Psycho-Babble Medication Thread 86964

Shown: posts 1 to 14 of 14. This is the beginning of the thread.

 

status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo

Posted by JohnX2 on December 15, 2001, at 7:04:15


Well its been about 1.5 weeks since adding
Topamax and 1.25 since adding Wellbutrin.

I'd say results are outstanding.

The Topamax has completely rid me of myofacial
pain, plus I can tolerate a full Wellbutrin
dose, which previously was an extremely anti-depressant
that would make me manic but poop out and give
severe myofacial pain. Tolerating it now without
myofacial pain is a very good sign.

My lack of interest in life has waned substantitally
although I am not sure if I have felt the full effects
of Wellbutrin. I usually get a 1.5 - 2 weeks response.
But on my previous trials I became (hypo)manic and
was not an any mood stabilizer, so it is hard for
me to know if I should get some of that dopamine kick
that I would get before, like on Adderall when not
manic? Any thoughts???

The Wellbutrin is really playing games with my
sleep. Yesterday I slept-walked from my master bedroom
into my closet and fell asleep!!!! I had to go pee
really bad, but was having this intense freudian dream
telling me not to go pee-pee. Finally my body threw
in he towel, got me up and I walked straight into
a wall (because I didn't know I was in the closet and
it was dark). ;).

Concentratring on Klonopin tapering since Topamax
is working..

-John

 

Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo JohnX2

Posted by Mitch on December 15, 2001, at 10:29:42

In reply to status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo, posted by JohnX2 on December 15, 2001, at 7:04:15

>
> Well its been about 1.5 weeks since adding
> Topamax and 1.25 since adding Wellbutrin.
>
> I'd say results are outstanding.
>
> The Topamax has completely rid me of myofacial
> pain, plus I can tolerate a full Wellbutrin
> dose, which previously was an extremely anti-depressant
> that would make me manic but poop out and give
> severe myofacial pain. Tolerating it now without
> myofacial pain is a very good sign.
>
> My lack of interest in life has waned substantitally
> although I am not sure if I have felt the full effects
> of Wellbutrin. I usually get a 1.5 - 2 weeks response.
> But on my previous trials I became (hypo)manic and
> was not an any mood stabilizer, so it is hard for
> me to know if I should get some of that dopamine kick
> that I would get before, like on Adderall when not
> manic? Any thoughts???

Hi John,

I think you are onto something there. I am getting a "little" bit of hypomania from WB, that I *never* got from Adderall, however. You are on a lot more mood stabilizer than I am, though. So, it might work out quite well. Topamax (IMO), is as powerful an antimanic agent as Depakote or Lithium (and obviously it is giving you the analgesia that you need).


>
> The Wellbutrin is really playing games with my
> sleep. Yesterday I slept-walked from my master bedroom
> into my closet and fell asleep!!!! I had to go pee
> really bad, but was having this intense freudian dream
> telling me not to go pee-pee. Finally my body threw
> in he towel, got me up and I walked straight into
> a wall (because I didn't know I was in the closet and
> it was dark). ;).

I have noticed an increase in dreaming as well in the last week or so. I had a dream last nite that my ADHD nephew gave me a giant bottle of Ritalin for Christmas! I have been on the WB for exactly four weeks as of today (with Klon, Celexa, Neurontin). The WB seems to take some weird quirky twists and turns. I had really blurry vision the first week with a little irritability but with an anxiolytic effect. Then the third week I got really anxious from it. Now that is fading and my attention is finally starting to improve (but I have developed a few nasty headaches in the back of my head-like on Adderall-but they go away after the peak). All of this on a dose of 75mg/day. I am going to wait this out and see what happens next.

>
> Concentratring on Klonopin tapering since Topamax
> is working..
>
> -John


Just an opinion, but I would wait on that one until the Wellbutrin goes through all of its changes. good luck

Mitch

 

Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo JohnX2

Posted by Cindylou on December 16, 2001, at 14:32:16

In reply to status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo, posted by JohnX2 on December 15, 2001, at 7:04:15

John,
Thanks for the chuckle :-)

Here's a question for you:

When I first started Lamictal (at 25 mg), I added some Wellbutrin to help with fatigue. I felt great on the Wellbutrin/Lamictal combo for about 5 days (maybe almost "too" great?? Lots of excess energy ...) but then "crashed" big time, with severe depression and worse fatigue.

