![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 12 of 12. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Alara on February 24, 2003, at 5:32:44
Every day I go to work and function well. I am social, outgoing and get the job done. Without SSRIs, I'd be really struggling.
Before I returned to full-time work I was functioning well without meds. I was myself. I cried at national disasters on the news and was connected with the core of my being. Sure, I was a little over-sensitive, both towards others and myself, but some people would argue that a quality like this is an asset. Sensitivity is the core of who I really am.
Life presents a bit of an illusion at times. We think we have choices. Every day we can decide what to eat, what to wear, and what decisions to make about our futures. But do we really have that choice?
I live my life from day to day, popping 20mg of Celexa and 0.5mg of XAnax to get me by. Yes, it works and I am incredibly grateful. But I am not myself. I was forced to choose between supporting myself financially (a necessity for most of us) and being myself (med-free in poverty).
Sometimes I wonder if I sold my soul to drugs. At other times I wonder if I had any choice at all.
I am not depressed. I just feel a little sad and reflective tonight. It's not easy to give up a part of yourself just so that you can `exist'.
At times like this I grieve a little and can only hope that the day will come when I can function - just as myself...Meanwhile, I am improving my lifestyle (and hopefully my baseline brain chemistry) but a part of my soul is grieving.
Can anyone relate?
I've been keeping this all inside and it's starting to eat away(just a little bit) at my soul.
Alara
Posted by agencypanic on February 24, 2003, at 10:25:03
In reply to SSRIs - Social Anxiety vs Existential Angst?, posted by Alara on February 24, 2003, at 5:32:44
Thank you for an interesting post. I know someone who refuses to medicate herself for depression
because of the fact that she then becomes 'decentered' for lack of a better word.
I think that most of us are selling ourselves for something, be it medicine or a Lexus or whatever. I'm not sure that the choices are as vast as many believe:
consumerism seems to be a choice between sh** and sh** and that's still sh**, as the Anti-Flag song says.
Starvation is a bad choice, being off meds that help us even in little ways is probably a bad choice too. Working jobs that drain us of our self-worth and humanity is a bad choice-- vicious circles are no choices at all.
Probably not addressing your concerns with this, but I do appreciate the chance to vent and I do appreciate your message. Right now I'm attempting to find one of those
jobs so that I can afford my medication and some therapy. I'd had no luck at it and reached the point where I pursued the option of having myself declared "seriously mentally ill" so as to gain access to a state program
for medication and treatment. While I'm not overly sensitive to the stigma of being mentally ill any longer, I admit that it did take some convincing
to allow myself to take this route. Some choice, huh?
Posted by Eddie Sylvano on February 24, 2003, at 11:51:16
In reply to SSRIs - Social Anxiety vs Existential Angst?, posted by Alara on February 24, 2003, at 5:32:44
> Sometimes I wonder if I sold my soul to drugs. At other times I wonder if I had any choice at all.
-----------------Is it really that much of a difference? Is who you are defined solely by your propensity for emotion? For most people, being anxious or depressed is the abnormality, keeping them from functioning "normally." My struggles with anxiety/depression have shown me that there isn't really any objective "me," but an ever changing expression of my current brain state. Unmedicated, I'm apathetic, sad, and tense. Medicated, I'm relatively happy and relaxed. Two different personalities, same brain. I'm always still working from the same beliefs and values, though. I'm always relatively quiet and try to be compassionate. I still love the same people and hate the same things. I think it's just a matter of deciding what really makes you happier: drugs or no. Nothing wrong with going off meds if it makes you feel better. If the meds really do make you feel better but you still pine for your "self," maybe it's more of a neurotic concern for purity that you feel than a true sadness over the loss.
Posted by bozeman on February 24, 2003, at 20:05:30
In reply to SSRIs - Social Anxiety vs Existential Angst?, posted by Alara on February 24, 2003, at 5:32:44
Alara
I know what you mean. My "life" works better on meds (high-stress job et al) but my "self" is not so precise. The lows are not so low but the highs are flatter, too. I have to work harder to achieve the creative genius that my employer pays me for, but after doing the creating, at least I still have energy to do something besides go home and collapse into bed. On medication, even though it seems like I have to work harder to find that "creatively high zone", it doesn't take as much out of me, if that makes any sense.
Like so many things in life, it's a trade off. Off medication, I am a gifted employee who doesn't have enough energy to do anything else. On medication, I am probably 5% less productive as an employee, but I have a life. When I look at it like that, the choice becomes not a choice, but a necessity.
