![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 21 of 21. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by MB on December 17, 2002, at 12:10:29
Does anybody know why almost everyone on this board who takes a benzo takes Klonopin? It definitely *is* the benzo du Jour. Once in a while I see Xanax mentioned on this board, but Valium, Ativan, Librium are almost unmentioned. Anyway, maybe they are mentioned, and I just don't see it. However, I've got to say that it seems 90% of all benzo posts are about Klonopin. Why is it the popular one?
MB
Posted by utopizen on December 17, 2002, at 16:41:31
In reply to Why is Klonopin the Benzo du Jour, posted by MB on December 17, 2002, at 12:10:29
> Does anybody know why almost everyone on this board who takes a benzo takes Klonopin? It definitely *is* the benzo du Jour. Once in a while I see Xanax mentioned on this board, but Valium, Ativan, Librium are almost unmentioned. Anyway, maybe they are mentioned, and I just don't see it. However, I've got to say that it seems 90% of all benzo posts are about Klonopin. Why is it the popular one?
>
> MBP-docs like it because it is the slowest to leave the blood, affecting a lesser risk for tolerance and abuse. Xanax is more likely to be prescribed by a GP, who is like conscious of this matter.
Posted by judy1 on December 17, 2002, at 19:10:33
In reply to Re: Why is Klonopin the Benzo du Jour, posted by utopizen on December 17, 2002, at 16:41:31
I think it's the best benzo for long half life (for anxiety) and pdocs like the secondary mood stabilizing effect for bipolar. I also take xanax prn (which my pdoc feels is the best benzo for panic disorder), so I guess I don't see a particular emphasis in my case. Valium and librium are the old ones- they have their devotees as well- it's just whatever works the best for you I guess. take care, judy
Posted by viridis on December 18, 2002, at 5:45:17
In reply to Why is Klonopin the Benzo du Jour, posted by MB on December 17, 2002, at 12:10:29
I agree with the other posters -- Klonopin has a very long half-life, so is less likely than many other benzos to induce dose escalation etc. Plus, it's a very effective drug for many, and has few side effects. Remember also that a large proportion of those here see psychiatrists, who are especially likely to appreciate these things, and also realize that K has mood-stabilizing properties, a plus for many patients.
I once asked my pdoc how easy it would be to maintain my drug regimen (daily K and Adderall, plus Neurontin and occasional Xanax) if I had to change doctors. He said no problem, except never ask a doctor directly for Xanax -- let them recommend it first, because Xanax in particular is considered "addictive". Apparently, Xanax has a bad reputation for abuse. Too bad, because it works very well for those who need it (like me, once in a while).
Posted by joy on December 18, 2002, at 7:57:57
In reply to Why is Klonopin the Benzo du Jour, posted by MB on December 17, 2002, at 12:10:29
My Psych likes Xanax over Klonopin. When I asked him about Klonopin, he claimed it tended towards depression for some people while Xanax did not. I have to say that Xanax has been a wonderful med for me for anxiety and insomnia. I am taking it 2 or 3 years, but don't take big more than .5 or 1 mg at most in a 24 hour period. Xanax is the only thing I've tried that helps my post menopausal insomnia. I know Klonopin is good for some people, but that's what my Psychiatrist thinks, so I'm good with the Xanax.
Joy
Posted by viridis on December 18, 2002, at 13:18:11
In reply to Re: Why is Klonopin the Benzo du Jour, posted by joy on December 18, 2002, at 7:57:57
I think Xanax got a bad reputation largely due to overprescription in the 80s and 90s, much like Valium did in the 70s. With enough people taking it (including some who probably shouldn't be), it's inevitable that a few will misuse it. It's a great med, and a shame that it has that stigma attached to it -- it can make it more difficult to get when you really need it.
Klonopin doesn't induce depression for me (in fact, it alleviates it), but several others here have reported that effect. I still use Xanax occasionally, for very stressful situations, and my pdoc doesn't mind prescribing it along with K. I find that X has a more immediate and definite effect, whereas I don't even notice the K. But maybe that's because I take K every day and X only once in a while.
In any case, if it works for you that's great.
Posted by comftnumb on December 18, 2002, at 15:48:40
In reply to Why is Klonopin the Benzo du Jour, posted by MB on December 17, 2002, at 12:10:29
Could be because Klonopin and Xanax are the strongest benzos. A link here will show you. http://www.sdh.sk.ca/rxfiles/acrobat/Cht-Psyc-Benzodiazepines.pdf. Klonopin is called Rivotril in this chart, but it's the same drug Clonazepam.