From your experience, should I try the Wellbutrin again now that I'm up to 100 mg Lamictal? I am still depressed, although I know it's gotten somewhat better. I definitely need to add some kind of AD though. I am currently taking Serzone, but can only tolerate 100 mg a day which isn't enough to help depression.

I have had a hard time with SSRIs in the past ... wondering if I might have a different reaction to them in combo with the Lamictal as well.

Thanks for any feedback. Thanks also for the update on how you are doing. Hope it continues to go well, and that your sleeping habits calm down a bit!

-cindy

> The Wellbutrin is really playing games with my
> sleep. Yesterday I slept-walked from my master bedroom
> into my closet and fell asleep!!!! I had to go pee
> really bad, but was having this intense freudian dream
> telling me not to go pee-pee. Finally my body threw
> in he towel, got me up and I walked straight into
> a wall (because I didn't know I was in the closet and
> it was dark). ;).
>
> -John

 

Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo Cindylou

Posted by JohnX2 on December 16, 2001, at 17:37:03

In reply to Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo JohnX2, posted by Cindylou on December 16, 2001, at 14:32:16


Hi Cindy,

I'm afraid I can not predict how your body
would respond to another Wellbutrin trial.
But I think you are correct in thinking that
you may get different results as you are not
tinkering with other med doses at this time.
At least you know if a new wb trial doesn't work
out then you can stop and will probably return to
your present state. Also, since you are more
stabilized now, you could dose in the wellbutrin
very slowly to help avoid problems and allow
escape routes.

It's your call, keep us posted ....

Good Luck,
John

> John,
> Thanks for the chuckle :-)
>
> Here's a question for you:
>
> When I first started Lamictal (at 25 mg), I added some Wellbutrin to help with fatigue. I felt great on the Wellbutrin/Lamictal combo for about 5 days (maybe almost "too" great?? Lots of excess energy ...) but then "crashed" big time, with severe depression and worse fatigue.
>
> From your experience, should I try the Wellbutrin again now that I'm up to 100 mg Lamictal? I am still depressed, although I know it's gotten somewhat better. I definitely need to add some kind of AD though. I am currently taking Serzone, but can only tolerate 100 mg a day which isn't enough to help depression.
>
> I have had a hard time with SSRIs in the past ... wondering if I might have a different reaction to them in combo with the Lamictal as well.
>
> Thanks for any feedback. Thanks also for the update on how you are doing. Hope it continues to go well, and that your sleeping habits calm down a bit!
>
> -cindy
>
> > The Wellbutrin is really playing games with my
> > sleep. Yesterday I slept-walked from my master bedroom
> > into my closet and fell asleep!!!! I had to go pee
> > really bad, but was having this intense freudian dream
> > telling me not to go pee-pee. Finally my body threw
> > in he towel, got me up and I walked straight into
> > a wall (because I didn't know I was in the closet and
> > it was dark). ;).
> >
> > -John

 

Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo Mitch

Posted by JohnX2 on December 16, 2001, at 18:02:37

In reply to Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo JohnX2, posted by Mitch on December 15, 2001, at 10:29:42

> > Concentratring on Klonopin tapering since Topamax
> > is working..
> >
> > -John
>
>
> Just an opinion, but I would wait on that one until the Wellbutrin goes through all of its changes. good luck
>

I just taper a little less klonopin and the doc recommeded
not to be aggressive so I take 5, maybe 4 mg/day
down from 6 mg/day. The major risk is seizure,
but I'm already taking 2 other anti-convulsants.

