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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 14 of 14. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Vesper on March 2, 2000, at 17:40:39
The following is pasted from an email to a listowner, that I just sent. I have edited out some portions. I just wanted to let you all know what happened to me, in case you wanted to know any more. I wouldn't, if I were you, but there it is.
The following can be forwarded to the list, at your discretion. Feel free to edit if necessary.
At UCLA, I have a psychiatrist, a therapist, and I attend day treatment. My behaviours include or have included cutting, suicide attempts, risky behaviour, drug and alcohol overuse.
I have no firm diagnosis, but Ultra rapid cycling bipolar disorder, PTSD, Depression, BPD, and others have been mentioned, and I have had symptoms of each. 2 years ago I was doing well at Cedars-Sinai, with a great pdoc/therapist and day tx. When my pdoc left, it was arranged that I could see my case manager from day tx as my therapist, as I was finished with day tx. anyway. It had taken me many doctors and much suffering to find these people. At my last apt. with my pdoc/therapist, she announced that one of the administrators who had been on vacation had returned and vetoed our plan, and refused to give any reason or explanation. I was left without a therapist. Personally, I think it was ego. He was left out of a decision to make a policy exception, and resented it.
I was crushed. I went on a spree of self-destructive behaviours, stopped my meds, etc. I finally found my current situation at UCLA, and my current t is wonderful. Recently, several horrible things happened in my life and I began to be very self-destructive, until I tried to kill myself saturday night. I missed 2 days of day tx, and one therapy appointment. I had not been talking about my mother's coming death, and the suicides of 2 friends, etc. because I was too afraid that I would not be able to handle it, and would be hospitalized. Today, I finally decided to just go to UCLA and meet with my pdoc. I wanted to go ip to break this cycle of self-destructive behaviour and causing harm to others, then get out and comply fully with my treatment regimen, including talking about what I needed to, regardless of my fears. Before I continue, I must give you the details of my "contract." It states that I will attend day tx, keep all my appointments, refrain from using drugs or alcohol, do no harm to myself, etc., or else I would be discharged from the day tx program, and would have to seek treatment elsewhere than UCLA.
Today my pdoc told me I had broken the contract, and therefore was being discharged from day tx. I asked if I would still be able to see her, or my therapist, and she was evasive, just saying we would discuss it with the ip staff re my future treatment plans. I told her I would take my motorcycle home and come back, to go ip. When I got home, I called her, and told her I wasn't coming, because there is no point in spending several days in hospital, just to get out and have no follow up tx. She gave me a bunch of shit about how they had failed to help me, and I could go to county, etc. etc.
UCLA is paying my medi-cal share of cost, and no one else will, so my only option would be county, which has med management, and no therapy. I asked did she really think county could do a better job, and can I please have another chance, but she said no. She began to reiterate my need for hospitalization as the most important thing, and that it was my choice to refuse treatment, and I was just being like I always am lately, etc. putting it all on me. I hung up on her.
I have to stop taking medications, and just try to go about my life and whatever happens, will happen. I don't know what else to do.
I'm sorry to have wasted everyone's time. I do not like what I have become, saying things to people I don't mean, saying inappropriate things, etc. I hate myself and wish I were dead, but have no immediate plans to do anything about it.
Posted by saint james on March 2, 2000, at 18:14:46
In reply to My last post, probably--caution, may upset people, posted by Vesper on March 2, 2000, at 17:40:39
Vesper....enough allready, admit yourself ASAP. You are not going to get any better continuing as you have. We all need a rest from your continued crisis and I am sure you do to. Your mental health is in your hands.
j
Posted by vesper on March 2, 2000, at 18:35:43
In reply to Re: My last post, probably--caution, may upset people, posted by saint james on March 2, 2000, at 18:14:46
> Vesper....enough allready, admit yourself ASAP. You are not going to get any better continuing as you have. We all need a rest from your continued crisis and I am sure you do to. Your mental health is in your hands.
>
> jYou want a rest, you've got it! Perhaps you didn't read, the "my last post" part of the title.
Posted by JJ on March 2, 2000, at 20:10:55
In reply to Re: My last post, probably--caution, may upset people, posted by vesper on March 2, 2000, at 18:35:43
Vesper,
You need to go to the hospital you've been told to by more than one person on this board. What are you waiting for someone to hold your hand, its not gonna be easy but you have to go so do it!
Posted by Cass on March 2, 2000, at 20:39:48
In reply to My last post, probably--caution, may upset people, posted by Vesper on March 2, 2000, at 17:40:39
Hi Vesper,
Regardless of whether or not you check yourself into the hospital (and you probably should), I don't think you should leave PsychoBabble. There's no point in isolating yourself, and I think very few people want you to leave. The people on this board have a connection with you and care about you. Stick around.