Ativan is considered the standard dose by which the others are measured. Xanax is twice as strong, Klonopin is four times as strong. By contrast Valium is 5times weaker and Librium is 25 times weaker.
I tried Ativan and Xanax but never in a high enough dose (1-2mg). Klonopin at 2mg works for me really well, and the long half-life is a definite plus.
Posted by johnj on December 18, 2002, at 16:39:27
In reply to Re: Why is Klonopin the Benzo du Jour, posted by comftnumb on December 18, 2002, at 15:48:40
8
Posted by Essence on December 18, 2002, at 18:54:29
In reply to Why is Klonopin the Benzo du Jour, posted by MB on December 17, 2002, at 12:10:29
I am currently taking Clonazepam, have been since May. In the past I had taken Xanax, and had been on it 7 yrs. It worked great for me but a new psydoc thought it was time I came off of it. The Clonazepam doesn't work on my anxiety and panic as well as Xanax did, if I had my choice, I would be back on Xanax as the Clon only is about 75% effective. Just my experience with the two.
Posted by Geezer on December 18, 2002, at 21:25:39
In reply to Why is Klonopin the Benzo du Jour, posted by MB on December 17, 2002, at 12:10:29
> Does anybody know why almost everyone on this board who takes a benzo takes Klonopin? It definitely *is* the benzo du Jour. Once in a while I see Xanax mentioned on this board, but Valium, Ativan, Librium are almost unmentioned. Anyway, maybe they are mentioned, and I just don't see it. However, I've got to say that it seems 90% of all benzo posts are about Klonopin. Why is it the popular one?
>
> MBHi MB,
Only my guess based upon my own experience. Klonopin has zero euphoria associated with it - therefore little chance for abuse. As far as I can tell it also has zero anxiolitic (sp) effect. I only take it for sleep, and for me, that's all it does....makes me sleepy. I should add I have Unipolar Major Depression/Depressed/Meloncholic with no anxiety but extreme chronic "sleepness" during the day (i take the K onle at night) with chronic insomnia at night - TRD. Nothing works for me so I am not a good example.....essentially brain dead.
Wish you the best,
Geezer
Posted by HIBA on December 19, 2002, at 1:46:55
In reply to Re: Why is Klonopin the Benzo du Jour » MB, posted by Geezer on December 18, 2002, at 21:25:39
Klonopin is an excellent anxiolytic. And has unique mood-stabilizing properties. Please don't confuse the others in this board.
HIBA
Posted by Geezer on December 19, 2002, at 9:04:28
In reply to Re: Why is Klonopin the Benzo du Jour » Geezer, posted by HIBA on December 19, 2002, at 1:46:55
>
> Klonopin is an excellent anxiolytic. And has unique mood-stabilizing properties. Please don't confuse the others in this board.
> HIBAHIBA,
I think if you had taken time to read my post you would notice I clearly stated what the drug Klonopin does, and does not do, for ME. All we have here (or anywhere in psychiatry for that matter) is anecdotal information. The reason being, there is no emperical science involved in the testing or application of psychopharmacology, therefore, each drug trial for each patient (be it a benzo., SSRI, TCA, etc.) is just another "roll of the dice".....sometimes you win sometimes you loose.
I doubt that I "confused" anyone, perhaps you feel a bit challenged, that is your right and your problem......no disrespect intended. I think K is a good drug from the stand point of its low abuse potential and its long half life. I also hope the person who left the original post has much success with K. Everything on this board is opinion - nothing more.
Best regards,
Geezer
Posted by kara lynne on December 19, 2002, at 13:26:39
In reply to Re: Why is Klonopin the Benzo du Jour » HIBA, posted by Geezer on December 19, 2002, at 9:04:28
I didn't feel you were confusing anyone. You also mentioned that you don't have anxiety, and quaified all you said : Nothing works for me so I am not good example.....essentially brain dead. Which though sad, still made me laugh because I unfortunately could relate.
Posted by chad_3 on December 22, 2002, at 20:31:54
In reply to Why is Klonopin the Benzo du Jour, posted by MB on December 17, 2002, at 12:10:29
My opinion is that:
1) Long half life unlike xanax and ativan
2) Less sedating than most benzodiazepines
3) Long shot best benzo for Social Phobia
4) Good for panic at low dose5) Good for many "antipsychotic wounded" people - the best common drug for most tardive movement disorders... Many here use it as a/p substitute once their aquired brain lesions from the a/p.