BTW, I started Wb 150 mg for 3 days, 300 mg each
day after that. A few transient headaches. Actually
fewer headaches this time than any other time.
I haven't experienced blurry vision this time
like my other wellbutrin runs. I am having
night sweats and apparently sleep walking
however. Generally Wellbutrin is one of my best
tolerated AD's (if it doesn't trigger myofacial
pain). It is stimulating and gets me off my ass even
before the major antidepressant effect kicks in. I can
handle stress better and get crapola outta the
way. I think I might take up excersizing more and
giving up caffeine to see if it improves my sleep
hygeiene.

-john

 

Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo JohnX2

Posted by Mitch on December 16, 2001, at 21:22:53

In reply to Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo Mitch, posted by JohnX2 on December 16, 2001, at 18:02:37

> I just taper a little less klonopin and the doc recommeded
> not to be aggressive so I take 5, maybe 4 mg/day
> down from 6 mg/day. The major risk is seizure,
> but I'm already taking 2 other anti-convulsants.
>
> BTW, I started Wb 150 mg for 3 days, 300 mg each
> day after that. A few transient headaches. Actually
> fewer headaches this time than any other time.
> I haven't experienced blurry vision this time
> like my other wellbutrin runs. I am having
> night sweats and apparently sleep walking
> however. Generally Wellbutrin is one of my best
> tolerated AD's (if it doesn't trigger myofacial
> pain). It is stimulating and gets me off my ass even
> before the major antidepressant effect kicks in. I can
> handle stress better and get crapola outta the
> way. I think I might take up excersizing more and
> giving up caffeine to see if it improves my sleep
> hygeiene.
>
> -john

John,

This is strange, but if I fail to drink caffeinated tea and coffee with the WB in the morning I get drowsy. It almost seems like the coffee/tea helps more than the WB. After I eat my first meal of the day I start getting very, very, drowsy, and it seems I have to drink a lot of coffee and tea+WB doses to get through the rest of the day without nodding off. I can't gripe too much, because I am not feeling very depressed. If I was on sedative AD's I would be very irritable and hostile, so I am not going to complain.

Mitch

 

Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo

Posted by JGalt on December 17, 2001, at 10:18:24

In reply to Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo JohnX2, posted by Mitch on December 16, 2001, at 21:22:53

Mitch,

I seem to have the same experience after eating any sort of meal, always feel relatively tired after it. As a result, and after doing some reading on dieting for better muscle:fat ratio, I've taken up the animal diet, which means I only eat 1-2 times a day, mostly in the evening, and avoid sugar throughout the day if possible. I think it does help significantly...it doesn't seem to matter whether I have a big meal or just a small one, I'm always tired after it too. I am thinking that my ephedrine+caffiene+WB in the daytime and inderal at nighttime (to remove clear the beta receptors) is helping some with my energy, but I still have that after meal effect too...quite annoying. At times it can make one want to turn anorexic.

JGalt

 

Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo JGalt

Posted by Mitch on December 17, 2001, at 23:48:08

In reply to Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo, posted by JGalt on December 17, 2001, at 10:18:24

> Mitch,
>
> I seem to have the same experience after eating any sort of meal, always feel relatively tired after it. As a result, and after doing some reading on dieting for better muscle:fat ratio, I've taken up the animal diet, which means I only eat 1-2 times a day, mostly in the evening, and avoid sugar throughout the day if possible. I think it does help significantly...it doesn't seem to matter whether I have a big meal or just a small one, I'm always tired after it too. I am thinking that my ephedrine+caffiene+WB in the daytime and inderal at nighttime (to remove clear the beta receptors) is helping some with my energy, but I still have that after meal effect too...quite annoying. At times it can make one want to turn anorexic.
>
> JGalt


Yes..the longer I wait to eat the longer I feel alert and awake. But I have this seasonal component to my depression which involves a tremendous complex carb craving. All I want is potatoes, rice, pasta, corn, etc. I went to a company Christmas dinner last week and noticed how significantly different my plate was compared to everyone else's. I am not like this between depressions. Then-I like salads, steaks, etc. I never had a blood sugar/insulin-like testing done. I never crave simple carbs/sugars, though.
I also crave CHEESES in a really bad way. I wonder if I am really deficient in tyrosine/tyramine or whatever. Scalloped potatoes-hey that is a meal in itself! With lots of soy sauce. I take just 37.5mg of Wellbutrin in the morning with 2-3 really strong cups of coffee over about two hours time and that gets me awake until I eat a few hours later. Then I have to take more Wellbutrin and drink some English Breakfast Tea or make more coffee. Without something like Wellbutrin during these seasonal episodes I would be sleeping 10-12 hrs a day. I feel like I have malaria or something.