You're not alone. Hope you feel better about it soon.
bozeman
Posted by bluedog on February 24, 2003, at 22:00:10
In reply to SSRIs - Social Anxiety vs Existential Angst?, posted by Alara on February 24, 2003, at 5:32:44
> Sensitivity is the core of who I really am.
>
> Sometimes I wonder if I sold my soul to drugs. At other times I wonder if I had any choice at all.
>Hello Alara....even though I've never met you personally I reckon your a really gorgeous person. Your sensitivity is what makes you so gorgeous and I have not noticed any less sensitivity in ANY of your posts since you started on your Celexa and Xanax around Christmas time. That is a short time on the meds and I believe that you are still in the therapeutic stage of your recovery and need to be VERY patient to wait for that moment in time when you realise that you are at the maintenance stage of your therapy. You might be able to eventually survive without any meds.
I too "suffer" from being a very sensitive person. As you know my prescription meds are Lovan and Valium....a fairly similar combination to what you are on. I stuggled for a VERY long time with what you are going through at the moment. ie Am I selling my soul to the meds. Well I believe I am finally emerging out through the other side and and now feel like I I am able to embrace life and the beauty in our world again despite all the ugliness that does surround us.
I am now at the stage where after over two years on AD meds I am now on the absolute minimum "maintenance" doses of my meds. NOW for the first time in years I actually feel like ME again. I am still very sensitive. I still get upset, sad and angry when I see documentaries about what us humans are doing to our planet. I cry at the mistreatment of animals at the hands of humans and the destruction and vandalisation of the Amazon and other natural forests and nature areas in the world at the hands of multinational corporations where the only objective is to ensure that the CEO get's his/her multi-million dollar bonus at the end of the year.
The point I'm trying to make is that despite being on meds I still FEEL all the emotions that are the essence of ME. The ONLY difference is that I am now much more resilient and problems in the world and my life don't cause me to spiral into an uncontrollable major depression like I used to. When I was severely depressed I didn't feel any emotions at all and furthermore I was of no use to anyone, to the world or even to myself.
==================================================================================================> I am not depressed. I just feel a little sad and reflective tonight. It's not easy to give up a part of yourself just so that you can `exist'.
>The fact that you are not depressed but merely a little sad and reflective is a perfectly normal and healthy human reaction. I would start to worry if you are NOT able to feel sad and reflective at times. To me this is an indication that you have NOT given up any part of yourself. Consider it as proof that you are still feeling your sensitivity shine through despite being on the meds!!!
And don't forget the struggle you have had with alcohol. I actually felt worse and not at all like me for the first 3-6 months after having quit alcohol in June last year. But now with each passing week, despite problems I experience in a job I hate and with a director who can't come to grips with the fact that I am recovering from a major depression I feel myself getting stronger with each passing week.
==================================================================================================> At times like this I grieve a little and can only hope that the day will come when I can function - just as myself...Meanwhile, I am improving my lifestyle (and hopefully my baseline brain chemistry) but a part of my soul is grieving.
>Alara....the only advice I can give you here is to be patient. Look at all the inspirational stories on psychobabble (I would especially refer you to Gracie's story which she posted not so long ago...unfortunately I can't find the link at the moment)
==================================================================================================> Can anyone relate?
>
> I've been keeping this all inside and it's starting to eat away(just a little bit) at my soul.
>YES I can relate. DON'T let it eat at your soul.
Oh and by the way (in relation to your question in another thread) despite the fact that I have not had the courage to ask Yoga Girl out yet I do not allow this to affect me to the extent it used to....In the past my sensitivity and feelings of failure as a human being at not asking her out would have sent me into a tail-spin and I would have hit rock bottom almost immediatiately after Yoga class. My lack of courage still upsets me and frustrates me but I am more able to accept that this is also just part of me. Again even though my meds help me they do not isolate me from my emotions. It just took a while to find the right combination and doseages of meds for me personally.
Thinking of you Alara
My warmest regards
bluedog
Posted by IsoM on February 25, 2003, at 0:27:03
In reply to Re: SSRIs - Social Anxiety vs Existential Angst? » Alara, posted by bluedog on February 24, 2003, at 22:00:10
Alara what you mentioned about the effects of SSRIs on you are very valid, but so is Eddie's post. I've talked with many people about SSRIs & when they work, they seem to affect most either one way or the other.