6) Combines well with the serotonergics which dominate the patented drugs right now - provided the sertonin add-in does not cause too much sedations and sexual side effects.
Chad
http://www.socialfear.com/
> Does anybody know why almost everyone on this board who takes a benzo takes Klonopin? It definitely *is* the benzo du Jour. Once in a while I see Xanax mentioned on this board, but Valium, Ativan, Librium are almost unmentioned. Anyway, maybe they are mentioned, and I just don't see it. However, I've got to say that it seems 90% of all benzo posts are about Klonopin. Why is it the popular one?
>
> MB
Posted by bluedog on December 24, 2002, at 19:26:31
In reply to Re: Why is Klonopin? - many uses long half life, posted by chad_3 on December 22, 2002, at 20:31:54
> My opinion is that:
> 1) Long half life unlike xanax and ativan
> 2) Less sedating than most benzodiazepines
> 3) Long shot best benzo for Social Phobia
> 4) Good for panic at low dose
>
> 5) Good for many "antipsychotic wounded" people - the best common drug for most tardive movement disorders... Many here use it as a/p substitute once their aquired brain lesions from the a/p.
>
> 6) Combines well with the serotonergics which dominate the patented drugs right now - provided the sertonin add-in does not cause too much sedations and sexual side effects.
>
> Chad
> http://www.socialfear.com/
>
>
> > Does anybody know why almost everyone on this board who takes a benzo takes Klonopin? It definitely *is* the benzo du Jour. Once in a while I see Xanax mentioned on this board, but Valium, Ativan, Librium are almost unmentioned. Anyway, maybe they are mentioned, and I just don't see it. However, I've got to say that it seems 90% of all benzo posts are about Klonopin. Why is it the popular one?
> >
> > MB
Hi Chad, I have a question for you.I am a long term social anxiety sufferer. I live in Australia and for whatever reasons (the reasons are always medico-political) there are many more legal restrictions on doctors prescribing Klonopin rather than Valium and the doctors actually prefer to prescribe Diazepam over Klonopin in Australia which appers to be the exact opposite of the situation in the USA.
So I guess you could say the in Australia (at least the State in which I live) Diazepam is actually the Benzo "Du Jour" with Temazepam probably sitting on an equal footing with Diazepam though Temazepam is more often used for insomnia problems. For these reasons my PDoc preferred to put me on Valium rather than Klonopin for my social anxiety.
It just so happens that Clonazepam has been the drug that has been the most heavily researched in relation to social anxiety. However have you seen the following 2001 study? I have higlighted with capitals the part of this abstract that caught my attention!!!
==================================================================================================1: J Clin Psychiatry 2001;62 Suppl 1:50-3 Related Articles, Links
Benzodiazepines and anticonvulsants for social phobia (social anxiety disorder).
Jefferson JW.
Madison Institute of Medicine, Inc., and the University of Wisconsin Medical School, USA. JeffJ@healthtechsys.com
Both benzodiazepines and conventional anticonvulsants have been evaluated as treatments for social phobia (social anxiety disorder). Among the benzodiazepines, clonazepam is the best studied, ALTHOUGH THERE IS REASON TO EXPECT THAT ALL BENZODIAZEPINE ANXIOLYTICS WOULD BE EFFECTIVE FOR THIS CONDITION. Among the anticonvulsants, gabapentin and pregabalin, an analogue of gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA), have been shown to be more effective than placebo in double-blind studies. Other than a small negative open study of valproic acid for social phobia, there is a paucity of information on whether other anticonvulsants might be useful for this condition.
PMID: 11206035 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
==================================================================================================Chad my question for you is as follows:-
With Diazepam also being a long acting benzo can you see any reason why the reasons you state in your post about Klonopin would not also apply to Valium?
Thankyou and regards
bluedog
Posted by utopizen on December 25, 2002, at 8:50:49
In reply to Re: Why is Klonopin? - many uses long half life » chad_3, posted by bluedog on December 24, 2002, at 19:26:31
In the 90's, Klonopin was famed for having "efficacy" in potentiating the euphoria of opioids in those that combined the two in abuse.
