dose Savella worked just as good as normal dose, except that the low dose took twice as long.
If I were you, I would use a minimum amount of sleep aid the first few nights, and only if you absolutely can't do without them, and from that point on do not use them. I fear that too many variables in the mix could screw up the whole brew.
Savella rapidly desensitizes the 5ht1a receptor, which is thought to be one of the reasons it can work quickly. It is better for moderate and severe depression than it is for mild depression. It is especially good for post-stroke depression, depression in elders, and anhedonic depression. It has been tested for various types of depressions and genders but performed equally across the board.
Speaking of mixes, these things have proven effective in combination with Savella, either in case studies or clinical studies...
Low dose Risperdal
Low dose Zyprexa
Pindolol
And in Japan they combine it with either Paxil or Luvox.In the mention of Risperdal, it was a case study with 5 nonresponders or partial responders to Savella...all treatment resistant patients...4 out of 5 of them experienced rapid (within 1 week) remission when low dose Risperdal was added. Another lady got terrible akathisia from Risperdal, and a switch to Zyprexa brought her to remission.
Stahl says that it has dopamine reuptake properties as well, because in the part of the brain where Savella prevents reuptake of NE, dopamine is usually taken up in those NE neurons.
I hope there will be minimum other meds in your mix, because they could screw up the whole deal. Savella doesn't need much help. It just needs to have the stage without competition and some time.
I'll be your cheerleader. Keep me posted.
Posted by floatingbridge on June 17, 2009, at 21:15:36
In reply to Re: giving up)to all, posted by ihatedrugs on June 17, 2009, at 15:49:13
Hi, I'm happy to hear about the optimism and very curious about your experience with Savella.
Good news and good luck. Keep us posted!
Candace
Posted by ihatedrugs on June 17, 2009, at 21:18:51
In reply to Re: giving up)to all » ihatedrugs, posted by bleauberry on June 17, 2009, at 17:54:22
Thanks for all the information. I already took my first dose today 12.5mg. I have read about some people having a little bit of a hard time but only for a few days, but I plan to stick with it. I am a teacher on summer vacation so I have a few weeks to wait for the med to work. I am not taking any other antidepressant except for tapering off Pristiq. I take one 50mg every other day for just a week. Also, I need to taper off the Klonopin since I have been taking it for too long. The dr. also gave me Seroquel to help with sleep if needed. I have really high hopes and will stick with it for as long as I can. I'm so happy I have a Savella buddy in you. We will keep each other posted about our progress. I wish you from the bottom of my heart the best of luck.
Posted by ihatedrugs on June 17, 2009, at 21:20:17
In reply to Re: giving up)to all, posted by floatingbridge on June 17, 2009, at 21:15:36
I will definitely keep you all posted.
Thanks
Posted by ihatedrugs on June 18, 2009, at 0:42:56
In reply to Re: giving up, posted by Phillipa on June 16, 2009, at 19:54:38
Hello everyone,
I went to the doctor today and we decided to ditch Pristiq. She said that we could go up to 100 mg but everything I read says that a higher dosage is not necessarily more effective. So I have taken a leap of faith and she recommended Savella which many of us know is now advertised for Fibromyalgia but is considered a very effective antidepressant overseas. She even had a started packet she got from her GP husband. She also said that we should begin tapering off klonopin but not until I am stabilized. So I got a prescription for it. Also, she added Seroquel to help with insomnia although I am a little aprehensive because of the possible weight gain and Ambien was not working. I am doing better in terms of optimism. I really hope this new regimen works. I will keep you posted about Savella as I am sure a lot of you are curious as how it works.
As for ParnateStarted you made me laugh for the first time in several days. Thank you so much to all for caring.
Posted by floatingbridge on June 19, 2009, at 0:59:49
In reply to Re: giving up)to all, posted by ihatedrugs on June 18, 2009, at 0:42:56
Thank you for letting us know; glad you got a good laugh, too-rare as hens' teeth these days, I figure.
Keep us posted, please, with how you do on your regime. I wish you relief!
Candace
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.