Cass
Posted by vesper on March 2, 2000, at 21:43:06
In reply to Re: My last post, probably--caution, may upset people, posted by Cass on March 2, 2000, at 20:39:48
> Hi Vesper,
> Regardless of whether or not you check yourself into the hospital (and you probably should), I don't think you should leave PsychoBabble. There's no point in isolating yourself, and I think very few people want you to leave. The people on this board have a connection with you and care about you. Stick around.
> CassThank you. Regardless of my recent posts, I am not suicidal, I was just angry and venting, and I am sorry if I gave that impression. I'm going to get some sleep, and see what tomorrow brings. If I feel self-destructive I will go to the hospital.
I would appreciate it if no one would make any more phone calls on my behalf. Thank you very much,
love to all
Vesper
Posted by juniper on March 2, 2000, at 22:46:19
In reply to Re: My last post, probably--caution, may upset people, posted by vesper on March 2, 2000, at 21:43:06
you do sound like you are doing better, and i sincerely hope so. i know the hospital is a dark shadow looming over you, but consider that if you continue doing what you've always done, you will continue to get what you've always gotten.
you don't like the end product, so change it by changing what you put into the equation.
and please keep us updated on your choices.peace in the struggle,
juniper
Posted by judy on March 3, 2000, at 1:25:14
In reply to Re: My last post, probably--caution, may upset people, posted by vesper on March 2, 2000, at 21:43:06
Hi,
I guess the feeling I get from many of your posts is the need to reach out- and what better place to do it than in a forum where people have shared your emotions. I have attempted suicide (seriously twice) and have made other gestures. My gestures came from a place of pain and I was reaching out for help. I think that's what you were doing- if people react angrily they do so out of fear for your safety. Suicidal ideation is transiant, perhaps your therp can work with you in finding better ways to cope with your thoughts. And try to stay away from the alcohol- it really does make things worse. I have received a great deal of compassion in my life and a great deal of anger- I welcome the compassion and try to pass it on. Please take care of yourself; if you feel a hospital is not the best environment for you- and believe me I have plenty of horror stories- than try to step up the visits to your therp. Take care.
Posted by Elizabeth on March 3, 2000, at 11:43:36
In reply to My last post, probably--caution, may upset people, posted by Vesper on March 2, 2000, at 17:40:39
Vesper,
I'm really sorry you've gotten caught up in UCLA's political web.
I can sort of understand your reluctance to go to the hospital when you may not be able to follow up with a long-term tx plan. While a contract of some sort is probably a good idea for you, I don't think this one has been helpful. If your treatment team doesn't want you to stay in the day program, they need to find a viable alternative. Forcing you to discontinue all treatment "cold turkey" is simply wrong. I don't know if UCLA's ethics board has any real power, but it might be worth looking into.
On another note, getting some sleep sounds like a good idea.
Take care.
Posted by bob on March 4, 2000, at 21:57:24
In reply to Re: My last post, probably--caution, may upset people, posted by Elizabeth on March 3, 2000, at 11:43:36
My two cents, V., for what two cents is worth nowadays it to forget the Neil Diamond songs ("I am, I said"? Really? To no one? Hey, we may be virtual at YOUR end of the pipe, Mr. Frog-King ;^) and stick with the Neil Peart songs. Worked once for me. Put on the CD, hit the Repeat button, and listened to "The Spirit of Radio" about 20-30 times in a row.
If not for that song, a few months back I might have wound up as the NRA's next poster child ... if I could have found a gun shop conveniently located where I worked on the Upper East Side of Manhattan at the time.
Feel angry? Feel like venting? Fine! Let it out here rather than taking it out on yourself. Don't let their incompetence victimize you.
The reason I disappeard for the last week or so is that someone else's incompetence sent me free-falling at terminal velocity right to Hell ... but gods-be-thanked my therapist is like the best bungee cord any canyon diver could want. The main thing she did for me was to stop me from beating myself for the stupidity and shittiness of others. In spite of how the Powers That Be have failed me, **I** have put myself in a better place than I was three months ago, and nothing they do or fail to do can take that from me. Nothing.
So, kiddo, it's time to make your own place of peace. I hope Babble has a lifeline to it.
bob
Posted by VESPER on March 5, 2000, at 4:11:19
In reply to Joke'em if they can't take a f...., posted by bob on March 4, 2000, at 21:57:24
> My two cents, V., for what two cents is worth nowadays it to forget the Neil Diamond songs ("I am, I said"? Really? To no one? Hey, we may be virtual at YOUR end of the pipe, Mr. Frog-King ;^) and stick with the Neil Peart songs. Worked once for me. Put on the CD, hit the Repeat button, and listened to "The Spirit of Radio" about 20-30 times in a row.
>
> If not for that song, a few months back I might have wound up as the NRA's next poster child ... if I could have found a gun shop conveniently located where I worked on the Upper East Side of Manhattan at the time.