Not sure if this had to do with feinds having a placebo effect, cultural effect resulting from a placebo effect, or such, but for whatever reason it reached the press and gave Klonopin a bad name for abuse. Still, no reason to have special laws over, but good example of legislators getting 100% of their pill info from newspapers. You'd think they'd have some humility and only base legislation on pills from stuff their read in Science or something? We all know they aren't smart enough to read those anyway. Especially those congressmen... lol
Although I never remember it (maybe early 90's? I was still learning ABC's then) I still have to explain Klonopin as the "it's like Xanax" to get the "oo---ooo-oh" reaction from my college roommates. And beyond Ritalin and Adderall, I don't credit this generation for knowing as much about pills as one would expect...
Posted by jimmygold70 on December 25, 2002, at 11:23:01
In reply to Why is Klonopin the Benzo du Jour, posted by MB on December 17, 2002, at 12:10:29
It's just cheap, potent and works. Xanax costs times more, butr it's cheap as well. I can tell you that most are as effective as each other. 2mg of Xanax equals 40mg of Valium, so people would tell you that the former is more effective, just beacuse nobody takes that much Valium. Biologically speaking, all do about the same in equivalent doses, but the duration and onset of actions varies. Klonopin and Valium are among the longer acting, Xanax and Halcion about the shortest.
> Does anybody know why almost everyone on this board who takes a benzo takes Klonopin? It definitely *is* the benzo du Jour. Once in a while I see Xanax mentioned on this board, but Valium, Ativan, Librium are almost unmentioned. Anyway, maybe they are mentioned, and I just don't see it. However, I've got to say that it seems 90% of all benzo posts are about Klonopin. Why is it the popular one?
>
> MB
Posted by Alan on December 28, 2002, at 13:33:34
In reply to Re: Why is Klonopin? - many uses long half life » chad_3, posted by bluedog on December 24, 2002, at 19:26:31
> > My opinion is that:
> > 1) Long half life unlike xanax and ativan
> > 2) Less sedating than most benzodiazepines
> > 3) Long shot best benzo for Social Phobia
> > 4) Good for panic at low dose
> >
> > 5) Good for many "antipsychotic wounded" people - the best common drug for most tardive movement disorders... Many here use it as a/p substitute once their aquired brain lesions from the a/p.
> >
> > 6) Combines well with the serotonergics which dominate the patented drugs right now - provided the sertonin add-in does not cause too much sedations and sexual side effects.
> >
> > Chad
> > http://www.socialfear.com/
> >
> >
> > > Does anybody know why almost everyone on this board who takes a benzo takes Klonopin? It definitely *is* the benzo du Jour. Once in a while I see Xanax mentioned on this board, but Valium, Ativan, Librium are almost unmentioned. Anyway, maybe they are mentioned, and I just don't see it. However, I've got to say that it seems 90% of all benzo posts are about Klonopin. Why is it the popular one?
> > >
> > > MB
>
>
> Hi Chad, I have a question for you.
>
> I am a long term social anxiety sufferer. I live in Australia and for whatever reasons (the reasons are always medico-political) there are many more legal restrictions on doctors prescribing Klonopin rather than Valium and the doctors actually prefer to prescribe Diazepam over Klonopin in Australia which appers to be the exact opposite of the situation in the USA.
>
> So I guess you could say the in Australia (at least the State in which I live) Diazepam is actually the Benzo "Du Jour" with Temazepam probably sitting on an equal footing with Diazepam though Temazepam is more often used for insomnia problems. For these reasons my PDoc preferred to put me on Valium rather than Klonopin for my social anxiety.
>
> It just so happens that Clonazepam has been the drug that has been the most heavily researched in relation to social anxiety. However have you seen the following 2001 study? I have higlighted with capitals the part of this abstract that caught my attention!!!
> ==================================================================================================
>
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=11206035&dopt=Abstract
>
> 1: J Clin Psychiatry 2001;62 Suppl 1:50-3 Related Articles, Links
>
> Benzodiazepines and anticonvulsants for social phobia (social anxiety disorder).
>
> Jefferson JW.