Mitch

 

Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo

Posted by JohnX2 on December 18, 2001, at 0:08:02

In reply to Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo JGalt, posted by Mitch on December 17, 2001, at 23:48:08

My diet is atrocious.
My weight ping-pongs between 140-175, and
it can swing like that in 1 month on medications.
For example, I was at 150-155, started Serzone and
popped to 175 in 1.5 months, stopped, switched
to Adderall for 1 month and dropped to 140 lbs.

I go through different phases of eating health/
crap food. But I always take dietary supplements
to make sure my body is getting an adequate ratio
of certain vitamins and minerals and also anti
oxidants. Its really hard in my area to eat healty.
There are probably more restaurants per capita
in my town than most any city in the country.
Last year I ate at a mexican restaurant next to the
current 1st lady. We figured this out after this
weirdo was sitting by himself at another table
next to us looking around the room and giving
the people at our table funny looks
(he was a body guard for Mrs. Bush).

-john

> > Mitch,
> >
> > I seem to have the same experience after eating any sort of meal, always feel relatively tired after it. As a result, and after doing some reading on dieting for better muscle:fat ratio, I've taken up the animal diet, which means I only eat 1-2 times a day, mostly in the evening, and avoid sugar throughout the day if possible. I think it does help significantly...it doesn't seem to matter whether I have a big meal or just a small one, I'm always tired after it too. I am thinking that my ephedrine+caffiene+WB in the daytime and inderal at nighttime (to remove clear the beta receptors) is helping some with my energy, but I still have that after meal effect too...quite annoying. At times it can make one want to turn anorexic.
> >
> > JGalt
>
>
> Yes..the longer I wait to eat the longer I feel alert and awake. But I have this seasonal component to my depression which involves a tremendous complex carb craving. All I want is potatoes, rice, pasta, corn, etc. I went to a company Christmas dinner last week and noticed how significantly different my plate was compared to everyone else's. I am not like this between depressions. Then-I like salads, steaks, etc. I never had a blood sugar/insulin-like testing done. I never crave simple carbs/sugars, though.
> I also crave CHEESES in a really bad way. I wonder if I am really deficient in tyrosine/tyramine or whatever. Scalloped potatoes-hey that is a meal in itself! With lots of soy sauce. I take just 37.5mg of Wellbutrin in the morning with 2-3 really strong cups of coffee over about two hours time and that gets me awake until I eat a few hours later. Then I have to take more Wellbutrin and drink some English Breakfast Tea or make more coffee. Without something like Wellbutrin during these seasonal episodes I would be sleeping 10-12 hrs a day. I feel like I have malaria or something.
>
> Mitch

 

Re: wellbutrin weight loss-diethylpropion switch? JohnX2

Posted by Mitch on December 18, 2001, at 11:32:50

In reply to Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo, posted by JohnX2 on December 18, 2001, at 0:08:02

>
>
> My diet is atrocious.
> My weight ping-pongs between 140-175, and
> it can swing like that in 1 month on medications.
> For example, I was at 150-155, started Serzone and
> popped to 175 in 1.5 months, stopped, switched
> to Adderall for 1 month and dropped to 140 lbs.
>
> I go through different phases of eating health/
> crap food. But I always take dietary supplements
> to make sure my body is getting an adequate ratio
> of certain vitamins and minerals and also anti
> oxidants. Its really hard in my area to eat healty.
> There are probably more restaurants per capita
> in my town than most any city in the country.
> Last year I ate at a mexican restaurant next to the
> current 1st lady. We figured this out after this
> weirdo was sitting by himself at another table
> next to us looking around the room and giving
> the people at our table funny looks
> (he was a body guard for Mrs. Bush).
>
> -john
>

That would be a fascinating and unnerving experience for me, especially nowadays. It would make me feel like a potential unintended victim!