>
> Feel angry? Feel like venting? Fine! Let it out here rather than taking it out on yourself. Don't let their incompetence victimize you.
>
> The reason I disappeard for the last week or so is that someone else's incompetence sent me free-falling at terminal velocity right to Hell ... but gods-be-thanked my therapist is like the best bungee cord any canyon diver could want. The main thing she did for me was to stop me from beating myself for the stupidity and shittiness of others. In spite of how the Powers That Be have failed me, **I** have put myself in a better place than I was three months ago, and nothing they do or fail to do can take that from me. Nothing.
>
> So, kiddo, it's time to make your own place of peace. I hope Babble has a lifeline to it.
>
> bob
How about...
"I don't think I can carry on
Carry on this cold and empty life..."
[sic] My life's blood
Spills over..."
I don't know. Rush is better live, saw em 7 times, 97 Test for Echo tour best ever. Too bad about Neil's tragedies lately.
I don't know...UCLA was my last best hope I think.
I went there to surrender to them and finally do something significant in talk therapy, and they said, you broke your contract, we give up, we failed, etc.
UCLA failed? And Los ANgeles county is going to be better? HA! Well...now what?
And Hey whoever reads this, I really like the people here and will miss them, even tho I've only been here a short time.
Dr. Bob...I have been in Hartgrove in Chicago..is it still there?
Posted by bob on March 5, 2000, at 17:40:56
In reply to Re: Joke'em if they can't take a f...., posted by VESPER on March 5, 2000, at 4:11:19
> How about...
> "I don't think I can carry on
> Carry on this cold and empty life..."
> [sic] My life's blood
> Spills over..."As long as you don't forget why that hero is "tragic" ... he gives up on his hopes moments before the Priests are overthrown and, with that, his hopes could have been realized.
Sounds more like what you need to keep in mind is:
"I will choose a path that's clear
I will choose free will."
Enough of this fatalistic talk already, okay?Or maybe, with that bike of yours, Red Barchetta?
> I don't know. Rush is better live, saw em 7 times, 97 Test for Echo tour best ever. Too bad about Neil's tragedies lately.
Hah! Last time I saw them was Detroit, Cobo Arena, on the Moving Pictures tour ... tenth row, in front of Geddy. I think that was the first concert I'd been to where parents and kids were both there as fans, as opposed to parents chaperoning the kids.
Yeah, Neil's seen an awfully bad stretch of road between then and now ... but he's still here making music.
Hang in there, Vesper
bob
Posted by vesper on March 5, 2000, at 23:43:18
In reply to Re: Joke'em if they can't take a f...., posted by bob on March 5, 2000, at 17:40:56
> > How about...
> > "I don't think I can carry on
> > Carry on this cold and empty life..."
> > [sic] My life's blood
> > Spills over..."
>
> As long as you don't forget why that hero is "tragic" ... he gives up on his hopes moments before the Priests are overthrown and, with that, his hopes could have been realized.
>
> Sounds more like what you need to keep in mind is:
> "I will choose a path that's clear
> I will choose free will."
> Enough of this fatalistic talk already, okay?
>
> Or maybe, with that bike of yours, Red Barchetta?
>
> > I don't know. Rush is better live, saw em 7 times, 97 Test for Echo tour best ever. Too bad about Neil's tragedies lately.
>
> Hah! Last time I saw them was Detroit, Cobo Arena, on the Moving Pictures tour ... tenth row, in front of Geddy. I think that was the first concert I'd been to where parents and kids were both there as fans, as opposed to parents chaperoning the kids.
>
> Yeah, Neil's seen an awfully bad stretch of road between then and now ... but he's still here making music.
>
> Hang in there, Vesper
> bob
You know they were into ayn rand at the time, right?
Anyway, I am from the Detroit area, been to Cobo, Silverdome, Pine Knob, etc.
It is lucky for me that Rush isn't as "big" as they were on Moving Pictures, I get to see them in ampitheatres with great acoustics. Actually, Neil is not doing much of anything since his wife and daughter...The new Rush album is on hold...
Neils percussion solo has been perfected, in my opinion. Just listen to the one on the newest live cd, "stages," although it has been cut for the album...
Posted by bob on March 6, 2000, at 17:40:36
In reply to Re: Joke'em if they can't take a f...., posted by vesper on March 5, 2000, at 23:43:18
Doncha know that people born and raised under 7 months of gray sky a year (Oct.-April in MI) just can't hack Southern California? You got the Sun Sickness. Get on your bike, get on that coastal highway, and don't stop til you hit Seattle. It's wetter than SE MI, but just as gray.
Sounds like I gotta get a listen to that live Rush ... I can't imagine Peart getting any better, so I guess I just have to experience it.
cheers,
bob
This is the end of the thread.
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