>
> Madison Institute of Medicine, Inc., and the University of Wisconsin Medical School, USA. JeffJ@healthtechsys.com
>
> Both benzodiazepines and conventional anticonvulsants have been evaluated as treatments for social phobia (social anxiety disorder). Among the benzodiazepines, clonazepam is the best studied, ALTHOUGH THERE IS REASON TO EXPECT THAT ALL BENZODIAZEPINE ANXIOLYTICS WOULD BE EFFECTIVE FOR THIS CONDITION. Among the anticonvulsants, gabapentin and pregabalin, an analogue of gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA), have been shown to be more effective than placebo in double-blind studies. Other than a small negative open study of valproic acid for social phobia, there is a paucity of information on whether other anticonvulsants might be useful for this condition.
>
> PMID: 11206035 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
> ==================================================================================================
>
> Chad my question for you is as follows:-
>
> With Diazepam also being a long acting benzo can you see any reason why the reasons you state in your post about Klonopin would not also apply to Valium?
>
> Thankyou and regards
> bluedog
============================================From my POV, this thread makes a lot of great points...the research, the politics of medicine,etc.
My own view is that there is no inherent superiority amongst bzds FOR ANY GIVEN INDIVIDUAL when it comes down to the treatment of anxiety.
That's why it's important to be able to try, as an individual, all of the bzds as necessary.
Anxiety disorders share with them common symptoms but originate from individual cases/causes that no one yet knows what necessarily differentiates the specific origins of symptoms amongst individuals. How much is genetic, mow much is behaivioral for instance is just one of the questions. Is there an underlying physiological problem yet undiscovered - one that falls through the cracks of the standard panel of tests normally given to rule out physiological causes (celiac disease for instance)?
That's why up to a certain point, the plethora of research and evidence while informative doesn't apply to individual cases. Individuals are not statistics as is obvious.
It is relatively easy to, with the help of an enlightened physician that knows this class of meds well, perform their own clinical trial in order to see what works best for them. It's relatively easy to switch out the different bzds if done with guidance since one gets an almost immediate effect in order to evaluate (as opposed to AD's, anti-convulsants, anti-psychotics, etc).
The problem is finding a physician that is up on their stuff and will, with all of the politically, morally, and commercially driven benzophobia, listen to their *individual* patient as to what they are telling them.
If xanax or ativan works markedly better than klon or valium, then the patient needs instruction and support about keeping up with their dosages so there is a steady state achieved with the relatively shorter half-life versions. It is the pragmatic approach as I see it (and have experienced it myself).
If klonopin works better than valium for any given individual, what in the end is the difference what the bzd of the day is?
In my opinion we as individual patients deserve no less expertise, understanding and compassion that originates from the attitude and outlook of our physicians.
Alan
Posted by worrier on December 28, 2002, at 17:58:16
In reply to Re: Why is Klonopin? - many uses long half life » bluedog, posted by Alan on December 28, 2002, at 13:33:34
> > > My opinion is that:
> > > 1) Long half life unlike xanax and ativan
> > > 2) Less sedating than most benzodiazepines
> > > 3) Long shot best benzo for Social Phobia
> > > 4) Good for panic at low dose
> > >
> > > 5) Good for many "antipsychotic wounded" people - the best common drug for most tardive movement disorders... Many here use it as a/p substitute once their aquired brain lesions from the a/p.
> > >
> > > 6) Combines well with the serotonergics which dominate the patented drugs right now - provided the sertonin add-in does not cause too much sedations and sexual side effects.
> > >
> > > Chad
> > > http://www.socialfear.com/
> > >
> > >
> > > > Does anybody know why almost everyone on this board who takes a benzo takes Klonopin? It definitely *is* the benzo du Jour. Once in a while I see Xanax mentioned on this board, but Valium, Ativan, Librium are almost unmentioned. Anyway, maybe they are mentioned, and I just don't see it. However, I've got to say that it seems 90% of all benzo posts are about Klonopin. Why is it the popular one?
> > > >
> > > > MB
> >
> >
> > Hi Chad, I have a question for you.
> >
> > I am a long term social anxiety sufferer. I live in Australia and for whatever reasons (the reasons are always medico-political) there are many more legal restrictions on doctors prescribing Klonopin rather than Valium and the doctors actually prefer to prescribe Diazepam over Klonopin in Australia which appers to be the exact opposite of the situation in the USA.
> >
> > So I guess you could say the in Australia (at least the State in which I live) Diazepam is actually the Benzo "Du Jour" with Temazepam probably sitting on an equal footing with Diazepam though Temazepam is more often used for insomnia problems. For these reasons my PDoc preferred to put me on Valium rather than Klonopin for my social anxiety.