My ideal weight is an elusive 175 lbs. I am just getting too old and working too long at sedentary jobs, I guess. I topped 200 at the endocrinologist visit last month and I was really pissed. Most of that was weight I had gained during the few weeks of tinkering with Remeron again (which I will never touch again with a ten-foot pole). The Wellbutrin (I am bouncing between 50-100mg/day) is definitely knocking the pounds off I must say! The tiny bit of Celexa I take also puts the death knell on my appetite as well. I think I have lost about 1-2 lbs a week over the last five weeks I have been taking it, despite all of this holiday munching. GOT A QUESTION: Have you ever tried the "sister" drug to buproprion used for weight loss? I think it is diethyl-propion (?). I wonder if it would be a good switch (for ADHD sx), without as strong an AD effect?

Mitch

 

Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo

Posted by JGalt on December 19, 2001, at 16:30:08

In reply to Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo JGalt, posted by Mitch on December 17, 2001, at 23:48:08

Mitch,

I too have those cheese cravings, not so much complex carbs though, rather meats and simple sugars. I've cut simple sugars a lot and the sleepiness after a meal isn't so pronounced, but it is still there. Luckily Wellbutrin is enough of an appetite suppressant that I can eat a large meal once a day (supper) and not feel too hungry otherwise. It doesn't sound to me as if you have a blood sugar/insulin problem. People with that sort of problem tend to like simple sugars a lot and can't stop eating them. The only thing I can think of for you is if you eat mostly complex carbs and little meat, then you are depriving yourself of tyrosine in your diet. Normally your body depends upon the protein in your diet (largely the tyrosine, also phenylaline) to go to the brain and supply the starting chems for neurotransmitters. Logically cheese makes up for this difference.

 

Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo JGalt

Posted by Mitch on December 19, 2001, at 23:27:32

In reply to Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo, posted by JGalt on December 19, 2001, at 16:30:08

> Mitch,
>
> I too have those cheese cravings, not so much complex carbs though, rather meats and simple sugars. I've cut simple sugars a lot and the sleepiness after a meal isn't so pronounced, but it is still there. Luckily Wellbutrin is enough of an appetite suppressant that I can eat a large meal once a day (supper) and not feel too hungry otherwise. It doesn't sound to me as if you have a blood sugar/insulin problem. People with that sort of problem tend to like simple sugars a lot and can't stop eating them. The only thing I can think of for you is if you eat mostly complex carbs and little meat, then you are depriving yourself of tyrosine in your diet. Normally your body depends upon the protein in your diet (largely the tyrosine, also phenylaline) to go to the brain and supply the starting chems for neurotransmitters. Logically cheese makes up for this difference.

Thanks,

That might explain my craving for *diet* sodas. So..if I bump up the proteins and meat consumption and reduce the fats I should lose weight and get the tyrosine I am craving..

Thanks,
Mitch

 

Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo

Posted by JGalt on December 20, 2001, at 15:32:16

In reply to Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo JGalt, posted by Mitch on December 19, 2001, at 23:27:32

Mitch,

One question for you. You mention craving diet sodas, I was wondering if you get increased headaches at all from them?

I was getting this unfortunate side from drinking too much diet soda and sugar free koolaid quite often...of course I know part of that was because I was also taking selegiline at the time. Just wondering if you had a similar experience?

JGalt

 

Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo JGalt

Posted by Mitch on December 20, 2001, at 23:25:21

In reply to Re: status of topamax+lamactal+wellbutrin+klon combo, posted by JGalt on December 20, 2001, at 15:32:16

> Mitch,
>
> One question for you. You mention craving diet sodas, I was wondering if you get increased headaches at all from them?
>
> I was getting this unfortunate side from drinking too much diet soda and sugar free koolaid quite often...of course I know part of that was because I was also taking selegiline at the time. Just wondering if you had a similar experience?
>
> JGalt

Nope, I just felt energized by them somehow. Probably the caffeine. I can't handle non-diet sodas because of the heartburn. But, I think the phenylalinine has something to do with it.

Mitch


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