I'm like Eddie. Without ADs, I'm apathetic (no motivation), tense, & not sad, but angry & irritable. SSRIs enable me to feel "me" - to love & laugh & weep when needed. I'm not an angry sort of person. I can feel this deep inside to be true. But anger was always just under the surface & would colour my every move before SSRIs. I'm incredibly patient now, & it feels real & very good.
I had long talks with my biology prof as she was only a little older than me & we had many interests in common. She told me when she'd been on an SSRI, it made her indifferent to other's plight. She felt distanced from the emotions she used to feel for other people. Because she was so disturbed at her actions & indifference, she found another way of dealing with her depression.
It seems SSRIs make some discover who they really are, while in others, like you sadly, it muffles their true nature. All I can say, if your true nature is being muffled, you still seem like an incredibly caring, understanding person.
Posted by viridis on February 25, 2003, at 12:22:33
In reply to SSRIs seem to affect people 2 diff ways, posted by IsoM on February 25, 2003, at 0:27:03
I agree with the differences in reaction to SSRIs that IsoM described. For me, they cause initial agitation, followed by a state of "wired indifference" in which I feel tense, yet don't really care about anything, and people find me "spaced out". I also experience irrational bursts of anger (definitely not my normal self). My pdoc verified that this is one, not especially uncommon, type of reaction.
Yet I know others who have benefitted tremendously from these drugs. For example, I have a friend who, without SSRIs, works very hard, but is miserable all the time, eats compulsively, and tries to sleep as many hours of the day as possible. With a bit of Prozac, she's enthusiastic, motivated, and feels alive -- the difference is striking. The same is true for someone else I know who uses Celexa.
I guess it all depends on which brain chemicals and/or receptors are deficient, and where. It's too bad that we're not yet at the point where we can test for likely response in advance, but I expect that in a few years we will be. Until then, most of this will continue to be trial-and-error, but doctors need to recognize that not all patients are good candidates for SSRI therapy, and be willing to shift strategies if necessary.
Posted by IsoM on February 25, 2003, at 14:36:45
In reply to Re: SSRIs seem to affect people 2 diff ways » IsoM, posted by viridis on February 25, 2003, at 12:22:33
Thanks for the verification, viridis. I'm one of those in which Celexa did a world of difference. I wish I was on the combo I'm on now when I was taking university courses a few years back. During that time, I was being switched around on meds & felt so spaced out. In my chemistry course, I had an A at mid-term but because of the switch, I ended up with a C finally. I was very upset but could do nothing about it. The profs were very understanding & went out of their way for me, but nothing will compensate for a brain that won't work. On my final exam, a part about orbitals & atomic configurations that I knew thoroughly, just went blank on the exam. I stared & stared at the paper but nothing would bring it back. That's why when I hear of college students trying to take courses while fiddling with their meds, I advise to wait till everything gets sorted out. The stress of not working to potential can be unbearable, further adding to one's problems.
Posted by Franz on February 25, 2003, at 20:23:48
In reply to Re: SSRIs seem to affect people 2 diff ways » viridis, posted by IsoM on February 25, 2003, at 14:36:45
Hello IsoM
I do not mean to go personal, but the issue of academic or intellectal work performance interests me.
I agree that not working to potential is very stressful.
Why do you think celexa would have helped and not a benzo like Klonopin?.
Are you talking about depression or anxiety?.
Thanks> Thanks for the verification, viridis. I'm one of those in which Celexa did a world of difference. I wish I was on the combo I'm on now when I was taking university courses a few years back. During that time, I was being switched around on meds & felt so spaced out. In my chemistry course, I had an A at mid-term but because of the switch, I ended up with a C finally. I was very upset but could do nothing about it. The profs were very understanding & went out of their way for me, but nothing will compensate for a brain that won't work. On my final exam, a part about orbitals & atomic configurations that I knew thoroughly, just went blank on the exam. I stared & stared at the paper but nothing would bring it back. That's why when I hear of college students trying to take courses while fiddling with their meds, I advise to wait till everything gets sorted out. The stress of not working to potential can be unbearable, further adding to one's problems.
Posted by IsoM on February 26, 2003, at 14:33:19
In reply to why Celexa? Re: SSRIs seem to affect » IsoM, posted by Franz on February 25, 2003, at 20:23:48
The current combo I take now is Celexa, Provigil, & Dexedrine. With this mix, I can stay 'relatively' focused & not start falling asleep as soon as I sit down alone to read or study. It wasn't so much depression or anxiety that hindered me but the overwhelming desire to sleep when I'd sit alone for studying & reading. Dexedrine can keep me awake & alert now & I didn't have it then in regular supply. My doc, unfortunately, is dead set against prescribing benzos. All pdocs in this area are also very weird. Other than my docs benzophobia, he's the best I've come across in years.