> >
> > It just so happens that Clonazepam has been the drug that has been the most heavily researched in relation to social anxiety. However have you seen the following 2001 study? I have higlighted with capitals the part of this abstract that caught my attention!!!
> > ==================================================================================================
> >
> > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=11206035&dopt=Abstract
> >
> > 1: J Clin Psychiatry 2001;62 Suppl 1:50-3 Related Articles, Links
> >
> > Benzodiazepines and anticonvulsants for social phobia (social anxiety disorder).
> >
> > Jefferson JW.
> >
> > Madison Institute of Medicine, Inc., and the University of Wisconsin Medical School, USA. JeffJ@healthtechsys.com
> >
> > Both benzodiazepines and conventional anticonvulsants have been evaluated as treatments for social phobia (social anxiety disorder). Among the benzodiazepines, clonazepam is the best studied, ALTHOUGH THERE IS REASON TO EXPECT THAT ALL BENZODIAZEPINE ANXIOLYTICS WOULD BE EFFECTIVE FOR THIS CONDITION. Among the anticonvulsants, gabapentin and pregabalin, an analogue of gamma-aminobutyric acid (GABA), have been shown to be more effective than placebo in double-blind studies. Other than a small negative open study of valproic acid for social phobia, there is a paucity of information on whether other anticonvulsants might be useful for this condition.
> >
> > PMID: 11206035 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
> > ==================================================================================================
> >
> > Chad my question for you is as follows:-
> >
> > With Diazepam also being a long acting benzo can you see any reason why the reasons you state in your post about Klonopin would not also apply to Valium?
> >
> > Thankyou and regards
> > bluedog
> ============================================
>
> From my POV, this thread makes a lot of great points...the research, the politics of medicine,etc.
>
> My own view is that there is no inherent superiority amongst bzds FOR ANY GIVEN INDIVIDUAL when it comes down to the treatment of anxiety.
>
> That's why it's important to be able to try, as an individual, all of the bzds as necessary.
>
> Anxiety disorders share with them common symptoms but originate from individual cases/causes that no one yet knows what necessarily differentiates the specific origins of symptoms amongst individuals. How much is genetic, mow much is behaivioral for instance is just one of the questions. Is there an underlying physiological problem yet undiscovered - one that falls through the cracks of the standard panel of tests normally given to rule out physiological causes (celiac disease for instance)?
>
> That's why up to a certain point, the plethora of research and evidence while informative doesn't apply to individual cases. Individuals are not statistics as is obvious.
>
> It is relatively easy to, with the help of an enlightened physician that knows this class of meds well, perform their own clinical trial in order to see what works best for them. It's relatively easy to switch out the different bzds if done with guidance since one gets an almost immediate effect in order to evaluate (as opposed to AD's, anti-convulsants, anti-psychotics, etc).
>
> The problem is finding a physician that is up on their stuff and will, with all of the politically, morally, and commercially driven benzophobia, listen to their *individual* patient as to what they are telling them.
>
> If xanax or ativan works markedly better than klon or valium, then the patient needs instruction and support about keeping up with their dosages so there is a steady state achieved with the relatively shorter half-life versions. It is the pragmatic approach as I see it (and have experienced it myself).
>
> If klonopin works better than valium for any given individual, what in the end is the difference what the bzd of the day is?
>
> In my opinion we as individual patients deserve no less expertise, understanding and compassion that originates from the attitude and outlook of our physicians.
>
> Alan
>
> I agree with Alan...if it works why does it matter which one it is? I do have a question for anyone who has tried both Xanax and Klonopin. I'm currently on Xanax but have toyed with the idea of switching to klonopin so I won't have to take it as often and won't get the sort of rollercoaster effect you get with Xanax, but I've heard that it isn't really as effective at reducing anxiety. My psychiatrist is willing to go either way. Any helpful comments?
Posted by ZeeZee on December 28, 2002, at 19:10:54
In reply to Re: Why is Klonopin? - many uses long half life, posted by worrier on December 28, 2002, at 17:58:16
Xanax takes effect for me within 20 minutes of taking it. I agree however, that it has a short half life and there is a roller coaster effect as a result. I tried Klonopin, although maybe not long enough, and found myself feeling no anxiolytic effects - only burning eyes. That's just my experience however.
