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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by saturn on June 29, 2006, at 15:31:39
It's difficult to know what to make of studies such as these:http://www.oism.info/en/adhd/ritalin/effects_of_methylphenidate_on_mammalian.htm
I realize this is an anti-psych/med site, but the reference is from a legitimate source.
Another story I'm still interested in is:
http://www.nurseweek.com/news/00-04/042400b.html
What interests me is that a total of *5* forensic pathologists agreed with the conclusion that "The small vessels of his heart showed thickening and fibrosis around them. They looked like the arterioles we see in amphetamine and cocaine addicts". While cause and effect here cannot be absolutely established, it still makes me wonder...
I have no dogs in this fight, so to speak, one way or the other. I'm just curious of your thoughts. Peace...Saturn
Posted by linkadge on June 29, 2006, at 15:42:36
In reply to link to article regarding effects of MPH on heart, posted by saturn on June 29, 2006, at 15:31:39
Worrysome,
Linkadge
Posted by Phillipa on June 29, 2006, at 16:23:41
In reply to Re: link to article regarding effects of MPH on heart, posted by linkadge on June 29, 2006, at 15:42:36
Glad I don't take Adhd meds although all the others seem to cause bad side effects to. not uncomfortable things that can hurt your body. Love phillipa
Posted by alohashirt on June 29, 2006, at 22:25:38
In reply to Re: link to article regarding effects of MPH on heart » linkadge, posted by Phillipa on June 29, 2006, at 16:23:41
It's all a numbers game.
I don't know if there is another medication that appears to be as safe & effective as MPH that has such critcisim, fear, and paranoia surrounding it
There are a few million Americans taking MPH with negligible fatalaties linked. This compares well with rates for NSAIDs like aspirin nurofen etc, which has deaths in th ten thousands each year.
There have been thousands of studies of MPH. All drugs have side effects. MPH appears to be relatively safe. The side effects of untreated ADHD for most are much worse (higher rate of unemploymemt financial problems, criminality, addiction, ...)
Posted by linkadge on July 1, 2006, at 0:30:17
In reply to Re: link to article regarding effects of MPH on heart, posted by alohashirt on June 29, 2006, at 22:25:38
Some of these problems may only manifest long down the road. The cardiac changes that were observed in mice can only be found post mortem.
Linkadge
Posted by saturn on July 3, 2006, at 15:05:32
In reply to Re: link to article regarding effects of MPH on heart, posted by linkadge on July 1, 2006, at 0:30:17
> Some of these problems may only manifest long down the road. The cardiac changes that were observed in mice can only be found post mortem.
Hey link,
Actually, it seems the changes appeared rather quickly. The following statements were in the first article:
“Also noteworthy was the rapid development of pathological changes (i.e., within 3 weeks). “
“The rapid appearance of lamellar structures, coupled with the potential for irreversibility and the profound structural changes seen in a patient on long-term MPH therapy, suggests that these findings may have clinical consequences for drug interactions and long-term side effects of MPH of which clinicians should be aware. “
Posted by linkadge on July 3, 2006, at 15:27:31
In reply to Re: link to article regarding effects of MPH on heart » linkadge, posted by saturn on July 3, 2006, at 15:05:32
Alrightly then :)
Linkadge
Posted by linkadge on July 5, 2006, at 17:33:43
In reply to Re: link to article regarding effects of MPH on heart » saturn, posted by linkadge on July 3, 2006, at 15:27:31
I was thinking through the possable mechanism for this effect. Would it be do to inhibition of noradrenaline uptake ? Could some of the same changes be observed in people on noradrenergic antidepressants ?
Linkadge
Posted by saturn on July 6, 2006, at 13:41:41
In reply to Re: link to article regarding effects of MPH on heart, posted by linkadge on July 5, 2006, at 17:33:43
> I was thinking through the possable mechanism for this effect. Would it be do to inhibition of noradrenaline uptake ? Could some of the same changes be observed in people on noradrenergic antidepressants ?
I don't know, but I found the following on freerepublic.com:
While many of Ritalin,s cardiac side effects might be due to its action on the sympathetic nervous system, it may bind to and alter cellular architecture, leading to symptoms and signs that are secondary to actual structural damage.
Ritalin is known to cause cardiac arrhythmia, tachycardia and hypertension. Ritalin and other amphetamines can interfere with the body phospholipid (complex fat) chemistry causing the accumulation of abnormal membranes visible with an electron microscope. Such abnormalities were seen in an adult treated with Ritalin for 4 years. A heart muscle biopsy was obtained during coronary bypass surgery. Fischer (1972) concluded: "Although the patient was exposed to a variety of different drugs, we feel the methylphenindate (Ritalin) should be considered as the incriminating factor since this agent is amphetamine-related."
Henderson & Fischer (1994) next exposed experimental mice and rats to MP (Ritalin), and found identical membrane proliferation to that in the patient described by Fischer (1972). Moreover, they found that "The MP (Ritalin) doses used in the experimental rodents fell within the range of therapeutic dosage prescribed for patients with attention deficit disorders (ADD/ADHD)."
>>I just don't know.
Posted by linkadge on July 6, 2006, at 18:49:49
In reply to Re: link to article regarding effects of MPH on heart » linkadge, posted by saturn on July 6, 2006, at 13:41:41
Yeah, that seems pretty significant to me. It would be reason for me not to start it again.
Too bad.
Linkadge
Posted by saturn on July 6, 2006, at 20:42:19
In reply to Re: link to article regarding effects of MPH on heart, posted by linkadge on July 6, 2006, at 18:49:49
> Yeah, that seems pretty significant to me. It would be reason for me not to start it again. I was pretty close.
>
> Too bad.
>
It is too bad, but it's also reason enough for me not to restart it also.BTW...do you mind being called "Link"? Peace...Saturn.
Posted by saturn on July 6, 2006, at 20:43:29
In reply to Re: link to article regarding effects of MPH on heart, posted by linkadge on July 6, 2006, at 18:49:49
Posted by linkadge on July 8, 2006, at 18:40:25
In reply to previous message meant 2b directed to linkadge (nm) » linkadge, posted by saturn on July 6, 2006, at 20:43:29
Oh goodness no.
Linkadge
Posted by saturn on July 9, 2006, at 16:47:51
In reply to Re: previous message meant 2b directed to linkadge » saturn, posted by linkadge on July 8, 2006, at 18:40:25
> Oh goodness no.
>
> LinkadgeJust to clarify, oh goodness no you don't *mind* or don't *wish* to be called "link"?
Posted by linkadge on July 9, 2006, at 18:30:40
In reply to Re: previous message meant 2b directed to linkadge » linkadge, posted by saturn on July 9, 2006, at 16:47:51
Go right ahead :)
Linkadge
This is the end of the thread.
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