About unviersity - the inactive periods needed for intense study makes me feel crappy. It isn't enough to get up & move about in regular breaks, I need fairly ongoing activity to feel good. Otherwise, headaches & muscle stiffness becomes unbearable. It's probably related to old injuries & fibromyalgia. Little I can do about it.
I was changing meds & trying to find what worked good at the time I was at university. The nausea, malaise, & foggy brain made keeping new info stored long term very difficult. The anxiety happened in diff situations. In one chem lab exam, already feeling disconnected, I noticed the level of a compound in my test tube going down. I looked underneath & saw the tube had a small hole in it & was leaking all over my papers. While I probably didn't act much diff if any one looked, but I lost it - & felt like I was in a dream. Hard to explain but not conducive to doing your best.
I have to admit I learn & remember much better if I don't have to 'perform'. The anxiety & stress of proving what I know always throws me. I do continue to read & learn on my own. Reading science & med mags is relaxing for me - my idea of the perfect recreation.
Posted by Alara on February 28, 2003, at 21:32:43
In reply to SSRIs seem to affect people 2 diff ways, posted by IsoM on February 25, 2003, at 0:27:03
Thanks for all of your your kind words. :-) It turns out that my `existential angst' had an element of neurosis to it as Eddie suggested: I was coming down with PMS!!! What began with a tense head and neurotic concern about whether I was still myself gave way the next day to a horrible fit of depression, culminating in a drinking binge and a day off work...I am beginning to recognise a pattern in myself: For 4 days every month I am transformed from a highly functioning person in a good mood to a miserable, neurotic, depressed mess...Once my period starts I am fine..(I wish the stupid thing would hurry up and start!)
Special thanks to Bluedog and IsoM for helping me to understand that I still remain the same person in spite of being on meds..It seems that the identity crisis only comes up at certain times...
Arghh!!!
Posted by KrissyP on March 1, 2003, at 1:27:23
In reply to SSRIs - Social Anxiety vs Existential Angst?, posted by Alara on February 24, 2003, at 5:32:44
Wow-great post. I can relate. I had to choose to and I chose to be med free inn poverty and I suffered as well as my family and friends. I often wonder why I have to be on meds, but still try to accept the fact that I have severe mood swings. I would rather play it off as just being a moody b$#@!-but that didn't work. I have a personality that is fighting with my emotions and I wondered if I could ever get by without medication. I am glad that you can work, I feel I am capable but I posted earlier about fear and I am only holding myself back and not acknowledging the positive, good, joy I can bring to a career and that hurts-really bad. I hate it and it hurts-real bad. I hear you when you say that sensitivity is the core of who you are-It is who I am and I have been criticized at times because of that trait, but I am now realizing that I am grateful for it, it helps me to be real in an often unreal society. Hang in there, we will be ok-hope this helped a little? Thank you so much for sharing this.
Kristen
Every day I go to work and function well. I am social, outgoing and get the job done. Without SSRIs, I'd be really struggling.
Before I returned to full-time work I was functioning well without meds. I was myself. I cried at national disasters on the news and was connected with the core of my being. Sure, I was a little over-sensitive, both towards others and myself, but some people would argue that a quality like this is an asset. Sensitivity is the core of who I really am.
Life presents a bit of an illusion at times. We think we have choices. Every day we can decide what to eat, what to wear, and what decisions to make about our futures. But do we really have that choice?
I live my life from day to day, popping 20mg of Celexa and 0.5mg of XAnax to get me by. Yes, it works and I am incredibly grateful. But I am not myself. I was forced to choose between supporting myself financially (a necessity for most of us) and being myself (med-free in poverty).
Sometimes I wonder if I sold my soul to drugs. At other times I wonder if I had any choice at all.
I am not depressed. I just feel a little sad and reflective tonight. It's not easy to give up a part of yourself just so that you can `exist'.
At times like this I grieve a little and can only hope that the day will come when I can function - just as myself...Meanwhile, I am improving my lifestyle (and hopefully my baseline brain chemistry) but a part of my soul is grieving.
Can anyone relate?
I've been keeping this all inside and it's starting to eat away(just a little bit) at my soul.
Alara
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.