Posted by HannahBeGood on December 28, 2002, at 22:16:29
In reply to Re: Why is Klonopin? - many uses long half life » chad_3, posted by bluedog on December 24, 2002, at 19:26:31
My very fussy physiatrist (& others) had tried me on robaxin, skelaxin, flexeril, etc. I took the klono not knowing it was a benzo (.5-1 mg. a day). Within 45 minutes of taking the med, I felt more pain-free than I had in years! I have herniated discs, the cervical is quite pronounced (at least it was 3 yrs. ago), fibromyalgia (supposedly) and definitely chronic myofascial pain (toxins are trapped in soft muscle tissue by the fascial sheath membrane, which becomes tight & causes rock-hard points throughout the affected area). These pain-points radiate and combining that with trying to allow 3 herniated discs (2 lumbar) to 'resolve' to more normal states was torture. (But yrs. of careful lifting/movement have kept me outta surgery and my pain has lessened considerably).
But, the klono (I soon switched to generic, no problem, altho I do prefer the TEVA brand generic) was a real life-saver. I had a baby to cradle, then chase, at 40 (my first) plus I was caring for my mom with cancer.Plus groceries, laundry, housework, the whole bit.I desperately needed a pain-pause.My point, I have tried valium a few times and it makes me so irritable, so downright bitchy, I cannot tolerate the stuff! I haven't heard any doc offer v. to me or any of my fam/friends in years. (I live in the southern USA). Around here, Klono reigns (if u get an actual benzo and not Buspar or Atarax), with ativan and librium trailing up the back end.
As stress compounded over the past few yrs., & I mean really compounded, the clon lost its intense & quick relief for my spasms.(Altho I have never felt anything like a buzz from it. Finally, a yr. ago, an open-minded ortho put me on carisoprodal, (Soma) over here, & for the past yr & 1/2 it has been the super life-saver clonaz was for me then. I only use it as needed, but am allowed 350mgs 3 times a day.It is not an easily accessed rx here, I had asked about it before, but I was told by a very self-rightious neurologist who had just stuck a god knows how long a needle into the back my spine (rt. by my precious brain) to give me a painful and worthless cervical epidural, "yes, everyone wants Soma (saccharine smile inserted) because it makes them feel sooo good."
What, after 10 years of back pain, I didn't rank a little freakin' respite?!?And, I didn't even know what the stuff was? It had been rec'd to me by my hairdresser. It is not a 'classified' drug, but is, I believe related to Talwin or Miltown and can be habit-forming. Apparently quite habit-forming, as I think it was in WHO's recent 'most difficult 'Top Ten' list, when it comes to discontinuation. It has not caused problems for me, nor did Eff'r discontinuation, but I went off about 4 x's slower than my doc recommended and I still take about 10 granules of fxr every 2-3 days to avoid swooshes and and the occ'l AD reduction nighjtmare. I am very prone to night terrors and that is about the only thing taking AD's has ever helped me with consistently.
Man, am I babblin, so sorry...
Many days I skip it the soma, as I have been in therapy for 1 yr. now, dx'd with endogenous depression & untreated ADD. EDS is a real problem w/me, so I take my Lex and dex, clono for anxiety disorder & just started gabatril for mood stabilization. Just came off 9 mos. Effexor at 300. it really gave me that, 'so what?', I'm wrapped in a fuzzy cocoon and I don't care feeling. Which actually helped me get thru the excruciating grief of losing both parents within 14 months. Mom had Alzheimer's. I was her caretaker, gladly, but what an experience for us both...She maintained her grace, kindness and dignity, even thru the severe dementia stage. She was truly heroic, god bless her soul.I am going back to my talk therapist when new yr. starts as I just received my parents estate settlement. I think my dx is off, and I cd. only afford to see my shrink mostly for the past yr. I cannot maintain any mood consistency and I really need to look at this whole thing from a fresh approach.Sometime soon, (when I am feeling as confoundedly verbose as tonite)I will give my history in a fresh thread, and get all you great readers' opinions on what I shd. research and consider, before I see my therapist or p-doc.
p.s. I am now at 3-4 mgs. of clonazepam, although it is not the dex causing it. The dex has been the best thing for me in years, for relieving depression and getting me interested in life again, & helping me face daily pain (for which I am allowed 2 darvocet + the carisoprodal). Now I can actually concentrate on something besides grief or physical pain.
Enuf already! Glad we both have long-lasting benzos available to us. Long live psychopharmacology! It's not perfect, but It sure beats doing it alone.Hannah
This is the end of the thread.
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